Very general ship question!!

[cod]

I've always wondered about this. The question is on another board which reminded me about the following.

 

Lots of people say the "port" side of the ship is the just that..the side which is along side wherever it's docked. But if I recall, we've had cabins on both sides and had the port cities on the starboard side on ocassion as well. If you can clarify this, I would appreciate it!

 

Thanks!

[Mary Ellen]

It has NOTHING to do with which side of the ship faces the port (dock) area. The port side of the ship is the opposite side from starboard. The easy way to remember which is which - the words port and left are both 4 letters, they are the same side to us landlubbers. Starboard and right are longer words, they go together. The port side of the ship is ALWAYS the left side as you face the bow (forward).

[kakalina]

If I recall correctly, and someone will notice if I am wrong, the starboard side originally was the side of the ship that they steered from and therefore the port side was the side that naturally went against the dock as the steering mechanism was on the starboard side. Something like that anyway.

[obriendan]

Your absolutely right, kakalina! Here's the more detailed, googled answer:

 

The origins of 'port' and 'starboard'

 

At sea, an emergency can happen at any time, and it is vital that everything aboard can be clearly identified and described. Where ‘left’ and ‘right’ could lead to confusion, ‘port’ and ‘starboard’ are perfectly clear and unambiguous to a seafarer.

 

Starboard: Boats developed from simple dugout canoes. When the paddler steering a canoe is right handed (and the majority of people are right-handed), he or she naturally steers over the right-hand side (looking forward) of the boat. As canoes developed into larger vessels, the steering paddle grew larger and developed into a broad-bladed oar, held vertically in the water and permanently fixed to the side of the boat by a flexible lashing or a built-in moveable swivel.

 

The seagoing ships of maritime Northern Europe all featured this side-hung rudder, always on the right hand side of the ship. This rudder (in Anglo-Saxon the steorbord) was further developed in medieval times into the more familiar apparatus fixed to the sternpost, but starboard remains in the language to describe anything to the right of a ship’s centreline when viewed from aft.

 

Port: If starboard is the right-hand side of the vessel, looking forward from aft, the left-hand side is port – at least, it is now! In Old English, the term was bæcbord (in modern German Backbord and French bâbord), perhaps because the helmsman at the steorbord had his back to the ship’s left-hand side. This did not survive into Medieval and later English, when larboard was used. Possibly this term is derived from laddebord, meaning ‘loading side’; the side rudder (steorbord) would be vulnerable to damage if it went alongside a quay, so early ships would have been loaded (‘laded’) with the side against the quay. In time laddebord became larboard as steorbord became starboard. Even so, from an early date port was sometimes used as the opposite for starboard when giving steering orders, perhaps deriving from the loading port which was in the larboard side. However, it was only from the mid-19th century that, according to Admiral Smyth’s The Sailor’s Word Book, published in 1867, ‘the left side of the ship is called port, by Admiralty Order, in preference to larboard, as less mistakeable in sound for starboard’.

[Mary Ellen]

Since I hadn't heard what kakalina posted (and I'm always up to learn something new), I googled the words port side origin. I found on the site Origins of Navy Terminology the following:

Starboard

The Vikings called the side of their ship its board, and they placed the steering oar, the "star" on the right side of the ship, thus that side became known as the "star board." It's been that way ever since. And, because the oar was in the right side, the ship was tied to the dock at the left side. This was known as the loading side or "larboard". Later, it was decided that "larboard" and "starboard" were too similar, especially when trying to be heard over the roar of a heavy sea, so the phrase became the "side at which you tied up to in port" or the "port" side.

 

On Wikipedia I found:

The origin of the term comes from old boating practices. Before ships had rudders on their centerline, they were steered by use of a specialized oar. This oar was held by a sailor located towards the stern (back) of the ship. However, like most of the rest of society, there were many more right-handed sailors than left-handed sailors. This meant that the right-handed sailors holding the steering oar (which had been broadened to provide better control) used to stand on the right side of the ship. The word starboard comes from Old English steorbord, literally meaning the side on which the ship is steered. The old English term steorbord descends from the Old Norse words stýri meaning “rudder” and borð meaning “side of a ship”. The modern term "steering wheel" comes from the same language root as "starboard" or "steer board".

 

Similarly, the term for the left side of the boat, port, is derived from the practice of sailors mooring on the left side (i.e., the larboard or loading side) as to prevent the steering boards from being crushed. Because the words larboard and starboard sounded too similar to be easily distinguished, larboard was changed to port.

 

The starboard side of most naval vessels the world over is designated the 'senior' side. The officers' gangway or sea ladder is shipped on this side and this side of the quarterdeck is reserved for the captain. The flag or pennant of the ship's captain or senior officer in command is generally hoist on the starboard yard.

I've learned something today, however in modern days, you'll find that the dock is on the starboard as often as on the port side of your cruise ship. Just think of all the times you've been docked with another ship on the other side of same pier. One ship is docked to port and the other to starboard.

[hammybee]

And none of this makes any difference if you have no idea which way you are facing.

 

Signed,

The most oblivious HAL PAL, ever

[IKE]

Thanks to everyone who contributed all that info about "Starboard and "Port". Very interesting info.

[tomc]

Huh ... and all this time, I thought port was a type of wine.

