The Not So Discretionary Discretionary Service Fees

[russianmom]

I think of the DSC in a similar fashion to "daily resort fees", it's part of the charge to stay there/use the facilites. Built into the price or seperated out doesn't make a difference- the end result is the same dollar amount.

 

I'm glad to not have to carry or worry about extra cash.

 

More and more places are doing it:

 

Green Valley Ranch Resort outside Las Vegas mandatory $24.99 resort fee

Bellagio in Las Vegas will begin charging a mandatory fee of $22.40 per day

Vdara recently raised its daily resort fee from $15 to $18

Starwood Hotels and Resorts began levying daily fees of $12.57 to $20.94 at its four Waikiki properties.

 

It is what it is....If you don't like it or can't afford it go camping or take a staycation!

[fergusonvt]

Sorry, I keep reading this "they should be researching it' and no sympathy for not knowing up front and putting the responsibility on the cruiser. Go to the website and tell me how easy it is to find that you need to pay the DSC. You can spend hours looking at cruises and pricing and never see one word about it. The responsibility falls on NCL to be up front with this. I agree with the charge but to go through a complete booking process online and the first time you are told about the DSC is after booking is wrong.

 

I was told ahead of time by my NCL PCC. I can't believe I'm the only one who ever booked through him or that I was the only one he ever told about this. Besides that I always ask when booking anything "are there any other charges or fees that I should be aware of".

[fergusonvt]

I think of the DSC in a similar fashion to "daily resort fees", it's part of the charge to stay there/use the facilites. Built into the price or seperated out doesn't make a difference- the end result is the same dollar amount.

 

I'm glad to not have to carry or worry about extra cash.

 

More and more places are doing it:

 

Green Valley Ranch Resort outside Las Vegas mandatory $24.99 resort fee

Bellagio in Las Vegas will begin charging a mandatory fee of $22.40 per day

Vdara recently raised its daily resort fee from $15 to $18

Starwood Hotels and Resorts began levying daily fees of $12.57 to $20.94 at its four Waikiki properties.

 

It is what it is....If you don't like it or can't afford it go camping or take a staycation!

 

 

And, don't all the the other major cruiselines do this same thing?

[fergusonvt]

1. $168 is nothing to us. I just feel it should have been listed with the port fees, etc.... not on a welcome kit or have to be searched for on the web.

 

2. I hear that the service on NCL is outstanding, I am sure they will earn their $168.

 

3. dalgirl, the wording of your response above is exactly the unhelpful, abrasive tone myself and others have noted on this thread and others. Thank you for the example so I could highlight exactly what I meant.

 

80% of the responses to my post have been helpful and/or supportive or at least saw my point, 20% are from people I hope to never cruise with. Enough said. I see these boards are gonna be fun.

 

 

The tone of the response was probably due to this being about the 8th thread about this very same topic over the last several weeks.

[drhry]

Like most of you on cc have been cruising for many years. The first cruise we took that had the dsc on it I thought I'm not going to like that. By the last day of the cruise we loved it, made things so less complicated. So much easier to seek out who you want to give extra to , and no worry of missing anyone and wasting time on those darn envelopes.

[russianmom]

And, don't all the the other major cruiselines do this same thing?

 

 

yes...;)

[sdmike]

Up until we sailed NCL we had the option of putting cash in envelopes at the end of the trip, totaling something similar to the $12. I always found this a hassle and often included more than the recommended because I didn't have smaller bills. Then you go through the hassle of handing these envelopes out! I was always amazed how many people didn't hand in an envelope for their waiter and assistant!

 

Before we booked our NCL trip I came here and did some reading about the line and the ship. When I learned of the DSC I thought "EUREKA! NCL gets it!". They will reduce the number of people that stiff the help, and they are making it easier for me. It's a win/win!

 

So maybe if the OP had done some more research on the topic they wouldn't have been as surprised. Be that as it may, if they had cruised before they would have been aware of the customary per day tip/charge on almost all cruise lines and thought this was actually a good thing. :)

 

OP - This is just one of those hot topics that gets brought up over and over. People aren't mean, just sort of tired of the repetition. There ARE a lot that come on here saying they're going to remove the DSC for whatever reason, and even though you didn't make that statement, that's where people's brains go.

