B_A_H

@Ianna's experience or one's like them have been shared by quite a few people on the forum. MSC doesn't do IT, payment processing, cruise moves, or refunds well. Pretty much anything that ends up being an exception is going to be rough going with lots of follow-up to get resolved. In all my cruises with them I've run in to some annoyances that were worked through vs. really big issues like @Ianna and @mscdivina2016 have experienced. But caveat emptor. Any of us could end up on the wrong side of an MSC exception at any time. As they say, you spin the wheel and take your chances. 😉

IT is MSC's kryptonite. Compared to most other cruise lines, what you can see and do in advance online is pretty sparse. You can buy things like drink and specialty dining packages, internet packages, and spa services. You can't schedule any of them until you're on the ship. You can't upgrade an included or previously purchased package (EG: Browse to Browse & Stream, Easy to Easy Plus). Canceling or modifying anything that was purchased in advance requires jumping through hoops and refunds can be horribly delayed. Helpful hint: don't buy anything through the cruise planner unless you're 100% sure you want it and plan to use it exactly as purchased. Any change made to your booking causes it to reprice to today's rate and an auto-generated e-mail is sent out. That just happened to me because the port charges dropped. My cruise fare went up $1,000. It's so common MSC has a dedicated e-mail set up for fixing it - mscexistingreservations@msccruisesusa.com. Another common complaint is that what's showing confirmed via e-mailed confirmation or online may be different once you're on the ship. For example, if a sailing is crowded they go from early/late in the MDR to early/mid/late. And the specified times for each of the three tiers can be different across dining rooms. So there could be two early's, two mid's, and two late's for a total of six different dining times. When they do, early is really early and late is really late. Experiences vary as to how receptive the Maître D is in making changes onboard. Same thing with changing assigned tables even though you didn't know your table in advance. Comparisons to the Soup *** from Seinfeld have been made. It even affects YC. You receive a full page of customization you can select. The ship receives none of them. Helpful hint: Aurea is a get out of jail free card from dining time hell because it comes with "anytime" dining which means the Maître D has to accommodate you. Let's just say interacting with MSC both pre-cruise and onboard is "quirky." As they keep expanding perhaps that'll be an incentive to join the 21st century.

Suites are what, 10% of a ship's cabins at most? NCL is a mainstream line based on the other 90%. Celebrity's 90% is (or used to be) a more premium experience. I've been on both. While YMMV, NCL isn't my cup of tea. At least based on my non-suite experience with them. There are three levels of cruise line experiences. I'm calling them mainstream, premium, and luxury/boutique. Others can call them whatever they prefer but which cruise line fits in which tier is pretty much universally accepted. Virgin being the exception because there's debate whether they are mainstream or premium. I'd suggest few here would categorize NCL as "premium." YC certainly doesn't categorize MSC as premium.

I looked at MSC for Me and found this interesting. The same verbiage also applies to all the specialty dining options. It isn't on MDR options or the buffets. If they are following halal (or at least trying to) that adds an entirely different dimension for procurement and food preparation. It certainly explains the "lamb tacos" and the oddities and limitations on the YC menu. I'd assume things go back to normal once the ship leaves the Middle East. I used to think a Middle East cruise would be something different and adventurous. From @alistairg's review and others I've read I think I'll skip it. Different isn't always good. 😉

Didn't catch that one. 😉 And I hope @Markanddonna isn't putting NCL on the "more prestigious" list. They are as mainstream as they come. For me, the tier in between mainstream and prestigious would be "premium" which I'd label Princess, HAL, and Celebrity. But those three, according to postings in their respective forums, are slowly hacking away at the things that earned them their above-mainstream status.

Well, that's not good. I'm going on a World Europa med cruise out of Barcelona in May and have been looking for reviews; especially YC. Almost all of the reviews, mostly on YouTube, have been from Brits and Europeans. The general theme has been disorganization, overstressed staff, running out of things, and some not favorable comments about the behavior of the Middle Easterner's that make up a large portion of the guests. I'm hoping when the World Europa transitions to the med in April it finds its mojo. That dining room pic with plastic water bottles and empty Coke cans certainly doesn't shout "luxury," does it? My January Divina cruise was nothing like that. Acqua Panna and San Pellegrino were served from glass bottles and kept chilled in nearby ice buckets for when the waitstaff needed to do refills. There are 152 YC staterooms on World Europa which translate to 304 people at double occupancy. The Seascape has 131 (262), the Virtuosa has 103 (206), and the Divina 69 (138). Maybe when it comes to YC bigger isn't better? I guess I'll find out soon enough.

