Disabled Courtesy

[sscruising]

We just returned from RC Explorer on Sunday out of NJ-10 day cruise-with my MIL who was using a wheelchair & my SIL who was using a walker. While we thoroughly enjoyed the trip, I was appalled at the rudeness of many of the passengers toward my relatives. It was particularly bad at the elevators. We would be waiting at the elevator which sometimes took a while & just as an elevator became available, people behind us would push past us to beat us on the elevator.:eek: I usually spoke up & most of the time was able to get them on the elevator, but their behavior was deplorable. I also saw the same thing happen to other passengers using wheelchairs & other devices & cannot believe how rude people have become! We even encountered similar problems getting on & off tenders. People would literally nearly push my SIL & MIL aside just so they could get ahead of them to wait to get off. Now I would probably be more tolerant of this type of behavior if the offenders were young but they were for the most part all over 40. I think society as a whole has become so self-centered & I think classes in courtesy should be mandatory for everyone! Believe me I do not want to have anyone believe that everyone behaved in this manner-there were many, many polite & courteous passengers but it just seems that politeness has become a thing of the past. I am just disappointed at the lack of courtesy that seems to be growing. Has anyone else noticed this trend?

 

Sandi

[Lightsluvr]

Some people will rush to beat you in a line whether you happen to be disabled or not... They'll elbow in the buffet lines and they'll block the steps at disembarkation before their turn. Rudeness is equal opportunity in today's society.

 

Oh, by the way...disabled folks can be rude , too. I've got the bruises on my foot from one of those motorized chairs to prove it.

 

:cool:

 

LL

[sscruising]

I agree that the disabled can be discourteous-I worked with the disabled for close to 20 years. However, I did not run across that on this particular cruise-it was strictly the able bodied who were in such a rush to get where they were going they did not care who was in their way & went to any means to get ahead. We spoke to several people on the cruise who agreed that they had never seen anything like it in all their cruises. Maybe it was something in the air or what but I have never before encountered this level of rudeness.

 

Sandi

[DEL67]

sscruising:

 

Unluckily we also often experienced rudeness from other passengers, especially with regard to elevators. And like you, we found it was usually not the young people who were rude. Senior citizens were sometimes the worst. Even when there was space for his wheelchair, they would stand in the middle of the elevator, refusing to move over so my husband could get n. In fact, once it was a young lady in her 20s who after watching us unable to get on several elevators, stood in front of the next one announcing that no one got on until my husband did.

 

However, this may partially be an east coast syndrome. On our last 2 cruises, both from Houston, we did not have any issues. In fact several times people offered to get off the elevator to make room for my husband.

[sscruising]

You may be right about it being an East coast syndrome. I had never experienced this sort of behavior at any of the ports I sailed out of-yes there was sporadic episodes but not to the scale this was. This was my first time sailing out of NJ & if it wasn't for the fact that it is so convenient, I probably wouldn't consider sailing out of there again.

 

Sandi

[Queenie2]

This is not a new issue, but to be honest it's just always baffled me how people can be so rude. So, I decided to ask. Yep, that's right I was on the elevator and it stopped at another floor and this lady pushed past a wheeler to get on the elevator. Since I had a pretty captive audience I asked her "Why did you crowd in front of that man in a wheelchair?" Her reply? "I didn't know he was waiting for the elevator." OK, that was not the answer I expected, so I continued. "Well he was sitting right there in front of the elevator. What did you think he was doing there?" And she said, "Oh I thought he was just waiting for someone to help him. You know, to push him around and take care of him."

 

Let's just forget that the hunky guy was in a quickie had biceps to die for...

 

So, do you actaully think that other people think this way? Maybe somebody should print up t-shirts? "Yes, I really am waiting for the elevator".

 

Candy

[Starr Mtn]

Maybe somebody should print up t-shirts? "Yes, I really am waiting for the elevator".

 

 

Love that idea ! Think I'll print a sign I can hang on the back

of my wheelchair . The worst time seems to be leaving the

dining room.

[dr28326]

Sandi,

I agree! I was on a scooter our last cruise and taking a powerchair on the next one..don't know if it will be any better or not. The elevator is the worst. We can't help that the elevators are so small on the ships I have been on. It would be nice if they held more than 6 people. The cruise ships should have 1 elevator for Wheelchairs and scooters only. Then you may have to wait a bit but not get the dirty looks for taking up room.

[rangeley]

My fiance is in a wheelchair. Our last cruise they announced for the muster drill that the elevators were off limits to ab people and only for hc. It was like they didnt say a word!!! I dont think its just a problem with hc people. Although we have had more fights with people who park in hc spots, but thats a whole other story! People in general are RUDE!!! You are on a cruise, whats the hurry! Maybe its an east coast thing, i surely hope there are still some nice people in this world but most are just driven by greed and selfishness! When we are crusin we try not to let things like that bother us. We can help people that are ignorant!!

[Queenie2]

Well I'm a true believer in karma -- what goes around comes around.

