Dissapointed and saddened by celebrity summit experience

[flag fan]

That is disappointing. I have been on four regular cruises (and one gay charter, which doesn't count) and never experienced any negative reactions, including a sailing on the Summit, but then I don't know what people are saying behind my back. I thought cruise passengers were relatively open-minded about gay people, or at least too focused on their own good times to worry about other passengers' orientation; your experience goes against that assumption. I think you are great for being so supportive and it's great that your son and his partner are open about their relationship (in a socially appropriate way) so kudos to all of you. I'm sorry your son and partner had a bad experience, but in the long run they are helping create a more tolerant world by not being intimidated by the hostility of others. You should be proud of yourself for standing up for your son and handling a difficult situation well. Thank you.

[COMBOY]

Schnoobie you have every right to rant and I hope you find a lot of comfort here. I am sorry you had to suffer the ugly head of homophobia first hand. You can see how hurtful it can be. There is just no justification for their behavior and these types of people should not be taking cruise vacations. They should say in their homes away from the rest of society. I'm not sure why they assume they were gay or in a relationship or what prompted these people's behavior. Clearly they knew and they didn't like it one bit and wanted everyone to know it to boot! All they had to do was be polite, eat and leave and change tables the following night. I feel sad for people that internalize hatred to such a ugly extent. Unless the boys were doing something inappropriate like kissing or touching each other at the table then it's their problem, their lost and only make them look bad. Your son and his partner should be so lucky to have a mother like you. You did the right thing by taking the high road. There isn't anything else you could do other then change tables and moving on to enjoy your cruise. You paid for it; you have every right to fully enjoy it. That being said I hope this doesn't stop you from cruising. Thanks for your post.

[fridayeyes]

I'm so sorry for what happened to you and your family. It was simply inexcusable.

 

I'm a professional female who often cruises solo. When I request my dinner seating, I specifically *ask* to be seated at a table with cabins shared by two adult males. I have never been disappointed, and I've had great times every single time.

 

Please do let Celebrity know that you were poorly treated.

[getfuzzy]

I would report this event to the cruise line and really go on about it. Don't just talk to whomever answers the phone. Ask for the "Big Guys". Nothing may come of it, but at least you will have voiced your concerns!!!!!!! I hate that you had this problem. My partner and I only cruise on Carnival. They seem to have a good track record concerning bigotted people. We have received a couple of looks, but no major comments. If we did receive any, I would be quick to reply.

[Bramcruiser]

I just wanted to ensure our OP that her experience is thankful the exception rather than the norm. We're a gay male couple who have only done regular cruises to date and rarely encounter much that would be construed as outright bigotry.

 

I think you did the right thing by asking to move and making the outspoken comments you did. Its only through embarrassing bigots that they will be put into their place.

 

Thankful, most people on cruises are worldly travellers and very accepting. But each cruise is different and the same line on the same iteniary can have two totally different types of passengers one week to the next.

 

The worse that has ever happened to us was an older trailer-trash type of couple (yes, I know I'm stereotyping here) who acted like the world was theirs and proceeded not only to snub us but the other straight couple at our table. This all on the QM2 on a Caribbean cruise. To make a long story short they moved to another table the second night and the remaining four of us had a table for six the rest of the week. We all had a good time and were glad that the other two disappeared.

 

Please don't let this incident stop your family and your son and his partner from venturing out into future cruises. I doubt your experience will be repeated again.

 

David

[teacher_md]

What a horrible experience. You go mom! Good for you - standing up the ignorance.

 

I have been on MANY mainstream cruises and have never had an experience like this. I never felt like passengers or staff were homophobic. I have seen passengers and staff a little bit uncomfortable, but it always seemed like they weren't coming from a bad place.

 

We have been pretty lucky about the people we've been seated with, I think.

[DonkeyB]

This is probably going to be long but I have to get this off my chest.

