smeyer418 Posted June 2, 2006 #26 Share Posted June 2, 2006 What constitutes a material change (the ship saying a change is not material is NOT controling) and whether something is out of the ship's control are different questions. For the latter, one would have to know when the itinerary was set and when the G-8 timing was known. If the G-8 is the reason for the change in itinerary and this was only recently known, a court may be more sympathetic about the change. I feel very sad for the OP, but it is easier to accept if it's the G-8 causing the problem than a private charter. The interesting thing about this thread, is how countries which have stricter consumer protection laws have different boiler plate provisions in the NCL contract, and it points out the travesty of this country not fighting for the same for its consumers. Its frankly the difference between a laissez faire country and a more socialist one. The UK/EU is much more protectionist than the US. Also it would be considered a state issue not a federal government one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calmac Posted June 2, 2006 #27 Share Posted June 2, 2006 This is the official NCL "notice" posted sometime today (2nd June) on NCL's US website (nothing that I have been able to find on the NCL UK site). http://www.ncl.com/download/itn_changes/dream_baltic_capitals_g8summit.pdf The part which is "refund-related" is "Although these circumstances are beyond our control, we understand that this itinerary is not the itinerary that was originally purchased. We would like to offer a $100 per person (maximum $200 per cabin) onboard credit, applicable to all items excluding the casino and service charges, for all guests who would like to continue on this voyage. If guests wish to move to any other Norwegian Dream Baltic Capital voyage in the 2006 or 2007 season, NCL will protect their current fare on any of these voyages, based on availability and offer a $100 per person (maximum $200 per cabin) onboard credit to help offset any costs associated with this change. If guests choose to move to any another Norwegian Dream Baltic Capital voyage they must do so by no later than Friday, June 16, 2006. Should guests wish to cancel their cruise, they must do so by Wednesday, June 7, 2006 and will receive a full refund." Interestingly, we were scheduled to be on this cruise but discovered that the G8 Summit seemed to be calling for the closure of the port so decided to bite the bullet and change to the following cruise. We had to PAY £25 per person (3 of us) for the privilege (but peace of mind). Gmatthew, I hope you are able to find a suitable solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuvBNatC Posted June 2, 2006 #28 Share Posted June 2, 2006 Contact your TA or NCL directly and see if you can transfer your booking to another cruise. I once missed an SS Norway sailing out of Southampton because thunderstorms prevented me from leaving the U.S. NCL's first offer was to reimburse me if I was willing at my own expense to fly to Sweden and spend two days there to meet the ship, losing 2 days of the cruise. I declined, but I counter-offered to move the booking to another sailing a month later. They agreed, and I paid no penalty. It's worth a try, especially since the change is NCL's fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmwman Posted June 3, 2006 #29 Share Posted June 3, 2006 I am not a lawyer but any contract made in thr Uk will subject to the Unfair Contract Terms act and no matter how thorough a company thinks it is it will ultimatly be a judge who decides if the terms were unfair EVEN if you signed them. Therefore there are two possible challenges one this act and then if the definition of material is fair. Matriality is completely subjective and in my view the same facts can be found to be either. Just depends on the weighting in your judgement that you give the facts. But hey a holday is a holiday enjoy and forget lawyers they are more expensive than holidays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1st time crusier Posted June 4, 2006 #30 Share Posted June 4, 2006 So let me get this right, if you have insurance and something changes you will be ok? It doesn't matter for what reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Host CMLA Posted June 4, 2006 #31 Share Posted June 4, 2006 Thats alot of days at sea. Im just wondering if you paid by credit card for the deposit? You aren't/didn't get what you paid for so maybe they can help you fight Ncl and keep Ncl from charging your card for a penalty plus get your full deposit refunded. Obviously if it wasn't for the change you would love to be on this cruise. I don't care about who's to blame you didn't/aren't get what you purchased and should get a full credit with no penalty or if ncl wanted to be nice give you full credit for your deposit plus the 25% off a future cruise. 5 days at sea is brutal. If you feel your not going to enjoy this cruise because of the changes then don't go. Good luck! Five days at sea isn't brutal. Also, it won't do any good challenging the charge with the credit card company. If you read the fine print of the contract, NCL does not guarantee you that you'll make it to any ports of call. You are guaranteed a certain number of nights on the ship. Of course people book the cruise for the ports but if you don't make it to the ports, the cruise line has covered its end as far as refunds are concerned. In this case, it looks like NCL is going to let people change their cruise. But they don't have to and if you dispute the charge with the credit card you're only delaying the inevitable. I may look into this cruise. I bet there will be some great rates. I've already done the Baltic trip and don't mind missing Russia. I bet the airfare would be terrible though. :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electricron