Leaving Epi-Pen at Kid's Club

[thewolffs]

Has anyone left an Epi-Pen at the kid's club? My daughter has a peanut allergy. I emailed the access desk and they said the staff wouldn't give her the Epi-Pen if she needed it. I'm worried that if she needed it, the nurse or dr. wouldn't get there in time. Anyone have any experience with this?

 

Thanks!

[Sparkygirl]

Has anyone left an Epi-Pen at the kid's club? My daughter has a peanut allergy. I emailed the access desk and they said the staff wouldn't give her the Epi-Pen if she needed it. I'm worried that if she needed it, the nurse or dr. wouldn't get there in time. Anyone have any experience with this?

 

Thanks!

 

What ship are you sailing? How old is your daughter? My daughter has anaphylaxis to latex as well as cross reactive fruits and we bring a set of epi-pens as well as her own personal first aid kit onboard specifically for splash academy. We've sailed 3 times without an allergy issue, her medication kit has remained with the splash academy staff all week.

 

The access desk is correct, the splash academy staff are not able to administer epi-pens. Have you completed the 4 page access desk needs form? The medical center is notified based on this form regarding the allergies onboard and in the kids center. Also, request a pager or handi-phone they have them on hand for usually the non potty trained children but also hand them out for allergy children where there is a need to immediately reach a parent.

 

With my daughter's allergy there are usually questions that don't come up until after we've dropper her off or they are getting ready to do face paint or something else that they will call to ask if something is safe or not. Splash academy has come up with amazing substitutions on the fly that my daughter is as included as everyone else.

 

I was very worried to leave my severely allergic three year old child in splash academy and after 3 cruises and working with the access desk and splash academy program director NCL is the only line we will sail with our daughter. I've called every other cruise line and no one can match the level of safety and access needs accomodations NCL has provided.

 

If you have specific questions that you would rather not share publicly please feel free to e-mail me at daadme at gmail dot com

[thewolffs]

I did send back the forms. I'm worried if she needed the epi pen, that she wouldn't have it administered in time. How long before someone could get there to give it to her? I get they don't want the liability, but I'd be willing to sign a waiver. It's super easy to inject. I don't trust my 6 year old to do it herself. We're on the Gem.

[Sparkygirl]

I did send back the forms. I'm worried if she needed the epi pen, that she wouldn't have it administered in time. How long before someone could get there to give it to her? I get they don't want the liability, but I'd be willing to sign a waiver. It's super easy to inject. I don't trust my 6 year old to do it herself. We're on the Gem.

 

Medical Center is Deck 4 right next to mid ship elevators, Splash Academy is on Deck 12 mid ship elevators. They have a "crew only" elevator in the back of the medical center that goes up and down mid ship. My daughter suffered a head injury onboard breakaway on the splash area pool, breakaway is a huge ship compared to Gem and the medical staff were by her side within 3-5 minutes, including grabbing immobilization equipment.

 

Go to the open house as soon as you get on board to register your daughters and ask to speak with the head of the splash academy onboard your sailing. They told me that a medical emergency call from the splash academy is immediately responded to within minutes. Based on knowing the exact location of the patient versus needing to find us on the pool deck I would think the response times would be even faster than they were for my daughter's head injury.

 

We also told splash academy make the medical emergency call to the medical center as well as to call us and we would also head for the splash academy. My husband and I spent the first day wondering the ship learning where the aft stairs up and down the ship ended up so that we could always find them.

 

The splash academy staff are very aware and conscious of the kids and particularly the kids with allergies, they will give her an allergy alert on her wrist band. We received a phone call that she was breathing fine but had developed a red spot. Did we want them to ask medical to come up or would we stop by? We also learned after running into the ship doctor in the splash academy area we learned that the doctors/nurses also roam the ship and stop by the kids area.

[rvsullivan]

I did send back the forms. I'm worried if she needed the epi pen, that she wouldn't have it administered in time. How long before someone could get there to give it to her? I get they don't want the liability, but I'd be willing to sign a waiver. It's super easy to inject. I don't trust my 6 year old to do it herself. We're on the Gem.

 

They will not inject her. They will either call you or the ships doctor. Has your daughter ever injected herself? Depending how far into the shock she would be, probably would have to wait for help anyway.

