RyderJ201

I don't care. It's not positions we tip in the real world. When you tip the laundry staff at the next hotel you stay at, we will talk. When you find a job washing sheets for a hotel that also pays tips, we will talk. Till then I live in this world. Not everyone gets a tip because there employer's are too cheap.

Huh??? There are tipped positions and non tipped positions. That's the way all positions are advertised. That is the reality. Do you hear yourself when you say something like that???

Not most. And sure doesn't include the cleaning crew etc. Not a fare comparison to the insane amount that get tipped from cruise line tipping pools.

Good for Canada.

Not if you don't want them to be by removing automatic gratuities.

Tips are in addition to pay. When working in a tipped position. Not a non tipped position.

Your playing word games. Tips are tips. Pay is pay. The percentage they receive from each is not the issue with anyone in this conversation.

And I'm sure they factor for the percentage that remove the automatic gratuities. And based on what I've read on the other thread about to tip extra or not to. It seems more people are getting ready to join the removing club. Cruise lines (hotels/restaurants at sea) get away with dumping there financial responsibility to "behind the scenes" employees on the customer's. It's a scam I refuse to participate in. Paying those employees is what our cruise fare is for. Not 100% profits. They are not tipped positions. I'll tip my waiter. You pay your laundry staff out of profits. That's how I feel about it.

I'm no longer sure what we have been arguing about? I don't see tipping as paying, it's tipping, but who cares. I thought you believed it was our moral responsibility to consider "behind the scenes" people before removing automatic gratuities and that we hurt them by doing so? That somehow that responsibility of subsidizing those workers salaries falls on us? Maybe you don't feel that way and I misunderstood?

I'll give you this one. I don't think the base salary is so great. That's only an assumption. But people take the jobs because it's still a lot more than in their own country.

Hahaha. You literally ran out of comebacks. It's your job to tip something for good service. Tipping for good service is not paying anyone. It's not your job to pre tip for possible good service or to tip people who don't serve you.

The "not my job to pay them" is about the "behind the scenes" people. Nobody here has said they don't believe in not tipping servers for good service. It's tipping those you do not see (and automatic gratuities tipping for possible bad service from actual servers) that is in question.

Because tipping "servers" is about the quality of their services.

Ah you said it "servers" in land based restaurants. You tip servers. You don't tip "behind the scenes" employees. That's the employer's job.

Let me just say I don't say these things in hopes of anyone tipping less and certainly not tipping at all. Everyone should do what works best for them.

Never ment you personally shaming. It's just the place so many go directly to. Enjoy.

Again, based on the lists I've seen and quick math. You never answered my question. Would proof of percentage effect how you tip?

Nobody who keeps the automatic gratuities on this site or tips extra is silent. LOL. And you can give every last cent you have. I don't care. Not everyone has that luxury. Some have to save every penny to afford the voyage and afford what we consider normal tipping practices on land. Everyone do you. But don't shame how others do or how they view this situation. Again, the real bad guys are the cruise lines who want us to pay the works salaries.

Fact. A percentage of passengers on each and every voyage remove the automatic gratuities. I doubt you need proof to believe this. Fact. A percentage of all passengers don't remove automatic gratuities. Fact. Crew still continue to sign on, work, and continue living. And just an additional observation. I read the thread asking if people are still tipping extra on top of automatic gratuities just now. It's maybe 10 or 20 pages long. I noticed in the course of conversation at least half a dozen people said they are considering removing auto grats for the first time because of the increase in amount vs what the people who actually serve them are getting vs what those folks won't get when they stop tipping extra. So more and more people are considering taking good care of just those that wait on them and leaving the big cruise corporations to make up the rest. In the end nobody should be made to feel bad for only wanting to tip the way they would anyplace else.

If I had written proof it was 15% would that be enough to convince you to stop paying automatic gratuities?

The amount of names per page and amount of pages on the list I've seen when being added to it. But I'm sure I'm the only person who removes them so nothing for you lot to worry about.

Not exactly. Only with few exceptions like waiting tables. We don't tip kitchen staff. We don't tip cleaning staff in a restaurant or hotel. Just the waiters, housekeeping, bell men carrying our bags. Cooks, cleaners, maintenance staff of hotels and restaurants AKA " Behind the scenes " people get a salary. No cut of gratuities is involved. It's only on cruises we are expected to subsidize 1500 to 3000 people's salary. (25% of crew, 50%, 75% some are Very hung up on this number). Hotels, restaurants, resorts all pay salary to " behind the scenes " employees. Only cruise lines dump this guilt trip on customers to save on profits.

And I don't believe it's fair to expect the customer to tip a percentage to staff they never see. That's not the custom anywhere else. Everywhere else you only tip those who directly provide you with a service. Everyone mentions the crew in the back doing a good job. What about the one's who do a rotten job? They get an equal cut too. I'm sure some are great. Just as I'm sure some stink. But we ever talk about them. We don't know who's done what. Why? We never see these people. Is it fair that waiters get tips, but people washing sheets in hotels don’t? A gratuity is a tip for good service. People behind the scenes do a job, not provide a service. And jobs come with wages. That's where a percentage of passage charged to customers should go.

Like I said All, 50%, whatever. No dishonest use. Just shorter to type than x amount of %. A large number of. What's the difference if it's all or 2000 out of 3000? It's still way more than should be on my plate. The fact is what removing automatic gratuities effects is not my problem. Don't count on my money. I never agreed to it. Again, I don't care about the financial implications of automatic gratuities on behind the scenes people. I can't care. It's not my job to fix the problems of the world. I do what I feel is my part. Its a shame so many are brainwashed into feeling it's there responsibility to make up for what the cruise lines save as profit, that should be payroll.

"All" or 50% of crew. 75% of crew. Whatever. Still too many people that I have no contact with.