I just returned from The Summit. Traveled from NY to San Juan with my mother, myself, My 22 year old (med student) son and his 24 yr old partner. Both well mannered, polite, charming and handsome (ok, so I'm biased, but there is a point...) we had planned a family vacation and a romantic time for them all in one...I shared suite with my mother so not so much romance for me but thats another story.... Anyway...........

All seemed fine until our 1st dinner, table for 8 seating the 4 of us and 2 straight couples late 40s & early 50s traveling together. Friendly chit chat etc although I noticed a few sideways glances at the boys (who I thought were oblivious, since they were eating like they were starving!)

The area was very loud so halfway throuhg dinner I spoke to the maitre d' about getting a different table. Unfortunatly, I was told that there wasn't anywhere else for a group of 4 to be seated. I returned to the table and continued the chatter with our table mates but my mother told be she overheard some disgustingly derogatory comments about the boys. I then noticed that they had changed their seating so that the 2 women were sitting near the boys now....Mind you, we were all sitting politely eating and talking; not drunk or rude in any way...I felt my head getting ready to spin and I so wanted to throw my water in their face....but, I didn't wan't to make a scene, so we excused ourselves politely.

Next night before dinner I spoke to maitre d' again to see if they had found us a new table but was told the same thing, no space. then I explained the prior night's experience, the maitre d' went away for a moment and when he returned he told me that our tablemates had requested a change after dinner the previous night so a table for 4 was created for THEM elsewhere. We now sat at a huge table by ourselves like we had plague but the homophobes were gone so whatever.....

next night at the blackjack table one of the men sat next to me without noticing...I rather loudly said (to no one in particular) that it seemed that there were many ignorant closed minded individuals on board and the jerk got up and literally ran away saying "I don't want to play at this table anyway". We had had a few drinks so we practically pee'd ourselves over that one.

Still later in the week I was in the ladies room while my son waited for me outside. Several women came in, talking about my son while they waited on line. One said "we were seated with them the 1st night, they were all over each other" (lying cow!) another answered that "that was disgusting and that homosexuals should not be allowed onboard, public pools!" The 1st one said, "the matre d' understood and he moved us right away".

At that point I came out to wash my hands - if looks could kill I'd be in jail right now ... all 3 dropped their eyes and ran out of the bathroom.

I was furious and I know the boys were upset by this whole thing ...their so young, not as thick skinned as some....Gay or straight we do understand that certain behaviors are innappropriate in public, it's not like they were having sex on the table for god's sake! They were just sitting there attempting polite (yet boring) dinner conversation.

...I know bigotry exists but it was just awful, I've never experienced it firsthand.......sorta turned me off cruising, but it wasn't the cruiseline but the clientele. I know there are specific "gay cruises" but Why should they not enjoy whatever trip they choose just because some middle american ***** can't cope?

Any comments? I'm afraid I sound like a fool myself but I just had to rant...

I am so sorry to read this!

I wish we had known and been able to help sort out something with you...

You were a really great fun family group and a very very caring group too.

Nobody deserves to have to put up with this kind of bigotry.

I hope I can be half as good to my family as I witnessed you to be with yours.

Our dining was early, and we had nobody to share our table with, it would seem maybe we got off light.

Lori, it was a pleasure to meet you and your mother and the handsome boys too.

 

Karen

[marzke]

We've been on a number of cruises and have learned that

 

(1) "the gay group" can get a table for four just as easy as the homophobes did - you just have to tell the Maitre'd that your tablemates were making insulting comments about you during the meal and you'd prefer to sit elsewhere.

 

(2) the homophobes can get in big trouble if they continue to harass you. We've seen a straight man get removed from a ship and left in port for continuing, loud comments he made about a gay couple onboard (he seemed to follow them around all the time just to make fun of them - it was weird). But the Hotel director/Captain kicked him off mid-cruise.

 

(3) My partner and I always "couples dance" together: we like to Country Western two-step, and we generally dance at the Captain's party/returning cruisers party. We've heard a lot of men make snide comments, but a lot more women say they wish their husbands could dance like we can. We've even danced in "barn dances" on a ship - all the men took it in stride when they had to dance with me or my partner rather than a woman.

