*LIVE* from Mariner of the Seas - PROBLEMS!

[DedeM]

DedeM

 

I was on that same cruise, the group was Liberty Mutual of Venezuela, and yes they paid for a unlimited drink card. We found out from the bartender in the Schooner bar that they chartered every year with RCCL, and RCCL has to put on extra Johnny Walker Black (Perfered drink) just for them. You are right the more they drank the more loud, unruly, obnoxous (sp) they became, even the women. I had one drunk elderly man start to screem at me outside the casino about President Bush, the US was having problems with the Venezuela government at the time. But, he just could not let me pass without making a statement, man was I mad!!!! They did take over Boleros so you couldn't get a seat or a drink even if you were next in line, they would just reach over, you and tell the bartender "two Johnny Walker Black". Same thing in the casino, I mean you could be sitting at the BJ table and they would be right up on your back trying to bet $100.

OMG! How awful! I can't believe they book this every year. Oy!

 

I think you were there right next to us. Every bar on the ship "two johnny walker blacks" or they would order as much as they could possibly hold in their hands. My girlfriend and I were saying jw black every where we went - AFTER the cruise! We couldnt' get over that. LOL!

 

Some of the women were awful too, I agree. My gf HATES to be bumped or poked, it's a quirk. This one woman came barreling into the elevator and bumped the crap out of her and my gf turned around, eyes on fire, and screamed in this woman's face EXCUSE ME!!! I was hysterical! The stupid woman had the frightened deer in the headlight look. :D

 

So, how does one get a drink for free card? Must you be in a group? :D

[gbgalnow]

Love your post...I want to cruise with YOU! lol

You are right...any big group is going to be a problem..especially a big DRUNK group! We were on a cruise with a big group of Cheeseheads...that was something to behold! Everyone in green with big cheese hats on...wow!

 

Im a Cheesehead from Wisconsin:cool:

[jgregory]

Overall, I think that Royal Caribbean may have done the right thing by setting aside the solarium for this group.

Imagine if they didn't... many behaviors, such as holding hands, or occasional smooches, which are common among straight couples on a cruise, would be considered offensive when exhibited by the "bears."

I'm afraid that our society has double- and triple-standards when it comes to displays of public affection. It's ok to see attractive straight couples holding hands and smooching in public, and we can cope with rare cases of beautiful gay couples doing the same, but when we're talking about big, fat, hairy, homosexuals holding hands, or caressing in the pool, that's not appropriate for our kids.

This thread has many exaggerations which suggest that these "bears" are filming porn in public spaces, but the fact is that they probably aren't. The fact is that when big, fat, hairy men conduct themselves in the same way that typical straight couples do in public, it offends us. That's not right.

If we don't want to watch them behave "normally" in public, then we shouldn't complain about giving them a private space. Otherwise, let them hold hands, embrace, and behave as any other couples do in public.

[bplazo]

They should have been put off the ship at the next port. I do not want to see that type of behavior from anyone. Should not be acceptable in any public place. Hard to believe the morals of people anymore.

[brigittetom]

jgregory, Actually in 19 cruises we haven't witnessed any of the things you've mentioned. A peck on the cheek as one is leaving the other is the most I've seen. Holding hands, yes. Certainly we would find it just as offensive if a straight couple was "major making out in public". Not a big deal, we just wouldn't watch.

 

There is a big difference in having a few couples on board who are overly affectionate versus 500 men who make a point of displaying their affections to the rest of the cruisers. Not to mention that the OP commented on how rude these men were to the other passengers. There is no excuse for one group to make other passengers uncomfortable to the point where the Captain has to regulate them to the Solarium.

 

And yes, there is something more offensive about 500 fat hairy men in a group trying to prove a point. Fat hairy men by themselves are just fun people and good company. :)

[Guest cvbart]

Just wondering - do you have any facts to back up your hyperbole?:rolleyes:

 

We should never let facts or first hand knowledge get in the way of a good rant:)

 

I think it's some sort of rule:D

[mohavemommy]

Let's see if Royal Caribbean follows through with their policies.

 

From Royal Caribbean's website:

http://www.royalcaribbean.com/customersupport/faq/lifeOnboardFaq.do#4

 

Can Passage or a Booking Request Be Refused?

We reserve the right to refuse to accept a booking request from an individual or group and reserve the right to cancel an existing reservation. For more details, see our Refusal to Transport Policy. That policy provides... that a booking request may be denied... where the guest's conduct on a prior cruise has resulted in disciplinary measures by Royal Caribbean.

