in rod we trust

sorry but if there was a 20 storey building next to you they would not pay big bucks they will give ya stuff all , and tell you who are you going to sell it to and who wants to live in a house next to a 20 storey building ..  so they will offer you stuff all probably even lower than market value to get your house for peanuts..   seen it done many times , people hold out thinking there house is worth more than what they offer , but in the end they loose more cause nobody wants to live next to a high rise .. 

and big m .. wasn't a 20 storey cruise terminal, it was a 20 storey high rise next to your house if you would be a nimbyists , block your sun , stuff your gardens up wreck your view ..  its ok to call people nimbyists or greenies , etc until it affects people  then they become one of those nimbyists, or greenies..  so you ok with it cruise terminal  because its not in your backyard , and a matter of convenience for you to board and cruise ship ,  no matter what the destruction building it or the dangers of it.. so long its not in your back yard ..  im not asking for a new deep water port to be built , im asking that they use there existing ones in Newcastle and Wollongong , not destroy a whole bay for massive ships just to use 3 months of the yr.. that's a joke

28 minutes ago, The_Big_M said:

They can only tell you what they can tell you. As said multiple times earlier the study and investigation has not been done.

 

Of course if they hadn't run the "sham info session" then they would be accused of not discussing anything with the public at all, and just being secretive.

 

Very predictable - as said, it's opposition for the sake of NIMBYism, not because there's any rational basis.

the studies have been done as far as port authority side of things,  and that's right they will only tell us lies. they have the business case ready to go but wont release it .. what are they hiding why not release it , its not national security its a cruise port ..they are hiding behind cabinet in confidence they know it will cost upwards of the 1.5 billion not 500 as they say they know it will destroy that whole area and pollute the whole of botany bay rending it un usable to swim or fish or any such water activities ..  

sorry but I pointed out many many things wrong with this proposal ,  I wont go into them again , or id be here all night … your main response is nimbyists all the time id like to see them put a 20 storey high rise next to your house and see how you would react see if you become a nimbyist as you point out...  what gets me is we go on cruises to see other countries and islands and say what a very nice beautiful place but when we get home we trash those who want to protect and save such places in our own backyard ..  that to me is very disappointing ..   

12 hours ago, Chiliburn said:

Rod that report refers to disturbing the industrial sediment in the inner harbour and parramatta river.

 I can’t think how that’s relevant to port botany.

ACI was a big polluter in the botany area but don’t think anything like the inner harbour.

The inner harbour and parramatta river had the big boys ICI ,Union carbide,James hardy just to name a few.

botany bay is just as polluted as Sydney harbor botany has a working port on both sides the amount of factories that lined georges river that threw there waste crap into the bay .. fpas from yrs and yrs of fire training and the engine pond at the airport has made that bay toxic....

by the way I went to the info sham session they could not even tell us anything about where it was going to be , where a break wall would be built , the exclusion zone from entering ships.. they say 50mtrs from a docked ship that's a sham the container ship have almost 350 mtr exclusion zone in place right now  even when there are no ships  , no info on what impacts it would have on marine life , or  if any of those beaches would remain, .. there projected area in there info sham map the water there is very shallow , the waves at times in summer reach right up that break wall , the average swell there in summer with the incoming high 2 mtr tides smash against that break wall  ... so another  break wall would have to be built from bare island to stop them swells smashing the ship or there supposed floating dock..  there are artificial reefs we anglers paid for to be put in they will have to be ripped out, pipe lines run under that section as well,  .. and that info sham session was just for them to say they consulted the stakeholders cross there T and dot there I's … half those so called people at the info session were not even from port authority and were day pr hire people who could not even answer any question's .. about 95% of the people boycotted that info sham only a few when in to see what it was all about.. it was directed at the cruise passenger and not stakeholders.. it was the biggest sham session I have ever seen .. but ithink with the action planned royal carribean will soon take note and attn when it starts affecting there back pockets 

this is the goverments confidence in cabinet report on Sydney harbour , and what the harm of the toxins can do , botany is worse than Sydney harbor as its still a working bay ..  and yeah I know I rave on but there is a time in some peoples lives wher one can no longer sit and see there country go down the drain to foreign investors coming in rapping our lands taking all the profits overseas for a couple of donations to labor or liberal party coffers ..  

