Thomson Cruises Considering Rebrand

[Sailaway487]

At the ACE Cruise Convention, the MD of Thomson Cruises, Fraser Ellacott, has been talking about how he is going to develop the Thomson Cruises business. One of the things that came up is that they are considering rebranding the business as an international brand to attract customers worldwide. It was also suggested that a new name is being considered for Thomson Cruises, although the Thomson name would stay. What it could change to though I don't know as surely if the name Thomson is staying and I would think that Cruises would stay, I can't think of a new name really that would fit! :confused:

 

They are also looking at increasing the range of accommodation for the Cruise & Stay options. They are also looking at becoming more sustainable, and are trying to reflect Thomson Airways in becoming the most efficient, I guess to tie in with the new fuel efficient Boeing 787 Dreamliner aircraft.

 

Another issue that came up was the fact that he stated that cruises should no longer be sold as a 'commodity' like flights are, and instead an experience in its own. It has been mentioned a few times on here in the past that the cruise side of the business has always seemed to be just another division of the Thomson holiday business and not a cruise company in its own right - whereas now, it seems the MD is looking to change this.

 

Three articles that mention these changes are here:

 

TravelMole - 'Thomson Cruises considering rebrand'

http://www.travelmole.com/news_feature.php?news_id=2003197&c=setreg&region=2

 

Travel Weekly - 'Stop selling cruise as a 'commodity', says Ellacott'

http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/Articles/2012/09/21/41702/stop-selling-cruise-as-a-commodity-says-ellacott.html

 

TTG Digital - 'Thomson Cruises to launch international brand?' An account is needed to view this one.

http://www.ttgdigital.com/news/thomson-cruises-to-launch-international-brand/4685270.article

 

It does seem that Ellacott is certainly moving the business along and looking at strengthening its position for the future. Hopefully this may mean new ships ;) and new itineraries to the Far East perhaps! :)

 

Not too sure about the international thing though. I just hope that they don't lose the more intimate and friendly atmosphere onboard. I'd fear that this could go if these sort of plans do go ahead.

[davecttr]

Thomson ships full of foreigners, that is going to open a can of worms, Costa anyone? :eek:

 

I will say they have to get rid of their old ships if they want to compete with the likes of MSC etc.

[davecttr]

Just read all the blurbs

 

Sensatori product?

 

5 star surroundings, superb dining, activities and entertainment., eh!, what about butlins.

 

Looks like Thomson could be going up market. I suppose this would make them somewhat similar to TUI's own cruise brand.

 

they will have to get rid of their old tubs though, a minimum of a multi multi million pound refit of a 10-15 year old ship(s) will be needed

[Sailaway487]

Just read all the blurbs

 

Sensatori product?

 

5 star surroundings, superb dining, activities and entertainment., eh!, what about butlins.

 

Looks like Thomson could be going up market. I suppose this would make them somewhat similar to TUI's own cruise brand.

 

they will have to get rid of their old tubs though, a minimum of a multi multi million pound refit of a 10-15 year old ship(s) will be needed

 

I thought the Sensatori comparison was quite strange. If that's what they are aiming at, then it does look like they are going along the Premium route. I think a massive ship overhaul will have to be in order if this is what they are considering. It does seem like they are trying to be more like TUI Cruises.

[happy v]

Do you think it's their passengers they are trying to overhaul?

If they go premium we may not be able to afford the prices.

[Sailaway487]

Do you think it's their passengers they are trying to overhaul?

If they go premium we may not be able to afford the prices.

 

Hopefully, if their idea of premium is the soon to be introduced Platinum concept, then pricing should stay the same. I'm guessing if they were thinking of a premium rebrand, then it would be the whole fleet going Platinum.

 

I do think a rebrand is needed, just perhaps not the international bit. They do need to modernise and do it properly, not just pass of Thomson Majesty as modernising because its slightly newer (though still old). I suppose we'll have a better idea of the way they are trying to shape the business when we see what the refurbishment of Dream and Celebration is like. Hopefully it is done properly.

