Atlantis Med cruise........from hell!

[Oslo Dutch]

Last week I returned from the Brilliance of the Seas Atlantis Gay Charter in the Med. It has been a very ugly experience. This might be not due to the actual Atlantis product but the combination of some very unhappy events.

 

 

The three weeks before the cruise were very hard as back in the Netherlands I nursed my father together with my family. He passed away on August 26th and the cremation took place on August 30th. It was a very hard time for all of us but I can look back to it with great spiritual satisfaction how we took care of him and made him a happy man on his deathbed. He was so happy to have his family committed and in peace around him.

The opposite I can say about this Atlantis cruise I joined on September 1rst in Villefranche, France. Initially I was booked for the Mexican Riviera cruise in October. As my father’s health deteriorated so fast this year I decided to change it to the Med one in September to be closer to home in case of emergency. Initially I was going alone but found a buddy on Gaydar from the UK. He was at first sight, a very nice, 51 year old guy from the UK. We met for the first time in the beginning of July. Something which resulted in romance and we started dating. So it looked all very promising indeed.

The Brilliance is very nice, well designed and a good looking ship. A bit soulless and it hasn’t got the class like Oriana (no teakwood decks etc). Dinner, food and service were very good and above expectations. The dining room has got a lot of big tables but has got terrible acoustics. Especially downstairs in the corners it’s very hard to understand your tablemates.

 

We tried once to have breakfast in the dining room. It was not a success, they tried to push you once again to a buffet (why in the dining room?) and it was very obvious they actually wanted you to have breakfast upstairs in the buffet area. And the waiter was downright rude! After this we never returned for breakfast and lunch there.

 

The buffets are very good and very well organized. But I found it a bit boring after a few days. They also have an Italian café on the top deck for pizza’s and pasta dishes which was very nice for lunch. Atlantis has got open seating for dinner. So you can walk in whenever you like. The negative side is you end up with different people every night and one dimensional stupid conversation. However we managed to meet other non US guys who became out table mates every evening.

 

One night we had dinner at Portofino’s, which was absolutely superb.

We had booked an inside cabin forward on deck 8. Also very nice and the cabin steward did a good job. I have a feeling RCCL has skeleton staff as turn down service took place around 4 pm.

Personally I think RCCL is financially really taking the mickey out of their passengers. At Civitavecheia they sold tickets for the shuttle bus service while the port authorities offered free one. I heard about guys who where lured into far more expensive treatments in the Spa than they had asked for. At parties when you bought drinks at the bar the 15 percent gratuity was still added (very unusual for us Europeans) and they had a tendency to sell you bigger and more expensive drinks than you asked for. There was a lot of nickel and dimming everywhere. My final onboard bill has been already converted to Norwegian Kroner at their rate. Not the better credit card rate I would normally get

 

 

Atlantis is now actively targeting the circuit party market. And it showed. There were lots of parties, and lots of people on drugs. Which resulted in lots of one dimensional, one brain celled, bad mannered, muscle Mary party boys. At night there was lots of sex over the place. I saw people who were running naked around the corridors. People were having sex in the pools and Jacuzzi, (so RCCL staff was not being able to start cleaning). The cabin next door was a bit of an orgy room with people running in and out all night. One night I was on the toilet and in the cubicle next to me a lot of snorting illegal substances took place. I did not find the atmosphere very friendly. And ffter a while it felt like being kept in a Gay Pride Prison. This is not a cruise to go solo. Throughout the cruise I still saw lots of single people by themselves. As somebody told me afterwards at Barcelona Airport, there were a lot of lonely people around.

 

But Atlantis does have their act together and things on board were very well organized. It is a very American product and we as Europeans felt sometimes a bit overwhelmed by it.

 

The shows were the best I have seen on any cruise ship. Once again a very American experience where the public oooh’d and aaah’d over Broadway and showbiz names we have never heard of. Special guest star was Debbie Gibson who gave a great show. They did have Topping and Butch in the Colony Club from the Edinburgh Festival. They were very funny and entertaining.

 

 

So I arrived on board in a rather run down state. Would I have gone solo, I would have cancelled but because of my now ex lover I decided to go. I went for him and wanted to be with him. He only came out only 3 years ago after having been married for over 25 years. Well, this cruise turned him into an unreliable untrustworthy alcoholic who left me for 3 nights alone in the cabin while partying, drinking or doing whatever around the ship. I have been looking several times for him in the middle of the night but could never find him.

