"Never again in the Haven"

[1witchydiva]

No - but my only saving grace is that I am the onle who usually does all of the planning. They just kinda go with the flow LOL

 

Lol. :). I am also keeping it a secret from the family. I have been keeping it to myself since October, 2011. The day latitude members could book. I am about to explode but I have not spilled the beans yet. :)

 

 

Sent using the Cruise Critic forums app

[NYteacher]

I paid for an upsell to a suite a couple of years ago--our first suite. When I lead my family over to the suite check in area he smiled and said "what did you do?". Then, when we had a butler come take our carry ons and escort us to the suite waiting room he actually got a little panicky--like I went into debt for the cruise.

 

We had a Fabulous! Cruise!

[cruise4kicks]

Maybe Norwegian needs to ditch the "Haven" concept and just go back to calling it the Courtyard? :confused:

[mommyto2girls]

Maybe Norwegian needs to ditch the "Haven" concept and just go back to calling it the Courtyard? :confused:

 

And how will that help to enforce any rules? Our first cruise on the Jewel was when it was still the Courtyard, we had a wonderful family with a Nanny next door to us. The children were well behaved and a pleasure to sail with fro 10 days.

 

Maybe parents just need to teach their children manners, and as I stated in my letter to NCL maybe they need posted rules that are actually enforced. The sense of entitlement that we have seen by some in the Haven is somewhat disturbing.

 

Just my opinion, I will continue to cruise the Gem because I love it but next time there will be video if it happen again.

[cruise4kicks]

And how will that help to enforce any rules?

 

Therein lies the problem... there are no rules.

[mommyto2girls]

Therein lies the problem... there are no rules.

 

And again I repeat posted rules that are enforced.

[SissasMomE]

The rules aren't enforced on the pool deck either .... this seems like it's really the same issue. I guess there are obnoxious people no matter which cabin you sail in. Unfortunately, NCL can't (and shouldn't have to) babysit people or teach a person common courtesy. It sure doesn't make it easy, though, for those of us who are spending 10k and more on these suites. I'm not going to cancel, but really, if it wasn't for the fact that my husband prefers the balcony to the pool deck, I would have probably cancelled this suite because of the horror stories. It's just too much money to spend to be miserable. The kids are one thing. I would not hesitate for a second to remove pool toys from a hot tub, but drunken, obnoxious, low class adults are an entirely different beast.

[Burpelson]

This thread shows that there is a serious problem.

 

Luckily, there is a solution, should NCL step up.

 

1. There should be clearly stated rules about behavior, monitoring, and consequences.

 

2. They should be enforced.

 

In the kids clubs, kids can be kicked out. What if kids are in hot tubs where they shouldn't be, kicking water in people's eyes and drinks, etc. etc.? After a warning or two, I'd suggest financial penalties? (same for badly misbehaving adults too). And then eventual disembarkation as a family, per the alcohol rules? I could see how crazy kids could get things that far, if no adults ever stepped up, even after fines.

 

I think posting of videos of crazy behavior in the Haven would have very quick effects! I believe videos would quickly reduce the reputation of the Haven, b/c to see on video what is described would be gut wrenching. The written descriptions are bad enough! NCL would hopefully not tolerate that, and indeed the very floating of the idea should catch their attention. This must be one of the more painful threads going for them.

 

I'm not saying the Haven should be for oldster fogies only - I'm bringing kids there. But my kids will behave and will be polite. They will also bring their smiles as they enjoy, along with everyone else. I hope all will be smiling! That's all I'm aiming for.

[Nalagh]

This thread shows that there is a serious problem.

 

Luckily, there is a solution, should NCL step up.

 

1. There should be clearly stated rules about behavior, monitoring, and consequences.

 

2. They should be enforced.

 

In the kids clubs, kids can be kicked out. What if kids are in hot tubs where they shouldn't be, kicking water in people's eyes and drinks, etc. etc.? After a warning or two, I'd suggest financial penalties? (same for badly misbehaving adults too). And then eventual disembarkation as a family, per the alcohol rules? I could see how crazy kids could get things that far, if no adults ever stepped up, even after fines.

