Keeping Passports with you

[cruzincurt]

Quote: "The legal instructions about surrendering it to the national authorities will not work if the national authorities are on the ship and you are at the beach with your passport." So what's the difference if it's locked in the cabin safe, and I'm on the beach?? Those "legal instructions" direct ME to surrender it to authorized national authorities, not the ship in my name.

Jim, nope still doesn't fly. If they keep the passports of everyone EXCEPT the US Citizens, and immigration comes aboard, wouldn't they want to see ALL the passports, not just the non-US ones? Your answer doesn't work if the US citizens still have their passports and they are at the beach with them. How are they going to view them if the US citizens have them locked in the cabin safe????

I still don't buy that explaination. If the foreign country/government wants to see passports, then they should be standing on the dock when we disembark and process us through customs/immigration. They should want to see everyone's passports. Other than "for their convenience" or "common sense" what gives them the right to take them in US waters when you board the ship?

The ship is not a US government or any government's authority or agency. They have no right to keep passports whether they belong to me or to the "US government". Yes, I read the fine print, I'll will surrender it to a US government agency if so directed, shouldn't be the cruise ship.

And the cruise line took them while were were in US waters, not at a dock in foreign waters as may be required by the foreign government under your explaination. To me, this deal of the ship holding passports is bogus.

[Jim Gallup]

Curt,
You are making a fatal error in this discussion. You are trying to be logical and assuming that Government Employees are logical as well.
These people are often unionized and always carry guns. They make up their own rules and change them every hour or so. The cruise lines are at their mercy. If a ship happens to upset them over the tiniest issue, you can expect that ship to have strange unexpected delays and surprise immigration inspections at very inconvenient hours - for the ship and the passengers. At Key West last year, one cruise line was only allowed to embark and disembark passengers for a certain part of each hour - an "Immigration Window" -because one of their ships had inconvenienced a US Immigration Officer.

Some countries insist that the ship keep all passports for surprise inspections. Other countries only want the ship to hold the more "exotic" passports.

You may be surprised to learn that the US Immigration authorities are the most confusing and inconsistent. The Regional US Immigration Supervisor in South Florida has a completely different set of rules about passports than the Regional Supervisor in Hawaii. In St Thomas this year, Americans and Canadians must go through separate inspections. Last year (at least for part of the year) they could go together through the same line.
In Honolulu, US Immigration requires one International cruise line to hold Canadian Passports and not American ones. For another International cruise line, Americans and Canadians are both allowed to keep their passports. None of this makes and sense, but that is the way that Governments operate.

For many years, cruise passengers entering China or Russia were forced to trade their passports for temporary Chinese and Russian Passports at the gangway as they went ashore. Is that legal? In China and Russia it was.

Today in Hong Kong if you want to get a visa for China, they require that you give them your passport for 2 or 3 days.
They give you what resembles a coat check in return. Can they take your passport? If you want a visa they can.

The cruise lines do not - contrary to popular belief - invent this nonsense to make more work for themselves and upset their passengers. They do these things because unreasonable Government Employees from several different governments insist on it.

[LHT28]

This from the Canadian Passport website.

[B]Before you leave... be prepared[/B]

[LIST=1]
[*]Try to apply for a passport during the off-season, between June and November.
[*]Ensure that you are carrying a valid passport. Check that the expiry date of the passport is well beyond your return date.
[*]Remember to sign the passport on [B]page 3[/B], and fill in your current address and the name of a person to contact in case of emergency on [B]page 4[/B].
[*]Make [B]two[/B] photocopies of the identification page of the passport.[LIST]
[*]Leave one copy with a friend or relative at home.
[*]Bring the second copy with you on your trip. Carry this photocopy separately from the passport when you travel. This can help identifiying you if the passport is lost, stolen, damaged, destroyed or inaccessible.[/LIST]
[*]Read the [B]last page[/B] of the passport. [/LIST]
[url]http://www.pptc.gc.ca/can/trip_planning.aspx?lang=e[/url]

[constructiondude]

Wow...what a nightmare that couple was put through (I wouldn't have left the ship without the scan though).

When I have travelled in Europe I had to carry my passport with me at all times. A drivers license written in English means nothing in a foreign country. A passport is the only internationally recognized form of ID and it can be asked for at any time by a police officer, government official, even a hotel clerk.

I have more of an issue with handing over my passport and having someone hold onto it, even if its the cruiseline. Can they really manage 1800 or more passports without any going astray?