 

During the last white party I became very unwell and had to go back to my cabin. He never bothered checking how I was doing and I found him around 9 am the next morning upstairs still dressed in white at the buffet. So this guy turned the whole thing into one big nightmare. And that within one week after my father’s funeral I had hoped for to be looked after a little bit. The pain and agony I went through were enormous. So this was surely a cruise from hell! Normally I always get very relaxed and rested on a cruise. This one completely wore me out and left me on the brink of a nervous breakdown.

So first I cancelled the Millennium sailing in March. From what I have been told the Caribbean sailings are apparently even more nasty circuit party than this one. After this I discovered I really don’t need gay men to be on a cruise ship. At one stage I kept longing for the civilized old ladies having tea in the Queens Room on the QE2.

I can imagine why people like Atlantis but this is simply not my cup of tea. I surely wasn’t in the right frame of mind for it and should not have gone in the first place. But I do understand it serves a purpose for especially people who are not out.

So on to a good cruise next time!

[thulewx]

Awww, Reindt - I'm so sorry you had such a terrible time:( . I've been in similar circumstances and know how low it can make you feel - like everything is going against you.

Hopefully, any built-up bad karma has been vanquished and you have nothing but good karma coming your way. Wish I was going on a cruise soon that I could invite you on (I don't think you'd be interested in a Thule military reunion cruise on Carnival Valor :eek: next February? ). Or maybe you could come to Georgia later next year and visit once I get settled into my new place at Lumberjack's Campground.;)

[CruisinMaterial]

Hey Oslo,

 

I'm very sorry to hear about your loss just prior to embarking on the first ever Altantis cruise you experienced. I've sailed four Atlantis vacations myself and have taken a year off from them and gone back to hetero cruising. I had a blast and met some quality people on the Med cruises, which shocks me that your experience was the exact opposite.

 

I'm not going to lie though, there are drugs on EVERY Atlantis cruise. I'm surprised by the amount of usage on the Med cruise though, I vowed after the Caribbean cruise that I wouldn't sail one of those again because over half the boat seemed tweaked on some drug. I watched a drug purchase by one of Atlantis's guest stars on one of the cruises, not going to give specifics but I was appalled, it happened right on the pool deck! I was shocked myself but I suppose it's part of the community and if you're sailing with that many you'll see it there too - still doesn't make it acceptable though.

 

I'm shocked and saddened that Atlantis' European product has declined that much. I was looking forward to doing a European cruise with them in the future...

 

Sorry to hear you had such a bad time... cheers to the ladies in the tea room! I'm sailing Princess myself in a few weeks and I absolutely cannot wait. The straight folk appear to want to have a fun time so I'm sure it'll be good! :)

~Jake

[CruisinMaterial]

P.S. I also hated the Royal Caribbean ship and service they had chartered back for the first European cruise, definitely a cheap cruise product than their sister line Celebrity.

[Bayotter]

I had found RSVP to be a better charter than Atlantis in terms of the circuit party atmosphere. Unfortunately drugs are everywhere, but there seemed to have been less of that environment on the RSVP cruises I have been on, although it's been a few years now. I hope that hasn't changed as I have 2 RSVP cruises booked for next year. Has anyone been on RSVP recently that can attest to that? Or was the OP's experience not representative of most Atlantis charters?

[ahoymatey3]

Oslo, sorry for your loss. Perhaps you should try a non-gay cruise sometime. I would never do an RSVP or Atlantis cruise. Gay cruises appear to be way over-priced. Nor do they offer traditional dining (same people, same table) which is great for solo cruisers. I've never felt out of place and usually meet other like- minded gay people on board.

[bepsf]

Oslo--

 

So sorry for your loss and your miserable cruise! One more nail in the coffin for Atlantis cruises for us normal guys!

Having just returned from the RSVP Alaska cruise aboard the fabulous Oosterdam, I again found the atmosphere elegant (it's Holland America, after all...) the crew and staff warm, outgoing and eager to please, and the clientelle diverse and friendly.

Over and over again we heard from the cruise staff that they wished that they had RSVP aboard more often!

Although RSVP allows open seatings, the times and general locations (Upper/Lower Dining Room) are set so that it makes finding a table much easier - and one can always do as we did and reserve a table for the entire week.

