Clinging to the past is the problem. Embracing change is the answer.

[amybear912]

More and more rudeness enter the cruise market because those who couldn't afford cruising a few years back, do it now. .

 

Now, now... let's not imply that rudeness is related to income... Working in the most affluent area of Indianapolis (my county is one of the top 25 most affluent in the country)... I can definitely say that rudeness does not limit itself to a lower income bracket...

 

Actually... think of a cruiseship as a microcosm of society in general... You have many people from all walks of life and incomes, confined to a ship... You are bound to encounter all sorts of people... It's no different than going to Disney World or even Las Vegas... or virtually any vacation destination... heck, even going to the mall is a lesson in sociology these days...

 

For the record, and as a side note, I have not set foot in a mall in 8 years... This past Christmas I celebrated 8 years of being mall-free:)

 

Rudeness is an epidemic in our society and does not discriminate on ANY basis...

[maitaiguy]

This has been a very thought provoking thread to read.

 

I haven't cruised as much as most people on CC but my first two cruises were long enough ago to give me the "old school" experience that some have shared here. I agree with many of your opinions but what really jumped out at me was the cost from long ago and now. Cruising used to be much more expensive than it is now. Our Southward and Sun Viking cruises were priced at over $100 a day for a non holiday time period. Cruising is a huge bargain now.

 

As to service - our waiter on Monarch a week ago was as terrific as our best waiter ever, a man from Barbados whose name I can't remember on Sun Viking. Christavo, (Monarch waiter) made our party of 11 feel very special. We were the loudest table in the dining room, having the most fun. Christavo came back to our table one night when most other tables had already left and spent an additional few minutes with us. That is one of the things that makes cruising memorable IMO.

 

I hope that RCI does not go to anytime dining. We like to sit with strangers for a week and get to know people. When my wife and I go on a cruise we would not request a table for two, we prefer a table for about 8.

 

By the way, we got an email from Princess a couple of weeks ago advertising 7 night cruises in January and February to the Mexican Riviera starting at $349 for some weeks and $399 for others. How do you feed, house and entertain people for that amount of money? (Yes, I know this is the RCI board but I'm just trying to make a point about mass market cruise fares.)

 

Can't wait for Mariner to get to LA in 09 and try a Voyager class ship. Very disappointed that apparently RCI is not replacing Monarch and leaving the short cruise LA market to Carnival.

[Majesty Fan]

I have cruised plenty over the last 10 years. I met my husband on the Majesty. he was my waiter over 10 year ago. In Sept we did a 15 night on the Radiance it had been over a year since we had been on RCI. We had given Disney a try. We have no kids. The difference in service was huge. We will still book both lines. From the moment we got to LA it was nightmare. No RCI directing people. Finally my husband got irritated and we were put to the front of the line since we are diamond plus. When we got to deck 11 the bar staff wanted to get the coke cup deal which I always do over $100 on the 15 night cruise. But then the next day when I am by the pool and want it refilled they would rather serve someone who wants a corona. It was only the pool bar any other bar had no issues with it. The entertainment was not very good this time. We walked out of the Production show. it was horrible. The magic and jugle shows were good but the singers were geared to the 70+ people. We did however love Matt Yee. he is in my Car's Cd right now. Our cabin steward was from Indonesia andwas fantastic. The dinning room staff were both guys from India. I thought the food was really good.On the 15 night there were so many choices. Debarkation was a night mare. We did not get off until after 10am. We had first colors none of the cruise staff was doing there job. We had planned to go back to Hawaii but after the other cruise after ours had issues as well we opted for the Panama Canal in late Sept. I can see RCI has changed. We love the Radiance class it is our favorite class but have seen some significant changes that we do not like but do we want to switch? Yes/No. For the Caribbean we we will do Disney and any other cruise we will do RCI.