 

I hope you're not too jaded on NCL to enjoy your trip. This is a very, very common charge and a standard in the industry whether you pay it in advance, leave it on your account, or put cash in envelopes. It's just part of the cost of the cruise, and until it's rolled up into the fares we will continue so see it broken out separately. I, for one, gladly pay the $12 and generally do not leave any other tips at restaurants, etc.

[russianmom]

And, don't all the the other major cruiselines do this same thing?

 

 

RCL-Only those guests who have signed up for My Time Dining will continue to have their gratuities added to their account.

 

CCL- For your convenience, we automatically charge the gratuities for dining and stateroom staff to your onboard Sail & Sign account. The total amount is $11.50 per guest, per day(our recommended guideline effective voyages departing December 1, 2011 and onward)

 

Celebrity- For your convenience, we will automatically add gratuities for your restaurant and stateroom services to your onboard Seapass account on a daily basis in the following amounts, which may be adjusted at your discretion: $11.50 per person per day for guests in staterooms ($12.00 per person per day for guests in Concierge Class and AquaClass staterooms and $15.00 per person per day for guests in Suites).

 

Disney-

Per Guest per cruise3-Night4-Night7-NightDining Room Server$12.00$16.00$28.00Dining Room Asst. Server$9.00$12.00$21.00Dining Room Head Server$3.00$4.00$7.00Stateroom Host/

Hostess$12.00$16.00$28.00

For your convenience, a 15% gratuity is automatically added to bar, beverage, wine and deck service tabs. All gratuities can be charged to your room charge.

 

Princess- To simplify the tipping process for our passengers, a discretionary gratuity of $12 per person for mini-suites and suites, and $11.50 per passenger in all other staterooms per day (including children) will be automatically added to your shipboard account on a daily basis. This gratuity will be shared amongst those staff who help provide and support your cruise experience, including all waitstaff, stateroom stewards, buffet stewards, and housekeeping staff across the fleet

 

This took me less than 10 min to find on each respective cruise lines' website

[probuilder2007]

A generous tipper would feel the 12 per day is light.

The only reason not to prepay tips is because you have some affinity for witholding tips.

 

I appreciate the automatic prepaid, I can then sling a one or two dollar bill around and feel quite alright.

 

Stable income for the crew makes NCL's crew very good, and the crew can make the cruise.

 

Maybe try Costa, seems they are cutting corners.:cool:

[dachengdao]

I don't like the how the service charges are presented to consumers as discretionary tips when in fact NCL is using us to subsidize wages. That being said, I don't dislike it enough to stop patronizing NCL (going on my third cruise with them next month), nor would I ever adjust it downward or remove it because that money is going to people who are going above and beyond to create a little slice of heaven for me and my family. So forget that it's a tip and just treat it as part of the cruise fare. I always give cash tips as if I haven't paid a service charge, because it's not the workers' fault. Have a great cruise and don't sweat the small stuff!

[yoyocruiser]

I think I look at this similarly to SDMike. There is going to be some type of service charge regardless of how it comes about--and regardless of what it is called. As a consumer you then have the choice to choose a line that fits best with how you like to go about paying it. In the OP's situation I am somewhat empathetic--because at least part of their issue was that they felt blind sided. I think it is a topic that is easy to misunderstand and that is not made very clear in the booking process.

 

So OP, my goal with this post is to help you better understand the charge and feel better about it--so that you can go on that crusie and have a great time without worrying about this. I just got off a cruise last week, and it is such a great experience that you really want to go with a positive feeling.

 

As others have noted, all lines do something. You are expected to either 1)run around with those crazy envelopes--(which in my opinion ruined the final night of the cruise dealing with this most stressful activity); 2) pay a predetermined amount--$12 per person per day for NCL and other lines that use this method are generally in that vicinity; or 3) it is built intot he fare (thsi is generally done on more upscale lines). In the end, you are going to pay in some way and then you choose a line that best matches how it is you would prefer to pay.