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-12/western-harbour-toll-construction-to-produce-toxicity-study/9537082

joined up hopefully I can get couple tickets to supprise my misses ..  I like kiss too so be nice to get a couple …  

15 hours ago, ger_77 said:

Here's the link for the KISS cruise; I believe your questions are best answered there.

https://www.thekisskruise.com/

 

Smooth Sailing!  🙂🙂🙂

cheers 

sorry but foreshore rd, m5 and all other rds from botany are gridlocked ,  its bumper to bumper on them rds , so its not solving any traffic jams just increasing it...   there is a basic and unconfirmed design , I went to the info session,  ..

that is the last remaining beach on the north side of botany , the aboriginal people have been using it way before any settlers arrived here and still do use it, people sail there they swim there , seals lives there, dolphins come and play there, we have corla reefs 400 yrs old there , seahorses that are found no where else living there , .. I fish botany bay , when the port extension happen it was a ghost town , then the desal plant , its just slowly come back to life after 10 yrs  and that is in yarra bay , where no dredging or development has happen ..the rest of the bay has strict limits on fish that you catch and eat  and further upstream you cant even eat the fish anymore .. the  proposed terminal is right on the edge of the break wall less than 100 mtrs from gas caverns and storage tanks,  driving piles in that close has a major risk in collapsing those caverns..  there are dangerous sediments on the seabed millions of contaminated  seabed spoil  will go thorught the entire botany bay like it did with the port extension killing thousand of fish and sea grass, people swim in kurnell side and brighton side , exposing them toxins is dangerous and stupid …  the EPA states than botany bay should not be dredged due to pfas and other terrible cancer causing toxins .. you know and I know the goverment  will find there own people to do surveys and give them a grant just so they can tow the government line..  

now if you rather stuff the whole eco system of a bay just so people can have better access for a cruise line company like royal carribean , to use it 3 months of the yr  then what can I say … its not to replace white bay that will still be used as a cruise terminal  ..

you say as long as its done correctly now when has any government done anything right .. or under budget  .. if you go on cruise ships and your not willing to travel a bit more or less depending where you live to Newcastle or port kembla or Wollongong ,and rather see a whole bay destroyed just for convenience , again what can I say  by the time people wake up its all gone..  and you keep going on about nimby   I don't live anywhere near botany bay I live closer to the city ..  .. all the council's in the area don't want it 90% of residents in botany bay area don't want it,  anglers don't want it , many amny people and different ethnic background people use the bay .. where I live in bankstown people are outraged by this destruction to the bay and we are 40 min away .. so sorry nobody wants it there...  no need on destroying the whole bay just for 330 mtr ships ..  save your country not destroy it . stop selling it off as no doubt it will be  sold of like everything else if it goes ahead ...it very selfish to say we need it there just for a cruise line that spends little to stuff all in the country , .. they fly international flags to avoid paying taxes , gee royal carribean and other ships use to fly liberian flags , and now malta flags to avoid paying taxes..   but anyway  that's another great story and ill fight to the bitter end with the rest of the 100, 000 anglers of Sydney  we have a major protest coming up against it and well done to all who see the value in saving the country for future generations..   sorry for the long reply but I cant stand by and see a whole bay destroyed for a cruise ship terminal … 

id like to supprise my wife with tickets to a kiss cruise but heard they get booked real quick ,  I have read its a presale and would like to know how are my chances of getting a ticket .. I know you have to fly to Miami for boarding 

On 12/5/2019 at 1:12 PM, The_Big_M said:

 

Having come across similar posts from others on other sites and facebook that say similar things, I get the impression they're community NIMBYists that just parrot the same lines and aren't interested in rational discussion or logic. They disregard many facts, and make their own up, then have others parrot them, all to achieve their desired outcome. Reminds me of a similar approach with natural gas protestors a few years back.

 

In that, the NSW government broke their own laws, and went against the Chief Scientist, and caved in. I wouldn't be surprised if there are a few of the same agitators here trying to get the same outcome.