[Cunard Rules]

My partner and I have done 30+ cruises (many with my parents who are in their 6o's) and never had any issues on any of the ships we have been on.

So I think you were just REALLY unlucky.

We come from England and travel on Cunard, P & O and many other cruise lines but out of all of them we have found Cunard to be just that little bit more gay friendly.

Transatlantic Cunard voyages are usually the best for having a good mix of straight / gay passengers and if you want to go to "friends of Dorothy" it is there and if you don't then don't.

Nightclub can occassionally be a bit quiet some nights but there are usually a few people up till the wee small hours.

As everyone else has said DON'T be put off, you just got some narrow minded people.

[WhiteDane]

I guess no place is immune from pea brains. The upsetting or surprising behavior was really with the maitre 'd. It's his job to take care of everybody. What a poor sense of judgment. I think I'd take his name and raise cane with the cruise line. And if they didn't fix the problem, I'd probably raise cane via the web all over this planet with his name. I did that once with a world wide retail chain. The VP contacted me to make things right. I wrote a synopsis of what happened, similar to yours here, and then copied and pasted it to every review website I could find. If they googled any sentence from my rant, it pulled up all the places I posted it. No doubt it caught their attention.

 

What a bunch of hags. But they're everywhere. Glad your son is doing his own thing and not letting it get him down. There will be more.

[PoseidonGodoftheSea]

I'm sorry this happened to you and your family. It reminded me so much of my own experiences when I've been with my family and "remarks" were made about gay people; my parents would be fuming about it, while I just let it roll off.

 

The one thing I don't understand is your request to be moved getting denied. I've only sailed on HAL, and suite guests are always accomodated with those types of requests. And obviously in this case there were tables available too. But maybe X is different.

 

And one more thing, your self-control was/is amazing! That whole dining room would have heard my snide remarks.

[CAR0612]

OMG i am in a Fukin rage right now over your experience.

 

I am going on a cruise with my gay son on June 29th and plan on having a ball. He is a flamer and if anyone with a narrow mind gives me one look I will be ready.

 

So sorry you had to deal with disappointment on your cruise. Having a transgendered daughter, gay son and a gay step-son, I don't look at others expressions for acceptance. When we go out we have fun and if anyone doesn't accept us its their problem not ours.

 

I do remember the days I looked at others and when I saw their disgust it made me feel bad but now i just say FU.. In the future just have fun and enjoy yourselves.

 

I just hope this cruise was not ruined for you. Don't let others take your joy from you, you can not get the time with you son back.

[2buggers]

My partner and I have experienced homophobia on several cruises. Once, while waiting on a line for something, a man turned around and asked my partner "Are you Queer?". I quickly chimed in and said "He's Gay - you're Queer". He said nothing and turned around.

Most often I ignore the comments or give them a raised eyebrow but this guy was an imbecile; and there are many out there.

 

Albert Einstein said: "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."

[beccab]

schnoobie, you have my sympathy for what happened. It is very painful when there is an offense against one's child even when they are adults. There is no shortage of bigoted, insensitive, ignorant and racist folks in the world. They are the ones missing out. On the other hand, there are a lot of nice accepting people. Hopefully, these will be the ones you encounter in the future.

[GlasgowGuy]

Hi schnoobie,

 

So sorry to read about your experience with the homophobic idiots. Well done to you for keeping a cool head.

 

My partner and I have been on a few cruises and have been fortunate not to encounter such inexcusable behaviour from a fellow passenger which is just as well as we Scots are not known for 'keepin thi heid' if we have been insulted ;)

 

Happy cruising for the future,

 

GG

[nycruiser80]

First off I must say you are a wonderful mother to recognize and respect your son and his partner. I wish and hope my family could do that one day. How nice and refreshing it is to hear that. So many of us wish we could have that positive recognition from our family especially our parents. Instead I feel like I am treated like I am the big family secret.

