Understanding NCL Freestyle - A synopsis

[jimswims]

Thank you for the synopsis sjbdtz.

 

Based on my limited experiences on NCL, I found it informative and accurate. We leave on the Spirit on Saturday. I hope to keep gaining more freestyle experiences on NCL ships in the future.

[tomluvsaida]

These comments are MOSTLY fact but as with everything (attire, smuggling, etc) some will always get away with something. I have seen people denied entry into the dining room while wearing shorts and jeans. It happens and it's not always an empty threat. But again, some will always get away with something. Did I miss the funny part of what Stephen said? Where's the joke? On NCL ships the tip is added to your account at the end of every day. You can change the amount if you feel the service was unacceptable. Having it added to your account is a convenience but under no circumstances do you HAVE to keep the tip on your account. If you feel the service was great and you'd tip anyway...why not take advantage of the convenience of having it on your account already? I didn't realize tipping was a secret and the cruising public didn't realize they needed to tip. If everyone knows they'll need to tip, why is having it added automatically now become some big scandal of the passengers paying the staff's wages? That's how it's always been. This is so far from the truth. Before, when the staff was tipped manually at the end of the cruise, the cruise line had no idea who was getting big tips and who got very little. If you get big tips, you must be a good staff person. If your tips are low, you might need some training. Now that the cruise line distributes the tip money based on seniority and feedback from passengers, the cruise line can see where they need to work on things. And if getting promoted and getting more tips isn't an incentive, I don't know what is. You must have had some bad experience on a cruise to feel this way. I've reported problems to reception and got results. No fantasy world there. Again, you must have had a big problem that wasn't resolved. Many people here have talked about big issues and had them resolved. I don't understand your walk the plank statement. NCL will take alcohol from you if they find it. That's a FACT that can be verified by members here. Yes, it's a business. But again, I think you must have had a pretty bad experience. And if you really feel this way...why do you keep cruising?

I think your last sentence says it all Cecelia:

..."And if you really feel this way...why do you keep cruising?" ....He apparently also owns a time machine because he listed Two NCL Cruises, and one Celebrity Cruise that "he's been on" that are in the future :D (as of today 8/13/06).

NCL Jewel 11/2006

Celebrity Centry 3/2007

NCL Pearl to Alaska 7/2007

[Host CMLA]

I think your last sentence says it all Cecelia:

..."And if you really feel this way...why do you keep cruising?" ....He apparently also owns a time machine because he listed Two NCL Cruises, and one Celebrity Cruise that "he's been on" that are in the future :D (as of today 8/13/06).

NCL Jewel 11/2006

Celebrity Centry 3/2007

NCL Pearl to Alaska 7/2007

I think that just means he's booked on those three future cruises. However, my question about why he's still going to cruise is a valid one when he feels so strongly about things that happen on cruise ships. I could understand feeling the way he does and not cruising again. But to speak about NCL's practices the way he does and then have two cruises booked with NCL...it just doesn't add up to me. And I honestly feel from reading his post that he must have had something pretty bad happen on a cruise for him to think talking to reception and getting a resolution is a fantasy world, it's a joke to have auto tipping and to think the cruise line doesn't care about the passengers. Sure, they don't send a Christmas card or come over for your birthday. But all the cruise lines are interested in guest satisfaction because guest satisfaction equals repeat business and that means money to them. It makes more sense to please passengers than it does to blow them off and wait for the next group to board.

[sunshine 229]

I think that just means he's booked on those three future cruises. However, my question about why he's still going to cruise is a valid one when he feels so strongly about things that happen on cruise ships. I could understand feeling the way he does and not cruising again. But to speak about NCL's practices the way he does and then have two cruises booked with NCL...it just doesn't add up to me. And I honestly feel from reading his post that he must have had something pretty bad happen on a cruise for him to think talking to reception and getting a resolution is a fantasy world, it's a joke to have auto tipping and to think the cruise line doesn't care about the passengers. Sure, they don't send a Christmas card or come over for your birthday. But all the cruise lines are interested in guest satisfaction because guest satisfaction equals repeat business and that means money to them. It makes more sense to please passengers than it does to blow them off and wait for the next group to board.

 

Before things get too scary because too many people are agreeing with you,:) I'm going to disagree with something you said above, or maybe not disagree, but add another view point at least.

 

I too think it would make more sense to try to keep repeat customers by trying to satisfy them and not do things that were likely to annoy, but there have been a few occasions in the last little while where I've felt that the actions of some of the cruiselines don't seem to show this. The way they have handled some situations gave the impression, to me at least, that they took the position: so what if we annoy these customers, there's more where they came from.