[Jim Gallup]

I have worked over 1,000 cruises in the past 3 decades, handling and holding over a million passports. On one cruise in Russia in 1988 my Purser reported ot me that 5 passports had gone missing in Odessa. It appeared that one of the Russian Officials may have stolen them. We were not able to recover them, but the passengers who lost them hit the jackpot. They were 3 Americans and 2 Canadians. My company and our agent contacted the American and Canadian Embassies in Moscow to report the losses. They sent officials to the ship to meet the passengers and investigate the loss. Then they flew with the passsengers to Moscow and put them up in hotels for a few days while they made them new passports. In Moscow they had daily tours of the city with Russian Government escorts, and dinner at their embassies every night with the Ambassadors. With the new passports they flew them back to rejoin the ship. The cruise line paid for everything. The cruise was "comped" for them. The 5 passengers all received a free future cruise.
You should hope and pray that the cruise line takes your passport and loses it. But with 5 passports lost out of well over 1 million, the odds are pretty slim.

[cruzincurt]

Well Jim, it sounds like you have some experience in this matter. So, assuming the cruise line does not take your passport when boarding, what is your opinion about keeping the passport locked in the cabin safe or taking it ashore?

Some on the board believe that if they know you are not on the ship at the sail away time, that somehow the ship will gather up the passports for the missing people and give them to the ship's agent at that port just before sailing? How do they know you don't have it with you, or if it is in the safe or elsewhere in the cabin?

Do they do this with the ones they previously collected?

[Jim Gallup]

Curt,
A very astute and intelligent question.
Ideally, if the ship is holding your passport and you encounter any problems ashore, the ship then can give the passports to the agent who is then responsible to take care of you until everything is resolved.
Most ships have a huge passport safe that would be a challenge even for Oceans 11 to open. So the passports are indeed safe there.

It does make sense to carry ashore a photocopy of your passport in case something serious happens. The photo copy is not in any way a legal document, but speeds up the processes required to get you "legal" in just about any situation.

On many cruises that originate around North America, the ship does not insist on holding your American passport, because it is really not required by immigration officials on that itinerary. In fact, the ship may refuse to hold your passport even if you request it. They don't want to be responsible for it if it is not absolutely necessary.

It is far more important for you to have the local Agent's contact information. In any emergency, you can contact the agent, who then contacts the ship. If your passport is locked in your cabin safe, you can give the ship permission to open your safe, remove the passport, and have it delivered to you.

[cruzincurt]

Sometimes, when we happen to be visiting a port on a Sunday, I wonder if anyone is manning the phones at the port agent's office? It's like XYZ trading company or something. What if sail away is 10:00 pm as it is sometimes in Nassau? Can you actually reach someone at the agent's office at that time of night?

[Jim Gallup]

Curt,
With the exception of a few Caribbean stops (Grand Cayman Agents are absolutely worthless), shipping Agents are incredibly responsive and available 24/7. Many have all the inside connections with Immigration, Customs, Police, Hospitals, Embassies, and Consulates.

[ciderapple]

[quote name='LHT28']Let us know how you make out with keeping your passport.

[/quote]

Well, I just thought I would post back with some feedback if anyone is interested.

We had a fabulous cruise and even though we are non US citizens the cruiseline made no attempt to keep our passports. I was extremely relieved as I did not want to argue with them but was not going to give them our passports either!

We took our passports with us everytime we left the ship, we both agreed it made complete sense (just incase).

Immigration was a complete breeze too, just filled out new I-94's to replace the old ones they took out when we embarked.

[Ryffian]

This is definitely an informative thread. As I've read through it, though, I just have one question.

I'll be going on my first cruise in April, and I've booked shore excursions at the ports through my cruise line (NCL). Do those that recommend taking your passport with you everywhere all the time maintain this point of view when it comes to ship-sponsored shore excursions, or just when touring "on your own"?

Thanks!!

[johnql]

[quote name='Ryffian']This is definitely an informative thread. As I've read through it, though, I just have one question.

I'll be going on my first cruise in April, and I've booked shore excursions at the ports through my cruise line (NCL). Do those that recommend taking your passport with you everywhere all the time maintain this point of view when it comes to ship-sponsored shore excursions, or just when touring "on your own"?

Thanks!![/quote]
To me, it doesn't matter whether it's ship-sponsored or not. I always keep my original passport on me when I'm in a foreign country.

[pg.]

My passport stays in the safe , on the ship.

Can't imagine taking it to the beach. Sounds really stupid to me.,, sorry that is what I think . I am not "naive " about international travel, I am well travelled and tend to always leave my passport in the hotels safes. The chances of me getting my purse ripped off or pick pocketed are far GRAEATER then a customs offical approaching me while I am snorkling on a Caribbean island and demanding to see my passport. I mean that is just so funny.

AGabbyMama, ,, you said you always carry your" money, jewels and passport with you in your PURSE"! You are exactly the type of travellor who will be very very sorry one day when your bag is picked or ripped off. No money, no credit cards, and no id, and your jewels gone to boot, doesn't sound fun to me.