[GeezerCouple]

This would be a worrisome situation.

 

But she is 6 now?

That's a big difference from someone 3 or 4.

 

Have you seen the new Epi-Pens?

I'm not sure how "new" they really are, or if the children's dose Pen is made like that, but it's a huge improvement.

(Maybe our internist wasn't as familiar with the changes? But our allergist, at the most recent visit, insisted that we have the new ones, and said that if insurance was a problem - it wasn't - she'd phone them and insist it was "medically necessary". We certainly would have paid, if insurance didn't, anyway.)

 

The new one is more compact, and when one pulls the top off (there is a trainer), it "talks" you through what to do, and counts down how long to hold it up against one's thigh.

 

I'd think that a 6 year old could be taught with the trainer, and some practice.

 

But here is another question: Would the Splash Academy staff let her inject herself? Just something to check on.

 

We both need to keep an Epi-Pen nearby/on hand, and the new versions are huge improvements to the old ones, in many ways.

 

GeezerCouple

[russianmom]

They do not allow food in Splash Academy so the chance of your daughter being exposed there is pretty slim.

 

As a peanut allergy sufferer and a pediatric nurse I would agree w/ the previous poster that 6 is probably an ok age for your daughter to learn from a nurse at your allergists office about self injecting.

This is the newest version:

 

https://www.auvi-q.com/?s_mcid=AVQCO05254PS&MTD=2&ENG=1&QCPN=1

 

 

Do you also carry Benadryl with you?

[Budget Queen]

I did send back the forms. I'm worried if she needed the epi pen, that she wouldn't have it administered in time. How long before someone could get there to give it to her? I get they don't want the liability, but I'd be willing to sign a waiver. It's super easy to inject. I don't trust my 6 year old to do it herself. We're on the Gem.

 

To inject this, the person is going to have to be licensed, it isn't a matter of you signing any waiver. Nobody at the Splash Academy is going to give it.

 

You state your daughter is not able to do it herself. Is she aware when she has a reaction, does she give clear details? Does she have common phrases used? IF so, then you need to disclose this clearly EVERY time she is dropped off. The response of the medical team is fast. Clearly the best plan of action is to be prepared. Epi is going to be available in the medical clinic. They may or may not give patient supplies. I would NOT be leaving any medications in the kids center. In advance see if the medical staff would use it, and leave a supply with them, if accepted. Otherwise, as your child grows older, get her professionally trained, and keep a supply with you.

[Sparkygirl]

To inject this, the person is going to have to be licensed, it isn't a matter of you signing any waiver. Nobody at the Splash Academy is going to give it.

 

 

 

You state your daughter is not able to do it herself. Is she aware when she has a reaction, does she give clear details? Does she have common phrases used? IF so, then you need to disclose this clearly EVERY time she is dropped off. The response of the medical team is fast. Clearly the best plan of action is to be prepared. Epi is going to be available in the medical clinic. They may or may not give patient supplies. I would NOT be leaving any medications in the kids center. In advance see if the medical staff would use it, and leave a supply with them, if accepted. Otherwise, as your child grows older, get her professionally trained, and keep a supply with you.

 

 

I disagree with this, the medication stays with the child. There has been a plastic bin with medications in it held by the counselors behind the check-in desk. It is in a non child zone therefore free of a child getting into the medication.

 

 

 

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[Budget Queen]

I disagree with this, the medication stays with the child. There has been a plastic bin with medications in it held by the counselors behind the check-in desk. It is in a non child zone therefore free of a child getting into the medication.

 

 

 

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Fine with your disagreement. But as a health care professional, having an intermediate step involved can have some issues. In my case, I would NEVER allow my meds to be handled by unlicensed individuals. Contamination, theft etc can happen. I don't care how many times it doesn't, it can't be predicted.

 

In an emergency you are now, counting on the Splash staff to find this med, and give it to the health care staff. If the child is alone with no parent/guardian right there, they would be smart NOT to give anything, until that child is taken to the health care center and accessed and given meds from their stock following their protocol.

 

If the child is independent in their health care, a whole different story with the med storage. This OP is stating they are not.

 

Reason, I mention ADVANCE contact with the Health Care Center and what they will and will not do, is essential.