 

Anyway, I have cruised extensively with my partner and have had only small issues on one cruise otherwise we never have problems. We usually dine alone as I don't want to put up with any problems however on my last cruise we sat with others and it was wonderful. By the end of the crusie they figured we were a couple and they were so very nice to us! On one cruise (Carnival) we have had a few people stare at us but I just stared back and wouldn't stop staring.... that of course makes most people uncomfortable and they won't look anymore. Not sure why they look? We DO NOT show public affection in any way shape or form unlike others. I was on one cruise (Carnival again) and there was this straight couple who were heavily making out in the pool. They come out of the pool and the guy was obviously VERY VERY happy after his makeout session....if you catch my drift.....He stood at the edge of the pool saluting everyone for a good 5 min or so!:eek: All the while kids and families were there and this guys walks around like nothing is going on. Being a teacher that disgust me, complete perv! If I was a parent I would have been a little upset over that. But for most people they view that as permissable because they are a straight couple so its okay. Its the great double standard.

 

Sorry for ranting...nevertheless most cruises I have been on with my man are great never had major problems. Please cruise again maybe go on a Rosie cruise so you can all go?

[apollobeach]

My Partner and I just returned from a HAL(ms Zaandam) cruise to Hawaii, and we know just what you and your Son and his Partner went through.......the stares; the comments - four people were sitting at a table in The Lido when my Partner walked by; one of the "ladies"(I use that term loosely) said to the other three....."those boys just make me sick." When they left I said to my Partner - "such small minded people should stay home." The "lady" who made the comment heard me, turned around then hurried out of the restaurant.

 

We are a retired couple, and are not making out on the Grand Staircase. We went about our business, and so many of our smiles were met with sneers. We purposely sit at a table for two so we can avoid the small-minded bigots at dinner.

 

People should live and let live, period. As I always say to my Partner - some folks just should not travel. My Mom suffered harassment in the 1960's for being a working single Mom; there is no place for hatred, bigotry and harassment, period, especially when a cruise vacation is meant to be enjoyed.

 

Kudos to you, your Son and his Partner - we'd love to cruise with you someday!

[baronsteel]

How sad that such bigotry still exists. As a gay man, I am about to embark on my first cruise within a week. I am traveling with a gay couple that have been on 2 Carnival Cruises, and they report that they have been very well received by all. I sure hope you will give cruising a second shot, and I will be following this thread to see what response you get from the cruise line.

[ikelmay]

I'm still angry that the maitre d' didn't treat this the right way and support your request - it should have been sorted out early and you should not have been put in the position you were in.

[MarkBearSF]

You go, Mom!

 

- I'm heartened to hear such great stories of support by family members of teh GLBT community.

 

- I agree both that it's important for you to register a complaint with Celebrity and that you likely won't see a measurable response, but you've still gotta' get it on the record.

 

- Finally, I'd like to share my experiences after 20 cruises since 1987. (This includes 2 gay charters.) The experience you describe is highly unusual. We have always been treated with the respect that we demand and deserve on all our cruises. Although most often, we're at tables for two or traveling with friends or family, in the half-dozen or so cases, we've had wonderful (straight) dining companions - mostly married couples. We've also been treated will by crew and staff in ALL cases. Have there been glares from the occasional fools amongst other passengers? Sure - but I suspect that will always be the case (and not just for gays!).

 

To those who say they book all-gay charters because they're afraid of being treated badly on "straight" cruises - don't worry. There are a number of advantages to an all-gay cruise (and costs - they ain't cheap!) - but we have never felt inhibited onboard. We travel as a couple and introduce each other as such (now we can say "husband") and have not encountered problems. ...and this is on just about all of the lines, from the dirt-cheapest NCL departure from Lousiana, to a Queen's Grill crossing on the QE2.