 

Given that you OP had already booked with NCL prior to finding out about the charge, you in effect ended up not being able to exercise your preference. (Yes, many will say you should have researched better etc. etc. and yes, in a perfect world you should have, but I for one can understand how things can slip by). But since you are booked, the best thing is to come to terms with it so that you can have a great crusie--or--if you are still at a point where you can cancel with no penalty, you should probably consider doing so (and I don't mean that in any sarcastic way). Then book either with an upscale line that has the charge build in, or go with a traditional line where you can distribute your envelopes as you please--a factor that is very important to many people and should not be ridiculed. However, you do need to realize that the cruise line DOES get to decide their own pricing strategy--for example--I cannot go on a traditional cruise line where the "envelopes" are used and go to the desk and demand that they instead add a $12 charge per day to my tab because I don't feel like doiong the envelope thing. Nor can I ask a line that builds the charges in the overall cost, to pull them out so that I can hand out envelopes.

 

Cruise lines market themselves in different ways and have pricing strategies done in different ways. On NCL, due to the "freestyle", the envelope thing just doesn't work well--there simply are not a finite group of people that you would be able to tip as is true on traditional lines (where you have the same waitstaff each night). Nor does NCL market themselves as that all inclusive type of high end line. So NCL has identified the $12 charge because they apparently feel it is the best fit for their line.

 

I hated running around with those stupid envelopes chasing people down; and I don't choose to go on the more expensive lines where the charge is built in (although this would actually be my choice--but I generally can't afford these lines). So I am left with lines such as NCL, RCCL, DCL that have the charge identified and added. Because in many ways I would prefer to think of the service as part of the overall cost of the cruise I always choose to pay my charges ahead of time--to me that is like an inclusive fee. And then I never have to think about it. I go on the cruise with it already paid. But what I totally understand is that regardless of what line you go on--you are in some way shape or form going to pay for the service. There's just no way around it--because the service is such a big--and very WONDERFUL--part of the cruise. And there are many staff working very hard to provide excellent service--these people of course have to be paid.

 

So in the end,I hope you can reconcile yourself to paying the fee, and to actually feel good about paying it--I know I did at the end of my cruise last week. Honestly, when I got home and thought about all the wonderful service, I actually regretted not giving out more extra tips in addition to the charge. I hope you will feel that way too. But I do udnerstand your initial negative feeling given that you were not aware of the charge. I hope this helps in someway and I also agree that NCL does need to make it clearer from the beginning that the additional fee will be expected. But please don't let this interfere with your having a fantastic time. :)

[Mooder]

I don't like the how the service charges are presented to consumers as discretionary tips when in fact NCL is using us to subsidize wages. That being said, I don't dislike it enough to stop patronizing NCL (going on my third cruise with them next month), nor would I ever adjust it downward or remove it because that money is going to people who are going above and beyond to create a little slice of heaven for me and my family. So forget that it's a tip and just treat it as part of the cruise fare. I always give cash tips as if I haven't paid a service charge, because it's not the workers' fault. Have a great cruise and don't sweat the small stuff!

 

I like your attitude, but I'm confused. Don't customers always subsidize wages when we tip or pay a service charge? If I tip at a restaurant, it is discretionary, but the purpose is certainly to subsidize a low wage. No? :confused:

[spacepotatoes]

RCL-Only those guests who have signed up for My Time Dining will continue to have their gratuities added to their account.

 

CCL- For your convenience, we automatically charge the gratuities for dining and stateroom staff to your onboard Sail & Sign account. The total amount is $11.50 per guest, per day(our recommended guideline effective voyages departing December 1, 2011 and onward)

 

Celebrity- For your convenience, we will automatically add gratuities for your restaurant and stateroom services to your onboard Seapass account on a daily basis in the following amounts, which may be adjusted at your discretion: $11.50 per person per day for guests in staterooms ($12.00 per person per day for guests in Concierge Class and AquaClass staterooms and $15.00 per person per day for guests in Suites).