 

In addition, a guest may be removed from the vessel where, in the opinion of the ship's captain... a guest is... a disturbance... to others. Such guest may be left at any port or place at which the ship calls without liability to Royal Caribbean. For additional details see the Refusal to Transport Policy and the Guest Vacation Policy.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

Refusal to Transport Policy: http://www.royalcaribbean.com/content/pdf/Refusal_To_Transport.pdf

 

REFUSAL TO TRANSPORT

The Cruise Line may refuse to accept a booking request from an individual, may refuse to transport any guest at any time prior to boarding the Vessel and may remove any guest from its Vessel at any time, for any of the following reasons:

 

G. Guest’s Conduct or Condition

By way of example, and without limitation, the Cruise Line may refuse to book/transport or may remove guest from its vessel in any of the following situations:

1. When the guest’s conduct is disorderly, abusive or violent.

6. When the guest’s conduct creates an unreasonable risk of offense or annoyance to other guest.

8. When the guest ...engages in ...behavior on board which, in the Cruise Line’s opinion, is detrimental to the on board atmosphere, the enjoyment of the cruise by other guest.

9. Any guest who on a previous cruise with the Cruise Line, or its parent, subsidiaries or affiliates, committed a violation of a Guest Behavior policy that resulted in ...disciplinary measures.

 

 

Guest Vacation Policy:

http://www.royalcaribbean.com/content/pdf/General_Policies_July_2006.pdf

[BillOh]

Now look I happen to love M&M's and there is a whole group of us M&M lovers going in January.

 

As long as your not leaving them on the floors and eating in the pool ro hot tubs, I think people should be tolerant of your perversion :D

[Cruzn Chuck & Susan]

Im a Cheesehead from Wisconsin:cool:

I wasn't trying to compare you with the Bears...I was just saying sailing with big groups can be, erh, interesting...lol. The cheeseheads looked like they were having a great time...very cute hats too!

[BillOh]

I don't think the OP said that the bears had to stay in that area... just that the rest of the passengers weren't allowed in. So I'm guessing you will find them in all areas of the ship at different times of the day... maybe the casino, other bars, etc.

 

The worst thing was that they were harassing the OP with cat calls. They obviously wanted attention.

 

It seems obvious the only reason they would give this group special treatment and concede an area was that they couldn't control them and they were giving up this area as out of control. Clearly RCCI failed to provide an acceptable atmosphere for everyone.

[Arizona Cruz Chic]

Overall, I think that Royal Caribbean may have done the right thing by setting aside the solarium for this group.

Imagine if they didn't... many behaviors, such as holding hands, or occasional smooches, which are common among straight couples on a cruise, would be considered offensive when exhibited by the "bears."

I'm afraid that our society has double- and triple-standards when it comes to displays of public affection. It's ok to see attractive straight couples holding hands and smooching in public, and we can cope with rare cases of beautiful gay couples doing the same, but when we're talking about big, fat, hairy, homosexuals holding hands, or caressing in the pool, that's not appropriate for our kids.

This thread has many exaggerations which suggest that these "bears" are filming porn in public spaces, but the fact is that they probably aren't. The fact is that when big, fat, hairy men conduct themselves in the same way that typical straight couples do in public, it offends us. That's not right.

If we don't want to watch them behave "normally" in public, then we shouldn't complain about giving them a private space. Otherwise, let them hold hands, embrace, and behave as any other couples do in public.

 

 

I don't quite agree with setting aside the solarium....what about the bears coming and going to the solarium? Casino? Bars? They are not confined to the solarium, just no other pax allowed in the solarium. So they are still going to be all over the ship, the dining room and windjammer. They are still going to show affection, be obnoxious and rude where ever they go.

 

It's as shame RC is not following their own rules that are in the pax ticket contract! I guess the bears money is a little greener than the other paying pax.

 

BTW....I see this is your 3rd post....Welcome to CC!!!! ;) ;) ;)

[Tarheelbelle]

I really hope that the OP will post something soon about the cruise and RCCI staff responses/explanations, if any.

[kittyg]

This thread has many exaggerations which suggest that these "bears" are filming porn in public spaces, but the fact is that they probably aren't.

If you have looked at their website, they most certainly are filming porn in the cabins and on the balconies, which aren't exactly private. And they take many stills of them doing very suggestive things to each other in very public places like the pool deck. Then they put those photos on their website and sell the videos.

[vfin]

My husband and I always went to the Solarium as it was the most peaceful environment on the ship. Our cruise was absolutely full of kids (over 650, I think) and it was our source of solitude. If it were closed off to us for a group we would have had to resort to our cabin, I guess! We enjoyed the Solarium so much I can't imagine not being allowed to be in there.

