Will an expired passport do the job?

[Kluge]

Well, I disagree about the OP "copping an attitude." Faced with responses ranging from

You don't need a passport at all....your BC and DL are all that's needed. For some reason, expired documents don't count!

and

Prior to the WHTI expired passports were used all the time to prove citizenship; however, the new regulation does not specifically list them as one of the proofs any longer.

to

Duh. No.

and

"What about Expired don't you understand?"

I find myself completely in agreement with the OP's expression of appreciation for the helpful responses and characterization of others as "jerks who want to be snide about a fairly trivial question."

 

The OP was asking about the current status of the rules. Expired used to be OK. Now -- maybe not. That's the answer. No need for "duh" or "what part of XXXX don't you understand?"

 

The only people I see "copping an attitude" are the posters who showed off with rude responses.

[njhorseman]

Well, I disagree about the OP "copping an attitude." Faced with responses ranging from and to and I find myself completely in agreement with the OP's expression of appreciation for the helpful responses and characterization of others as "jerks who want to be snide about a fairly trivial question."

 

The OP was asking about the current status of the rules. Expired used to be OK. Now -- maybe not. That's the answer. No need for "duh" or "what part of XXXX don't you understand?"

 

The only people I see "copping an attitude" are the posters who showed off with rude responses.

 

I never said this OP "copped an attitude". I even said "Now I'm not saying that's the case here, but I have seen it time and time again" in order to make it clear that I wasn't talking about this poster. I was describing what I've seen transpire on all too many "passport" threads.

[spongerob]

Of course, the authorities can make any rules they want.

It's not that they can make up rules, it's that they have some discretion in enforcement, as your example with a stolen DL illustrates. In a similar situation, I got to go for a ride to a police station where I was checked out - though to be fair, the officers were actually quite nice and didn't lock me up, and we discussed chili recipes while they did their check. But they did force me to fnd my own way back to where my adventure started.

 

I'm with NJHorseman on this question. You don't know what might happen while you are out of the country. Being unprepared for predictable situations that require proper documentation is ill-advised, and those who say it's okay to travel internationally without proper documentation do so only because they have not found themselves in such a situation. And there are far too many people who will tell the OP it's okay to do so, when in fact it is something that can potentially leave you stranded, or at least, cost a lot of money to get out of a sticky situation.

 

An ounce of prevention...

[Ethel5]

If an expired passport is just as good as a valid one, then why on Earth would anyone bother to go through the time and expense to keep theirs current?:rolleyes:

[momofmeg]

Well, that is contrary to what they've directly told me at NCL, and now I've found the text on the Carnival website the agrees with the NCL people.

 

Unfortunately, the State Dept doesn't address the topic anywhere that I could find.

 

Thank you for the definition of "expired"

 

This what happened to us in September 2004. Our daughter's passport had expired and we did not realize it. She was 14 almost 15 in 1999 when it was issued to her. We did not realize that it was only good for 5 years instead of 10.

 

As we checked in, the agent called this to our attention, but she accepted it, as we were only going to Nassau and Disney's private island. She also understood our not realizing, because she read the issue date was February 1999. We were not sure why it was only good 5 years. Is this normal with minors?

 

Anyway, it was accepted as ID, BUT, I don't think I would count on that if I had time to renew my passport. You know the old saying-Better safe than sorry- and the fact that you posted this thread-shows me you are a bit concerned. So even if it may be okay, why not just go ahead and renew?

[uppitycats]

Momofmeg..yes, passports for children..I think it's up to the age of 18..are only good for 5 years.

[momofmeg]

Momofmeg..yes, passports for children..I think it's up to the age of 18..are only good for 5 years.

 

Well 1999 was our first trip to Europe, before that, we had only been to Mexico, Canada, and the Bahamas, and back then, a passport was not needed if you never left North America. We were unaware. After we learned, we said no wonder the kids passports were cheaper. They are not good as long.

[njhorseman]

This what happened to us in September 2004. Our daughter's passport had expired and we did not realize it. She was 14 almost 15 in 1999 when it was issued to her. We did not realize that it was only good for 5 years instead of 10.

 

As we checked in, the agent called this to our attention, but she accepted it, as we were only going to Nassau and Disney's private island. She also understood our not realizing, because she read the issue date was February 1999. We were not sure why it was only good 5 years. Is this normal with minors?

 

Anyway, it was accepted as ID, BUT, I don't think I would count on that if I had time to renew my passport. You know the old saying-Better safe than sorry- and the fact that you posted this thread-shows me you are a bit concerned. So even if it may be okay, why not just go ahead and renew?

 

 

Yes, passports issued prior to age 16 are only valid for 5 years. Think of how much a child's appearance changes in a short time and I think you'll understand why.

 

In 2004, the documentation requirements for cruising and other forms of travel with the North American and Caribbean regions were not nearly as strict as they are now. The current requirements were only put in place on June 1, 2009.

[momofmeg]

Yes, passports issued prior to age 16 are only valid for 5 years. Think of how much a child's appearance changes in a short time and I think you'll understand why.