Posted June 5, 2006 #32 Share Posted June 5, 2006 Here's the revised itinerary Mon London (Dover), England 4:00pm Tue Transit of the Kiel Canal Wed Copenhagen, Denmark Noon 7:30 pm Thu Berlin (Warnemunde), Germany 7:00 am 9:00 pm Fri At Sea Sat Stockholm (Nynaeshamn), Sweden 7:00 am 6:00 pm Sun Helsinki, Finland 1:00 pm 10:00 pm Mon Tallinn, Estonia 8:00 am 5:00 pm Tue St. Petersburg, Russia 8:00 am 8:00 pm Wed At Sea Thu At Sea Fri At Sea Sat London (Dover), England 5:00 am Here's the regular itinerary Mon London (Dover), England - - 4:00pm Tue Transit of the Kiel Canal - - - - Wed Warnemunde (Berlin), Germany 7:00am 9:00pm Thu Cruise Baltic Sea - - - - Fri Tallinn, Estonia 8:00am 5:00pm Sat St. Petersburg, Russia 8:00am overnight Sun St. Petersburg, Russia - - 7:00pm Mon Helsinki, Finland 8:00am 4:30pm Tue Stockholm, Sweden 8:00am 4:30pm Cruise Swedish Archipelagos Wed Copenhagen, Denmark 7:00pm overnight Thu Copenhagen, Denmark - - 12:00pm Fri Cruise North Sea - - - - Sat London (Dover), England 5:00am You still get to every port, although there's no overnights on this revised itinerary. It's not NCL's fault the G8 summit caused the itinerary change. What NCL has offered, for a changed itinerary without actually losing any ports, is very generous, imho. (1) $100 per person (maximum $200 per cabin) onboard credit, applicable to all items excluding the casino and service charges, for all guests who would like to continue on this voyage. (2) If guests wish to move to any other Norwegian Dream Baltic Capital voyage in the 2006 or 2007 season, NCL will protect their current fare on any of these voyages, based on availability and offer a $100 per person (maximum $200 per cabin) onboard credit to help offset any costs associated with this change. If guests choose to move to any another Norwegian Dream Baltic Capital voyage they must do so by no later than Friday, June 16, 2006. (3) Should guests wish to cancel their cruise, they must do so by Wednesday, June 7, 2006 and will receive a full refund. It's up to you to decide to take the same voyage, trade cruising dates, or get a full refund. Over a months warning, and several days to decide, is very fair...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoreguy Posted June 5, 2006 #33 Share Posted June 5, 2006 So let me get this right, if you have insurance and something changes you will be ok? It doesn't matter for what reason. Absolutely not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaxon41 Posted June 5, 2006 #34 Share Posted June 5, 2006 Shoreguy, Actually, it still comes down to knowledge -- if the ship knew that the port was going to be closed because of the G8 and advertised and sold an itinerary anyway ..... I am not saying the line did know, just saying what was known when would determine if something was out of one's control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MortgageChick Posted June 5, 2006 #35 Share Posted June 5, 2006 This statement does not make sense to me. "If the cruise you have booked isn't til late this year or next year and final payment has not been made, you may lose your deposit. Having said that, if you contact your TA, they could possibly get the deposit back for you by arguing your corner for you." Why would you lose your deposit if final payment has not been made?? Oceanbreeze -October 1995-5 night W. Caribbean Destiny -May 1999-7 night Eastern Caribbean NCL Majesty- August 2000 -7 night Bermuda NCL Sun-November 2001-13 night Repo Boston to MIA Paradise-May 2002- 10 nights S Caribbean Carnival Legend-Sept 2002-15 night Transatlantic Crossing Royal Olympia Voyager-Feb 2003-15 night Amazon River Rotterdam- June 2003-7 night Canada-New England Enchantment of the Seas-Sept 1 2003-5 nights Cozumel and Belize Costa Mediterranea- December 14 2003 Western Caribbean Oosterdam-March 14th 2004- 7 nights Eastern Caribbean Westerdam Nov 12 2004- 17 nights Barcelona to Fort Lauderdale Mercury Feb 7 2005- 11 nights Mexican Riviera Summit Sept 16 2005 – 14 Nights Vancouver-Alaska-LA Galaxy Dec 29th 2005-11 nights Panama Canal Carnival Victory June 13 2006- Canada New England RCL Jewel of the Seas- Oct 31 2006- 12 nights Boston-Bermuda-S Caribbean-FLL Carnival Spirit April 2007- 12 nights to Hawaii Navigator of the Seas November 5 2007- 13 nights Southampton to FLL TA Crossing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaxon41 Posted June 5, 2006 #36 Share Posted June 5, 2006 The G-8 Summit has been announced for a while, but it wasn't until the end of April that they decided to close the port - at the request of the US Secret Service. You should've seen the uproar over on the Celebrity board, because one of their sailings completely lost St. Petersburg and ended up going to Warnemunde instead. Celebrity announced it before final payment was due - but one family didn't see the change until afterwards. I would certainly hope that any line would notify each and every person by email, or phone, who was under deposit of the change before final payment, if possible. I have always had to call for final payment and have it added to my cc -- that would be the time for the person on the other end of the phone to be sure the client knew of the changes before accepting final payment. Just cruious, why would the secret service think the port should be closed, I wonder. I think back of the G8 the summer before 9/11 -- what I recall reading at the time was that Condi and Pres (secret service) were worried about rumors/ suspicions of a plane being used as a missle and as a result stayed on some ship/barge thingy in the middle of a body of water. Gosh, can't remember where it was that summer -- I'm thinking Italy. Wonder if some big whigs will be staying on ships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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