ChutChut

33 minutes ago, CruiseRQA said:

I don't know what "adoption papers" consist of so I can't answer this.   But again, the people being "accused" of a crime in this scenario are white and the child that is trying to be protected is not white.    Which is why this incident is more likely than not a result of stupidity, ignorance and/or poor training rather than racism.  

I don't see where anyone is being accused of a crime. Please explain what "crime?" Racism is not a "crime" unless it's attached to an actual crime like murder, assault, etc. 

23 hours ago, PTC DAWG said:

I wouldn’t take kids that age on Celebrity myself…it will be nothing like those 3 lines you referenced. 

I took my then ten-year-old daughter on the Celebrity Silhouette several years back and she loved it. Celebrity is not an adult-only cruise line. There are lots of things to do for kids and adults. 

1 minute ago, mphooker said:

I'm the mom of the girl posted about.  It was completely humiliating to my entire family of 6.  They actually out loud asked "Is she adopted?"  She knows she is and she answered to it.  They still made it out like we could not board that ship with her if we didn't have adoption paperwork.  Never in her 17 years have we had to prove that and I've even traveled internationally with her.  

 

But here's the other thing that bothers me...How likely is a sex trafficker going to have a passport AND pay for all this to go on a cruise?  I'd like to know those percentages.  

 

I'm so sorry it happened to you. I understand the humiliation. I should have raised it at the time but was afraid the Irish authorities (onboard a Princess ship) would find some reason to prevent us from entering the country. Looking back, I should have done what you're doing - address it with the cruise line and inform others that this practice is taking place. 

1 minute ago, prmssk said:

Same last name, same address, has a US passport that required permission from parents to obtain (along with documentation they are the child's legal parents) - this wasn't about preventing human trafficking.

 

(On another note that has come up in this thread, it is also my understanding that port staff are not cruise line employees.  They just wear the shirt of the cruise line they are serving that day.)

True - they are contracted. But if they're wearing a uniform reflecting the cruise line, then the cruise line must ensure they are trained properly, etc. I had a port authority person intentionally separate me from my then 8-year-old daughter as she descended the escalator into a crowd of hundreds of people disembarking a cruise. He refused to allow me to descend with her as he claimed I didn't have two free hands to use the escalator (I did have two free hands but envisioned both of them being around his pencil neck). He detained me for 10 minutes and threatened to call the cops. When I finally caught up with my kid, a kind couple was waiting with her. However, someone could have lured her away, etc. in that time. Needless to say, Princess compensated me for that debacle. 

2 minutes ago, wahooker said:

Same last name, same address. However, they never even looked at the Driver's license that my daughter tried to show them. Once we said she was Adopted, they wouldn't look at anything except to demand the original adoption paperwork.

They demanded ORIGINAL adoption docs??? OMG - I have those in a safe deposit box. I always bring copies - just in case some id*ot gets off on authority crap and racially profiles us again. This racial profiling really is getting old. If they have reasonable suspicion of trafficking based on non-discriminatory indications - that's fine. But to single out multi-racial families and - essentially - shame them - isn't okay. 

4 minutes ago, dleahy4444 said:

I completely agree. I’m blond and fair skinned but I was raised with my sister who was African American. I saw firsthand how differently we were treated in the same exact settings, how we were constantly questioned when we introduced each other as sisters. 

Yep and it makes the kids (and the parents) uncomfortable and feel like second-class citizens. I understand the whole human trafficking concerns, etc. but it seems that authorities have decided the way to detect it is to single out multi-racial families. When it happened to me and my daughter on Princess, I didn't pursue it because I didn't want any blowback that might impact our ability to enter the various countries we were visiting. 

2 minutes ago, dleahy4444 said:

Was she the only child in the car with you? Would you feel the same if you had 3 other children in the car, one of which was of a different skin tone and they asked that question of just that child? Maybe race wasn’t an issue in the case of the OP, but when the different race  child is singled out, it makes you wonder. 

It happened to me and my Asian daughter (I'm Caucasian). Multi-racial families are but a small percentage of families but it seems we get this treatment a lot more often that families of one race. Unless there is some evidence or reasonable suspicion to implicate trafficking, etc. it is inappropriate and, basically, racial profiling to subject our families to this without subjecting ALL families to this. 

11 minutes ago, MagPie60 said:

https://www.hstoday.us/subject-matter-areas/border-security/how-airport-and-seaport-employees-can-help-stop-human-trafficking/

 

My biological daughter was asked if I was her mother when she was about 8 or 9 - crossing a land border into the USA. We are obviously the same race, and she resembles me quite strongly (poor kid)

 

Again, I can understand why the OP was so upset, and feel that PE and/or Celebrity were over-zealous to say the least. Just not 100% convinced the issue was entirely about race. 

I would bet it happens a lot more with multi-racial families though. It happened to me and my different-race daughter although we had all necessary documentation. There's a huge racial element going on and it's not okay. 

3 hours ago, Homosassa said:

Kudos to the shore side staff on being aware of the trafficking issues of children in the day and age and taking the time to be sure that your adopted daughter was truly traveling with parents.

 

I suggest that you avoid this problem in the future by having the adoption papers with you.