 

Not elevator related, but on one cruise the pool deck was just swamped and tables were at a premium. We were finished eating and ready to go and I saw this lady looking for a table. She had a tray and this man just pushed her out of the way to get to the table. So I got up and went and told here that we were about ready to leave and she could have our table (in the shade). No problem, the rude man just pissed me off.

 

Several days later I was in the bar waiting for my hubby and I ordered a drink but couldn't find my card. I emptied out pretty much my entire bag on the bar before I realized I left the card on the table in my room (idiot move, I know). So I was about to leave when the same table lady came up to me and said, "No problem, my treat."

 

Ended up talking to her while we both waited for our dates. Nice lady.

 

Moral of the story -- You never know when the lady you gave your table to or that wheelchair-user you pushed out of the way will reappear in your life:) Act accordingly.

 

Candy

[cruzecrittor1]

You may be right about it being an East coast syndrome. I had never experienced this sort of behavior at any of the ports I sailed out of-yes there was sporadic episodes but not to the scale this was. This was my first time sailing out of NJ & if it wasn't for the fact that it is so convenient, I probably wouldn't consider sailing out of there again.

 

Sandi

 

My sister is in a wheelchair, and encountered just this type of rudeness on her cruise, which left from Port Everglades. She said it was far worse on the ship than she ever encounters elsewhere. This, coupled with the seasickness she experienced, has made her swear off cruises. I tried to get her to cruise with us on our Oct cruise, but she declined. I hate that she is limiting herself to land-based vacations, and will be missing out, but understand her reasons. :(

[Queenie2]

CruiseCrittor:

 

If your sister gets seasick, tell her to try ginger root (in capsules). I also supplement it with ginger altoids and I use the seaband at night. I get dreadfully seasick (or at least i used to) and have tried everything, but this seems to be the magic combo. I don't like the seaband during the day cause it gets sweaty, but at night it's the perfect answer (I don't have to get up and take piils every 3-4 hours).

 

Fresh air also helps. When I was first adjusting the ginger dosage I spent a few nights sleeping on my balcony. Not that I recommend sleeping outside, but the fresh air really helped calm my stomach.

 

Candy

[juliab]

Queenie2, How much of the ginger do you take? I bought some capsules for my daughter from the GNC store. She took one every four hours and it seemed to work, but we had really smooth sailing. If it is rough seas, is that enough?

[Queenie2]

Queenie2, How much of the ginger do you take? I bought some capsules for my daughter from the GNC store. She took one every four hours and it seemed to work, but we had really smooth sailing. If it is rough seas, is that enough?

 

Well, I take 2 capsules every 3 hours, but I think it's pretty much a personal thing. I had to play around with the dosage before I got it right. Also, I'm a adult and I get *really* seasick (when not dosed up on ginger) so I think my dosage would be different than for a child. The one thing about the ginger is that you have to take it punctually (once you find our your dosage) because it doesn't wear off gradually. You can go from "I feel great" to "where's the bathroom" in a matter of minutes. I carry ginger altoids with me in case I'm late (it happens -- you get involved with an activity or you fall asleep in a deck chair). If I suck on the ginger altoids it helps calm my stomach until the ginger capsules take effect. So I'd say, play it by ear with your daughter. Give her some ginger altoids to take "just in case" and if you notice she is taking a lot of them, then you might want to up her dosage.

 

Candy

[sscruising]

Love the idea of t-shirts or at least a sign to attach to the chair or scooter!! I'd also like to print up signs to attach to anyone who is so rude & place them on their backs saying something like "kick me-I'm a jerk"

 

Sandi

[muskrat897]

Hi Sandi

It looks like things haven't changed since I posted a similar thread 3 years ago. Maybe I need to get an air horn and "blast" people who push their way in front of my wheelchair at the elevator.

[GRMonLI]

As a New Yorker I am happy to say that I, nor anyone I know, would push past a wheelchair to get on board an elevator.

I seriously do not think that rudeness is limited to the East coast.

By the way, as a person with a disabilty who frequently uses a cane I have been the victim of rudeness on the East coast, West coast and in Europe.

Thanks!!!! :D

[CruisinOnWheels]

I had heard once, that RCCl had developed a sysytem wide policy of "priority use of elevators by passengers with disabilities" I do not know if that is true, but I think it is a great idea that could be done like this:

 

Each cruise ship could have one elevator marked on each deck with a placard reading "priority use for passengers with disabilities". That coupled with a simple handout, given to each person who boards the ship...pointing out the location of that particular elevator would be simple to do.

 

The idea being, to ask passengers who do not use a wheelchair or have a walking disability to permit those who do, to board that elevator first when waiting.

 

Any thoughts??

[muskrat897]

Cruisin:

We discussed this earlier and the problem of enforcement came up. I suggested that the "disabled elevator" only be callable with the key card from an accessible room.

[lindacat]

I was also recently on the Explorer 10 day out of NJ. (8/25). I was cruising with my parents and my brother and his family. My mother has PAD, fibromylagia, and recently suffered a major heart attack with a quint by-pass which has left her with only 30% heart function. While she does not use a wheelchair walking up and down even one flight of stairs is virtually impossible for her.