Two things allow the cruise lines to continue to raise prices and pare inclusions and service. Land-based options and airfare are through the roof now which makes cruising seem like an even better value; even at elevated prices. The other thing is new cruisers, and there's the potential for lots of them, have no idea that the total for their 7 day cruise will likely be twice what they initially paid. All the earnings calls for the big three have gleefully pointed out how much higher onboard spend is now and that there's even more opportunity. I find it hard to believe that Celebrity thinning out MDR options and making them less attractive isn't tied to increasing the use of specialty dining. Or perhaps I'm just being cynical.

Isn't this horse dead yet? No one here is going to change @mscdivina2016 or the OP's positions about their experiences and what they thought should have been done because of them. Both are using their experiences to grind an axe and smite MSC for not responding in the way they wanted. MSC are who they are. They aren't like other mainstream cruise lines. They do have clunky IT, have some strange policies, approach food and service differently, and will never win any customer service awards. Those things have been talked about for years so I'd assume MSC is sticking with them. None of that's dissuaded me from sailing with them. People should do their research before booking any individual cruise or with a particular cruise line. Those researching MSC would find numerous references to the things they do differently. If those things clash with an individual's expectations than perhaps MSC isn't the cruise line for them.

His videos are click-baitish and I've watched a few. Never gotten all the way through one though. This one was truly odd. And it focused almost entirely on what happened from 10PM on vs. the overall sailing. I'm not saying he may not of had some negative interactions with people due to his white girlfriend (he's black for those who didn't watch) because they are an interracial couple. But sadly those things could happen anywhere and I don't see how it reflects on MSC or the passengers they attract. If passengers were pre-screened for appropriateness Carnival wouldn't exist. He mentioned adults, mostly international, allowing their teenage daughters to dress older than their years and that they were being hit upon. Exactly what is any cruise line to do about something like that? "Sir, I'm sorry but your daughter's tight dress and makeup don't meet our standards and she'll have to leave the lounge." It's a parent's responsibility to raise and safeguard their children. He was babbling about security not being prominent enough but I never really understood the point he was making or the harm it caused. He mostly talked about what "could" have happened. I've never seen a security issue on any of my MSC cruises but I assume they monitor and respond to them just like the other cruise lines. The passenger mix on every sailing is different. Sounds like he drew a dud and decided to paint MSC as fatally flawed because of it. None of his videos on any cruise or cruise line have a positive focus; they tend to have ledes like "what I hated about [insert cruise line]" and "is the food on [insert cruise line] the worst?" It must work for him because he has a 1M+ views. But that doesn't make him objective and I don't follow him.

Those are things being faced across the tourism industry. The third and fourth items should help mitigate the second and to some degree the first. Celebrity is increasing prices, actively and passively, yet still (and consciously) reducing quality, quantity, variety, and to a degree service. They are walking a fine line based on their self described position as a "premium" cruise line. Too much cost cutting puts their premium-ness at risk. I canceled a November sailing on Apex because I know the ship will be full which item one will impact and for the Celebrity cost premium item two was something I didn't want to take a chance on. What Celebrity does next depends on how many people react the way I did and whether there's enough new blood to replace us. If people start canceling or booking away, which I'm sure they track, that will get their attention and potentially make them reconsider their race to the bottom. Or, maybe it won't.

If by "prestigious" OP's referring to Regent, Azamara, Seabourn, Silversea, and Viking, it's comparing apples and oranges even though YC may be priced similarly to the entry level prices on those boutique/luxury lines. All those cruise lines have ships that hold less than 1,000 people. Ships that size have far fewer venues, limits on entertainment offered, and skew toward a much older demographic. They also tend to be more port intensive and their cruises are longer and to more exotic destinations. Traveling with those lines is less about the cruise/ship and more about experiences at where they stop. I've been on some of them and the food and service are exceptional (when done right). I don't seek them out though because frankly, they can be boring. With YC you get equal the food and service (when done right) but you have an entire 5,000 passenger ship to entertain you. Then, when you've had enough of the 5,000 passengers, you retreat to your exclusive little corner of the ship. I gravitate to YC because I like a "cruise" vs. "destination" experience and I like the diversion MSC's large ships provide. I also like the diversity of the broad demographic you'll find on MSC's ships. Choosing a specific cruise, ship, or cruise line is a huge YMMV because one person's ideal cruise could be another's nightmare.