 

can you please explain what rational discussion or logic  is in destroying a whole bay and eco system  just for a cruise ship terminal … what facts have people disregard .  also what have they made up on this proposal,  you mention few might be agitators..  

but look at the real facts …  there are so many negative points and some dangerous ones  that a cruise terminal shouldn't be even considered .. there are plenty other deep water ports up and running to house these 330 mtr ships  don't have to be all in Sydney .. not sure where you live but Sydney is at grid lock ..

you may call me and others nimbyists..   some people care about there country, they don't want to see it sold off for a few bucks.  if people don't stand up for what is right what future is there for your kids and grandkids ..  look back in history and see the few who stood up to give everybody a better life  are they nimbyists ..  I was like many people  if it don't bother me or not in my back yard who cares . until one day a yr ago with fishing lockouts my nephews while out fishing said if all this goes of limits where are we going to fish when we are old enough to buy a boat , what happens to us uncle ??  that bothered me badly  so I took them to a rally against the fishing lockouts and we won.. the smiles they have while fishing is priceless  ..  so call me what ya like but I will stand up and fight for there future and boycott royal carribean who are the ones pushing for it and even offering cash to build it..   

the only cruise line pushing for it is royal carribean to fit there mega ships in there ..

if I want to stand up for a bay that has historic values and a place for people to relax and unwind whats so bad about that.... we see parts of our country get sold of to communist  we see so many of what we own sold off now what future are you leaving ya kids and grand kids...  I don't really care ill fight to save it .. ill boycott royal carribean ,  today there was a pod of dolphins messing around with paddle boarders,  now really do you think its worth spreading those dangerous toxin   around botany Cronulla beach just for a cruise ship terminal..  really is it worth it...  call me nimby call me what ya like not worried , but when one day it comes and affects you or ya family maybe then ya might see why we need to protect what little we have left...    ill still go on a cruise but since its my money I can pick where and who ill spend that money with..  who knows maybe I might fly and enjoy more time at the country I visit .. 

15 hours ago, possum52 said:

Wow, you’ll not let your your wife go? What an astounding statement to make at the end of the 2nd decade of the 21st century. Doesn’t she have a say?

 

I actually thought your post made some sense until the last sentence. That lost me completely!

 

Leigh

well if im paying for it then you bet I will not let her go on any royal carribean ship.. there are other ships she will be just as happy to go on ..  at the moment she is pushing for the kiss cruise with her friends .. that's one cruise that eludes her  its a pull out of the hat ticket as many people want to go on it..  I hope she gets it  … never looked into who operates that ship but if she got a ticket I might say no but I know I cant stop her and her dream cruise..  

13 hours ago, mr walker said:

 

says it all! So, not just a NIMBY eh. I am really starting to wish that the Yarra Bay proposal goes ahead now 🙂…...

13 hours ago, mr walker said:

 yeah whats wrong with that she is my wife and I don't even have to say no to royal carribean  she wont go .. backs the bay over the royal carribean any day.. and no im no nimby I don't live anywhere near it im closer to Sydney harbor ten min away and botany is 35 min away .. but I believe in saving a great place for the future not rip it up and put a whole bay at risk for what royal carribean ships..  save your country not let these companies destroy it for there back pocket ..  im sorry but we will be looked and remembered for not doing nothing , letting our gov sell and destroy everything,  so whats so wrong with trying to save a piece of it …  im sure people here would agree Ningaloo reef if you been there is one of the most amazing place on earth   now they are trying to run pipelines thru a world heritage place  subsea 7  .. you know if we don't start saving our country then what does that say about us .. isn't it time we change .. 