Lexi

[LuckiStac13*Majesty*]

AmyBear:

 

No, I didn't feel you were speaking strictly to me regarding people getting bored after so many cruises. No problem here :)

 

Also, I would like to note after reading quite a few posters mention how "funny" it is that people keep mentioning the decline in food. I was merely adding that to the overall discussion in the decline of RCI. I don't feel I was negative or overboard with saying the food was bad. I did not. I love the food onboad, and we are NOT picky in the least bit. I just meant that it's going downhill. No lobster, for one example. In my mind, that is flat-out cheap. I don't like those types of cutbacks because I don't think they're fair.

 

MajestyFan:

 

Lexi how's it going? Nice to see you around.

[teajak]

Great post amybear.

 

I like to add:

 

I find it extremely funny that people complain about diminishing food quality yet want to cruise cheaper and cheaper.

 

If you go back 10 or 20 years when the storage capabilities were limited in size and technology and mass food production was not as common as itis today, sure the food was better. It is much easier to feed 1500 passengers than 3000 or 4000. Fresher food is much more expensive as well.

 

The cruising industry has change with the demand of more and more offerings. RCI changed its tune in the 90s by saying "let's not just cruise but give people the opportunity to everything they want ON the ship whenever they want to". Mass maket cruise lines became 'resort style cruising' rather than cruising in a traditional sense.

 

The best example you see in dining habits by passengers. A gazillion years back it was part of the dining experience to sit with stranger, meet new people while dining. Today, passengers call for tables for two and scream for any time dining (which you have any given time you go to a restaurant). You see it in the attire. Formal nights are washed down, people don't care anymore. With the mass market and resort style cruising at the lowest possible rate you also have taken on a market of cruisers who want everything for the $1.50. And you get those who don't want to change from the daily routines (must have brown sugar). More and more rudeness enter the cruise market because those who couldn't afford cruising a few years back, do it now. The rush to the buffet lines like it is a sale at Walmart is more and more common, the forcing themselves onto the elevators without letting people get off first, like it is the very last elevator of the day, is creating a cruise picture which is more and more unattractive.

 

And you can extrapolate that onto the cruising staff. With bigger and bigger ships, cruise lines not only have to fill cabins but also staff. And with this mass search for staff you get a lot of employees who see it merely as a job not like it used to be when it was an honor to serve on a cruise ship because jobs were rather rare and hard to come by.

 

With the demand of flow riders, ice shows, etc and parties and more food and more of everything (which makes the resort style cruising) the intention of what made cruising a cruising experience is going more and more to the curb.

 

Obviously Royal Caribbean is selling off the smaller ships and its road to a true resort style cruising line is already paved.

 

I still like sailing RCI because I like the superior ship design in every class to its competitors. But I would reckon that eventually I will switch to Celebrity or an even smaller cruise line to keep the traditional cruising experience alive for me. I'd assume that this will happen in 2010 or 2011.

 

But my switch will have nothing to do with Royal Caribbean as a cruise line but rather with the quality of my fellow passengers. I don't want to be clogged up with people who rush, push, shove, complain, whine, sue and are total budget cruisers. I have those penny pinching, constant complainers, totally rude people every day of my life.

 

All three major cruise lines (NCL, Carnival, RCI) will go down this path and when it becomes overbearing I will make the switch and find another line. Right now I can consciously avoid those people but in time and with the increase of such passengers it will be harder and harder.

Excellant post and we agree with everything in it.

[partsbabe]

I'm not sure that I accept your premise to begin with and I certainly disagree with just about every point that you have made to prove it. The attitude of the staff we encounter, while it may vary to some degree from crew member to crew member, has been as friendly on our recent cruisers as it was when we first sailed with RCI 25 years ago and certainly has not suffered by the addition of staff from countries outside the Caribbean. Prices, if you adjust for inflation, are more of a bargain than ever. Just dig out those old brochures from years gone by and you will find that you can actually cruise now for less than you paid years ago, and on ships that are larger, more comfortable and with features that we would never have imagined when we first began cruising. Opinions about food are subjective and while there have been some changes such as the reduction in the number of midnight buffets etc, the number of dining options, even excluding the addition of extra charge restaurants, has increased significantly. Nostalgia is great but all too often it romanticizes the way things actually were in those "golden" times. The cry that everything is going downhill is not a new thing and is certainly not confined to cruising but it reminds me of the song from Bye Bye Birdie which asks about kids: "why can't they be like we were, perfect in every way?" Change is not always for the better, but then again it is not necessarily for the worse. :rolleyes:

 

 

well said

[jimdicap]

I agree with the post by FL_Cruiser64. All these posts lately have been about the decline in food. I have no comparision as I started cruising in 2006. Due to my own health and being caregiver to my sweet mother DH and I never were able to take a trip until she passed away. That said, we enjoy the smaller ships we have sailed over the "mega" ships. The rudeness on the larger, family freindly ships has been unbelieveable at times. I walk with a cane (better than the wheelchair I was in not long ago) and DH has to run blocker for me when we are on the Mariner! There was once I had the elevator door closed in my face by a pre-teenager who was just riding the elevator for fun and when the door opened he pushed the "closed" button so the door started closing just as I got to it. I threw my cane into the door to keep it open and got on despite his best effort to keep me off. We also had a parent on the last Mariner trip act as rudely as I have ever seen anyone in front of his children and other guests in response to a polite request from a crew member! The problem we see as new cruisers is what was stated before - the mentality of "it is my vacation and I can do as I please so get out of my way!" I had a woman cut me off 4 times on the way to the Windjammer and in line at the Windjammer (which was not crowded at the time) as if there would not be a morsel of food left for her!! She almost knocked me over, cane and all each time and did she care?? No. And that is the problem I see with cruising family oriented mass market ships. We will be Platinum after this next cruise and are seriosly planning on looking more at Celebrity than continuing on Royal because of the passanger mentality not the ships or Royal staff or food.

 

 

Read my prior note on statistics--The more people the more likely the low end of the probability curve will be with you.....the same for the high end. This is really a mathematical issue, not a "people" issue per say....

[jimdicap]

This has been a very thought provoking thread to read.

 

I haven't cruised as much as most people on CC but my first two cruises were long enough ago to give me the "old school" experience that some have shared here. I agree with many of your opinions but what really jumped out at me was the cost from long ago and now. Cruising used to be much more expensive than it is now. Our Southward and Sun Viking cruises were priced at over $100 a day for a non holiday time period. Cruising is a huge bargain now.

 

As to service - our waiter on Monarch a week ago was as terrific as our best waiter ever, a man from Barbados whose name I can't remember on Sun Viking. Christavo, (Monarch waiter) made our party of 11 feel very special. We were the loudest table in the dining room, having the most fun. Christavo came back to our table one night when most other tables had already left and spent an additional few minutes with us. That is one of the things that makes cruising memorable IMO.

 

I hope that RCI does not go to anytime dining. We like to sit with strangers for a week and get to know people. When my wife and I go on a cruise we would not request a table for two, we prefer a table for about 8.

 

By the way, we got an email from Princess a couple of weeks ago advertising 7 night cruises in January and February to the Mexican Riviera starting at $349 for some weeks and $399 for others. How do you feed, house and entertain people for that amount of money? (Yes, I know this is the RCI board but I'm just trying to make a point about mass market cruise fares.)

 

Can't wait for Mariner to get to LA in 09 and try a Voyager class ship. Very disappointed that apparently RCI is not replacing Monarch and leaving the short cruise LA market to Carnival.

 

 

My wife and I feel the same way about the table for 8! We did a Bermuda cruise on NCL, and hated the anytime dining. While we had one bad table on AOS last time, we met lifelong friends on Radiance. To us, this outweighs the bad table....

[jimdicap]

This has been a very thought provoking thread to read.

 

I haven't cruised as much as most people on CC but my first two cruises were long enough ago to give me the "old school" experience that some have shared here. I agree with many of your opinions but what really jumped out at me was the cost from long ago and now. Cruising used to be much more expensive than it is now. Our Southward and Sun Viking cruises were priced at over $100 a day for a non holiday time period. Cruising is a huge bargain now.