[cowboycritter06]

I agree about the behavior of passengers should be dealt with in the same manner, regardless of individual or group, but in the same breath RCCL would also not be able to discriminate due to sexual preference. Would you like RCCL to announce when there are large groups of Hispanics, African-Americans, Elderly or Children. I do not believe they would be able to do this due to Federal Law. So, I do to some point empathize with RCCL. It cannot be a easy situation for them either.

[BillfromWV]

I am glad that my family did not have to suffer through this cruise as I have a 9 and 6 year old and I would hate for them to be exposed to some of the behavior that I can only imagine based on the website provided for the BEARS.

 

Some of the later post here have hit the nail on the head. If some passengers are behaving inappropriately or harrassing other passengers then they should be removed from the ship at the next port. RCCL has policies that address this situation and they should follow their policy. RCCL should have also anticipated the problems and had more security onboard this cruise to handle the situations that were bound to occur.

 

Had I been on this cruise, I would have complained as the OP has attempted to do. If I had not gotten a satsifactory response I would have left the ship with my family, belongings at the next port of call and continued my vacation at a resort and flown home. There is no way I would have been subjected to this behavior.

 

Upon my return, I would have hired counsel and filed a lawsuit against RCCL for not enforcing the policy and also filed a lawsuit against the travel agent who booked this group. Eventually I would have found satisfaction.

 

Good Luck to the OP and others on this cruise

Bill

[teajak]

I agree about the behavior of passengers should be dealt with in the same manner, regardless of individual or group, but in the same breath RCCL would also not be able to discriminate due to sexual preference. Would you like RCCL to announce when there are large groups of Hispanics, African-Americans, Elderly or Children. I do not believe they would be able to do this due to Federal Law. So, I do to some point empathize with RCCL. It cannot be a easy situation for them either.

I would like to know whenever there is a larger than usual group on any cruise, no matter who that group consists of. When there is a group of people that will obstruct my use of all of the facilities of the ship it affects me and what I paid for, the example being denied the use of the solarium. I think it is ridiculous that this information is not made available to anyone that requests it.Giving this information to booked passengers is not discrimination against the group, but allows us to make an informed choice if we want that particular cruise.

[jgregory]

If you have looked at their website, they most certainly are filming porn in the cabins and on the balconies, which aren't exactly private. And they take many stills of them doing very suggestive things to each other in very public places like the pool deck. Then they put those photos on their website and sell the videos.

 

I've looked at their website, and the pictures of past cruises that I see show nothing more than shirtless men with their arms around each other's shoulders. I see plenty of photos of them in public places and on pool decks, but they're not overtly suggestive. (There are many links to porn there, but those pictures don't seem to be in public spaces on a cruise ship.)

 

I've read Mojo4trav's original comments in this post, and there aren't a lot of details about the offending behavior. Most of this post seems to based on assumptions about what these men must be doing. I have no more facts than anyone else, but I suspect that if they are behaving just exactly like straight passengers, their actions are viewed as offensive to other guests.

 

If you see a straight young couple holding hands, you smile and assume that they're newlyweds, but if you see a couple of these "bears" holding hands, you assume that they're off to their cabin to do something pornographic.

 

It's a difficult situation for Royal Caribbean. With 30% of the passengers belonging to this group, the other passengers probably feel like all the public areas are dominated by the "bears," regardless of how well or badly behaved they might be. By setting aside the solarium, they encourage the bears to congregate there, reducing their impact on other areas of the ship.

 

Like any group, these are probably nearly all really nice, good people. I'm not trying to defend a few individuals that are behaving inappropriately, but to assume that all these people are making porn and behaving lewdly is classic prejudice.

[MrsPete]

It seems obvious the only reason they would give this group special treatment and concede an area was that they couldn't control them and they were giving up this area as out of control.

This is a very scary statement, but I think you're right. When I sail, I want to know that THE CAPTAIN and his crew is always in control. They're there for a reason, and it seems to me that this captain failed his passengers.

[MrsPete]

I've looked at their website, and the pictures of past cruises that I see show nothing more than shirtless men with their arms around each other's shoulders . . . but to assume that all these people are making porn and behaving lewdly is classic prejudice.

Then you and I didn't see the same things. ONE CLICK away from their opening website is real pornography -- not suggestive poses. I didn't study the pictures to see if they were made in cruise ship staterooms, etc. and don't care to go back to check, but if the group posts things like this on their website, I think it's a reasonable thing to assume that this is what they're all about.