You kind of don't need proof. People like OP who take paragraphs to recount an issue, or like @mscdivina2016 belaboring a point ad nauseum, typically aren't just sharing a point or experience. OP wanted sympathy because his two page complaint letter didn't get him a free cruise and I've yet to figure out what @mscdivina2016's pile on was all about. There's an old saying - leopards don't change their spots. Some people relish being miserable and you can tell by what and how they post.

Some helpful Internet tips. Everyone on the ship shares limited bandwidth. The more people online at the same time, the slower everyone's individual connection will be. Early morning and late evening is when you'll get fastest speeds. Same with port days when everyone's off the ship. Sea days, forget about it. Also, the fuller this ship is the more people that are sharing bandwidth. That's why for the same ship you can hear howls of complaints about Internet speed and others saying how great it is. When you sign-in for the first time when you're onboard, the directions and pricing are confusing. The upgrade price I was shown for two devices was $35 a day. Once I clicked through it was $48 for the week. Clear as mud.

There have been some first time MSC cruisers in this thread trying to read how what's discussed might affect them. Let me share some insight. Some is specific to MSC, some is universal. Other seasoned MSC and general cruise veterans feel free to chime in. The mix of passengers - 3 and 4 night cruises, especially those over weekends, draw a rowdy crowd looking to exploit every minute they are on the ship. These sailings are also typically full. Because they are relatively cheap, you typically get a bunch of first time cruisers. The combination of these things are a recipe for service issues, overcrowding, and behavior you might not want to be around. MSC's short cruises are the cheapest and they have bargain "resident rates" that further affect the passenger mix. I avoid these cruises. I did take a 4 night Meraviglia cruise that left Sunday from Port Canaveral in October. I saw what I described but the ship wasn't full because it left on a Sunday and I was in Aurea which helped. But I saw people slamming drinks starting at 6:00AM and by midday you can imagine their condition. So caveat emptor on short cruises. Where you sail from - Miami cruises skew both heavily Hispanic and international (Miami is a big European gateway). You're looking at boisterous crowds that travel together as families and large groups. Their fun can be loud and overpowering. It is what it is but sets the tone for the entire cruise. Port Canaveral also attracts an international crowd as well as a lot of families. That affects the dynamic on those sailings. MSC's lower rates and kids sail free promotions fill up their ships which also affects the dynamic. If you're on a sailing with a lot of Europeans, be prepared to throw elbows. They don't queue at home and they don't queue when they are on vacation. Americans view their behavior as rude but it's cultural. When you sail - spring break, holidays, and school recesses almost guarantee a full ship, lots of kids, lots of large groups and families traveling together, and a more raucous environment. Again, MSC's low pricing allows more people to travel together for less so their ships tend to attract more of that business mix. For 7 days cruises, those that leave and return on Saturday or Sunday are most heavily booked by people taking a week off from work. A departure and return on any other day screws that up because vacation days also need to be taken the week before or after the sailing. The exception is international travelers who typically take two weeks or more of vacation and do something land based before or after the cruise. I went on a 7 day Friday Divina cruise a couple of weeks ago and the ship was 2/3 full and had a heavy European business mix. I was in YC but when I ventured out the ship seemed to be reasonably contained and everyone seemed happy. MSC is a European cruise line - They do things the European way which can be good or bad depending on your outlook. For example, you have to self register your credit card via an electronic kiosk after you board to activate your onboard account. Meals and the buffet are simpler with portions smaller than you'd see on the mainstream cruise lines. Food is available around traditional meal times, not 24/7. Things like pizza and snacks are but some call out the lack of major eating opportunities throughout the day and night. Their service staff (EG: reception) aren't "fun" and overtly bubbly. They are officious much like European hotel staff. Almost all the direct service staff are from SE Asia or Eastern Europe. They aren't going to where Hawaiian shirts and dance limbo by the pool. They are servers and you'll be served. Another personal example. I went on the Apex last summer to Norway. The passengers were 90% American and blindfolded you wouldn't have known you weren't sailing Celebrity in the Caribbean. Some people like seeing Europe surrounded with Americans and having an American experience delivers by a cruise line focused on Americans. If I'm sailing in Europe the MSC experience mirrors the countries I'm visiting and I prefer that. For better or worse. I like MSC, especially in the YC. But I have friends I wouldn't recommend them to. Not because of anything in particular, just that chemistry wise those friends are a mismatch for the MSC experience. More bluntly, those of you looking for a Norwegian, RCI, or Carnival experience aren't going to find it on MSC. The formulas those three cruise lines use are almost identical to each other. Go on one and you know what to expect on the others. MSC is different. Whether you find that good or bad is subjective.