[Jim The Scot]

Thomson ships full of foreigners

 

If that were to happen would be the day I stop cruising with Thomson

[Norwegianlatvian]

If that were to happen would be the day I stop cruising with Thomson

 

wow.... Suddenly felt very welcome..

 

With that attitude it would probably be safe to stay at the highlands.?

[davecttr]

wow.... Suddenly felt very welcome..

 

With that attitude it would probably be safe to stay at the highlands.?

It is logical for Thomson to market no fly cruises in the areas where they have ships based. I don't think they mean multiple language announcements like Costa etc, or at least I hope not. If you can get by with english I see no problem, in fact it would be good to meet different nationalities in a relaxed social setting. It might even liven up the atmosphere aboard a bit:)

 

Reading between the lines i see the Thomson MD seeking some sort of different future for the company. Competing on 'box shifting' is not going to work, hence the comment about not treating cruises as a commodity. All these big ships need filling with passengers and the industry has got itself locked into a vicious circle of cost cutting. These 'that airline' marketing techniques, like paying for the use of a safe, are , IMO, counterproductive as they give the message that the company does not really care about the customer and just treats them like stupid cash cows.

 

How do you break out of this spiral? One way is to rebrand and reposition the company in the market. Thomson may be thinking of this BUT they should not think they can get away with doing it on the cheap, just because we are british and can be overcharged for a mediocre product. They have to aim for the highest standards, for example Thomson ships should be at least as good as Mein Schiffs etc etc.

[davecttr]

British Mein Schiffs anyone?

 

TUI's Mein Schiffs operation targets the german market.

 

Extracts from various advertising bumpf.

 

The target group are baby boomers who are sophisticated and well earning pragmatics. They expect room for individuality, are generous and willing to pay more for high quality.

 

Is this perhaps the direction Thomson will go? there is no equivalent product in the british market?

 

the ships are mostly all inclusive including wines and some excursions etc etc.

 

ps No dress codes!

 

Looks to me like a more mass market version of the utterly exclusive small ship lines.

[WeeCountyMan]

They are also looking at increasing the range of accommodation for the Cruise & Stay options.

 

I've always assumed (maybe wrongly)that you could pick just about any accommodation from Thomsons main package holiday brochures if you want a pre/post cruise and hotel stay, not just the prescribed offers.

 

Essentially all they are doing is giving you a 7 (or whatever) night hotel in addition to a 7 night cruise, within a 14 night cycle for flights.The travel agent could surely tailor any hotel package to suit ?

 

Or am I missing something ? :confused:

[davecttr]

They are also looking at increasing the range of accommodation for the Cruise & Stay options.

 

I've always assumed (maybe wrongly)that you could pick just about any accommodation from Thomsons main package holiday brochures if you want a pre/post cruise and hotel stay, not just the prescribed offers.

 

Essentially all they are doing is giving you a 7 (or whatever) night hotel in addition to a 7 night cruise, within a 14 night cycle for flights.The travel agent could surely tailor any hotel package to suit ?

 

Or am I missing something ? :confused:

Maybe they are thinking of bringing in more choice, perhaps villas or more upmarket hotels. Or boutique style or farm houses etc etc?

[geomagot]

it sounds to me like Thomson’s cant get away from having to invest in bigger ships in the future, which they are consideringselling as a brand of its own rather than the present version of their ‘package holidays at sea’ product

 

they know that the global cruise market is expanding year on year and they want a slice of it

 

they have noticed that their sensatori product has been picked up on by international clients

 

they will need to fill up these bigger ships and the current traditional British mass market cruises product just isn’t enough to fill them

 

maybe they want to market some sort of cruises within cruises to appeal to the niche's maybe a sensatori style package, P&O already do this with their exclusive upmarket spa cabin packages where guests have their own areas exclusive to them and is marketed at couples

 

maybe they are looking at Disney and want to attract more families and kids by having more child friendly areas of the ship made over exclusively for families (this would appeal to the family market that would traditionally take a beach /land based holiday and wouldn’t consider a cruise)

 

maybe they are looking at the international market by adding on some international flair? costa style, to attract some international clients

 

they have an in house airline and some brand new aircraft on the way they could offer cruise and stay packages in far flung places that the other lines would struggle to get to

 

maybe a mixture of all of the above?