 

It does not make sense to me, as a way to do business, but still to take NCL for instance, since this is the NCL board, the way they handled the problems surrounding the PO Aloha launch, and the way they dealt with passengers who were booked on the Dream, last summer, when the ship was having engine problems over a long period of time, gave the impression that they were way more concerned about short term income than they were about keeping those as satisfied customers.

[tomluvsaida]

I think that just means he's booked on those three future cruises. However, my question about why he's still going to cruise is a valid one when he feels so strongly about things that happen on cruise ships. I could understand feeling the way he does and not cruising again. But to speak about NCL's practices the way he does and then have two cruises booked with NCL...it just doesn't add up to me. And I honestly feel from reading his post that he must have had something pretty bad happen on a cruise for him to think talking to reception and getting a resolution is a fantasy world, it's a joke to have auto tipping and to think the cruise line doesn't care about the passengers. Sure, they don't send a Christmas card or come over for your birthday. But all the cruise lines are interested in guest satisfaction because guest satisfaction equals repeat business and that means money to them. It makes more sense to please passengers than it does to blow them off and wait for the next group to board.

I know Cecilia, just having a little fun with what he said, that's all.:D You're right though, his comments and his "supposed crusing experiences":rolleyes: don't make a bit of sense. Also don't you think it's odd he never posted before. (We may be talking to a ten year old that's never crused and is bored with video games.):p

[Host CMLA]

I too think it would make more sense to try to keep repeat customers by trying to satisfy them and not do things that were likely to annoy, but there have been a few occasions in the last little while where I've felt that the actions of some of the cruiselines don't seem to show this. The way they have handled some situations gave the impression, to me at least, that they took the position: so what if we annoy these customers, there's more where they came from.

Even scarier...I do agree with you to a certain extent. ;) However, there comes a time in any business relationship that you have to decide if the problem you're having with a customer is worth the amount of money they may or may not give you in the future. Those types of customers are called dogs. I'm not making that up. That's what they're really called in advertising/marketing circles. At some point the price you have to pay to keep a customer becomes too much and you have to cut your losses. If I've learned anything from these boards it's that sometimes there are passengers that will never be satisfied with whatever they're offered to fix a problem. So while some people here talk about how NCL handled a situation badly, we can't be sure it's the cruise line that's the whole problem. But again, I do agree with you that it is possible that NCL or any other line has handled things badly in the past.

[mbisson]

Is this fiction or fact?

 

The bottom line is cruising is a business.

Steve

 

Steve,

I deleted everything in you post I believe is fiction. So, we agree cruising is a business and your name is Steve (and I have no way of verifying the second thing we agree on)

 

-Monte

[1derful]

Thanks for all the Info SJBDTZ!

 

I just wanted to add this from the NCL Website:

Below are a few exceptions to the dining room dress code:

 

Blue Jeans will be allowed in all dining rooms on all Houston departures, due to the Texas culture.

Blue Jeans will be allowed in the Trattoria's in the evenings.

Bermuda shorts with knee high socks, or Scottish kilts with knee highs will also be allowed in all dining rooms in Bermuda as these are considered formal dress in Bermuda.

Hawaiian shirts are allowed with proper slacks in all dining rooms.

Ladies Capri Pants, which are a length between the knee and ankles, are acceptable in all fine dining rooms as long as they are not blue jean capris.

[shoreguy]

Sure, they don't send a Christmas card or come over for your birthday. But all the cruise lines are interested in guest satisfaction because guest satisfaction equals repeat business and that means money to them. It makes more sense to please passengers than it does to blow them off and wait for the next group to board.

 

But they do send Christmas cards ;) Still waiting for someone to stop by for a birthday:D

[steveaaaa]

I think that just means he's booked on those three future cruises. However, my question about why he's still going to cruise is a valid one when he feels so strongly about things that happen on cruise ships. I could understand feeling the way he does and not cruising again. But to speak about NCL's practices the way he does and then have two cruises booked with NCL...it just doesn't add up to me. And I honestly feel from reading his post that he must have had something pretty bad happen on a cruise for him to think talking to reception and getting a resolution is a fantasy world, it's a joke to have auto tipping and to think the cruise line doesn't care about the passengers. Sure, they don't send a Christmas card or come over for your birthday. But all the cruise lines are interested in guest satisfaction because guest satisfaction equals repeat business and that means money to them. It makes more sense to please passengers than it does to blow them off and wait for the next group to board.