I'll post a more in-depth review this weekend, but I certainly hope that anyone who doesn't appreciate the circuit-party/drug atmosphere of Atlantis will consider sailing w/ RSVP.

[LVMediaboy]

After 16 gay cruises, I think of learned one can see what they want to see. At any given time during a nighttime party, usually a third or so of passengers participate. Leaving two thirds elsewhere. I generally tell friends who think nighttime on Atlantis means 'only' the dance party to walk around the ship and see what else is going on. On the 8/04 Med, there was piano bar, ballroom dancing and several other 'non-circuit-y' things going during an on deck dance party. Just because dance parties happen, doesn't mean attendance is compulsory. Before I saw the light, straight cruises had there fair share of 'too much party', albeit more likely booze and valium induced - worse yet -- bad calypso music.

Honestly, the wildest thing I saw on the 8/04 Med was a hot naked guy running down the hall for 10 Euro. (The best money I ever spent - jk)

So my best advice, if anyone does a gay cruise -- Atlantis or RSVP -- is to check out alternative activities if anything seems to be too much.

[CRSNDC]

Olso,

 

I'm sorry to hear that you have had such a rough time of it lately. I hope brighter, happier days are ahead for you.

 

Admittedly the Atlantis product is not for everyone but I get the impression that unfortunately you were in a place that no cruise could have cured. Several of the things you mention either a) Atlantis or RCI have no control over, or b) were known going in and you just didn't care for them.

 

The ship didn't have teak floors. (ok, knew about going in)

Didn't care for open seating. (knew about going in)

American's applauded entertainers you didn't know. (ok, so?)

Services tried to upsell/gratuity on drinks. (that's business)

Sex and drugs. (known reality in large groups of gay men)

Felt overwhelemed by American product. (ok, that's fine)

New friend of 45 days flaked on you. (welcome to life)

 

Please don't take any of this personally. I am trying to illustrate LVMediaboys glass half full/empty comment. And maybe not doing it well.

 

Atlantis didn't work for you this time and that is fine. But I do think you owe gay cruising a second shot sometime. I'm sorry to hear you have cancelled the March cruise. I have seen you on several boards and was actually hoping we could meet someday.

 

And RSVP guys, I mean no disrepect but please stop saying RSVP is so much more wholesome. Sex and drugs happen anytime you assemble 2000+ G/L folks for a vacation. (ok, now I'm gonna get it)

 

-Chris in DC

:)

[CruisinMaterial]

LVMediaboy - I wholeheartedly agree with your comments as well. There are plenty of other things to do onboard as I learned during the January 04 Caribbean cruise when the circuit parties up on deck were just way out of control... discovered Matt Yee in the piano bar... awesome guy!! There are alternative things to do, not as highly advertised as the deck parties but there are things... one just has to make the experience the best for themselves as possible. To place that on Atlantis or the cruise line to know what works for each person would be insane... they try to appease everyone with a generic product and hope it goes well... for some that's not enough though... :cool:

 

Chris in DC - Yikes! :eek: You raised valid points about the review of the cruise with life and business. The comment about the gratuities, it's customary on all vessels to do that. As for the waiters charging for higher premium drinks, one can only imagine that they're using our gay dollars to help them through all their new builds including the gigantic Freedom of the Seas and the new propulsion problem on another one of their vessels! I know one things for darned sure, we spend an aweful lot on alcohol and their mark up is insane so they are making a TON of money on just our charter alone... and even more when you consider they don't have to advertise with our cruise and pay out commission to travel agents (that's what Atlantis has to do)...

 

In regards to the RSVP cruises, since I haven't been on one, I'd concur with your thoughts... drugs is prevalent in our community as it is in our society these days. Being on a ship with that many people is going to make it appear more obvious because there are less places to do it with privacy... bottom line... I'm sure RSVP has it too...

 

Well said the two of you...

~Jake

[a4drver]

Oslo - I recently booked my first Atlantis cruise (Infinity 15th Anniversary '06) & after your review I'm seriously considering cancelling. I've been on 7 hetero cruises with straight friends & loved them all. I've been wanting to go on an Atlantis cruise for a long time but your experience makes me reconsider. I'm a fairly young (35) American guy who likes to drink but not into the drug scene. Not into the bathhouse scene at all. Since I'll be on this cruise single, your comments about single travelers being left alone & bored concerns me. Any comments/experiences from similiar guys well appreciated. Thanks-

Manny

[CRSNDC]

Hey Manny,

 

Admittedly I know nothing about your personallity except for what you mentioned but I think it would be a shame if you cancelled based on one persons bad experience.