Let's talk about service recovery. I'm in the hotel business. We try to be perfect but the law of averages says we can't be. When guests report issues, we take them seriously. But many issues are exaggerated and/or based on an inappropriate or unrealistic expectation. And sometimes it's pretty clear an issue is framed specifically to garner some type of financial consideration or other type of service recovery. Reading the OP's dissertation, it was definitely in the latter category as evidenced by his "is that all there is?" to MSC's response. Anecdotally, he also exaggerated his issues and had inappropriate expectations. The hotel conglomerate I work for tracks loyalty member activity including total dollars spent vs. dollars awarded due to service recovery issues. People who chronically complain and cross a ratio of their spend vs. what they receive in problem compensation are evicted from the loyalty program; some achieved the highest level. I'm sure the other big hotel conglomerate has a similar policy. Moral of the story? The biggest is - you can't please everyone every time. Most companies will do the right thing if a reported issue was their fault and avoidable. But in terms of service recovery, it's "the punishment fits the crime." So no, I won't comp someone's stay because housekeeping missed their room one day. I will give them loyalty points or some F&B credit to acknowledge our failing. On the flip side, some issues have been large enough that a guest's stay was comped and they received a ton of loyalty points. Companies know when an issue is small or large and all the theatrics in the world aren't going to change the definitions. And here's an inside secret. The person who calmly points out an issue they experienced will receive more consideration and service recovery than someone pitching a hissy fit and threatening to a) never stay with me or my hotel conglomerate again, b) hire an attorney to sue me over their issue, or c) become physically or verbally threatening. The latter gets the police called and they are evicted from the hotel. Back to the OP. We've all met tons of people like him. Some of you may even be like him. I just hope that none of you are on any of my cruises. 🙂

Your saying this made me think. People who haven't sailed YC probably don't understand how separated it is from the rest of the ship. Of the three separated experiences (Haven, The Retreat, and YC), YC is the most separated. Those of us that have sailed YC are the most vocal about it's accessibility to outside guests because we've experienced the intent of the concept first hand. All of the suites on NCL are Haven and all the suites on Celebrity are The Retreat. MSC offers suites outside the YC, some much larger. On the Seascape for example, there are six suite category cabins outside the YC including a two-bedroom that's 537 sq ft. I guess because they drew such a hard line on the separation of YC, MSC wanted to provide an alternative for situations like the OP started this thread with. On my recent Divina cruise, other than shows, the casino, and the gift shop, I had zero interaction with the rest of the ship. YC is truly independent and literally a "ship within a ship." I've spoken to people who've done the Haven and Retreat that have also done YC. They've pointed that distinction out as well. MSC was first out of the gate with a separated experience. It was lambasted as a return to the old multi-class ocean liners and dilutive of the common experience shared by everyone (so was specialty dining, BTW). It must have been successful because NCL and Celebrity followed. Someone saying they are "anti-class system" and booking away from lines that offer it is swell. But what's been discussed here is how far is too far in enforcing the YC barrier. I guess the real question is once the barrier becomes gray and subjective, can exclusivity (and the additional cost for it) even be maintained?