 

Disney-

Per Guest per cruise3-Night4-Night7-NightDining Room Server$12.00$16.00$28.00Dining Room Asst. Server$9.00$12.00$21.00Dining Room Head Server$3.00$4.00$7.00Stateroom Host/

Hostess$12.00$16.00$28.00

For your convenience, a 15% gratuity is automatically added to bar, beverage, wine and deck service tabs. All gratuities can be charged to your room charge.

 

Princess- To simplify the tipping process for our passengers, a discretionary gratuity of $12 per person for mini-suites and suites, and $11.50 per passenger in all other staterooms per day (including children) will be automatically added to your shipboard account on a daily basis. This gratuity will be shared amongst those staff who help provide and support your cruise experience, including all waitstaff, stateroom stewards, buffet stewards, and housekeeping staff across the fleet

 

This took me less than 10 min to find on each respective cruise lines' website

 

To add to this list, Holland America automatically charges $11.50 pp/pd ($12 for suites). They call it a Hotel Service Charge, but it is essentially the same thing.

[my_crib_too]

I hope you're not too jaded on NCL to enjoy your trip. This is a very, very common charge and a standard in the industry whether you pay it in advance, leave it on your account, or put cash in envelopes. It's just part of the cost of the cruise, and until it's rolled up into the fares we will continue so see it broken out separately. I, for one, gladly pay the $12 and generally do not leave any other tips at restaurants, etc.

 

I fear the negative review upon return from this vacation and hope that the OP can cancel and re-book with a cruise line that does not have a DSC. We were lucky on our first cruise and worked with a good TA that told us all about the DSC.

[Glen&Kathy]

It has been a few years since we cruised and the last time we received envelopes to place cash in. We have our first NCL cruise on Epic coming up on 2/4 and at first I was a bit taken back by the fact that they would add $12 per person per day. However, the more I thought about it, it would certainly cost me more than $12 per day in tips if I were eating out 3-4 times a day.

 

Everyone needs to take a chill pill and enjoy life...and their cruise!

 

Beers 'n Cheers!

 

G

[valleyvillage]

First cruise was on HAL, and at the time they had something called : Tipping Not Necessary! We were so confused by it. We asked if that meant tipping included, or was it like a restaurant where you don't HAVE to tip but it is expected, etc. All anyone could tell us was Tipping Not Necessary!

 

I even asked, so if I don't tip anything, that's ok? Tipping Not Necessary!

 

I searched a bit on HAL's CC board and folks there felt kind of the same way we did, it was not a helpful policy.

 

Then we cruised NCL and the DSC was added automatically and we loved it! We felt confident that any tipping we might choose to do on our own was truly up to us.

 

I understand the impetus to post things like NCL should do this, that, or the other thing, but I always have the same thought: "Interesting idea! Maybe when you start your own cruise line, you could try that!" :rolleyes:

[cruizecrazygramma]

While I have found similar threads, they seem to be from foreign travelers, so I guess I’ll start a new conversation. I have taken two cruises before (Royal Caribbean and Disney) but the last was 8 years ago, clearly things have changed.

 

We booked a 7 day cruise on the Gem from in late Winter of this year several weeks ago. Thought we got a really good price for a balcony room. Never traveled on NCL before but when our welcome kit came I was somewhat floored to see they were going to take the liberty of charging us $12 or so a day per person for “prepaid service fees”. According to their web site, I can prepay them now (they would love that) for $168 for my party of two.

 

Huh?

 

When was the last time you walked into a restaurant and gave the host a tip in advance for a server you had yet to meet or experience how well they did their job? Maybe this is now common, but Disney and RC never did this when I traveled with them. I tipped as I chose as the voyage went on... and I tipped well when called for.

 

We are not cheap and tip very well when we elect to tip for good service. I am sorry, but NCL simply deciding the service I am going to receive is going to make me want to tip $168 total during my trip and if I don’t prepay they are just going to add that daily to my room fee REALLY feels rude to me.

 

I know how cruise ship personnel are paid (or not). I know how they need tips. I get it. However, we are really easy guests. I probably will never use room service (I don’t care for eating in my room/cabin), I rarely call for additional pillows or special cabin service unless something is wrong and we’re probably going to hit the buffet for many of our meals. I’ll be lucky if I pass by the main dining room.