I did my first Atlantis cruise this past March at age 39 and am still kicking myself for waiting so long. I went with a good friend.

I don't do drugs. Maybe I'm blind but I did not see the rampant drug use Oslo refers to. I also didn't think it was a floating bathhouse.

What I experienced was 2000+ friendly G/L folks having a great vacation. And I can't wait to do it again. Yes, there was some drug use and yes, I did drink and have sex. But there is so much else to do as well. And I made some great new friends. I will be solo on both next months Mexican Riviera cruise and the 15th Anniv cruise.

You say you've been wanting to do an Atlantis cruise for a long time so, in my opinion, by all means Just Do It!

 

-Chris in DC

[marcoigna]

we were on the atlantis millenium european cruise this past july/august...and had actually one of the best vacations...

 

we are from canada - in our mid 40s. we very much enjoyed each and very party ... took our costumes...

 

we don't do drugs and we did not go looking for it either - therefore we saw very little use...

 

we met a great group of people, just like us..and had an awesome time...

 

i cannot believe that u found this much drug use on the european cruise...on our cruise is was defineatly a different crowd than u might find on a caribbean cruise...many people were there for the cultural experience of europe.

 

yes, we went naked in one of the pools, and yes there was a dark room and yes there was sex in the sauna, but not overrun by 2200 men... if this is what u want it was there for u,,,otherwise turn a blind eye and go and do something u enjoy on the ship.

 

as for the crew onboard , my partner had worked with princess, sitmar, and silverseas for over 30years..and cannot believe - being a gay cruise - how polite all of the staff was....they were even invited to the white party event.

 

we loved our cruise so much ... and we have been on about 30 cruises as passengers - this being the first with altantis - we are booked next year on the brillance european cruise and know we are going to have a great time.

 

 

for me and alot of people - as their cruise sell out months and even a year inadvance - atlantis is a first class operation and love that they give the freedom that gays and lesbians deserve...in a straight world.

 

so any of u planning to cancel your atlantis cruise because of 1 readers bad review (come on - complaining about a 15gratuity on drinks, what cruise line doesn't beside silverseas and seabourn - have sailed both...) read between the lines...

 

very hard to put in writing ,,, but atlantis has something for everyone...if u want it you will find it,,,if u don't want to participate - turn the other way...

 

it is like walking down church street in toronto, passing by the leather bar - it is my choice to go in and see what is going on or passing by and going to the bar next door....

 

ig****o/marco

[eroller]

Hey Reint,

I've already emailed you my thoughts privately. As you know I'm very sorry you had to go through this. What should have been a fun time turned into something very depressing and disturbing for you. You are a good guy and didn't deserve it. When your own relationship is going through turmoil, it only makes it that much harder to watch other guys frolicking around .... especially if your so-called "partner" is one of the guys frolicking. Truly rotten and selfish on his part, especially considering what you just when through with your dad. Better to be rid of him now early on rather than see his true colors years down the road.

 

I still think you should join us on QE2 on January 3rd. I promise you will forget all about Atlantis and this as-hole! ;)

 

Ernie

[ZIPPER]

Oslo Dutch:

 

I have never been on an Atlantis Cruise, but I have been on five Atlantis Land Vacations. While in the past I have had some of the best times of my life, I would no longer recommend that single guys looking for active vacations consider Atlantis. The commaradrie that was once there seems to be long gone.

 

I've often looked to Atlantis as a place to find other guys to go swimming, horseback riding etc., but increasingly these guys are few and far between. On an Atlantis vacation almost no one goes in the ocean, and while the pool dominates the scene few guys actually swim. The pool scene is mostly a continuation of one continuous cocktail party that is truly Atlantis. In fact you have the feeling that swimming is frowned on lest you splash a twinkie or get water in his drink. The trapeze is long gone, and most of those guys with it. On my last trip to the world famous Xel-Ha water park in Cancun, only ten guys came from a resort with 500, and those ten were all couples who promptly went their own ways. The zip cables are great though, and Shann Carr is always up for adventure.