[Sparkygirl]

Fine with your disagreement. But as a health care professional, having an intermediate step involved can have some issues. In my case, I would NEVER allow my meds to be handled by unlicensed individuals. Contamination, theft etc can happen. I don't care how many times it doesn't, it can't be predicted.

 

 

 

In an emergency you are now, counting on the Splash staff to find this med, and give it to the health care staff. If the child is alone with no parent/guardian right there, they would be smart NOT to give anything, until that child is taken to the health care center and accessed and given meds from their stock following their protocol.

 

 

 

If the child is independent in their health care, a whole different story with the med storage. This OP is stating they are not.

 

 

 

Reason, I mention ADVANCE contact with the Health Care Center and what they will and will not do, is essential.

 

 

Thank you for your response, I understand your perspective as I am also a health care professional. I was focusing on my daughters medication and first aid kit which we are training her at 4 that she is not separated from as that habit will possibly save her life one day. We do not depend on the medication that is left with splash academy. I make up 4 complete kits with an epi-pen, single dose Benadryl and basic first aid supplies as I do not trust bandaids and tape to be latex free and packaging free of latex. The one left at splash academy is in a tamper evident sealed plastic bag marketed for schools as meeting the child safety requirements. Her dad and I each carry a complete kit on ourselves while traveling as well as her grandparents have one.

 

I absolutely agree that pre communication with the medical staff onboard is vital! Due to my daughters allergy and severity we attend a team meeting immediately upon boarding where we discuss my daughter and her needs with the ship physician, splash academy, hotel manager and food and beverage manager. I've actually had a room steward we had never met at a towel folding demonstration go to hand my daughter a towel animal, catch himself as he heard our room number and swap out for a latex free towel animal.

 

With pre planning and communication cruising can be an enjoyable and relaxing vacation for all!

 

 

 

 

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[thewolffs]

I was told that she can keep the epi pen at the kid's club. I would assume the medical staff also has one. I'll be double-checking with everyone, once onboard. She's never needed the epi pen, thank God. She hears me telling other people how to use it, but I don't think she's mature enough to do it herself. I'm sure everything will be fine and she won't need it, but you never know if another child ate peanut butter for lunch and didn't wash their hands. It's the same fear I have for her at school. Thanks for the advice!

[Vyhanek]

My daughter also has a nut allergy.

 

At 6 years old you need to be moving towards...."Personal Responsibility". With your own child you need to be doing a much better job of trusting that she is responsible for her own health. Not in a million years would I trust the college aged Kids Club staff with her epic-pen and think everything is good.

 

At 6, I would send my allergic dd to the Kids Club and tell her "Not to eat anything". At 6 I should be able to trust that she knows the dangers because I've worked with her for years almost at every single meal and she should know this.

 

If your child was 3 or 4 years old, this would be a different story. You don't have a toddler. You have a child who should at this point be able to know not to eat things she isn't absolutely sure about. On vacation, she should be able to follow instructions like........."Don't eat in kids club. I will come pick you up and we will go to the buffet together. I will come get you to eat.". This is parenting 101 for an allergic child at 6 years old.

 

You need to change your strategy.

[thewolffs]

Umm, I never said I don't trust her to not eat anything. I don't trust her to give herself her Epi-Pen. Big difference. I'm not concerned about peanuts being in the kid's club. I know it's "peanut free". There's always the chance that she'll be exposed to peanuts somehow. If another child ate peanut butter and didn't wash their hands properly before going to the kid's club. She could potentially touch something that has peanut butter on it and rub her eyes or whatever. It's never happened to her before, but you never know. We've been very lucky so far. Not sure how this turned into judging my parenting style. She is very aware of her allergy. That's not my concern. I was only asking about the Epi-Pen being left there. It needs to be given within minutes to help. I'm concerned about someone getting there fast enough to inject her. I don't think at 6, she'd know if she truly needed it and could actually go through with injecting herself. Thanks for all the advice. I really do appreciate it.

[GeezerCouple]

Umm, I never said I don't trust her to not eat anything. I don't trust her to give herself her Epi-Pen. Big difference. I'm not concerned about peanuts being in the kid's club. I know it's "peanut free". There's always the chance that she'll be exposed to peanuts somehow. If another child ate peanut butter and didn't wash their hands properly before going to the kid's club. She could potentially touch something that has peanut butter on it and rub her eyes or whatever. It's never happened to her before, but you never know. We've been very lucky so far. Not sure how this turned into judging my parenting style. She is very aware of her allergy. That's not my concern. I was only asking about the Epi-Pen being left there. It needs to be given within minutes to help. I'm concerned about someone getting there fast enough to inject her. I don't think at 6, she'd know if she truly needed it and could actually go through with injecting herself. Thanks for all the advice. I really do appreciate it.

