Coastal Renaissance.

[bcscot]

The Queen of Alberni use to be a somewhat faded & dingy old ship, but since her refurbishment she looks great & is a nice vessel upon which to sail. The larger area of open car-deck is nice to walk around on a sunny day if it is not full of cars.

 

The Duke Point run has the advantage of being quieter, so I often use it. I will look forward to sailing this route on the new Coastal Inspiration later this year. It used to be the Alberni & the New West. on this run. The Coquitlam or Cowichan would be there sometimes & then the VERY SLOW old Queen of Esquimalt. Why is she so much slower than the other old vessels?

 

It is interesting news about the Queen of New West. I wondered why I had not seen her on the Duke Point run for a while. I do not know why they would keep her though & sell the Queen of Saanich.

 

I am not so familiar with the ships on the Sunshine Coast routes. The Queens of Cowichan, Coquitlam, Oak Bay & Alberni are all very nice since their upgrades. I did not know that the Surrey was a sister. Has she also had the 'makeover' treatment?

 

The Coastal Inspiration was reported on the radio this morning to be due to sail past Victoria. I will look out for her in Nanaimo on my next visit.

 

Graham.

[Putterdude]

It is interesting news about the Queen of New West. I wondered why I had not seen her on the Duke Point run for a while. I do not know why they would keep her though & sell the Queen of Saanich.

 

I am not so familiar with the ships on the Sunshine Coast routes. The Queens of Cowichan, Coquitlam, Oak Bay & Alberni are all very nice since their upgrades. I did not know that the Surrey was a sister. Has she also had the 'makeover' treatment?

 

I probably haven't been on the Queen Of Alberni more that 2 or 3 times as I have always lived on the North Shore or now up here on the Sunshine Coast (which is not to sunny today), so a trip using Horseshoe Bay was and is much more convenient for us. I do remember her as a very sterile ship with not a lot of passenger amenities but she has a specific purpose and does it well.

 

The Queen of New Westminster used to winter up here tied to the emergency dock we have up here. I am guessing and it is only a guess that she has deemed to have more service life in her than the others plus her size is such that she can be the back up on any number of routes.

 

Yes the Queen of Surrey has had the full mid-life redo. She never had escalators like her sisters did at one time. After an incident on one of the escalators the Cowichan or Coquitlam was pulled off this route and the Surrey was put on. The joke at the time was the people on the Coast couldn't handle escalators. The one difference in the Surrey's mid-life do over was that the people of the Coast didn't want the seats all facing one way because they felt that this did not foster communication. So the Ferry Corp relented and we do a have a number of the seats facing one another. I have to admit that it is a great way to have a discussion with your fellow "Coaster" and you will see us walking around looking for someone we know.

[Putterdude]

I spoke with # 2 son about the Queen of New Westminster and he has no idea what is going on with her in the yards. He did point out though that sometimes when they start on fairly innocent renovations SOLAS regulations kick in and they require much more than what was originally anticipated. He asked me if I had noticed the windows in the Queen of Tsawwassen and when I said I had he told me that they had been a SOLAS requirement a few years ago and they are fireproof and virtually bullet proof; thus the distortion I mentioned last evening. Evidently they had to replace or add 3 new search lights on the Northern Adventure and the only manufacture of the approved lights was a British company and by the time the lights were in place the bill was approaching $1m.

 

On another topic the replacement for the Queen of Tsawwassen on the Earls Cove/Saltery Bay run is currently being built by Vancouver Shipyards and Victoria Shipyards. She is an open decked ship and will be called the Island Sky (so much for the Queens). Her displacement is 3500 tons, she is just over 300 feet in length, will carry up to 600 passengers and 125 cars at a speed of about 14.5 knots. BC Ferries will accept delivery of her this summer and she will enter service this fall.

[Urban trekker]

Coastal Inspiration is now docked at Departure Bay in Nanaimo - she arrived yesterday and will be berthed there for a few months as the crews gets trained.

 

Regarding no longer having the name "Queen" This actually started with the Spirit Ships which goes back a ways but with an American Hahn running the show and wanting to and not succeeding in getting the Queen's picture off the ships it isn't a big surprise that we won't see the name Queen on any of our new ships.

 

Thanks for the info regarding the Queen of New West.

 

Cheers

 

Dennis

[Putterdude]

Yes I was aware that the name Queen disappeared with the "Spirit" ships but of course that pre-dates Hahn and he of course is just be guided by some wiz-bang marketing types. It is just when you saw the name Queen of "Something" the name of the town, city, or area immedaitely sprung into your mind. Island Sky, Coastal Renaissance mean nothing.

 

I was thinking more about the Queen of New Westminster and of course they are going to need a back up vessel but also what about replacements for ships like the Esquimalt, Saanich and Vancouver they will need something to replace them, we know about the Tsawwassen and the Island Sky?