 

I had thought about taking an RSVP Star Clipper cruise, but I decided to take a straight cruise instead. Aside from being $1000 cheaper, I figure I'll at least have some (straight) guys to hang out with. I want this trip to be about sailing, not about being gays. I fear on RSVP I'll be tripping over twinkies sunning themselves when I'm helping the crew hoist the sails.

 

I presume you are Dutch, and I can see why you had the experience you did with Atlantis. I am well accepted in the Netherlands, but I can be low key. While the Dutch are tolerant toward homosexuals, I can appreciate that they don't care for loud groups of americans. I hope Atlantis never goes to Amsterdam, it would not be a good mix.

 

Tot ziens!

[ZIPPER]

Manny!

 

I would solicit responses from a number of people before you decide to cancel your cruise. A lot depends on what you like to do, where you are going to, and how outgoing you are. Once again I can only speak from the perspecitvie of having been on the land vacations.

 

First off, don't worry about being accepted. That's not an issue. Almost everyone is extremely friendly. The parties tned to be great, from what I've heard they are far better on the cruises than on the land resorts.

 

On the other hand, most guys at Atlantis tend to be either couples or in groups. Yes their are a lot of singles, but they are usually in groups. There's also a lot of guys who meet up ahead of time so they are certain to have someone to hang out with. When you see these messages "Anyone from Dallas" they're usually people looking to meet up before the cruise, and that is also an option.

 

The big thing is the extent to which you are outgoing. If you are quite outgoing things can be great; however, if you're not, an Atlantis vacation can be socially exhausting. Atlantis goes out of its way to seat you with other people, on the other hand, unless you hit if off immeadiately with someone, every meal involves dining with strangers. At first it is great, but after a few days it can become tiring. It tends to have a feeling of freshman orientation week, "Where are you from?", "What did you do today?", "Is this your first Atlantis vacation?" The other place where things can be ackward is at the shows, which tend to be great. You may frequently find yourself sitting by yourself, as a gay man this is not unusual. The Castro is full of restaurants with gay men by themselves. It's a matter of whether you are comfortable being by yourself.

 

As to my previous comments, if you're looking for adventure, there are better options. Quite frankly, if you're going to Alaska you can see and do a lot more going on your own on the Alaska marine highway, and you'll meet plently of far more interesting people along the way. If you're looking to party, you should probably give Atlantis a shot. Maybe try one of the shorter vacations like Mexico or even the land resorts, although I would recommend Puerta Vallarta over Cancun. It could possibly be the best time of your life so I wouldn't cancel casually.

 

The change that had taken place in the Atlantis scene for me is much of my source of disappointment. On my first trip in 1998, Atlantis was only about a tenth the size it is now, the group was only 250 guys, everybody knew everybody, and we were all a lot younger.

 

I usually don't comment about the sex. But quite frankly, most guys aren't up for as much as they claim to be, especially on a 7-10 day trip. Many of them are also couples on a fairly short leash. It can be interesting because as the week progresses the leashes tend to get longer, or in fact snap!

[ZIPPER]

Guys:

 

I am going to try to reconcile my somewhat contradictory messages:

 

 

If you are perfectly comfortable walking into a trendy gay bar by yourself you will have a great time at Atlantis!

 

or

 

As a friend of mine said after winning the beer chugging contest, "There aren't twenty people here you can have an intelligent conversation with!"

[Atlcple]

After 14 gay cruises, both RSVP and Atlantis, our experience has been a combination of all of the comments mentioned above. OVERALL WE LOVE THEM and KEEP BOOKING MORE and MORE. Next one OCT Mexico on Atlantis.

 

Many of these cruises we have done with friends that we have encouraged to go with us. Depending on "where they are at in their life" there experience during that week reflects it. We have had friends that have gone and "blown it out big time and others that have "had more down time, reading a book, sunbathing and being low keyed", others have been up at the crack of dawn each morning so they could do "every execursion or workout, etc".

 

My lover of 14 years, never has nor ever will do drugs, nor does he drink much beyond one or two cocktails at a party. However, we do attend the dance parties and while some people are high...not everyone is and we have a great time!! We also like to do the execursions, have quiet time, go to the piano bar and to the nightly shows. For us, we vary what we chose to do throughout the week and that works for us. I guess what I am trying to say is that it can be whatever you want it to be.