 

personally I think these niches will be bolted on the existing product, Thomson’s wont want to lose their core british clientele, as we know, brits will almost demand traditional elements from their cruise such as formal dining & a proper afternoon tea (its tradition) and people will still want to go to the traditional cruising destinations, they will want good value too

 

whatever they do, I still cant see Thomson attracting that many Germans as they already have aida and the 2 mein schiffs plus the mv delphin to choose from, all are marketed directly at them exclusively and at all levels of luxury, the Italians have costa and Disney has….well Disney

 

any changes would probably be introduced bit by bit Thomson’s wont want to invest in anything too risky…..will the product get better?….who knows?

[Sailaway487]

British Mein Schiffs anyone?

 

TUI's Mein Schiffs operation targets the german market.

 

Extracts from various advertising bumpf.

 

The target group are baby boomers who are sophisticated and well earning pragmatics. They expect room for individuality, are generous and willing to pay more for high quality.

 

Is this perhaps the direction Thomson will go? there is no equivalent product in the british market?

 

the ships are mostly all inclusive including wines and some excursions etc etc.

 

ps No dress codes!

 

Looks to me like a more mass market version of the utterly exclusive small ship lines.

 

I think that this could be the way that Thomson go and I think it will be good for them, as you say nothing to compare with to the rest of the market. A ship like Mein Schiff I think would be really good. I just hope they don't try and alienate the current customer base and that prices don't hugely increase. If Thomson do go down the better ship route, are still affordable and still have good itineraries, I think that it could be a good option. Of course though, if they get ships like TUI Cruises, I can see prices increasing a lot!

[Sailaway487]

it sounds to me like Thomson’s cant get away from having to invest in bigger ships in the future, which they are consideringselling as a brand of its own rather than the present version of their ‘package holidays at sea’ product

 

they know that the global cruise market is expanding year on year and they want a slice of it

 

they have noticed that their sensatori product has been picked up on by international clients

 

they will need to fill up these bigger ships and the current traditional British mass market cruises product just isn’t enough to fill them

 

maybe they want to market some sort of cruises within cruises to appeal to the niche's maybe a sensatori style package, P&O already do this with their exclusive upmarket spa cabin packages where guests have their own areas exclusive to them and is marketed at couples

 

maybe they are looking at Disney and want to attract more families and kids by having more child friendly areas of the ship made over exclusively for families (this would appeal to the family market that would traditionally take a beach /land based holiday and wouldn’t consider a cruise)

 

maybe they are looking at the international market by adding on some international flair? costa style, to attract some international clients

 

they have an in house airline and some brand new aircraft on the way they could offer cruise and stay packages in far flung places that the other lines would struggle to get to

 

maybe a mixture of all of the above?

 

personally I think these niches will be bolted on the existing product, Thomson’s wont want to lose their core british clientele, as we know, brits will almost demand traditional elements from their cruise such as formal dining & a proper afternoon tea (its tradition) and people will still want to go to the traditional cruising destinations, they will want good value too

 

whatever they do, I still cant see Thomson attracting that many Germans as they already have aida and the 2 mein schiffs plus the mv delphin to choose from, all are marketed directly at them exclusively and at all levels of luxury, the Italians have costa and Disney has….well Disney

 

any changes would probably be introduced bit by bit Thomson’s wont want to invest in anything too risky…..will the product get better?….who knows?

 

Agree entirely with everything you say. Better ships and a more serious cruise line operation I think is the way then need to go, and it does seem that this could be happening - no longer an addition to the package holiday business but a cruise line in its own right.