 

As for the takeing down of the Queen's picture, I certainly was not in favour of it and when you look at the share structure of BC Ferries the only shareholder really is the Province so I am not sure who they were trying to kid. Again, my guess is that Hahn knew nothing about it... likely a decision of some young middle management person with out any affinity for the monarchy. However I am sure the that the Lt. Gov's office phoned the Premier's office who phoned Hahn's office and the whole matter was set right...quickly!

[bcscot]

They certainly seem to be coming on stream with the new ferries now. I suppose that they have had time to recover from the Pacificat debacle. One of those sat at the terminal in Departure Bay for ages. I then thought that I saw one or more sitting at North Vancouver for quite a long time. Where are they now? What was the reason for them being so unseaworthy? A sad story indeed.

 

Graham.

[Putterdude]

They certainly seem to be coming on stream with the new ferries now. I suppose that they have had time to recover from the Pacificat debacle. One of those sat at the terminal in Departure Bay for ages. I then thought that I saw one or more sitting at North Vancouver for quite a long time. Where are they now? What was the reason for them being so unseaworthy? A sad story indeed.

 

Graham.

 

I am not sure that people ever blamed the Ferry Corp for the FastCat fiasco as much as they did the NDP government of the day and without trying to sound to political, I think correctly so. I also suspect that is why the BC Ferry Services Corp … or some such name was set up. It was an exercise to try to remove the Ferry Corp from the direct control of the government, a sham actually, but also to try to privatize the fleet. To the best of my knowledge the only run that has been privatized is the route from Langdale to Keats and Gambier Islands and the patrons love it. There was also an announcement 6 or 8 mos ago that they had received an unsolicited offer for the Buckley Bay, Denman Is. and Hornby Is. route but nothing seems to have come of that.

The last time I saw the FastCats was about 8 mos ago and they were all in North Vancouver, two at Vancouver Shipyards (the Washington Marine Group who built them and then bought them back for less than the break up value of them) and one was down towards the Mosquito Creek marina.

I forgotten all that was wrong with them but one was the wake that they created at cruising speed which was alleged to be destroying certain marine habitat but I think the biggest single issue was the fact that marine life kept entering various ports relating to propulsion and causing overheating and breakdowns of engines. But I think the biggest single issue was political, they cost way too much, they were uncomfortable, people couldn’t sit in their cars because they were below the water line and people just plain hated them. I am sure that there were other issues as well but Dennis Washington after 6 or 7 years has had absolutely no success in selling them on the world market which probably tells us something.

[bcscot]

At least on the naming issue, they had a format with Queen of.., Spirit of...., & now even Coastal....whatever. Will they have other Island ..... ferries? The new names sound too much like cruise ships to me. I like the names with a historical or geographical link to the local area.

 

Graham.

[c-to-sea]

As I recall, the FastCats were like a camel, which is a horse designed by

a committee. The government kept making political appointments to the

group responsible for their design and construction to the point that they

became totally unsuited for their planned purpose. The wash was one problem

but another major fault was their weight. Instead of designing docks to handle

the ferries, they designed the ferries to fit the existing docks, adding tons to

their displacement weight, creating more wash, requiring more power (which

they did not have, thus the overheating) and increasing the operating cost.

I wouldn't be surprised to see them suddenly appear as floating accommodation

for the 2010 Olympics.

[Putterdude]

Your points are all well made and yes I also wouldn't be surprised to see them used for Olympic accommodation expect for the cost of renovating them to make happen and I wonder if Dennis Washington wants to throw anymore money into the bottomless hole. It would be interesting to know if his carrying costs on these vessels (aside from what was made from their building) has now outstripped his profit potential if he were to scrap them. Surely the only thing that would skate him onside would be the excalating cost of metals.

[bcscot]

What is the ferry service like in Fort Mohave?;)

 

Maybe they could use the PacifiCats down there.:D

 

Graham.

[Putterdude]

What is the ferry service like in Fort Mohave?;)

 

Maybe they could use the PacifiCats down there.:D

 

Graham.

 

Brilliant, phone Dennis Washington right a way, he could weld them nose to stern in the Colorado River and create another dam. But hey, some of the concrete freighter hulls forming the breakwater in Powell River are looking kind of tired after 60 years and maybe the FastCats could serve as replacements.:D

[Urban trekker]

I wonder if a certain very wealthy businessman with the initials of JP would be willing to let a certain VP with the initials GC time off work to help with the sinking of the fast cats.

 

As for naming aren't the other two new northern replacement ships going to have names starting with Northern when they join the Northern Adventure in a few years time.

 

Cheers

 

Dennis

[Putterdude]

As for naming aren't the other two new northern replacement ships going to have names starting with Northern when they join the Northern Adventure in a few years time.