 

As to service - our waiter on Monarch a week ago was as terrific as our best waiter ever, a man from Barbados whose name I can't remember on Sun Viking. Christavo, (Monarch waiter) made our party of 11 feel very special. We were the loudest table in the dining room, having the most fun. Christavo came back to our table one night when most other tables had already left and spent an additional few minutes with us. That is one of the things that makes cruising memorable IMO.

 

I hope that RCI does not go to anytime dining. We like to sit with strangers for a week and get to know people. When my wife and I go on a cruise we would not request a table for two, we prefer a table for about 8.

 

By the way, we got an email from Princess a couple of weeks ago advertising 7 night cruises in January and February to the Mexican Riviera starting at $349 for some weeks and $399 for others. How do you feed, house and entertain people for that amount of money? (Yes, I know this is the RCI board but I'm just trying to make a point about mass market cruise fares.)

 

Can't wait for Mariner to get to LA in 09 and try a Voyager class ship. Very disappointed that apparently RCI is not replacing Monarch and leaving the short cruise LA market to Carnival.

 

AmyBear:

 

No, I didn't feel you were speaking strictly to me regarding people getting bored after so many cruises. No problem here :)

 

Also, I would like to note after reading quite a few posters mention how "funny" it is that people keep mentioning the decline in food. I was merely adding that to the overall discussion in the decline of RCI. I don't feel I was negative or overboard with saying the food was bad. I did not. I love the food onboad, and we are NOT picky in the least bit. I just meant that it's going downhill. No lobster, for one example. In my mind, that is flat-out cheap. I don't like those types of cutbacks because I don't think they're fair.

 

MajestyFan:

 

Lexi how's it going? Nice to see you around.

 

 

We are all better off with no lobster....Caribbean cruises use Caribbean lobster, which is tougher than Maine lobster due to the temperature of the water........Lobster from the North Atlantic is usually better......This come from people I know--I actually am allergic to lobster, but this concept made sense to me.

[jallison8378]

Great post, OP. I also went on my first cruise in 1997, at age 14, and have cruised once or twice a year since then.

Back then, I never would have thought that only 10 years later I would be cruising with my friends on my own dime. Cruising was an expensive luxury. But since then, RC's prices keep getting lower, and lower, and lower.... but I'm not complaining! I'm a 20-something making a pittance working for a politician and RC cruises provide the best bang for the buck!

It is too bad that cruising RC isn't the same high-class experience that it once was, but their target demographic has taken the line in a different direction. No biggie. I still enjoy my RC cruises, but I agree that it just isn't the same as it was 10 years ago, let alone 20 or more. Now days, you have to pay a pretty penny to re-live the "glory days" of cruising.

I will continue to sail RC until I can afford the luxury lines. Even though I am young, I prefer a more sophisticated, elegant atmosphere that RC is lacking.

[DeepWaterMariner]

It's a pretty simple answer to figure out. If you want to cruise like yesterday then step up to lines like Oceania, Silverseas, Seabourn and others. Right now I still feel like I am receiving more than my moneys worth on RCI and until that changes, they will be my cruise line of choice.

 

Actually Silverseas, Seabourn, or Regent aren't like how cruising use to be, at least not on the mainstream lines. They are better now than the mainstream lines have ever been. They are more like how Royal Viking or Norwegian American Line use to be which weren't mainstream. I think Crystal is more like some of the mainstream lines use to be if you go back 30 years or more. My feeling about the RCI is that they are following the Carnival business model, having different brands for different tastes in cruising. I think they have positioned (read that as changed) Royal Caribbean for the younger and perhaps less experienced cruiser, Celebrity for the older or more sophisticated (at least in their own minds) cruiser, and Azmara for the more affluent and well traveled. In doing so they have caused some of us older cruisers to find another mainstream line that provides a product that is a better fit for our tastes. For us that line is Princess, HAL, or Celebrity.