 

In 2004, the documentation requirements for cruising and other forms of travel with the North American and Caribbean regions were not nearly as strict as they are now. The current requirements were only put in place on June 1, 2009.

 

If we had known, we would have never taken that chance. When the agent told us, we were really sweating it.

[Kluge]

If an expired passport is just as good as a valid one, then why on Earth would anyone bother to go through the time and expense to keep theirs current?:rolleyes:

I don't think anyone suggested that they are "just as good." :rolleyes: What was mentioned is that they were accepted for some limited purposes prior to 6/09 - including serving as adequate proof of citizenship on a "closed loop" cruise. That may have changed in the past 5 months, but an expired passport still has value as proof of ID for purposes of getting a new passport, and possibly for other purposes, for all I know. It's still a government-issued photo ID with proof of citizenship, facts which don't change just because the date for renewal has passed.

 

I wouldn't throw mine away even after getting a new one. You never know when it might come it handy...

[momofmeg]

I don't think anyone suggested that they are "just as good." :rolleyes: What was mentioned is that they were accepted for some limited purposes prior to 6/09 - including serving as adequate proof of citizenship on a "closed loop" cruise. That may have changed in the past 5 months, but an expired passport still has value as proof of ID for purposes of getting a new passport, and possibly for other purposes, for all I know. It's still a government-issued photo ID with proof of citizenship, facts which don't change just because the date for renewal has passed.

 

I wouldn't throw mine away even after getting a new one. You never know when it might come it handy...

 

I was glad they returned it with my new passport. I kept it for a souvenir. After all, it has stamps on it, two for London (I flew there twice) and one for Brussels. However, they punched a hole in it to show it had expired and was not my current passport. So it is only worth as a souvenir.

[Crusincat]

Would you drive on an expired driver license? I don't think so, so why travel with an expired passport when it is so easy to get it renewed. Unless you have some situation that would cause a problem getting it renewed. Just remember what others have said, yes you might be able to get on the ship since it is closed loop but what if something happens while you are away. Then what will you do. That expired passport will not get you home. Good luck with whichever way you decide to cruise. Happy Sailing

[luddite]

If an expired passport is just as good as a valid one, then why on Earth would anyone bother to go through the time and expense to keep theirs current?:rolleyes:

 

Aha!!

As the fog slowly burns off, we can see.

[Kluge]

I was glad they returned it with my new passport. I kept it for a souvenir. After all, it has stamps on it, two for London (I flew there twice) and one for Brussels. However, they punched a hole in it to show it had expired and was not my current passport. So it is only worth as a souvenir.

There are also some circumstances where an expired passport has significant legal value. An unexpired visa in an expired passport can still be used - but only if you have both the old and the new passport with you! http://travel.state.gov/visa/questions/questions_1253.html#7

 

Learn something new every day...

[startraveler]

I wouldn't throw mine away even after getting a new one. You never know when it might come it handy...

 

For whatever reason, my wife has some credit cards in her maiden name - though she has changed over her driver's license and gotten a new passport. Just never bothered to change everything over. You guessed it, she paid for something using one of those credit cards and they asked for ID. Luckily, she had her old passport with her.

[spongerob]

There are also some circumstances where an expired passport has significant legal value. An unexpired visa in an expired passport can still be used - but only if you have both the old and the new passport with you!

The passport has no value, the visa does. That's why you need the new one. You just proved the point you were arguing against.

[imsulin]

I don't think anyone suggested that they are "just as good." :rolleyes: What was mentioned is that they were accepted for some limited purposes prior to 6/09 - including serving as adequate proof of citizenship on a "closed loop" cruise. That may have changed in the past 5 months, but an expired passport still has value as proof of ID for purposes of getting a new passport, and possibly for other purposes, for all I know. It's still a government-issued photo ID with proof of citizenship, facts which don't change just because the date for renewal has passed.

 

I wouldn't throw mine away even after getting a new one. You never know when it might come it handy...

 

Kluge - a couple of things for you:

 

1. I have three expired Passports (two with holes in them), and all were returned with my new Passport/s. I pretty much keep them for fond memories.

 

2. A year and a half ago, I made an appointment with my local Social Security office to apply for benefits. I was told to bring "proof of citizenship", etc. I showed up with my current Passport, issued in 2003. I was IMMEDIATELY told that a US Passport was not acceptable, and I needed my BC. I was born at a US Army Post (the old black and white photocopy), and I sent it in with my application for my FIRST Passport, and it was not returned. (We're going back a lot of years, here). The SS employee made a really big stink about it, and told my repeatedly that my US Passport was not "proof of citizenship"! He said he'd worked for SS for ten years. I finally asked to speak to a "supervisor", who confirmed the same thing. I was completely floored! I'd cruised and travelled to many parts of the world over many years on my Passports! Finally, a lady walked by, overheard the "conversation", and said something like, "Oh, if they were born between 19whatever and 19whatever, we accept current Passports as proof of citizenship". This endeavor took a whole day! Finally got approved. I still can't figure out if this was a case of US Social Security policy or Dumb and Dumber. (Me not being the D&D. I brought in the required paperwork).