 

Yes, Ut I believe that is the case. However like you, those of us who have lived in BC for so many years just relate Queen of......... to the BC Ferry Fleet but the name Northern ........ or MV Island ...... or Coastal ....... could belong to the Newfoundland Labrador fishing fleet. Though I guess in an other decade or so it really won't matter.

[Urban trekker]

"Though I guess in an other decade or so it really won't matter." The only Queens then may be the ones on Davie St in downtown Vancouver.

 

A little evening humor on a night that the Canucks sucked on the ice. While at least the Jr Giants are winning.

 

Cheers

 

Dennis

[Putterdude]

Putterdude, how did you enjoy your 5 hours and 18 minute delay in Powell River on Good Friday afternoon?

 

Well it is very kind of you to ask Mr. Hahn and you should have a letter on your desk tomorrow morning explaining how the Queen of Tsawwassen was 15 minutes behind schedule and we arrived at your Westview terminal at 11:57 for the noon sailing only to be told that your captain of the Queen of Burnaby had, per the book of rules, ordered that ticket sales be suspended at 11:55 precisely. Your terminal still had cars in it and the ship was still being loaded when we arrived. Our explanation to your very polite and embarrassed cashier that we were” in transit” passengers and that our tardiness was of your system’s making was to no avail.

 

Now Mr. Hahn notwithstanding that it was a holiday long weekend, I might have understood if your captain had had to maintain a very tight schedule, the need for a cut off of sales but in this instance the Queen of Burnaby was going to sit in the Little River terminal for 1 hour and 55 minutes before setting sail for Westview again. Surely Mr. Hahn the extra 30 seconds that Captain “By the Book” may have been delayed in loading an “in transit” passenger would not have negatively impacted the life of BC Ferries or indeed his own, however, his lack of discretion deprived us of a valuable and much anticipated afternoon with our 4 year old granddaughter.

 

May I suggest that if you are going to continue to market the “Circle Route” that Captain “By the Book” be required to attend a course in discretion and how to use same? But other than that Mr. Hahn we had a wonderful lunch at the “Taidal Zone” restaurant and then watching the smoke rise from the Powell River mill.

[bcscot]

Oh, I feel for you Putterdude. How frustrating & disappointing for you. I hate that sort of petty, rule orientated, illogical & small minded behaviour, & it is to be found everywhere. Of course it often comes from employees not being allowed to think & take some responsibility. If they are just abused for getting it wrong, then they will adhere rigidly to the rules to protect themselves.

 

One day on one of the Spirit vessels, I was hungry & had to resort to the fast food. The 'meal deal' was chicken strips, fries & a drink. I took water for the drink as I do not drink pop & the meal deal was cheaper than just the chicken & fries. Why was I not charged the cheaper rate? Well, because I had water (which was free) but I had to have pop to get the meal deal rate! The server would not listen to reason & I was getting 'hot under the collar' (losing my cool!). I went & poured myself a pop, presented it to her & was charged the cheaper rate. I then poured it down the drain & said " Well, did that achieve anything?" She looked at me quite calmy & said "Yes, it saved you $3." I retreated, defeated!:(

 

Graham.

[Putterdude]

The idea that the ferries used to go to Gibsons has been bugging me for days and I have finally found this article:

 

 

Fifty years ago, in 1957, Black Ball Ferries opened the Langdale ferry terminal on the flats next to Langdale Creek near Hopkins Landing. The terminal was built to handle Black Ball's hugely popular car ferry service between Horseshoe Bay and the Sunshine Coast which had started up six years earlier in 1951.

Before the Langdale terminal was built, the car ferries loaded and unloaded at the wharf at Gibsons Landing. In the beginning there was only one ferry (the M.V. Quillayute), it could handle only 48 cars, and it made only five round trips daily, so congestion at the Landing was manageable. However, the service became very popular very quickly: in the first 5 1/2 months, Black Ball reported handling 66,593 passengers, 10,000 cars, and 3,554 trucks. To meet demand, Black Ball put a larger ferry on the run in the summer of 1952 (the M.V. Bainbridge) and later added more sailings. In 1956, a second ferry was added (the S.S. Smokwa) which allowed for additional summertime sailings on the route.

As Black Ball service expanded, it became very clear that the Landing had to be abandoned in favour of a terminal which was built on level ground, could handle more traffic, and could provide more parking for outbound foot passengers. Black Ball also wanted to reduce the duration of the 70 minute ferry trip, if possible. The solution was to move the terminal to Langdale.