[MrsPete]

I agree about the behavior of passengers should be dealt with in the same manner, regardless of individual or group, but in the same breath RCCL would also not be able to discriminate due to sexual preference. Would you like RCCL to announce when there are large groups of Hispanics, African-Americans, Elderly or Children. I do not believe they would be able to do this due to Federal Law. So, I do to some point empathize with RCCL. It cannot be a easy situation for them either.

I agree that it's not an easy situation for RCCL; however, no one has said these people should be treated differently because of their sexual preference. Everyone is saying that they should've been disciplined because of their public actions. If they'd been engaged in "alternative" behavior quietly, behind closed doors, the great majority of passengers wouldn't have a problem with them.

[Tony20]

Never posted before, but this was unbelievable.

 

This was only my second cruise and I am extremely angry at RCCL.

 

The Bears not only took over the best spot on the boat, but their activities were in plain view, AND ALLOWED BY RCCL. I was told by guest relations that their activities were okay if kept in the Solarium.

 

I happened to be on deck 12 waiting for an elevator where a window shows the solarium. I saw men touching each other's crotches, heads in crotches, passionate kissing and fondling. A women with three small children was standing next to me waiting for the elevator and that activity was in full view of her children.

 

They also wore sexually charged t-shirts. For example, one had the word COCKS across his shirt in the fashion of a sports logo.

 

RCCL did nothing when I complained. Would I be allow to touch my wife's breast in the pool area? Or fondle her while sunbathing? Of course not!

 

I am demanding a full refund for denying the best part of the ship as well as subjecting me to their behavior.

 

My biggest problem was RCCL's failure to enforce their rule and protect my wife and I from this extremely offensive display.

[mohavemommy]

It's a difficult situation for Royal Caribbean. With 30% of the passengers belonging to this group, the other passengers probably feel like all the public areas are dominated by the "bears," regardless of how well or badly behaved they might be. By setting aside the solarium, they encourage the bears to congregate there, reducing their impact on other areas of the ship.

 

More accurately, given the capacity of this ship, they make up 15% of the total. That would mean that the other 85% of the passengers were denied any use because of a minority.

[mohavemommy]

Never posted before, but this was unbelievable.

 

This was only my second cruise and I am extremely angry at RCCL.

 

The Bears not only took over the best spot on the boat, but their activities were in plain view, AND ALLOWED BY RCCL. I was told by guest relations that their activities were okay if kept in the Solarium.

 

I happened to be on deck 12 waiting for an elevator where a window shows the solarium. I saw men touching each other's crotches, heads in crotches, passionate kissing and fondling. A women with three small children was standing next to me waiting for the elevator and that activity was in full view of her children.

 

They also wore sexually charged t-shirts. For example, one had the word COCKS across his shirt in the fashion of a sports logo.

 

RCCL did nothing when I complained. Would I be allow to touch my wife's breast in the pool area? Or fondle her while sunbathing? Of course not!

 

I am demanding a full refund for denying the best part of the ship as well as subjecting me to their behavior.

 

My biggest problem was RCCL's failure to enforce their rule and protect my wife and I from this extremely offensive display.

 

I feel so bad for you and others who were subjected to this. It was not like you could "check out" and go to another hotel. Royal Caribbean needs to be giving some answers soon as to why they allowed this to happen.

[dmk446]

Never posted before, but this was unbelievable.

 

This was only my second cruise and I am extremely angry at RCCL.

 

The Bears not only took over the best spot on the boat, but their activities were in plain view, AND ALLOWED BY RCCL. I was told by guest relations that their activities were okay if kept in the Solarium.

 

I happened to be on deck 12 waiting for an elevator where a window shows the solarium. I saw men touching each other's crotches, heads in crotches, passionate kissing and fondling. A women with three small children was standing next to me waiting for the elevator and that activity was in full view of her children.

 

They also wore sexually charged t-shirts. For example, one had the word COCKS across his shirt in the fashion of a sports logo.

 

RCCL did nothing when I complained. Would I be allow to touch my wife's breast in the pool area? Or fondle her while sunbathing? Of course not!

 

I am demanding a full refund for denying the best part of the ship as well as subjecting me to their behavior.

 

My biggest problem was RCCL's failure to enforce their rule and protect my wife and I from this extremely offensive display.

 

Sounds like it's time to start a boycott of RCCL, seems like anything short of that will fail to get their attention. I'm anxcious to hear stories from other Mariner passengers as they arrive home and access their computers and share their experiences.