 

I think posting of videos of crazy behavior in the Haven would have very quick effects! I believe videos would quickly reduce the reputation of the Haven, b/c to see on video what is described would be gut wrenching. The written descriptions are bad enough! NCL would hopefully not tolerate that, and indeed the very floating of the idea should catch their attention. This must be one of the more painful threads going for them.

 

I'm not saying the Haven should be for oldster fogies only - I'm bringing kids there. But my kids will behave and will be polite. They will also bring their smiles as they enjoy, along with everyone else. I hope all will be smiling! That's all I'm aiming for.

 

I could not agree more!

[SuiteCruiser]

I could not agree more!

 

Cherie, what's going on? We've been worried about you!

[Nalagh]

The BA comes down to math, and the ratio of family suites to suites for 2 is not on my side. Not sure that all of those S4s (over 120 places) will work out for the haven as promised to be ensured as tranquil. I do not feel this is the current intention of the Haven. Too many suites for 6 for that to be true imho. People pay for a private pool as it seems these days, not a quite private tranquil area.

 

I require transparency as to the Haven's future intentions. Daniel does not wish to go on the next trip in September. I had to talk him into it, like "we will lose our money if we do not go".

 

I have had a very long work week. NCL HAS returned my call but I was at work when they called.

 

I will call them back on Monday, but it seems they do wish to listen.

 

 

Cherie

cherie.leblanc@gmail.com

[SuiteCruiser]

The BA comes down to math, and the ratio of family suites to suites for 2 is not on my side. Not sure that all of those S4s (over 120 places) will work out for the haven as promised to be ensured as tranquil. I do not feel this is the current intention of the Haven. Too many suites for 6 for that to be true imho. People pay for a private pool as it seems these days, not a quite private tranquil area.

 

I require transparency as to the Haven's future intentions. Daniel does not wish to go on the next trip in September. I had to talk him into it, like "we will lose our money if we do not go".

 

I have had a very long work week. NCL HAS returned my call but I was at work when they called.

 

I will call them back on Monday, but it seems they do wish to listen.

 

 

Cherie

cherie.leblanc@gmail.com

 

I hope your talks with them on Monday are fruitful. Hopefully September will be so good that Daniel is ready to book another one. That time of year is promising for less kids. We're on the Breakaway in March, in the DOS and a 2 bedroom suite, and hope things calm down by then. We have had Haven access before but never used it, this time we'll be staying right in the Haven and the ability to relax there was a large factor in laying out all of that money.

 

Thanks for keeping this up and fighting for us all. I think you need a massive hug, so I'm sending one your way.

[cruise4kicks]

At this point I do feel like I should add an addendum to my "infamous event" post... It was not as if the crew did absolutely nothing. When the woman tried to engage me in a physical confrontation, we reported it to our butler, who went to the concierge. Security reviewed the tapes, saw what happened, and had a talk with the woman telling her to not have any interaction with me for the rest of the sailing. That helps somewhat, but doesn't help the fact that we couldn't help but run into them all over the ship, not just the courtyard, and she was obviously very hostile, creating a hostile environment for me. :(

[david_sobe]

I think we all agree and are sympathetic to the situation. But one thing that never gets mentioned is the times people have posted on CC when they actually complained to the concierge or to NCL staff about children in the adult hot tubs on the main pool deck.

Remember what the response was? The response is always the same: "We are a family company and families should be allowed to have fun on vacation"

That is a HUGE burden for any cruise line to start policing children while on vacation. It is a very touchy subject. This is why the "adult areas" on ALL cruise lines are being expanded. The Sanctuary on Princess is now 30% larger and other cruise lines now have multiple adult only areas. I still say having an adults area only section of the Haven would solve this problem.