 

Mark & Steve

[dcc617]

Hi schnoobie,

 

So sorry to read about your experience with the homophobic idiots. Well done to you for keeping a cool head.

 

My partner and I have been on a few cruises and have been fortunate not to encounter such inexcusable behaviour from a fellow passenger which is just as well as we Scots are not known for 'keepin thi heid' if we have been insulted ;)

 

Happy cruising for the future,

 

GG

 

My partner and I have been on several cruises and have never experienced any problems. In fact, we had a wonderful time a few years ago. We were seated at a table of six. It was us, another gay couple and a straight couple. As we all introduced each other, the couple introduced themselves as Gary and Mickey. Gary is a mechanic on the south side of Chicago. I thought - - gawd - here we go. They were the nicest, most accepting people I've met in a long time. We ended up palling around with them most of the cruise. When we told them about an FOD party we were going to, they were very curious and started asking details. "What is it', 'Why Dorothy', etc. When I explained the reference, the immediatly said how cool that was and could they join us. I said of course - they'd be our honory Toto. I thought they'd bust a gut. We had more fun with them than the other gay couple.

 

We leave a week from today with a large group of people we met 2 years ago on another cruise, mostly straight. All of them are warm, accepting people. We can't wait.

 

The point of the story - hate and ignorance is all around us. They're the ones missing out on a good time, not us.

[adventuregrrl]

...I know bigotry exists but it was just awful, I've never experienced it firsthand.......sorta turned me off cruising, but it wasn't the cruiseline but the clientele. I know there are specific "gay cruises" but Why should they not enjoy whatever trip they choose just because some middle american ***** can't cope?

Any comments? I'm afraid I sound like a fool myself but I just had to rant...

 

What a lousy experience! Your son is lucky to have an accepting mom. My gal and I haven't had any problems on the 2 cruises we've been on with my parents. In fact, other passengers have acted pretty accepting.

 

I agree with others that you should let Celebrity know about the other passenger's perception of the maitre d'.

[yosam]

I recently sailed on Celebrity Century with two girlfriends. While hanging out in the hot tub we met a young man named Preston who was traveling by himself. Preston immediately let us know in no uncertain terms that he was gay. As if that was going to bother us. We had a blast with him. Hopefully we made his cruise a little more enjoyable, I know he did ours. My younger brother is gay and I am trying to get him to go on a cruise. Hopefully he does not encounter the same treatment that your son and partner did. It's sad that in this day and age that some people still have the mentality that they do. Don't let that experience sour you or your son from cruising. Trust me there are quite a few people who will not judge and welcome you just as you are.

[SanDiegoCruisers]

I'm 33 and have sailed on 16 cruises - most of which have been on Celebrity - but have sailed on HAL, Cunard, NCL, Princess, and RCCL. Each time, I've enjoyed our tablemates and have actually kept in contact with many of the straight couples we have met over the years. It appears that you were placed with some close-minded individuals the first night that soured remaing days.

 

Unfortunately, everyone can't be as accepting as we would like. But, I'm also a realist and though I'm gay and not ashamed of it, I do understand and appreciate different points of view. Not everyone has the same upbringing and I try to take a step back and think what environment the person may be coming from that has them formulating their thoughts this way. Though it does not excuse their behavior in my mind, it allows me to place things in perspective and recognize that everyone is entitled to their opinions; what's more important (for me) is how I allow it to affect me.

 

Just my two cents. I still feel your pain.

[movie buff]

I always feel so sad when I hear of someone having a bad experience like this. My partner and I have been on over 40 cruises (all straight). And to me its like anything else we have experienced in life. There are alot of very rude people around. ( and some of them gay by the way). But overall we have met so many lovely people on many of our cruises and have made some wonderful life long friends (all straight couples). We have been invited and traveled all over the united states and been guests in there homes and vice versa. So I hope your don't measure this unhappy experience as the norm. When we encounter this kind of stuff on cruises (or in life general) we just rise above it and enjoy our life and the many great friends we have made over the years.:)