Harters

Ah. That makes much more sense. Such a contract would probably be illegal under UK competition law I remember, when I think I was a young teenager, the UK did have government imposed price controls on quite a wide range of products. So long ago, I can't recall its name. Think it was scrapped in the late 1960s - I have a vague recollection that it was "a big thing" but I was too young to really have any interest in it.

That's interesting and actually surprised me. I would never have thought the law in the States would constrain how a company trades in that way. Is it only cruises that cannot be discounted, or are many other things "price fixed" by law? Flights, escorted tours, cars, TVs, etc?

As we've both said before - it is what it is.

Vallesan - I think a discussion about how TAs operate in different countries is a very different matter. Interesting as I'm sure it would be, with the ban on naming names on the forum it's difficult to get into any details. But I would note that O's "preferred TAs" who are members of its Club (getting additional financial support from O) are all North American. It reflects the fact that North Americans form the vast majority of O's customers. It means they are likely to be in a position to pass on some extra benefit to their customers, so the price gap most probably widens between North American customers and those elsewhere.

It's just awful. Nothing works with any great success. Our first visit to the States was in 1980 and we've visited a goodly number of times since then. I cannot sleep on planes so that and the time difference means I am always wrecked when I get back to the UK. It takes me perhaps three days to get back to some semblance of normality and, always, feeling I need another holiday to recover. And it's got steadily worse as I've got older. Our last trip was to join the ship for a transatlantic cruise back to Europe. So, no jet lag issues with that but I doubt whether I want to visit the States again on a trip that involves flying back home.

And on our recent one. One evening, there was only us there. Can't understand it. Lovely spot for an aperitif.

I do actually have one (and I bet most Brits have never heard of it). The term was first coined in the mid 1970s when I was studying for my professional qualification in municipal administration. One of the modules of the Final level (which I never gained in spite of sitting the examination three times) was about the British constitution.It is one of our quirks that whilst Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales have their health services run by their own local parliaments/assemblies, the service in England is run by the national UK government. My view then, and now, is that these powers should be passed to new regional assemblies in the English regions. West Lothian question resolved. Or that Scotland votes to cede from the union and the people of Northern Ireland vote to join the South. Then the country stops being called the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and becomes, simply, Britain.

It's bad enough when its amongst our family members. I don't want to discuss it when on holiday and with strangers (most of whom will be from a foreign land with few having a real grasp of the nature of the politics in my country, not I of theirs). .

HOHOs can be very helpful for us. We used one at Malaga on our recent Vista cruise. The Costa del Sol is an area well known to us from previous holidays so we werent really interested in any organised excursion. In most other ports, we just ambled round the cities as best we could, at our own pace. Means we can stop for a coffee, or simply a sit down on a park bench, when we need it, rather than being tied to an organised excursion. Two hours walking at our own pace, with stops, is very different to an organised excursion which may also have two hours walking but over which we have no control. By the by, we did an O excursion at Monte Carlo where, basically, you see the cathedral, the prince's palace and the casino. But we came away having no sense that we'd really visited the place and we'd have got a much better feel if we'd just gone for a walk.

Indeed so. I would certainly expect there to be a price differential as, within UK consumer law, the cruise is defined as a "package holiday" which is protected should the operator go bust. There's also protection that requires an operator to refund the cost of a holiday they have to cancel (such as with Covid), rather than offering only a future credit. We were actually able to take advantage of that at beginning of Covid, when our operator tried to only offer a credit - only resolved when we played the "see you in court" card. The $300 difference between UK and US prices may not be unreasonable but I've no way of knowing the implied costs for O. Oceania does note its compliance with UK law in its "small print".

Coffee and SM soft drinks are gratuity free.

Thanks EJL. Interesting. The without air is the better comparison as this is a UK - UK cruise, so no airfare included for we Britons. So, the $6249, plus $18 per day gratuities, gives a total of $6465 for American customers. Some $300 cheaper than the price available to Britons, with gratuities, at $6767.

Absolutely. It's not a discount, just a different way of costing a cruise for markets that do not have a tipping culture (or not a significant one). But let's see what the actual situation is. In this I need the help of one of our American cruisers who can look at O's website priced in USD and see what a fare is. Have a look at Vista's cruise departing 3 June 2025 "Epicurean Awakening" . On O's site, priced in sterling, an A1 concierge veranda has the brochure price of 6099 GBP and a promotional price of 5299 GBP. That converts to $7788 and $6767. What's the listing on the US site?

We've done three O cruises. One was a penthouse (Nautica - because of the well reported small shower elsewhere) and the other two concierge veranda. The facility to make early reservations for speciality restaurants is important to us - in being able to book when and what we want. The free laundry was also helpful on our recent transatlantic. For our Vista cruise next year, the price differential between an A1 and a B1 is £30pppd. Well worth it to us. Maybe not to others.

The new arrangements for Britons mirror the arrangements that Australian and New Zealand customers for some time. I'd suggest that it reflects a different cultural attitude towards tipping in our countries than exists in North America.

And drinks in the bars still attract a 20% gratuity regardless.

We were on Vista a few weeks back. This cruise was booked with Simply More but before general gratuities were included in the cruise price for British (and other European?) customers. Gratuities were added to our onboard account, as they had been before SM.

Congratulations and best wishes that it stays that way. We have various medical conditions (including the fact the cancer has returned to the lymph nodes next to my prostate - but very much under control). It means our annual travel insurance policy, including cover for European cruises, is expensive - about £1200 (about 1500 USD). We have recently taken a transatlantic which meant we were in the States and the Caribbean for six days. Those six days more than doubled the insurance cost and would have been much more had the annual policy not been coming towards its end. It probably means it'll be too expensive for us to consider visiting the States again.

The suggestion to look at Trivago (or my preferred booking.com) is a good one. It will give you actual comparisons so you can form your own view about what's available and at what sort of cost. You're going to get better info than relying on the relatively limited information that contributors like me can offer.

Indeed so. And changes can happen very quickly. For most of my trips to London in recent years, I've stayed out in Brentford (nearish to the National Archives, where I was doing research). I remember once pricing PI, then going to check the local Travelodge price and, I think, a Holiday Inn. The PI had been cheapest but, by the time I came back to their website to book, maybe 30 minutes later, the price had gone up and was no longer cheapest.

I generally stay in Premier Inns when I travel round the country - including the one at Euston (which I've stayed at several times when visiting the central area of the capital). If backpackers hostels are only a bit down market from PIs, then perhaps I should start looking to stay at hostels in future. FWIW, PI Euston would cost £219 for a room next week, on their "pay in advance, non-refundable" rate, without nbreakfast. In American terms, PI is something akin to the Days Inn chain, if that helps

No it wasn't. The question was actually "about non-alcoholic drinks like......."

I'm sure you're right. Lyre's and Seedlip products are increasingly commonplace in the UK. As someone who hasnt drunk alcohol for over 20 years, I certainly welcome it (as I do the improving quality of zero alcohol beer and wine). It used to be the case that water was pretty much the only non-alcoholic alternative to sugary drinks like Coke.

Some non-alcoholic cocktails were chargeable on Vista. For example, the "No-groni", which uses Lyre's non-alcoholic substitutes. Similarly, a Lyre's "gin" and tonic is chargeable. And, IIRC, perhaps even more surprisingly, "San Pellegrino Cocktail", served in Baristas Aperitivo

Well, we've booked the two excursions for the ports where we didnt really have other plans. The third wasnt worth the investment of another £100 each, so we'll wing it for that port. It is what it is and we'll include this in our post cruise discussion about whether or not cruising remains a good value holiday for us.