[Burpelson]

I don't think the problem is so much that NCL has to police children. But they have to identify problem situations and correct them. Which in this case is to contact parents with warnings and then penalties - based on clearly stated policies in the first place.

 

Parents have to police their children, or pay the price. I feel sorry for all of them in terms of life trajectories. But not in terms of NCL protecting the well being of its rule abiding passengers.

 

NCL has to step up.

[Aurora2143]

I shared this thread with my DH and he shared that the Haven wasn't as tranquil and relaxing for him and his son on this last cruise as I originally expressed. He just didn't want to hurt my feelings because I had worked so hard to plan this last trip.

With that said, we are on the Breakaway in February (just the two of us) and he said that if the Haven is the same as this last trip or worse, we will stick to RCCL because of their Solarium.

He felt that it's ridiculous to spend all that extra money for the haven and if you want real tranquility on the Breakaway, you have to pay extra. He feels it's BS.

So hopefully, NCL will do something about this "tranquility" issue before February (or before september for Cherie's sake), or we're not sailing on NCL anymore...which makes me sad.

[Nalagh]

IMHO, NCL needs to be decisive at this point. They are at a " Y " and are required to take a path. I do not care which path they take, just so long as it is clear, as are our expectations for our vacation money. I would never book an S4 because of the small balcony. I am a balcony brat, or maybe just a brat. However, this brat wants to know and report to her husband what we will get for our hard earned dollars.

 

This thread has been enormously enlightening to me. Some have written that they understand the current model of the Haven, but they book it to have a neighbourhood pool. Regardless of the written and published intention of the Haven by Norwegian, unless people respect the intended product, we will not have it.

 

The Jewel class ships that spirited the Haven, were designed by a different CEO. The Epic is very different, and Mr. Sheehan came in in the middle of the process. Now, the Breakaway and it is all him. What do we have? We have a lot of family suites and no rules regarding behavior in the haven. I do not believe his vision of the haven is one of tranquillity, but rather a family space to be upbeat and provide family fun.

 

This feels like roulette to me. Transparency is necessary, not just for this issue, but for potential issues such as, renovations on ships that may affect your stateroom and balcony, booking deck 8 on 3 of the Jewel class ships as well as the star and her sister, or booking the cabin in what was the Spinnaker with windows that leak.

 

Transparency is necessary,

 

Cherie

cherie.leblanc@gmail.com

[Aurora2143]

IMHO, NCL needs to be decisive at this point. They are at a " Y " and are required to take a path. I do not care which path they take, just so long as it is clear, as are our expectations for our vacation money. I would never book an S4 because of the small balcony. I am a balcony brat, or maybe just a brat. However, this brat wants to know and report to her husband what we will get for our hard earned dollars.

 

This thread has been enormously enlightening to me. Some have written that they understand the current model of the Haven, but they book it to have a neighbourhood pool. Regardless of the written and published intention of the Haven by Norwegian, unless people respect the intended product, we will not have it.

 

The Jewel class ships that spirited the Haven, were designed by a different CEO. The Epic is very different, and Mr. Sheehan came in in the middle of the process. Now, the Breakaway and it is all him. What do we have? We have a lot of family suites and no rules regarding behavior in the haven. I do not believe his vision of the haven is one of tranquillity, but rather a family space to be upbeat and provide family fun.

 

This feels like roulette to me. Transparency is necessary, not just for this issue, but for potential issues such as, renovations on ships that may affect your stateroom and balcony, booking deck 8 on 3 of the Jewel class ships as well as the star and her sister, or booking the cabin in what was the Spinnaker with windows that leak.

 

Transparency is necessary,

 

Cherie

cherie.leblanc@gmail.com

 

DH said that they never got to go in the pool because of the kids always occupied the pool. But when they saw the hot tub FINALLY available, they rushed out to it and we're stared down until they got out less than 30 minutes later. I think parents need to start taking their kids out to the main pool, or NCL come up with a Solarium type idea like RCCL.