 

About your second to last sentence...

... that is why there are trainers included with the "live" Epi-Pens.

 

Try the newer, "talking" type.

It's time for her to start getting accustomed to how it works, regardless of whether/when you give her full responsibility.

 

These newer ones *really* "tell you exactly what to do", and also count down the few seconds needed to keep the device at the upper thigh after the injection start.

 

Even if only so that she'll be more familiar with it IF it is ever needed, you should be having her do this now.

 

And better yet IF someday it saves her life because she DOES understand the little device and knows how to use it.

 

They've really made them extremely easy to use with the latest design and "talking" instructions.

 

The trainer can be used over and over, for practice.

 

The other thing our allergist did - which really startled us the first time - was to have us "practice as though it were a real emergency".

After all, if it's needed, it IS a real emergency.

 

So there we both were, calmly sitting in her office, and she asked where the Epi-Pen was. (This was the older version, but the procedure is the same.)

It was in my purse.

SUDDENLY, she shouted to my husband, "GET THE EPI-PEN *NOW* AND GIVE IT TO HER!"

Then she added, "NOW!"

 

We were pretty upset about the fumbling and nervous shaking that occurring immediately afterwards. :(

But we have ever since thanked her profusely. :)

That shook us up enough to take the practice more seriously.

(And now that DH also needs to keep one with him, we've had to practice "both directions".)

 

This little device is meant to be life-saving if needed.

 

Start teaching her to use it.

She also needs to learn to recognize the very earliest symptoms of an allergic reaction. You won't always be watching her every minute.

 

GeezerCouple

[Budget Queen]

Umm, I never said I don't trust her to not eat anything. I don't trust her to give herself her Epi-Pen. Big difference. I'm not concerned about peanuts being in the kid's club. I know it's "peanut free". There's always the chance that she'll be exposed to peanuts somehow. If another child ate peanut butter and didn't wash their hands properly before going to the kid's club. She could potentially touch something that has peanut butter on it and rub her eyes or whatever. It's never happened to her before, but you never know. We've been very lucky so far. Not sure how this turned into judging my parenting style. She is very aware of her allergy. That's not my concern. I was only asking about the Epi-Pen being left there. It needs to be given within minutes to help. I'm concerned about someone getting there fast enough to inject her. I don't think at 6, she'd know if she truly needed it and could actually go through with injecting herself. Thanks for all the advice. I really do appreciate it.

 

I agree with some of the other comments. Your daughter needs to be moved along. :)

 

You have 2 comments in your above posts.- about her hearing you tell others how to inject this and then your daughter not knowing if she needed to inject. Both of these are moot. Again, nobody is going to use her "kit" that you left without FIRST a medical professional assessment- from the cruise ship staff on scene. And even then they may or may not use your supplies.

 

It's a whole different story with self administration. Your child would know the symptoms, tell the staff, the staff hands her the package. Your daughter manages ALL her own health care. This is the quickest administration when it's self.

[allison0523]

I don't know how it works on a ship but I think it's probably similar to EMS on land. Therefore, I wanted to make a couple of points about the time it would take to get Epi into a patient having anaphylaxis. I work as paramedic in a busy urban setting. Here, we don't carry Epi in an auto injector or pre-filled syringe. We have to draw it up out of a vial, then inject it. We use a standard dose for pediatrics or adults. 0.3 or 0.5. So, I think the Epi pen is a better tool in the aspect of the time it takes to administer Epi in the field. So, as a parent, I would be more worried about finding out if the medical staff will administer your child's Epi pen to her if necessary or not. Some will and some won't, depending on their protocols. Also, I would want to find out if the medical staff has Epi in an auto injector or pre-filled syringe for pediatrics. If the answer is no to either of these questions, personally, I would not leave my child there until they were old enough to administer their own Epi. (If they have a severe allergy). That's just my opinion for what I would feel comfortable with.