[Navy_Chief]

Mary Ellen has it correct. Another thing you will notice, all even numbered "compartments" are located on the Port side, and all odd numbered "compartments" are located to the Starboard side.

[fsalzer]

Another thing you will notice, all even numbered "compartments" are located on the Port side, and all odd numbered "compartments" are located to the Starboard side.

 

I used to think that applied to all ships until I sailed on Celebrity Summit. What were they thinking?:confused:

 

Fred

[Navy_Chief]

I used to think that applied to all ships until I sailed on Celebrity Summit. What were they thinking?:confused:

 

Fred

 

Seems they're not the only ones Fred, RCCLs deck plans show some strange numbering as well; seeing it's the same company, it just figures they would follow suite and foul up the numbering:D. But it does apply to Carnival Corp ships from what I can tell and others. It is supposed to be valid to all ships though.

[cod]

Thanks to all for the PORT side info. The other thread I talked about has someone advising that the op get a cabin on the port side so as to be able to see land when docked. And my boss, a TA for many years who knows more than I ever will on the subject, told a client just the other day that she wants to be on the port side for that same reason. (And believe me, I have no intention of telling her about my new-found knowledge!!). I'm just happy that I wasn't hallucinating when gazing out my starboard side window!!

[jtl513]

Thanks to all for the PORT side info. The other thread I talked about has someone advising that the op get a cabin on the port side so as to be able to see land when docked. And my boss, a TA for many years who knows more than I ever will on the subject, told a client just the other day that she wants to be on the port side for that same reason.

Has your boss ever been on a cruise? Many times either the bow or stern will be facing land, not either side.

[cod]

Yes, she's been on a few cruises though I think personally she prefers 'land' vacations. She knows A-Z about every resort/all inclusive in Mexico or the Caribbean and, were I planning that kind of vacation, there would be no one better at answering all my questions and helping me pick one and finding either the best package or air/resort deal. I don't have enough years left to learn what she knows on this subject. She also plans a lot of European tours starting from scratch which is time consuming and no easy task.

However!, I am now the port/starboard expert!! (And, as my kids are fond of saying, "big whoppety-do"!)

[tomc]

jtl513 --

Many times either the bow or stern will be facing land, not either side.

Only in the movie "Speed 2: Cruise Control," if I understand your post correctly.

[jtl513]

jtl513 -- Only in the movie "Speed 2: Cruise Control," if I understand your post correctly.

I've never seen the movie, but I've been at a number of ports where the pier was perpendicular to the land, and either the bow or stern was facing land. In Costa Maya Mexico and Tallinn Estonia it was the stern, in Monaco and Naples it was the bow. There may be more that I can't think of right now.

[jtl513]

bump after time-out on last post

[Druke I]

You better add San Francisco to your list - all finger piers there. Nine times out of ten, bow first. Very rare to be stern first, due to prevailing currents/tides.

[Druke I]

delete-duplicated post.

[jtl513]

You better add San Francisco to your list - all finger piers there. Nine times out of ten, bow first. Very rare to be stern first, due to prevailing currents/tides.

Well, I was only trying to think of ones I've docked at! I'm sure there's dozens if not hundreds in the world. :) Plus there's ones like NYC where you have the banks of the Hudson at bow and stern. :)

[tomc]

I just wanted to toss in "Speed 2" for the heck of it. They docked the ship like my neighbor brings his car into the garage after a night of drinking. :rolleyes:

 

jtl513-- If you've never cruised, "Speed 2: Cruise Control" is a gripping drama. If you have cruise, it's a stupid attempt at being a gripping drama ... or a comedy. It's just soooo bad.

[obriendan]

And when you tie up astern, it is called a med moor (used in the Mediterrean). Here's an example from long, long age (July 4, 1956): The USS Borie (DD704) med moored at Naples, Italy. To execute this maneuver, you first drop your anchor and then go astern to the dock. So you are held in place by the anchor forward and the the pier astern. (Posting this again because, although it says it is posted, picture doesn't show up:confused: ).

[joeinsb]

Actually, there's some logic to having your cabin on starboard or port. Lat summer in the Mediterranean, we chose starboard on Nautica because we reasoned (correctly, that much of the time we would be seeing land, since the ship was sailing north from Sicily and such. As for tying up stern facing shore, in Puerto Vallarata, most (all?) of the six ships we've been on turned around when sailing in and moored bow facing the ocean. Methinks, for a fast getaway when the last pax struggles aboard :)

[tomc]

The board is here for anyone to get their questions about crusing answered.

[penwah2002]

It doesn't matter which side is which to me. When you have NO sense on direction it really doesn't matter.

On our first cruise on the NCL Dawn, I decided I needed a sweater for dinner after we left our cabin. I left my husband to sit an wait for me, and that's just what he did for about a half hour. I could not find where I left him sitting. I walked and walked that ship not remembering exactly where I left him. Finally I stumbled upon him and he had that "you've been lost" look on his face. Once again he tried to explain the ship layout to me but once again it made no sense to me. I have been fired as navigator of the maps when we travel, I always seem to second guess a map, like my sense of direction tells me something else and it usually is wrong.

So port, starboard, front, back, none of works for me, I just follow my husband.