Loyalists seem blinded by their loyalty. When you read a forum, any forum, you should look for repetitive comments from varied posters. What I've taken away is that Celebrity is cutting corners in numerous ways. Buffets being limited and shrinking. Quality, quantity, and number of options in the MDR are being cut. There's even been multiple mentions of cutbacks in Luminae. Charging for room service on certain sailings is another example of cutbacks and/or revenue generation "enhancements." Celebrity is following mainstream cruise lines in these areas which is their prerogative. But, Celebrity markets and prices itself as a premium cruise line. I don't mind paying the premium when it's warranted. I was booked on an Edge sailing in October that I canceled and replaced with Yacht Club on the MSC Seaview. I may be in the minority, but I don't want to chance my cruise based on what it may or may look like eight months from now. Clearly Celebrity is tinkering with their formula in a way that's not beneficial to its customers. And by what's being posted, clearly they aren't done. YMMV

I looked at an upcoming booking. Pretty unambiguous if you ask me.

I'm going on the World Europa in May and the same thing happened to me. The port taxes went down and when they were adjusted it repriced the reservation to today's pricing. Apparently it happens frequently. Send a copy of your original reservation to: mscexistingreservations@msccruisesusa.com. They reinstated my original pricing in less than an hour.

I was quoting someone else. Actually, that post is what prompted my response. YC being exclusive was being twisted in to something societal in a number of posts. It's not. The dividing line is purely financial. But I guess that could take us down the capitalism rabbit hole. 😉 Long live segregation, or what does this mean? No fraternization betwwen tue class. There are all kind of reasons why one might invite a guest to his or her cabin. Some might be really private and certainly not the business of you, any other guest or even MSC. Does any of you who say 'No non-YC guests in the privacy of ones cabin' has seen a guest been dragged out of cabin?

People's perspectives on this are interesting. YC is not a public space where people are "segregated" based on a personally defining characteristic or the subjective decision of staff. It's a "for money" dedicated area for people who choose to consciously pay for it; MSC is very clear about that. So is NCL for the Haven and Celebrity for The Retreat. And it isn't anti-democratic for anyone in YC, Haven, or The Retreat to expect the exclusivity of what they paid for to be preserved. People in the YC are there by choice. Same thing for the people that aren't. Literally anyone can be in YC, Haven, or The Retreat. Simply pay the additional cost. But for those that don't want to or can't, don't blame the two caste system for your exclusion. Instead, boycott cruise lines that offer it. I just got off a Divina 7 day in YC, am going on the World Europa in YC in May, and on the Seaview in October in YC. If I were sailing with friends or family on any of those cruises, we'd either all be in YC or I'd downgrade to be with them. I'd never put the YC staff in an awkward position by asking "hey, can I host some of my non-YC friends to do some YC things?" It's not fair to the staff or others that paid to be in YC. Nor would I stake claim to "my YC cabin" to host anyone else outside of the YC for parties. I'd see that as an afront to fellow passengers that paid for YC. Again, that's why I'd downgrade. Just my opinion, but me being in YC while friends and family on the same sailing weren't would smack of elitism on my part. I could never see myself doing that. But to each their own I guess. If I saw a bunch of fellow YC guests, either with or without YC staff consent, diluting the value of what I paid for I'd be pissed and not quiet about it. A bunch of people here have posted similar sentiments. Those sentiments are totally appropriate based on MSC's definition of "Yacht Club."

If you're in first or business class on a flight, should you be allowed to bring guests from main cabin to "visit you?" If you're in a room at a hotel that allows executive lounge access, should you be allowed to bring friends staying in standard rooms to "share the lounge with you?" If you're in a Queen's Grill cabin on Cunard, should your Britannia restaurant friends be allowed to "dine with you?" All of those things are designed to accommodate a specific and limited number of people. Allowing unentitled "guests" and "visitors" affects those that paid for or earned the higher level of privilege. Yes, all those things and YC are caste systems. And it's rather black and white. Pay or earn the privilege to be in a better caste or stay in the caste you're entitled to. So to the OP, either downgrade from YC to be with your friends or plan on spending time outside of the YC to socialize with them. The other option you didn't mention is for them to pay more to be in YC with you so I'm guessing that's out of the question based on cost. That's a choice. But don't lambast those posting here or MSC for saying the YC is exclusively for those that paid to be part of it.