 

I think a lot of people have this illusion that they are going to pay X amount of dollars, get on board and then they think it's up to Atlantis or RSVP to carefully orchestrate the week so that they have a good time. To some extent this is true and while they can offer many options/activities/events for the week, it's up to the individual to pick and chose, to put themselves out there to meet other people and to have a positive attitude. If you don't put yourself out there, especially on the larger cruises, you will feel isolated and you may not meet many people. A weeklong gay cruise is like a piece of clay, you can mold it into what ever you want it to be, but if you sit back and just stare at it, the clay is not going to take shape on it's own.

[CruisinMaterial]

Turning a blind eye to the goings on isn't a bad thing either. I agree with the poster who suggested that. Not everyone on board is in the sauna or streaking down the hallway (although, its funny you should mention... I did do that once... :rolleyes: ).. there is drug usage but that's every where and with partying going on... you know it'll be there... just come to expect that...

 

Now for the person who was wondering about single traveling with Atlantis... I'm single and have gone on four cruises with Atlantis single and have been blessed by the share room matching gods to get level-headed people and not party animals for roommates! That's a good start...

 

I would strongly suggest you read this carefully and make an assessment as Oslo had some issues with being attached to someone, he most likely (correct me if I'm wrong) didn't have the proper Atlantis singles event experience...

 

Atlantis does a host of meet and greets for singles, usually held by Malcolm in the early days of any Atlantis charter. Then you have the singles dinner where you switch tables around so you will meet loads of people and if you can't remember names, at least you'll know the familiar faces onboard to say hello too! It's not hell for single people. After all, are you expecting to come off the ship with a relationship? If you are, that's foolhearty to me. I've come off with great frienships and prospects that one would go further as we're still keeping in touch but distance got rid of that... neither here nor there... don't go on a cruise expecting to get married... you'll be sadly disappointed.

 

Bottom line: Sailing single with Atlantis is not a tragedy... there's plenty of events aimed at you for being single, your choice is whether to partake or frolick or do something else.

 

Now the comment on drinking... so long as you have a credit card that can support your PUNA intake then... PUNA!!! PUNA!!! to you!! :D

 

If you would like to know more about my singles experiences, hit me up... btw... I'm a little younger than some who've posted comments here on Atlantis so just so you could factor in the age... I'm 23.

 

Enjoy the cruise and I look forward to your review!

~Jake

Chairman of Nef. Activities - Star Princess 10/23

[rodraad]

Yes

 

I am reading this discussion very carefully

 

Having attended the last two European cruises and had the time of my life

 

I am also very worried that Atlantis has made the mistake of their lives switching from Celebrity to Royal Caribbean. I pray Atlantis will see that their clientele don't want to leave Celebrity whatsoever and return to Celebrity for other cruises to 2007.

 

The key success factors I believe that made the trip was the Atlantis entertainment and the quality of Celebrity.

 

Highlights for me were

 

Pam Ann (Rich if you ever drop Pam Ann I will fly to LA and hit you on the head), Shawn Carr, the hypnotist

 

2004: Belinda Carlisyle - who brought great music into my life and a blast from the past

 

2005: Jackie Beat, Dixie Longate & Pippi

 

And the ports my favorites were

 

2004: Athens for the Olympics & Rhodes

 

2005: Ibiza and that spirited club Space and perfect Es Cavallet beach, Tuscany and that fun beach resort I visted Viareggio, Eternal Rome and the magnificent pasta I had for lunch (I retraced the mystical Angels and Demons experience and joined the Illuminati), and that perfect orange juice I drank in Santorini, exotic Istanbul - being welcomed by a Turkish band & the exotic adventure of the merging of Asia and Europe

 

 

As a single person I did not meet the man of my life on either of these cruises:( :( :( And I knicknamed the pool deck "the Attitude" Deck. I dont take my shirt off during the day. But most of the "Attitudes" on this ship would last five minutes on the rugby pitch.. so there!!! :)

 

The first year I had a roommate.. well to say the least we were two different people .. oh well its a big ship you spend very little time in the room

 

This year I had a great roommate

 

This year I confidently have booked the Rio cruise

and look forward to the adventure. I believe Oceania is a good line

 

albeit hoping Atlantis will return to Celebrity for future cruises

[CRSNDC]

Rodraad,

 

Just a point of clarification- Atlantis has used three Celebrity ships this year... Constellation in March, Millenium in July, and Infinity in August. And they are using the Infinity again in March 2006.