[psycomac]

At the risk of playing devil's advocate (or just being a voice of...alternative opinion?) I didn't actually want to book our suite based upon Haven access. I will be booking for the room, not for the Haven. Yes, breakfast and lunch through Cagney's will be a lovely perk but we plan on taking advantage of that perk in suite because of the guests we'll have with us in a non-suite cabin. We'll order breakfast for all of us and have it in our room. I might feel differently (probably WOULD feel differently) if I was booking as a couple sans DD (and SS's). As it is, I don't see us getting much use of the Haven as a relaxation/get away spot simply because the dynamic of the area does not fit with how we will be travelling this time. I would not subject my DD or the other residents of the area to her behavior as she's only 4, doesn't know how to swim so the plunge pool is not a good idea and, quite frankly, she's very boisterous, loud and a typical 4 yo.

 

But again that's to do with me and my beliefs and the way I'm trying to raise her. But on the same note I would be the first person to be getting in someone's face if they were being (insert word I can't say here without getting a virtual nose slap from the moderators via email). I refuse to allow people to be rude in public and I'm not shy about demonstrating that.

 

As far as I am concerned, the people who abuse areas like this are no better than bullies. And I refuse to abide bullies.

[Aurora2143]

At the risk of playing devil's advocate (or just being a voice of...alternative opinion?) I didn't actually want to book our suite based upon Haven access. I will be booking for the room, not for the Haven. Yes, breakfast and lunch through Cagney's will be a lovely perk but we plan on taking advantage of that perk in suite because of the guests we'll have with us in a non-suite cabin. We'll order breakfast for all of us and have it in our room. I might feel differently (probably WOULD feel differently) if I was booking as a couple sans DD (and SS's). As it is, I don't see us getting much use of the Haven as a relaxation/get away spot simply because the dynamic of the area does not fit with how we will be travelling this time. I would not subject my DD or the other residents of the area to her behavior as she's only 4, doesn't know how to swim so the plunge pool is not a good idea and, quite frankly, she's very boisterous, loud and a typical 4 yo.

 

But again that's to do with me and my beliefs and the way I'm trying to raise her. But on the same note I would be the first person to be getting in someone's face if they were being (insert word I can't say here without getting a virtual nose slap from the moderators via email). I refuse to allow people to be rude in public and I'm not shy about demonstrating that.

 

As far as I am concerned, the people who abuse areas like this are no better than bullies. And I refuse to abide bullies.

 

Girl, you're gonna love it then. I didn't go into the Haven to enjoy the pool, but I LOVED MY BUTLER!!! My email is mpfullenwider@wildblue.net. Let me know if you have questions.

[Aurora2143]

So, I'm going to play devil's advocate here.

 

Many of the complaint on here have been about ONE family or group.

Imagine you're the good family with the good kids...

Yup..you've all been all over these threads defending YOUR PERFECT KIDS. Well, what will YOU DO?

YOU SPENT ALL THIS MONEY SO THAT YOU, YOUR FAMILY, ESPECIALLY KIDS could enjoy a private rich kids's pool, but...you're taking away from the TRANQUILITY!!!

Do you think about that? No? Would you pay extra for an exclusive kids area? Because we adult are now asked to pay extra for it. Would ya?

[psycomac]

Girl, you're gonna love it then. I didn't go into the Haven to enjoy the pool, but I LOVED MY BUTLER!!! My email is mpfullenwider@wildblue.net. Let me know if you have questions.

 

I really cannot wait...I swear I was born to be rich but there was a mixup at the astral waiting room or something because I definitely don't have the financial background to want to live this way lol. My husband is like 'I don't care about the room' blah blah blah...I'm all...."OH WHAT??? WE'RE GOING ALL FANCY PANTS MISTER!!" lol

[psycomac]

So, I'm going to play devil's advocate here.

 

Many of the complaint on here have been about ONE family or group.