 

So, in our case, I am being asked to pay $168 in service fees so someone can make up our cabin each day and maybe something for one sit down restaurant when I tire of the buffet. Never have I left what works out to a $20 a day tip to a housekeeper at a hotel. That is essentially what NCL is telling me they expect based on the services I know I will require from the crew.. very little.

 

This policy actually makes me want to tip less. I know it says “discretionary” but “prepay now or we’ll ad it to your bill unless you come have an awkward conversation with us on board and ask us to remove or reduce it” is not the definition of discretionary. It's call "a mugging" or jacking up the cruise fee.

 

“Discretionary” is “Yes, please make it easy for me by tipping for me” or “No, leave my bill the way it is, I’ll tip when I feel one is deserved.”

 

Again, those who give me great service will be well taken care of. How do you get NCL to NOT do this and leave tipping up the guest? Really annoyed by this one. I know there is a tip pool... but that means the excellent employee I tip is going to have to share their tip with people who I never even received service from. Not any better.

 

 

For me , i have no desire to walk around with cash to hand to staff for great service and if you don't do it right away, you may never encounter that particular crew member again. Even though you won't use all the services available to you, you may be forgetting that the

re are hundreds of personnel behind the sees that you will never see that help make your cruise wonderful. i think that you would likely end up spending more money giving individual tips. It seems to me that when we arrive in florida, we tip the cab driver for our ride to the hotel, then we tip the driver from the hotel who takes us to the cruise port then we tip the cruise line staff when they load our bags to be taken aboard. At this point we are already out $20 and we havent even boarded yet, not to mentione we do it again on the way home. So, while I respect your opinion I think I'm happy not having to worry about it.

[cruizecrazygramma]

When I said I have no sympathy, I wasn't addressing whether NCL is clear enough about it. My point is that even if NCL doesn't make it clear enough, I know I will have to tip at some point. So, I don't see how anyone gets caught unaware without enough money.

 

As to your point about whether it is clear enough, a quick scan of the FAQ on the NCL website answers these questions. Didn't take me hours, took me 30 seconds.

 

 

I agree. i am new to ncl and i found info about the charge my first time on the website.

[dutchess43]

I don't know if this has been discussed b/c I am not going to read all four pages. The tip added to your sea pass account was instituted by NCL b/c of free style cruising so all of the waiters etc would not get stiffed. After more of the cruise lines started with free style so did adding the tips automatically. We have seen on the last night how many diners have been among the missing before the tips have been added, there have been many complaints over the years due to the lack of tips. We find even though we usually dine traditional on other cruise lines we like having the tips added we do not have to run around & get money changed.

[CPT Trips]

I think of the DSC in a similar fashion to "daily resort fees", it's part of the charge to stay there/use the facilites. Built into the price or seperated out doesn't make a difference- the end result is the same dollar amount.

 

[snip]

 

It is what it is....If you don't like it or can't afford it go camping or take a staycation!

 

The "purpose" of a resort fee is very different from the DSC and, much less defensible by the business. DSC is a charge in lieu of tipping. A resort fee is for those things one normally expects at a resort: the pool, beach, towels, loungers and common area amenities, etc.

 

Sure, both add to the total cost of a vacation but (at least according to the cruise line) the DSC goes to service staff. Try telling your housekeeper at the Bellagio or your waiter at some other property that there is no need for you to tip them because you already paid a "resort fee." It isn't like these resorts previously charged you $5 for a towel and $7.50 for pool admission. Much better they include those things in the rate and just charge ala carte for tennis, golf and the like.

 

A generous tipper would feel the 12 per day is light.

The only reason not to prepay tips is because you have some affinity for witholding tips.

 

I appreciate the automatic prepaid, I can then sling a one or two dollar bill around and feel quite alright.

 

Stable income for the crew makes NCL's crew very good, and the crew can make the cruise.

 

Maybe try Costa, seems they are cutting corners.:cool:

 

In general, I agree with this although I would still prefer to see crew paid a better wage by the company and just have the extra added to my fare.