Wow, I guess I was a little rough in my original reply,was not really intended to be that way,more in the line of everything is not that easy or perfect.:eek:

To answer your question host. I go almost for free all the time.I earn tens of thousands worth of points every month on various credit cards.Don't get me wrong I love cruises,just not the resolution of issues when they occur.Yes I have had some bad stuff happen.Every thing from getting the wrong cabin (inside instead of outside) and being given a $140 room credit for it,which was the difference in what the rate was that I paid for it.I have had a wet room because of a sprinkler blowing 1 floor up.I have had plumbing problems ect.I have listed the major cruises I have taken.I have actually been on many smaller ones for 2 night cruises and there are problems everywhere. I travel allot and I have had many issues with hotels and airlines also.The problem with the ships is they are almost always booked solid so a room change is not possible until the first port.My bottom line is, I travel all the time and there are greater chances of issues happening.I have just had my share of the larger ones.

I was generalizing the cruise industry as a whole and not NCLs practices themselves.

As far as tipping goes...why call it tipping?Why call it a service charge at all?Is the captain paid from it?If not,why not?What is the distinction from the captian being paid from the fare and certian crew members from the service charge?Its all a game if you ask me. It all boils down to some technicality.They don't want to include tips because it increases the price.I wonder if the service fee portion of a cruise is deductable on your taxes if cruising for business purposes?

 

mbisson..Yes I am real.I just get a bug up my ...:D every now and then.I am early forties and retired in sunny Florida. I have even been on a CC group cruise.The Conquestadors a few years back.I have also been on shore excursions with other CCers on other cruises arranged thru CC boards.

 

Steve

[John&Charlie]

Many Thanks for all the info on this post, we booked NCL Dawn in Oct last minute after our original cruise got cancelled and I knew very little about NCL and I was a little worried about some of the reviews I'd read, but I it would appear people are complaining about them being 'different' rather a poor service.

As a Brit I like the idea of them automatically putting the tip on my account as I usually over tip as I'm so unsure! I think the only thing I'll miss is eating with the same people every night, last year we made some very good friends on our dinning table, but then I can't have it all can I?!

Charlie

[Retired not Expired]

Many Thanks for all the info on this post, we booked NCL Dawn in Oct last minute after our original cruise got cancelled and I knew very little about NCL and I was a little worried about some of the reviews I'd read, but I it would appear people are complaining about them being 'different' rather a poor service.

 

As a Brit I like the idea of them automatically putting the tip on my account as I usually over tip as I'm so unsure! I think the only thing I'll miss is eating with the same people every night, last year we made some very good friends on our dinning table, but then I can't have it all can I?!

 

Charlie

 

One thing you can do is when you go to eat and they ask if you are willing to share a table, tell them yes. This can help get you in quicker if they are busy and you will get to meet a lot of new people. Sometimes we've met people and decided to meet again for dinner.

 

And if the people you are seated with is a dud, you won't have to dine with them the next time.:o

[shoreguy]

It all boils down to some technicality.They don't want to include tips because it increases the price.I wonder if the service fee portion of a cruise is deductable on your taxes if cruising for business purposes?

 

 

I believe that technicality is tax based. The tips go direct to the crew and I would guess with some accounting magic not reported as income or as an expense on the books.

 

Plus the price issue - It is still possible to tip at the end of the cruise in cash on a traditional ship so no reason to add it to the fare. That does not work on a Freestyle ship and the whole program almost collapsed before the service charge was put in place. In the early days few if any carried cash to tip as you go and NCL was at risk of losing there best staff.

 

If NCL just adds it to the fare they will be disadvantaged in the market against traditional ship pricing.

[sjbdtz]

I was generalizing the cruise industry as a whole and not NCLs practices themselves. Steve

 

Steve, this is something you're entirely entitled to....except that my thread is referring VERY specifically to NCL, and in particular to differentiating NCL from other cruiselines.

 

You coming in & discussing generalities just muddies the water.

 

That's the reason you got raked....

 

The irony of it all, is that NCL doesn't refer to it as tipping. They refer to it as a Service Charge, from which team members are incentivized in addition to their pay rate...according to some structure which they understand.

 

What irks me is people who haven't experienced Freestyle coming in & discussing how much they PREFER giving out envelopes to SOME of the staff (thereby stiffing others), because they like the look of gratitude on the staffmember's face. It's just SO reminicent of yes'masser; thank you masser.... that horrific episode in American history where different races were subjugated & the only niceties they experienced were a result of the beneficence of the "tipper" (for all intents & purposes).

 

The automatic system rewards people with whom one doesn't interact (and who would not receive any envelopes), while ensuring that everybody else doesn't get stiffed. Not having to bow & humble oneself to the tip-giver is only an ancillary benefit.

 

NCL has a no tipping required policy. It's part of the definition of Freestyle. It's made possible by the automatic service charge, which can be reduced in extenuating circumstances.

 

That's the message I wanted to make clear....and it's specific to NCL.

[seahorse]

Haven`t been on the main board for awhile. This thread is interesting.

 

Reply to comments.......Businesses are made up of individuals purchasing a product.........you always care about your individual customers.