 

As to you calling the pool deck the "attitude deck" I find that sad. I find that no matter what appearance guys give off if you are friendly to them they will be friendly back. I guess I have more self confidence than some but when I'm on a ship of 2000+ men I'm not gonna sit in the corner. I'm 40, 5"10, 210, hairy, single, and will definately take my shirt off at the pool on the Radiance next month. But that's just me.

 

-Chris in DC

[ZIPPER]

Bruce MacDonald, the gay hypnotist, used to give a very good seminar on self-hypnosis for stress reduction. I went to it in PV in '98, but I haven't seen him offer it since, I don't know if he does on the cruises. If he does offer it I would highly recommend it both for it's content, but also as a way of meeting other singles. A lot of these guys you see sitting by themselves often turn out to be highly educated professionals who can't relate to the endless "sticky floor" jokes. They're out there but they are often scattered, and Bruce's seminar is the only place I can think of that brings the professionals together, as opposed to bears, or guys from Dallas etc. If Bruce doesn't offer the seminar and anyone is interested I know he lives in SF and has a web site.

 

Being a gay event, inevitably the queens will push their way to center stage and the pretty boys will be on a pedestal. That's a given. But that doesn't mean there can't be a lot of thriving sub-cultures. I've tried to promote Atlantis to more guys who are professional or are interested in more of a gay adventure travel experience (generally separate crowds). My frustration is that I meet a lot of these guys at Atlantis, but inevitably they don't come back. With more of a critical mass, I think you would see more diverse sub-cultures. These are things that people are going to have to conciously make an effort at. Rich Campbell generally does all he can to come up with new ideas. I'm sure any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

To some extent everybody gay had their own acceptance problems. Shann Carr can't get hired on by the lesbians because she isn't sufficiently butch. Likewise, when she was at Gay Ski Aspen she had to learn to ski by herself because she couldn't find anyone to go skiing. I guess that's life!

[NotHimAgain]

I was on the same cruise as Oslo but I don't recognize it from his description. Of course, the death of a parent and realization that your new love interest is a total jerk would ruin anyone's vacation.

 

This was my first gay cruise and I travelled alone. The food and the entertainment were both terrible, but the passengers were great - very warm, friendly, and interesting. I did not encounter any rudeness or attitude.

 

I didn't see any drug use or notice anyone who was obviously under the influence of drugs. I just saw a lot of guys having fun.

 

The bathhouse factor was there if you went looking for it in the sauna and steamroom, but that was less than ten percent of the passengers. I did not see "sex all over the place" or any sex in the pools or jacuzzis and did not see anyone running down the halls naked.

 

There is a lot Atlantis could do to make their cruises better, but contrary to Zipper's post I don't think they are interested. Their cruises sell out and they only have one direct competitor. At Ask Atlantis Anything, Rich and his assistant were very defensive and did not take responsibility for anyone's complaints, instead blaming the cruise line or denying that the mentioned problem existed.

 

Most guys were in their 40's or 50's, with a significant number over 60. Almost none under 30 that I noticed. Frequent Atlantis cruisers commented that the average age was much higher than usual. All body types and everyone I met was at least polite if not friendly. For me, it was a great cruise to go solo. I didn't want it to end.

 

One of the best parts was meeting so many couples who have been together for 10, 15, or 20 plus years. It renewed my hope for myself and for the community.

 

I would definitely do an Atlantis cruise again and would recommend it to anyone, but it was the gathering of 2000 gay men on vacation that made it great for me, not the ship, not the food, and certainly not the entertainment.

[HotlantaCruiser]

I will admit that I was not on the recent Med cruise, so I can't comment on what happened, but I have been to many (8-9) of the Ask Atlantis Anything sessions. Before anyone runs with that last poster's comment about Rich's actions at the "Ask Atlantis Anything" session, you should know something about how that dynamic operates.

 

Rich and usually 1-3 others of his team (Glenn, Steve, Don) put themselves in front of anyone who will show up and they answer any and all questions for an hour. Usually there are about 20-30 people (out of 2000 pax). The audience is almost always made up of the same 2 types of people. A small cadre of first time Atlantis cruisers, and a large group of Repeat (10-20 times) cruisers who are either Travel Agents or Drama Mary's who have to be the center of attention. You know the types, big pinky rings, oversized sunglasses, snappable fan, and if they could have brought their Lincoln on the ship they would.