 

Until your post, I did not realize that Bridge Officers were in the tip pool. :p ;)

[jeannep]

When we go out we usually tip approx. 20% to our server. Our next cruise is costing us $2200. 20% of that is $440. The service charge on NCL for 10 days for the 2 of us is $240. Even adding an extra tip to some workers, I feel that I am still ahead. As we say in New York "IT'S A DEAL!!!!!".

 

The last time we were on RCCL we were at a table with lovely people. One couple did not show up for the last nights dinner and I realized there were more empty seats around the dining room that night. Maybe I am wrong, but I think it had to do with those last night envelopes and not tipping the waiter.

 

It is only my opinion,

Jeanne

[russianmom]

To add to this list, Holland America automatically charges $11.50 pp/pd ($12 for suites). They call it a Hotel Service Charge, but it is essentially the same thing.

 

 

Darn it, I knew I forgot one....

[Deadahead Neil]

To quote Leona Helmsley, "Only the little people pay taxes"...So this DCS is a flat fee charged the same to everyone, regardless of what you paid for the cruise. So if you paid $300 per person for the cruise, your "gratuity tax" is 24% of your cruise. If you go the suites and pay $4000 per person, you pay the same $12 per day DSC, and your "gratuity tax" is only 2% of your cruise cost. Seems to me this is not really fair, but I guess that's the way it is. In fairness, it should be a % of your cruise cost. The total " gratuity tax" (DSC) should be a percentage of your cruise (and most likely, service level) and not a flat tax. Then more services would justify more gratuity. If they bake that into their total fare and use the same "formula" for distribution of the funds, good service would still be rewarded and be more equitable based on services rendered. Just food for thought. :cool:

Edited January 18, 2012 by Deadahead Neil

[Mooder]

To quote Leona Helmsley, "Only the little people pay taxes"...So this DCS is a flat fee charged the same to everyone, regardless of what you paid for the cruise. So if you paid $300 per person for the cruise, your "gratuity tax" is 24% of your cruise. If you go the suites and pay $4000 per person, you pay the same $12 per day DSC, and your "gratuity tax" is only 2% of your cruise cost. Seems to me this is not really fair, but I guess that's the way it is. In fairness, it should be a % of your cruise cost. The total " gratuity tax" (DSC) should be a percentage of your cruise (and most likely, service level) and not a flat tax. Then more services would justify more gratuity. If they bake that into their total fare and use the same "formula" for distribution of the funds, good service would still be rewarded and be more equitable based on services rendered. Just food for thought. :cool:

 

The problem with this theory is that the services covered by the DSC are the same regardless of cabin level. The additional services received by suite passengers are tipped separately by tipping the butlers and concierge who are not covered by the DSC.

[Warmer Climes]

When we go out we usually tip approx. 20% to our server. Our next cruise is costing us $2200. 20% of that is $440. The service charge on NCL for 10 days for the 2 of us is $240. Even adding an extra tip to some workers, I feel that I am still ahead. As we say in New York "IT'S A DEAL!!!!!".

 

The last time we were on RCCL we were at a table with lovely people. One couple did not show up for the last nights dinner and I realized there were more empty seats around the dining room that night. Maybe I am wrong, but I think it had to do with those last night envelopes and not tipping the waiter.

 

It is only my opinion,

Jeanne

 

I agree. I hated those little envelopes on our first cruise (RCI). I found it totally embarrassing running around the ship looking for people, and I also noticed a surprising absence at the table on the last night. Also, I disliked my waiter and loved his assistant. I did the recommended but if it was on the NCL plan, I would find the assistant and slip him some extra while leaving the DSC in place. I think of the DSC as a minimum, and it saves me a lot of hassle. I enjoy recognizing a few outstanding crew members with the little appreciation cards they have at the desk and some $, usually the cabin steward and a favorite dining server and/or bar staff as well as people outside the tip pool, like the kids' club workers.

 

I would like to say that it's up to the passenger what to tip, but it aggravates me no end to see the giant line of people the last night getting the DSC removed.