We carry our ship pass, a copy of our passport and ONE credit card( leave another in the safe) ... we can get a hotel that way while we wait for our passports to be sent to us if we miss the ship! LOL

BTW, Some of you seem to feel that having your passport on you means if you miss the ship you can just jump the next plane to catch up, that is the funnyest of all, IF there is a plane going directly to the next port( you may end up having to fly back to Florida and then the next port via there) you may not get a seat on it regardless, still leaving you stranded for two of more days.


PS Do some of you travel internationally other then cruising? I wonder . I mean, who would walk around Paris all day with their passport in their purse, not me, guess I 've been lucky.
And for the UK poster who said that while living in the US they actually carried around for two years, whoa, that is sad....

[bowbiter]

I haven't read the bulk of this thread but to the last poster... I wanted to add (and this is probably a bit of a unique situation) that I lived overseas for 18 months and had my passport with me the majority of the time...and am very glad I did. The apartment I was living in got broken into and some items were stolen - if I had left my passport there who knows where it would have ended up.

There is nothing wrong with carrying around your passport and prefer it to leaving it in a hotel safe where a large # of employees have access to it. I'd rather take my chances of my purse getting stolen/sliced than to not know where it is. At least if it does get stolen you KNOW what happened to it - and if you are smart you have multiple copies of it to help ease the process of getting it replaced.

[johnql]

[quote name='pg.']My passport stays in the safe , on the ship.[/quote]
I'm not going to bother rehashing both sides of the argument on this issue. It's apparent from this long thread that there are pros and cons on both sides. Any given individual will have to do what he feels most comfortable with.

[ciderapple]

[quote name='pg.']

And for the UK poster who said that while living in the US they actually carried around for two years, whoa, that is sad....[/quote]


Yes that's me. Nice of you to be so judgemental, but then you aren't in my shoes are you?

Still doing it today, will continue until I leave the US. You really don't know my situation or what experiences I have already been through in this country that have made it extremely useful to have my passport with me.

How dare you call me "Sad". If I'm honest I find it extremely "SAD" that as a military spouse from a country who is supposed to be one of your allies I get treated with suspicion at times and the dirty foreign national attitude thrown at me.

So shove that it your pipe and smoke it, chill out and have a bit more understanding for different circumstances.

[broberts]

[quote name='pg.']PS Do some of you travel internationally other then cruising? I wonder . I mean, who would walk around Paris all day with their passport in their purse, not me, guess I 've been lucky.
And for the UK poster who said that while living in the US they actually carried around for two years, whoa, that is sad....[/quote]

Interesting. When cruising in the Caribbean I like to leave my passport in the cabin safe. But only if I'm going to a beach or planning activities that may increase the risk of damage to or loss of the document, i.e. snorkeling.

I have lived overseas and traveled extensively. I carry my passport on my person whenever I'm in the US, Europe, Asia, Africa, etc.

I'm not sure why you think it sad that an alien resident in the US carries his/her passport with them. Especially these days. How else can one quickly and reliably establish one's identity to authorities? Depending on status, one's visa may be attached to, or stamped in the passport. There are also other times when one may need to establish identity: banking, flying, etc. Not many people in the US would trust a foreign driver's license or other photo id. No surprise. The same holds true around the world. I've even had people look askance at my passport.

At the best of times, in any community, foreigners are not accorded the same level of trust as a stranger from the same community. A passport helps.

[broberts]

[quote name='pg.']PS Do some of you travel internationally other then cruising? I wonder . I mean, who would walk around Paris all day with their passport in their purse, not me, guess I 've been lucky.
And for the UK poster who said that while living in the US they actually carried around for two years, whoa, that is sad....[/quote]

Interesting. When cruising in the Caribbean I like to leave my passport in the cabin safe. But only if I'm going to a beach or planning activities that may increase the risk of damage to or loss of the document, i.e. snorkeling.

I have lived overseas and traveled extensively. I carry my passport on my person whenever I'm in the US, Europe, Asia, Africa, etc.

I'm not sure why you think it sad that an alien resident in the US carries his/her passport with them. Especially these days. How else can one quickly and reliably establish one's identity to authorities? Depending on status, one's visa may be attached to, or stamped in the passport. There are also other times when one may need to establish identity: banking, flying, etc. Not many people in the US would trust a foreign driver's license or other photo id. No surprise. The same holds true around the world. I've even had people look askance at my passport.

At the best of times, in any community, foreigners are not accorded the same level of trust as a stranger from the same community. A passport helps.

[broberts]

double post

[Podorama]

[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3] [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=4] I solved the problem by having an [U]exact[/U] copy of my passport tattooed onto my backside. I also made photo copies in both colour and B&W to pass around as needed. In a few years when it expires, I will just have it redone onto the other cheek. I have also found that photocopies of my cash is also a real help.[/SIZE][/FONT]

[BobBeaSea]

Yes that's me. Nice of you to be so judgemental, but then you aren't in my shoes are you?