Nah - not an inkling of trafficking to justify this. Pure racial stereotyping and discrimination. 

38 minutes ago, WestLakeGirl said:

Sadly we live in a world where girls and young women are at risk.  The terminal employees may have been overzealous but what if they had been right and she was in danger?

Doesn't justify it in this situation as all the papers were in order. Seems entirely based on race with no inkling of trafficking. 

I had the same thing happen to me on Princess when we had to present our passports to the Irish custom authorities. My daughter is Asian (I'm not) and they asked me to step aside and privately questioned me about whether my daughter was actually mine. They actually asked my daughter if I was her mother. She was 6 at the time. She and I live at the same residence and share the same last name. I had my adoption docs with me and showed them to the individual. I understand the sex trafficking issue, but I felt this was completely based on race. Given I'm white and my daughter isn't. I didn't make any "waves," but I felt singled out and uncomfortable that they asked my kid if I was her mom. Other passengers had kids, and I didn't see anyone else have to endure that type of scrutiny as they all were the same race, etc. 

I guess the cat's "out of the bag" so to speak....

Yes. Jump on it if it's only $180 in total.

30 minutes ago, Cigar King said:

Assuming you left them in a locked safe, the cabins steward can not open it.  They need to call security, and they'll collect your stuff and take it to guest services.

 

A related story.  On a recent cruise my nephew forgot his insulin.  It was in the fridge.  It got sent to guest services.  I was on a B2B, so I went down a couple days later to try to collect it.  What a pain.  He was never contacted and had I not been there it would have been lost.

And it appears you're blaming the cruise line? It was your nephew's fault. 

Just came on to say that I love the title of your post. I feel that way every - single - day. Hope you can book a great fare.

Thank you for your well-balanced review. I've stayed in one of the great window view cabins in front on the Sun deck (Sky Princess) and we loved it. Never heard any banging, etc. but the seas weren't rough. I, too, have gotten sick on the last days or right after a cruise (several different cruise lines). I thought I was the only one cursed with this. I guess I'm not. Hope you feel better and Merry Christmas!

On 12/18/2023 at 10:58 PM, awhitleycrew said:

Of course the more I think about it I don't think it makes sense because I'm having to pay more money to get some back haha

If the additional money spent and the hassle of recouping it is more than the loss, don't do it.

15 minutes ago, Joe33472 said:

 

Interesting that you mentioned race.   I was just googling tipping culture in the US to better understand where all this tipping is coming from and apparently tipping in the US finds its origins in racism and sexism. 

 

I’m guilty as the next person of participating and perpetuating the tipping culture.  I wouldn’t remove auto-gratuities and have budgeted an onboard amount for additional tips.  I guess I look at the issue pragmatically.  Workers should be paid a fair wage, but many are not, and rely upon tips to support themselves and their families.   I guess I just hope that RCI is allocating the funds fairly as a motivation to provide excellent service.   I think it’s the “black box” nature of that allocation that some people don’t like.  

 

I’m surprised an employee hasn’t “leaked” some document or other information about how this really works.  Or maybe they don’t even know?    

 

Tipping was a "thing" long before the Civil War. As such, it did not come about as a result of the 13th or 15th Amendment. Southern Democrat business owners (e.g. restaurants, railroads, etc.) took advantage of it to pay - mostly black - workers a low wage and reap greater profits for themselves. Southern Democrat politicians attempted to ban tipping in several southern states because they felt whites shouldn't have to "lower" themselves to tip blacks. Those laws were either deemed unconstitutional or overturned for other reasons. The ability to tip was then codified into federal law in the 1930s (I believe) and allowed. 

I tip to reward great service. If I were to stop tipping now, it would be hurting the very people who need it the most. It's fine to lobby the cruise lines, etc. to do away with tipping (increasing fares) and just pay their people more. But how do we know any increase in wage (with no tip) will be greater than what they have now (lower wage with generous tipping). I guess it's up to cruise employees to make their opinions known. 

Tip if you desire. Don't if you want. It's all up to you. That's the beauty of "discretionary." 

yes. enjoy.

So sorry you've encountered ignorant, indelicate people. One of the problems is so many people abuse the service dog situation that a lot people are callous to it. 

3 hours ago, h20skibum said:

Spent the morning on the track, doing 4 minute miles. 

 

At least that’s what Apple Watch tells me. 
 

 

And the tracking looks almost like a straight line, although it tells me my pace was 4 minutes 33 seconds. 
 

 

At least steps get counted correctly. 

 

Walking 4 minute miles??????? HAHAHAHA. You'd win a gold medal!!!!!

I had one of the large window cabins up front on the Sun deck. Absolutely my favorite cabin of all time and sooooo quiet. However, it's a longer walk to most things. If your mom has mobility issues at all, I would pick a cabin closer to mid ship.

Always deadbolt your door!

1 hour ago, Cruise Raider said:

Only on my credit card as far as I can tell.  

I know it's a small amount, but I would dispute the $11 on my credit card. You are able to dispute an amount smaller that the total charged to your card. I did that with Princess once and Princess couldn't substantiate the incorrect change and the credit card company credited me for the amount. After that headache, I always check my onboard totals every day.