[uppitycats]

imsulin -- I vote for "dumb and dumber" (and no, not you! :D ) I don't know where social security "higher-ups" GET some of their employees. I've had to deal with them for years, both on my behalf and on behalf of my disabled clients, and it's darned near impossible to get correct answers from them!

 

I'm sure somewhere they have a list of what are "acceptable documents", "passport" doesn't appear on that list, and so they don't have a clue. I'm glad that worked out for you.

[imsulin]

imsulin -- I vote for "dumb and dumber" (and no, not you! :D ) I don't know where social security "higher-ups" GET some of their employees. I've had to deal with them for years, both on my behalf and on behalf of my disabled clients, and it's darned near impossible to get correct answers from them!

 

I'm sure somewhere they have a list of what are "acceptable documents", "passport" doesn't appear on that list, and so they don't have a clue. I'm glad that worked out for you.

 

Thanks, uppity! I also worked with disabled clients (DD, MH and MI) for years, and encountered the same difficulties. Spent MANY hours in SS offices with disabled clients! Guess I shouldn't have been so surprised when it happened to me. I guess the first clue was when the guy looked at my blue Passport and said, "Is this your bank savings book?" This was after waiting three hours in the SS office just to get an APPOINTMENT (months later) for my SS benefits.

[HappyJoKer]

Kluge...at last a voice of reason! What you wrote in all your posts makes perfect sense and looks like you ACTUALLY might have done some research and know what your talking about. Unlike the others who are "athorities" on everythibg!

Of course Kappa is pissed he asks a valid question and the "regulars" go from thread to thread just waiting to pounce on someone. Sorry everyone can't be such savvy cruises and know it alls like you guys. Why did you have to treat him like an idiot. He was told and read somewhere, that he could use it and was looking for validation. I just love it that people get their jollies at putting people down or mocking them.

I say game, point, and match...KLUGE here's some words to live by...refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person

[sparky-elpaso]

Thanks, uppity! I also worked with disabled clients (DD, MH and MI) for years, and encountered the same difficulties. Spent MANY hours in SS offices with disabled clients! Guess I shouldn't have been so surprised when it happened to me. I guess the first clue was when the guy looked at my blue Passport and said, "Is this your bank savings book?" This was after waiting three hours in the SS office just to get an APPOINTMENT (months later) for my SS benefits.

 

I applied on-line for my SS benefits and didn't have to provide any documentation. You would have had to provide your birth certificate to get your social security card in the first place so they really shouldn't have to have any documentation (except for maybe DD-214 if you were in the military). How old was this guy - banks haven't had savings books for years.

[Kluge]

The passport has no value, the visa does. That's why you need the new one. You just proved the point you were arguing against.

Actually, the state department website is quite specific - if you take the visa stamp out of the old passport, it becomes void and worthless. The visa has to be kept in the old passport to be valid.

 

Happy JoKer, I guess my point is simply that it's best to be polite and civil in forums like these. The OP's question wasn't unreasonable. The consensus of advice - get a new passport - was sound, although it's not like the OP hadn't thought that through already. The people who responded in a rude, condescending and sarcastic manner weren't simply ill-mannered; they were, for the most part, ill-informed as well. An "expired" passport has had a variety of useful functions in the past, even though it's not valid for the full scope of functions a passport serves. (That's the part of "expired" that some posters apparently "don't get.") One of those functions used to be as acceptable ID for a "closed loop" cruise. Apparently not any more, though, which is why the OP's question was both reasonable and pertinent.

[imsulin]

I applied on-line for my SS benefits and didn't have to provide any documentation. You would have had to provide your birth certificate to get your social security card in the first place so they really shouldn't have to have any documentation (except for maybe DD-214 if you were in the military). How old was this guy - banks haven't had savings books for years.

 

Really? I've had a SS card since I was 16 to get my first job. (brought it to the SS office along with my fourth Passport), I was born on a US Army post, and sent the original BC with my original Passport application back in the 60's (Got the PP, but not the BC back). Try to do this on-line! Oh, a local credit union still uses bank books, because many people still pay in cash and have no local checking/savings account. The guy was probably mid-thirties, and, IMHO, had never been out of the county, let alone the state.

[njhorseman]

I applied on-line for my SS benefits and didn't have to provide any documentation. You would have had to provide your birth certificate to get your social security card in the first place so they really shouldn't have to have any documentation (except for maybe DD-214 if you were in the military). How old was this guy - banks haven't had savings books for years.

 

Same here. I applied on line, had to submit no supporting paperwork, received approval and started collecting my SS benefits shortly thereafter.

[imsulin]

Same here. I applied on line, had to submit no supporting paperwork, received approval and started collecting my SS benefits shortly thereafter.

 

Were you born on a US military base? Really curious. TIA