Although there were certainly compelling reasons for a move to Langdale, the decision stirred up plenty of controversy. Many locals thought it would turn the Landing into a ghost town because, for the first time in decades, there would be no regular ship service to the Gibsons wharf. (For the first half of the 20th century, Union Steamships had made regular stops at Gibsons.) The writer of a letter to the editor of the Coast News warned "...the severance of ferry service of any kind to Gibsons may bring about a diversion of the Provincial Highway which may miss Gibsons altogether..." and Tony Gargrave, the local MLA, blustered "...this will create many hardships for the people who live in Gibsons..." Despite these concerns, Black Ball went ahead with the Langdale terminal and it officially opened on June 19, 1957. As it turned out, it would be four decades before the feared highway by-pass was built, so the ferry traffic continued to pass through the Landing, and local merchants seemed to survive quite well.

 

Evidently Black Ball had started service in 1951 with 2 ships, the MV Machigonne (passengers only) and the MV Quillyute. So no wonder I couldn't remeber this, I was only 6 years old then.

[c-to-sea]

Great find, P-D. Where did you locate the article?

Brings back a few more distant memories. I had left Black Ball before the Langdale

terminal opened but recall making a few trips to Gibson's. On one occasion, a

loaded logging truck pushed the ferry away from the dock while boarding,

dropping the rear wheels off the deck. Caused a long delay until Tex Enemark

was able to dispatch a large crane truck to clean up the mess.

The Machigonne (sp) was operated prior to Black Ball and was passenger only.

It served the loggers and pulp mill workers coming to Horseshoe Bay for R&R.

(Although most got into the second R before the ship docked.) My friends

and I made pocket money meeting it after school and carrying bags up the

dock to the bus stop. A second ship, the MV Bonabelle also came into

Horseshoe Bay. This takes us even further back, as she, along with the

MV Hollyburn, had operated the passenger ferry service from downtown

Vancouver to West Vancouver. I last saw the Hollyburn as a shuttle for

Expo 86.

 

(Amazing where a post about a new ferry has lead.)

[Putterdude]

Part of it came from the Gibsons-Sunshine Coast archives and my foot note came from the history of Vancouver. Of course prior to the Black Ball ships the Coast, as you well know was serviced by Union Steamships and each little community had its own dock where the ships came in. My wife remembers when she was in Powell River as a little girl prior to the BC Ferries coming in, having to come to Vancouver by Union Steamships or by float plane....but she is much older than me. Yes I remember the Hollyburn and her retirement but I may be mistaken on this, but wasn't she reincarnated to run from the foot of Lonsdale to Downtown in the 1970's prior to the SeaBus? I can remember my dad using it, he had always car-pooled into downtown but quite liked the ferry and started to use it exclusively.

[Urban trekker]

From the Harbour Ferries website:

 

In 1945, Harbour Navigation purchased the MV Hollyburn (built in 1936- pictured above right) which did trips up to the Wigwam Inn. Previous to the purchase from Harbour Navigation, the MV Hollyburn carried passengers across the First Narrows to North Vancouver. The MV Hollyburn is still part of Harbour Cruises, permanently moored and converted into a Tour Reservations Office.

 

If I find more I will post it

 

Cheers

 

Dennis

[bcscot]

Evidently Black Ball had started service in 1951 with 2 ships, the MV Machigonne (passengers only) and the MV Quillyute. So no wonder I couldn't remeber this, I was only 6 years old then.

 

You are giving your age away there P-D. That would make you one of the early model 'Boomers'! I am a late model myself!:D

 

Great information. I think we started with the SS Prince George, prior to this thread.

 

So where is the MV Hollyburn moored?

 

Graham.

[c-to-sea]

MV Hollyburn should be here, according to the map on this page:

http://www.boatcruises.com/contact.html

 

Google Earth shows what I think is her in False Creek. She should be the

ship on the very inside, bow towards shore. This moorage would not allow

for in and out, so is probably the permanent office position, as I don't think

she is sailable. Zoom in to the marina with the larger vessels closer to Stanley

Park on the south side.

[Urban trekker]

I am also an early boomer and now enjoying the fruits of my labours over the past 40 years. Putterdude has me beat by a couple of years.

 

The MV Hollyburn is now the office for Harbour Ferries and is berthed in Coal Harbour near the foot of Denman.

 

Crazy weather here right now in downtown Vancouver - it started hailing and snowing about an hour ago and hasn't stopped - you can see clearer skies all around the area - it is almost as if the storm has stalled over the downtown peninsula.

 

Cheers

 

Dennis

[Putterdude]

Crazy weather here right now in downtown Vancouver - it started hailing and snowing about an hour ago and hasn't stopped - you can see clearer skies all around the area - it is almost as if the storm has stalled over the downtown peninsula.

 

Well we had the snow up here yesterday, it kind of took the edge off picking the second crop of bananas. However nice today, we had a neighbourhood park dedication and the sun came out for that.