 

That said........I have been known to "fire" some individual clients:eek: if they are "dogs" as Cecilia calls them:)

[muzicgal]

I have been on 5 cruises so far and have my first one booked with NCL next month. I really appreciate all of the advice on freestyle because I didn't know anything about it. I like having the tip or service charge being added automatically. Even if I had 3 meals out and the service wasn't spectacular I would still spend 10.00 a day on tips just for meals!

 

I guess I have been lucky, I have never had to complain about anything. I think it takes a lot to get me upset when I am relaxed and on vacation.

 

42 days to the Crown!

 

Laurie

[hotspur]

I wonder if the service fee portion of a cruise is deductable on your taxes if cruising for business purposes?

I don't know why it wouldn't be. If you have a "business" dinner the tip for the waiter would be deductible. If you take a cab to call on a customer the tip for the cabbie is deductible.

[sjbdtz]

I wonder if the service fee portion of a cruise is deductable on your taxes if cruising for business purposes?

 

Why would it matter? You're retired in your forties in sunny FL, remember? :rolleyes:

[steveaaaa]

I don't know why it wouldn't be. If you have a "business" dinner the tip for the waiter would be deductible. If you take a cab to call on a customer the tip for the cabbie is deductible.

 

It did not work out right.I was only able to deduct about 30% as it was considered meals and entertainment (in a restuarant). On the cruise ships, I was able to deduct the whole cruise fare including port charges and taxes but not the gratuities for all officers and shareholders for our annual meeting.That is why I would love it all added into the fare.It does not get broken down.

Steve

[Jett456]

I just returned from the Sun last week. While on a shuttle bus I had the pleasure of conversing with a group from a HAL ship. They asked me how I liked eating in the buffet all the time. They assumed that Freestyle had no formal nights or set times and that meant eating in the buffet every night. I was also asked if NCL's food was really as bad as she heard from her travel agent. There are a lot of misconceptions out there about NCL. I heard from a staff member on the Sun that when cruisers praise a staff member by name on the comment cards they earn points that go towards how much they share in the tip pool. Seniority and level of service count as well. So, there certainly is incentive for the staff to try hard to please.

[Lady Patriot]

Like everything else, Freestyle has its good and bad points.

 

While the Majesty didn't have tickers (or whatever they're called), on Formal Night they put our names on a list, and we went and got our formal pics. We showed up at 7:00 and had to wait about an hour. They came out and called our names. After that we learned to dine at off-peak times whenever possible.

[sunshine 229]

What irks me is people who haven't experienced Freestyle coming in & discussing how much they PREFER giving out envelopes to SOME of the staff (thereby stiffing others), because they like the look of gratitude on the staffmember's face. It's just SO reminicent of yes'masser; thank you masser.... that horrific episode in American history where different races were subjugated & the only niceties they experienced were a result of the beneficence of the "tipper" (for all intents & purposes).

 

quote]

 

I've seen comments like this before and I just don't get it.

 

If I go to a restaurant at home and nothing horrendous happens in the way of service, I leave a tip. If service is extra good I leave a larger than usual tip and I also usually thank the server for making the meal a very nice experience. I've never yet had one of the waiters reply yes'masser, thank you'masser.

 

When I get a haircut, I also usually hand the hairdresser a tip and give a thank you, if I have been happy with the service. Once again at no time have I received a yes'masser.

 

These people work for their money, they provide service and they earn our appreciation and a monetary reward. I do not see anything demeaning about that.

 

When I hear these comments from people, it makes me suspect that they are reflecting their own discomfort with tipping and I do wonder if it is because they are the ones who think that being in a service position is somehow demeaning or makes those people inferior to them.Maybe they feel the tipping action must be uncomfortable for those receiving it because it highlights the fact that the person giving the tip is superior to the person receiving it.( In their minds).

[MrLee]

But they do send Christmas cards ;) Still waiting for someone to stop by for a birthday:D

 

Who cares if they stop by as long as they send a gift! :rolleyes:

(A free cruise would be nice!):p

[shoreguy]

Who cares if they stop by as long as they send a gift! :rolleyes:

(A free cruise would be nice!):p

 

Heck I am still waiting for a free upgrade :rolleyes:

[mbisson]

These people work for their money, they provide service and they earn our appreciation and a monetary reward. I do not see anything demeaning about that.

 

I know (from your sig line) that you haven't cruised NCLA, but I have to ask if you've cruised NCL since freestyle came about and if so how have you handled tipping those who deserved it?

 

IMO-freestyle just isn't conducive to the traditional method of tipping. Yes, it would work in the case of the cabin steward, sort of-if the "teams" pooled their tips among themselves.

 

-Monte