 

The first timers ask the typical questions you would expect (how did you get started, where are going next, etc), are usually scared to ask a question, and Rich does a very very good job of making sure that the other group (see below) doesn't dominate the questions. Rich picks between the two so as to make sure that all get a chance to ask their questions. He usually gets the "how do you compare Atlantis to RSVP" question, and I have never heard him utter a disparaging word about the competition.

 

The other group usually start their question with a trite complement to the (ship, Atlantis, staff, something), then most always get into a 5 minute monologue/diatribe about something that happened to them personally on this cruise (didn't get towel animals, or some immaterial issue), that is almost always a cruise line issue, and not an Atlantis issue. Then they announce the death of Rich's business if he doesn't fix said problem, as they have "X" number of year's in the travel business, know "XX" many more people who feel the same way, and demand to know what Rich is going to do about this. Then they continue to drone on and on, while Rich is trying to begin to answer their question.

 

I've seen this play out time and time again. The above post didn't mention exactly what Atlantis deffered to by "blaming the cruise line" or "denied the mentioned problem existed", but I'm willing to bet that Rich was right. The typical complaints center around Hotel operations (room, stewards, etc) that Atlantis doesn't control, or shore excursions (again, outside of Rich's control). The one complaint that Atlantis gets (and deserves) is the lack of organization in the reservations office related to travel documents. I understand what it takes for Rich's team to get that stuff out, but by now they should have it down to an art, and they don't.

 

That session is very much like Cruise Critic. You get someone who doesn't understand the real (business) world, has an issue, and then finds an opportunity and a soapbox.

 

I think LVMedia Boy summed it up. If you go looking for this stuff, you'll find it. Just like you would in any dance club in any major city on a Saturday night. Also, the cruise is not solely about the parties, there is usually alternate entertainment going on during the evening parties, at least until 12:30 (hypnotist show, cabaret bar, special performers, etc). There is always alternative activity during the afternoon parties.

[ZIPPER]

I have to give Atlantis a lot of credit for trying to accommodate their guests. I was surprised to read about how they offer ballroom dancing on their cruises, at the PV orientation they asked if anyone played golf because one guy was looking for partners, and in Cancun they offered a lecture on the Mayan indians (which I didn't attend), that is diversity. But more importantly, on the Atlantis Alumnae board I recently read a very moving post about a guy who apparently is a quadraplegic who is willing to pay someone's cruise fare in return for help with eating, grooming, and getting in and out of bed. He also made it clear that after that he was on his own and there were plenty of things on the trip to keep him entertained. Now to get a testimonial like that says they must be doing something right. Likewise, who can forget the guy who attended the first Atlantis event and every one since then up until his death a few years ago at the age of 98!

 

Then there was my dinner in Cancun. Being on my own, I generally solve the "who to dine with problem" by wondering the dining room until I find someone interesting to sit with. This time I came upon a goodlooking, friendly guy who invited me to sit at the last open seat at a table of eight, the other six people being off in the buffet line. As it turns out this guy was the hotel manager, and without realizing it I was sitting at the Atlantis staff table, and as is turns out I was sitting next to Mr. Rich Campbell. When Rich shows up it is real clear that he is not happy about my being there and proceeds to do what no one ever has done to me at an Atlantis event which is to give me massive, total attitude. The first fifteen minutes, I don't thing he even looked at me. It was real clear that his intention was to have dinner with the hotel manager, and everyone else was to be seen and not heard. This didn't happen. Being as how I am no shrinking violet, the hotel manager was worldly and fascinating, and there was another guy at the table who although being quite young, and very cute, knew a hell of a lot about resort project development. Well Rich promptly lost control of the conversation and the rest of us had a wide ranging conversation covering everything for the details of south american politics to development opportunities in Cancun. The rest of us tried to keep the conversation light-hearted, while Rich tended toward the strident. All in all it was one of the most interesting conversations I've had in year, and Rich did appologize to me the next day.

 

Rich is Rich, what can you say. He's every bit as intense as he looks, but at the same time Atlantis can be an incredible experience. I can only imagine the grief he has endured creating his business and he is certainly entitled to the success.