Imagine you're the good family with the good kids...

Yup..you've all been all over these threads defending YOUR PERFECT KIDS. Well, what will YOU DO?

YOU SPENT ALL THIS MONEY SO THAT YOU, YOUR FAMILY, ESPECIALLY KIDS could enjoy a private rich kids's pool, but...you're taking away from the TRANQUILITY!!!

Do you think about that? No? Would you pay extra for an exclusive kids area? Because we adult are now asked to pay extra for it. Would ya?

 

Like I said, not paying for "The Haven"...paying for "the room"

 

But, if you're talking about people will well behaved children (and well behaved adults in general) then no, they're not taking away from "the tranquility"

 

If you're going to make dividing lines like this, then you need to make the ADULTS who are taking away from the "tranquility" pay extra...like the 6 females traveling in a suite who were acting like morons in the area...they're not a family with kids, they're 6 females who don't know how to behave like adults. You can't ask people to pay extra for something when it isn't just their 'demographic' that is causing problems.

[Nalagh]

Like I said, not paying for "The Haven"...paying for "the room"

 

But, if you're talking about people will well behaved children (and well behaved adults in general) then no, they're not taking away from "the tranquility"

 

If you're going to make dividing lines like this, then you need to make the ADULTS who are taking away from the "tranquility" pay extra...like the 6 females traveling in a suite who were acting like morons in the area...they're not a family with kids, they're 6 females who don't know how to behave like adults. You can't ask people to pay extra for something when it isn't just their 'demographic' that is causing problems.

 

I am not trying to be the morel benchmark for the Haven. NCL created, published and required my funds to reserve it.

 

Yes, I have never sailed in a cabin that was not a suite. I also always choose a Haven in the event that that the ship is equipped.

 

I do, as you and everyone who chooses the Haven, pays a premium for it. If you were to pay $20,000 for a car let's say, you would expect the car to come with the promised and promoted features. Well, we paid that for a week. Yes, we got a bigger cabin for the week, but in the rain our patio area was unusable. We wanted to use the Haven, but the EXTREME behavior deemed the Haven usless for it's intended published marketed purpose.

 

Again, with all due respect,

 

Cherie

[psycomac]

I am not trying to be the morel benchmark for the Haven. NCL created, published and required my funds to reserve it.

 

Yes, I have never sailed in a cabin that was not a suite. I also always choose a Haven in the event that that the ship is equipped.

 

I do, as you and everyone who chooses the Haven, pays a premium for it. If you were to pay $20,000 for a car let's say, you would expect the car to come with the promised and promoted features. Well, we paid that for a week. Yes, we got a bigger cabin for the week, but in the rain our patio area was unusable. We wanted to use the Haven, but the EXTREME behavior deemed the Haven usless for it's intended published marketed purpose.

 

Again, with all due respect,

 

Cherie

 

I think you misunderstood the purpose of my post, I was addressing specifically the question raised by Aurora in my quoted posting of hers. I fully agree with your issues regarding recent haven experiences (as is evidenced by my own posting regarding my complete and total refusal to abide bullies, which these people are by their behavior in the aforementioned area). I was only attempting to reply to her question regarding defense of my 'well behaved' child with regard to how we travel. I'll defend my child's behavior (as you would yours) because she's not one of those that would behave (or be allowed to behave) in the manner which has been described here in this thread.

 

And as I've stated a couple of times, I'll be one of the first to get in the face of any child or adult who acts like a nimrod in public and intrudes on the personal space of others. I do it on a daily basis at work, I can't see that changing in my private life, especially where my hard earned and spent money is concerned.

 

Had I been in the situation you (and others) have described, either NCL staff would have been removing them, or I would have made their lives so uncomfortable that they would have removed themselves. I'm not shy about speaking up and I'll do it repeatedly. As rude as some people can be by way of their loud and annoying behavior, I can be just as rude through my refusal to accept and acquiesce to such behavior.