 

as I mentioned she goes on more cruises than what I go im the one at home looking after the pets its like 2 to 1  .. she goes of with her mum and good friends , but even she backs me and wont go on any roryal carribean ship...  and don't give a rats but no way would I let her go on any royal carribean .. even her friends have also said no to royal carribean ships..  her and her friends go every yr and  I go every 2 yrs ..  

 good on matt .. the idea is stupid way to close to gas storage , cemetery  in front , cranes,  container ships,  and destroying a whole beach is stupid , there is also pipelines under that spot, not to mention at mollineaux point has 4 massive underground gas storage caverns 250 long being close to the proposed port could rupture them  and that would be a disaster …   lets see if royal carribean are still willing to add to the destruction of such a awesome beach and bay...  and on another note botany bay would be more of a target than Sydney with all the gas storage caverns and oil wharf ….. there is too much at risk with this idea and should be stopped...  as I mention I will not go on any royal carribean cruise again nor will I let my wife go ...

On 11/22/2019 at 10:27 AM, gbenjo said:

Me thinks the latter, probably never set foot on a cruise ship, favourite  colour is green and has a deep dislike for Royal Caribbean for some unexplained  reason???  the word troll comes to mind. Happy to be proven wrong.

 well me thinks wrong  .. been on plenty cruise ships altho the wife has been on more than me lol  .. but have a think about where the cruise ship takes us to awesome places..  im just trying to save one of those awesome places yarra bay .. I swim there and fish there , my family has been going there for over 40 yrs , have fond memories with the old man rip  going fishing there ,  …  if this goes ahead opposite the terminal is gas storage caverns if that goes up the cruise ships and all the passengers will go with it  ..im against royal carribean as they are the ones calling for botany bay other cruise lines don't want it and have ships in Wollongong , port kembla , and Newcastle ..  whats  so wrong with trying to protect what little we have left of our country  yarra bay is a place where  people  can unwind from the grind .....   about time people put there country first ..  if not for you than at least your kids future..  

hayes dock cannot be used as the height of the cruise ship is  to dangerous for planes landing wind turbulence  according to pilots union …  the answer is Newcastle , port kembla , or Wollongong …  500 million to build it at botany , they could spend 100 million to upgrade all three other options and give the  rural fire brigade / farmers  urgent funds to combat the fires and drought … there is no need to destroy and waste that kind of money for a cruise line like royal carribean who made 2 billion profit …  royal carribean should  not be pushing the gov for it to be built there knowing how much damage it will cause to the bay and beaches ..  

here is  a small vid 

thanks for the welcome all

ill try answer all the above in one post ...

yes its all about the big bucks and  greed plus maybe a job for one of the politicians  down the line who approves it .. like most things they approve someone of them always get a high earning cushy job..

I target royal carribean as they are the only ones calling for it and have mentioned they will put some funds towards it  they want to dock there 5000+ passenger mega ships there …  

as for dredging it has to be done the water depth at yarra bay  or molli point isn't deep enough for these massive ships there is also artificial reefs that will have to be ripped up  most of it will have to be dredge and will have to keep being dredge due to the being so close to the heads , there will have to be another break wall  built as the swells there can reach and have reach 2 mtrs in summer the average is about 1 mtr  during  summer winds …  the dredging of that area is very dangerous due to the toxins that have settled over time on the bottom.  

 and lets face it who wants to come in to botany bay and see container terminals and a cemetery as you come thru to dock  … the bay has been raped already has just come back to life with dolphins visits , seals , albatross birds and sea horse life not to mention the fishing has just recovered after the port expansion ….  there are better option than destroying a whole bay  for royal carribean greed .. I will never travel with royal carribean again unless they drop this proposal and neither will my cruise friends .. we love Australia its one of the best places in the world to live and should not destroy it for big companies like royal carribean .. im going to boycott them so are my other friends and go with another cruise company this yr …. cheers and thanks all happy cruising ..

don't under stand why they would want to destroy botany bay for a cruise ship terminal .. if they dredge that area , so much toxins would pollute the whole bay.. it will kill whats left there.. dolphins visit yarra bay , seals have a spot there, seahorse's live there and 16 types found no where else .. its just recovered for anglers to fish it  kids swim there family's swim there and not to mention the rock pool

.. these cruise ships on one hand want to take you to beautiful places and on the other hand destroy some for  there back pockets...  if you love Australia and the beauty of it you would say no to this stupid idea …  there is no way I would sail anymore with royal carribean if this goes thru ..  id find a ship that goes directly to syd harbor not botany bay