 

Still doing it today, will continue until I leave the US. You really don't know my situation or what experiences I have already been through in this country that have made it extremely useful to have my passport with me.

 

How dare you call me "Sad". If I'm honest I find it extremely "SAD" that as a military spouse from a country who is supposed to be one of your allies I get treated with suspicion at times and the dirty foreign national attitude thrown at me.

 

So shove that it your pipe and smoke it, chill out and have a bit more understanding for different circumstances.

 

Ciderapple, I may be going out on a limb here but, IMHO, pg wasn't "attacking" you. I believe the poster meant it was sad that you felt the need to carry your passport with you...which is a whole different matter entirely. The poster was not saying you were sad, just the circumstances that cause you to carry your passport are sad. A lot has changed since 9/11 and certainly not for the better.

[JanesCruisingBuddy]

Curt,

Have a close look at text inside your American Passport. In the fine print you will read (more or less), "this passport is the property of the United States Government. It must be surrendered to any national authority for inspection on request." Many Americans are surprised to find that even though they paid for the passport, it does not belong to them. It belongs to the US Government. The legal instructions about surrendering it to the national authorities will not work if the national authorities are on the ship and you are at the beach with your passport.

As to the red portion above, I expect it is simular on my Canadian pasport as well. Fine.

My concern comes with the purple section... the cruise line is NOT a national authority.

Why would the ship use my passport in the absence of me being present.

I cannot imagine US immigration officials being happy knowing that some "non-official stanger" had possesson of my passport for several days. They would be wondering what that unknown person might have done with it... did the alter it... did they give it to someone to help them gain illegal access to the US, and then send it back to the ship to later be given back to me... in this post 911 world, I sure do not trust US immigration to be resonable. There is something wrong with this!!!!

[goodml]

My passport stays in the safe , on the ship.

 

Can't imagine taking it to the beach. Sounds really stupid to me.,, sorry that is what I think . I am not "naive " about international travel, I am well travelled and tend to always leave my passport in the hotels safes. The chances of me getting my purse ripped off or pick pocketed are far GRAEATER then a customs offical approaching me while I am snorkling on a Caribbean island and demanding to see my passport. I mean that is just so funny.

 

AGabbyMama, ,, you said you always carry your" money, jewels and passport with you in your PURSE"! You are exactly the type of travellor who will be very very sorry one day when your bag is picked or ripped off. No money, no credit cards, and no id, and your jewels gone to boot, doesn't sound fun to me.

 

We carry our ship pass, a copy of our passport and ONE credit card( leave another in the safe) ... we can get a hotel that way while we wait for our passports to be sent to us if we miss the ship! LOL

 

BTW, Some of you seem to feel that having your passport on you means if you miss the ship you can just jump the next plane to catch up, that is the funnyest of all, IF there is a plane going directly to the next port( you may end up having to fly back to Florida and then the next port via there) you may not get a seat on it regardless, still leaving you stranded for two of more days.

 

 

PS Do some of you travel internationally other then cruising? I wonder . I mean, who would walk around Paris all day with their passport in their purse, not me, guess I 've been lucky.

And for the UK poster who said that while living in the US they actually carried around for two years, whoa, that is sad....

 

When we applied for our most recent passports, the passport agent scolded us for carrying our birth certificates with us. She said we should always carry our passports as a form of ID and leave the birth certificate at home. My passport is in my purse but I live near the Canada/US border and make frequent crossings. The passport definitely speeds up that process.

 

I don't, however, carry it with me into ports when on a cruise ship. More often than not our passports have been kept by the cruiseline but when they're not they stay in the cabin safe or safety deposit box and we take our driver's licences, photocopy of passport and ship cards for ID.

 

On the flipside: my niece just spent a semester studying in Paris and had her Canadian passport stolen, not once but twice.

[goodml]

I cannot imagine US immigration officials being happy knowing that some "non-official stanger" had possesson of my passport for several days. They would be wondering what that unknown person might have done with it... did the alter it... did they give it to someone to help them gain illegal access to the US, and then send it back to the ship to later be given back to me... in this post 911 world, I sure do not trust US immigration to be resonable. There is something wrong with this!!!!

 

I don't disagree with you that we shouldn't have to turn our passports over to the cruiseline, but do you honestly believe that they are doing this without being instructed to by a governement body?

[Host Kewlguy]

I was told we need to keep our passport with us at all times. I am concerned about this since all our excursions are water related. We are Cave tubing in Belize, for one. Do they have lockers to put your personal items in? Is it safe? First time crusiers needing to learn the ropes. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

 

We bring photo copies of our passports with us when we travel. We keep the actual passports in the safe in our stateroom or hotel room. When we're asked to produce identification by customs agents or other authorities we've never had a problem when showing them the photo copies.