 

The whole Thomson operation has been going down the slightly exclusive route the past couple of years. 90% of the operation I believe is going to be 'only with Thomson' i.e. can't find the same accommodation in the UK with anyone else. Add this to the Sensatori product and Thomson Couples expanding range, it does seem that Thomson are going down the more Premium end of the market, and it would make sense to reflect this with the cruise line. I suppose stage one of this is the Platinum upgrades. Be interesting to see the developments in the next couple of years and the way that they direct the company and the product. Could be a new Thomson Cruises a few years down the line.

[Little Nell]

I think that this could be the way that Thomson go and I think it will be good for them, as you say nothing to compare with to the rest of the market. A ship like Mein Schiff I think would be really good. I just hope they don't try and alienate the current customer base and that prices don't hugely increase. If Thomson do go down the better ship route, are still affordable and still have good itineraries, I think that it could be a good option. Of course though, if they get ships like TUI Cruises, I can see prices increasing a lot!

 

The Mein Schiff cruises are not that much more expensive than Thomson.

[Sailaway487]

The Mein Schiff cruises are not that much more expensive than Thomson.

 

...goes to do some €uro pricing... ;)

[Sailaway487]

Done everything as similar as possible. Not included any flights on either, so it's just the cruise only.

 

THOMSON CRUISES

06 July 2013 - Treasures of the Mediterranean (7 nights)

Palma - At Sea - Trapani - Naples - Rome - Calvi - Palamos - Palma

Deck 4/5 Inside

Thomson Dream

£1,674.00

 

TUI CRUISES

07 July 2013 - Western Mediterranean (7 nights)

Malta - At Sea - Monte Carlo - Ajaccio - Rome - At Sea - Catania (Sicily) - Malta

Inner-cabin C

Mein Schiff 2

€2.378,00 = £1,901.00

 

So with TUI Cruises you do have the extra day at sea and is more expensive, but usually cruises (from both companies I guess) usually fluctuate £300 either way now and again depending on discounts and that. When you consider though what TUI Cruises give you for free and extras that are included and the overall state of the ships, a difference of £200 isn't really much. Time for Thomson to be a little bit fairer I think. If TUI can give cruises to the German market with prices that aren't that far off what the Thomson prices are, makes you wonder whether they think they can take the UK customers for a ride...

 

(Still would rather go with Thomson though ;))

[Little Nell]

...goes to do some €uro pricing... ;)

 

The thread Thomson v Tui Mein Schiff by Topsey on June 25th discussed this so anything you can add on pricing would be good as there were only a couple of examples. There is some good discussion on that thread :);)

[Sailaway487]

The thread Thomson v Tui Mein Schiff by Topsey on June 25th discussed this so anything you can add on pricing would be good as there were only a couple of examples. There is some good discussion on that thread :);)

 

Will have a look at that thread. Thanks for mentioning it! :)

 

Think I was away then so missed it. Will have a look now...

[davecttr]

:(

Done everything as similar as possible. Not included any flights on either, so it's just the cruise only.

 

THOMSON CRUISES

06 July 2013 - Treasures of the Mediterranean (7 nights)

Palma - At Sea - Trapani - Naples - Rome - Calvi - Palamos - Palma

Deck 4/5 Inside

Thomson Dream

£1,674.00

 

TUI CRUISES

07 July 2013 - Western Mediterranean (7 nights)

Malta - At Sea - Monte Carlo - Ajaccio - Rome - At Sea - Catania (Sicily) - Malta

Inner-cabin C

Mein Schiff 2

€2.378,00 = £1,901.00

 

So with TUI Cruises you do have the extra day at sea and is more expensive, but usually cruises (from both companies I guess) usually fluctuate £300 either way now and again depending on discounts and that. When you consider though what TUI Cruises give you for free and extras that are included and the overall state of the ships, a difference of £200 isn't really much. Time for Thomson to be a little bit fairer I think. If TUI can give cruises to the German market with prices that aren't that far off what the Thomson prices are, makes you wonder whether they think they can take the UK customers for a ride...