 

My father is diabetic and suffers from advanced nueropathy which was further aggravated by a recent round of chemo for colon cancer. He has been very unstudy on his feet for the last few months, just prior to this cruise he fell and broke his shoulder. For his own safety and our peace of mind we rented a wheelchair for his use on this cruise. I agree with the OP that it was very difficult to get an elevator before or after dinner. We often rode the elevator to the promenade floor as it was easier to manuever the chair to get from one end of the ship to the other. On more than one occasion we had to ride the elevator back up to the 12th floor just to get from the 5th to the 3rd floor for dinner.

 

However there were many instances of people who helped us after we had been waiting for a while. There was one father waiting with his young son who made sure my mom, dad & brother (who was pushing the chair) got on the elevator first. (My SIL, niece and I would take the stairs and meet them at the final destination.) There was another woman who actively cleared a path for us, so in our situation there were just as many kind people who tried to assist.

 

As far as using a special pass from one of the accessible rooms, that would leave those of us who don't book an accessible room because we can get by without one without access to an elevator which we need as much as those in the accessible rooms. As my father is capable of walking short distances we simply folded the chair and stored it in their closet. The shower and bathroom facilities int he non-accessible room was actually better than their facilities at home. I would hate to take the accessible room from some-one who could not cruise at all without it.

[muskrat897]

The problem you mention of disability without a disability coded accessible room key can be resolved by taking your key to the ship's hospital, where it could be re-coded. This would be useful for people who become disabled onboard (like breaking a limb).

[crusing54]

I am only 52 and due to Neuropathy and unsteadiness I now use 2 canes. Most people are very nice , even on land. I am leaving on October 8th for a cruise, haven't gone on one since I started using 2 canes. I can only hope that it will be as much fun as I want it to be. As far as those that push in front or are rude... they can be ignored - I don't plan to add to their rudness. It's a shame- but when their time comes hopfully they will experience what they have given out.

[allenee]

We just got off the Mariner on Sunday and the majority of the people were very nice and let my husband on the elevator first.

[~Loreo~]

My observations come from my first cruise on the Summit last October. Generally, people are very nice and accommodating particularly when in "vacation" mode. Occassionally I found that I had to wait a long time for the elevators with the odd person jumping the line. But I was in vacation mode too so everything was cool.

 

I do, however, find rudeness prevails where crowds begin. During the tendering process, at the 1/2 price sales on the final day, on the elevator at dinner time, and during disembarkation people slip out of vacation mode and back into "I've got somewhere to be, now!" mode. It doesn't matter who you are, you had better get out of their way. This may be acceptable behaviour in an able-bodied world where we can all push and shove to get what we want, but is not acceptable where persons with disabilities are concerned. When there is only one option available to persons with disabilities (e.g. elevator travel) these people have to be accommodated, in this case given priority access.

 

Until there are enough elevators etc to satisfy demand, I favour a policy of designated elevators, lines etc. because I am soft spoken and do not like to draw attention to myself so I usually don't say anything to individuals who do not accommodate me. I do believe, however, even those individuals who are willing to advocate for themselves, like Queenie2 and others, should not have to do this. Access should be a right.

 

Last point (I promise) while it may seem insignificant to ask someone to wait their turn so you can get in the elevator or be served at a counter, it becomes very onerous when one is forced to do this constantly. Imagine fighting for the right to use the elevator each and every time you moved from one floor to another on a cruise (10+ times a day) and every time you approach service counters. It's too exhausting.

 

I lied, I have one more point. I want to address an earlier comment that people with disabilities can be rude too - just look at the bruise on his foot. I agree that everyone can be rude. If you were accidentally wheeled over and an apology followed, I do not consider this rude. I would consider the person with the disability rude if s/he either intentionally ran over your foot or s/he did not apologise for accidentally causing harm. One thing to note is that sometimes a wheelchair user (particularly in power chairs) may not have realised that s/he ran over your foot: s/he may not have felt it. In any case, decorum dictates you were owed an apology.

 

Having said all of that, my first cruise was probably the best vacation of my life. The cruise lines are really committed to providing a wonderful inclusive vacation for all. (I'm so happy they are installing pool and tender lifts on ships now!). I hope the "East Coast rudeness" theory is not true as I leave on Explorer of the Seas from New Jersey in 7 days! I'm hooked on cruising.

 

Ok, stepping off of my soapbox now.

 

Cheers,

Laurie

[kyriecat]

Laurie,

 

Would you mind posting a review of the Explorer and boarding/debarking from an accessibility standpoint when you return? My parents are booked on Explorer next year for the Canada trip from Cape Liberty. This will be their first solo cruise. In the past my husband and I have gone with them to help with planning, transportation, luggage, etc. I haven't been on the RC Voyager class ship yet. I know those are now the second largest/newest in the fleet. I assume that the ship is designed with adequate handicapped access, but I've learned that what others perceive as accessible and reality don't always match.

 

I'm going to look for other Explorer information as well. However, everyone has a slightly different perspective so I'd love as much information as I can get to help prepare them for what to expect.

 

I thought that I had done my homework for the Alaska planning, but we got caught with a few surprises there.

 

Thank you.