 

(Still would rather go with Thomson though ;))

Next year i have 1 thomson cruise booked and 3 P&O! Why? Because the P&O ships are a lot more modern and what surprised me was the price can actually be cheaper for a solo cruiser than the Thomson offering. Have we been victims of the british 'mustn't complain' disease for too long? Lets face it, Thomson ships basically are old tubs and a bit of tarting up a la Platinum won't change that. I would pay a higher price for a better product but for me Thomson don't offer one :(

[Sailaway487]

Didn't know whether to post this here or the cabin photo one as it is linked to both.

 

Just been doing a little bit of investigating (as usual :rolleyes:) and I came across Mein Schiff forum, a forum just on TUI Cruises. There has been speculation for the past couple of weeks that Mein Schiff 1 is going to be sold.

 

Link to it below. It's in Google Translate, so don't have to many wines before trying to decipher it! :D

 

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://www.meinschiff-forum.de/index.php%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1366%26bih%3D643%26prmd%3Dimvnsfd&rurl=translate.google.co.uk&sl=de&u=http://www.meinschiff-forum.de/index.php%3Fpage%3DThread%26threadID%3D2191%26s%3D7b7d199c0d8e2128b2090e41f41695019bcb456c&usg=ALkJrhhdnyCiGf9dW2wwvHqd25V6Trn2Hw

 

Is it stupid to think that Mein Schiff 1 could go to Thomson if it is indeed sold? Most likely yes. Oh well, there can always be hope. :(

[davecttr]

Brilliant translation. :D

 

Whatever happens to Mein Schiff 1 it is the sort of vessel Thomson need if they are to develop theit fleet. The existing vessels just don't fit the bill.

 

Dream - few balconies and a very unimaginative public room layout. There is no real difference between the bars for example. It cries out for a horizon type bar.

 

Celebration - no balconies and the famed 'wobble' Now many don't care about the wobble but if you are going to sell a product to a new market it better not have anything that can be critiscised. Are you reading this Thomson?

 

space, the Mein Schiffs have about 1800 passengers on 77,000 tons, following this ratio would need Celebration to have only 800 passengers and Dream less than 1300. the existing ships have too little space per passenger to be considered premium.

 

The product has to include free cabin safes, fridges in all cabins, free tea making facilities, free room service (like P&O), free laundry.

 

You can't make a silk purse out of a cows ear.

 

IF Mein Schiff 1 did go to Thomson what's the bet it would not get refitted :rolleyes:

[WeeCountyMan]

Maybe they are thinking of bringing in more choice, perhaps villas or more upmarket hotels. Or boutique style or farm houses etc etc?

 

Yes, I think you are right, it would appear so.

 

More likely the upmarket hotels ?

 

Not sure I would want to stay in a villa or farmhouse after having been served hand and foot on a cruise.

[Sailaway487]

Brilliant translation. :D

 

Whatever happens to Mein Schiff 1 it is the sort of vessel Thomson need if they are to develop theit fleet. The existing vessels just don't fit the bill.

 

Dream - few balconies and a very unimaginative public room layout. There is no real difference between the bars for example. It cries out for a horizon type bar.

 

Celebration - no balconies and the famed 'wobble' Now many don't care about the wobble but if you are going to sell a product to a new market it better not have anything that can be critiscised. Are you reading this Thomson?

 

space, the Mein Schiffs have about 1800 passengers on 77,000 tons, following this ratio would need Celebration to have only 800 passengers and Dream less than 1300. the existing ships have too little space per passenger to be considered premium.

 

The product has to include free cabin safes, fridges in all cabins, free tea making facilities, free room service (like P&O), free laundry.

 

You can't make a silk purse out of a cows ear.

 

IF Mein Schiff 1 did go to Thomson what's the bet it would not get refitted :rolleyes:

 

I would doubt it would get refitted, probably no changes to it at all. Saying that though, it did have a HUGE refurb when it started sailing with them and another refurb last year. But, it will probably never happen. :(