Good Bye Celebrity

[Pandora1958]

Are you on the 1 July cruise??

 

Lynne

[Pandora1958]

Connie's Paris is LeHarve, a good 3 hour bus ride from Paris. Just completed the transatlantic with them...

 

Lynne

[KevBew]

Ingrid, LOVE THAT IDEA! I am really wondering why X has developed this sttitude of customer be damned? I am on the 11/19 and I vote for the jeans and flip flops on first formal night!

[ingrid295]

KevBew,

 

Not sure I have the guts to try to pull that one off... I guess I'm a conformist at heart... it would be a funny turn of the tables, but it would be punishing the wrong people -- the staff -- who have nothing to do with the itinerary change.

 

 

Let's see if/how Hanrahan or Rice respond to our letters... If I were booking today, I would opt for the Golden Princess out of San Juan on 11/19 also doing the Southern Caribbean. The itinerary is more what I expected when I booked.

[OTRlady]

Just received an email from one of the travel discounters advertising the Constellation's 12/3 cruise for a DEEPLY discounted rate which includes everything - cruise, airfare, port charges, taxes and transfers.... ($800 for everything). Ingrid.

 

Very interesting turn of events. Now I feel lucky that things turned out as they did for me. At least I didn't have to go through this experience.

 

Last December, I was scanning for a new cruise and latched onto the 12/3 & 12/10 Connie itineraries. But the best thing was the price--$800 for a balcony room, including port charges, taxes, etc. (not airfare, though). Because we were waiting to see if friends would be able to arrange their vacations to come with us, we delayed booking. When I finally got a 'nay' from the friends, I went to book us in June, and that's when I found out about Celebrity's new pricing policies. The fares for the exact same trip had more than doubled. Reluctantly, because I REALLY wanted that itinerary, I booked on the Golden Princess instead. The itineraries for 11/26 & 12/3 are nearly the same as the Connie's original itinerary (missing Casa de Campo & Dominica, advertised Caracas instead of Isla Margarita.) Best thing: the price was less than half the new Connie price.

 

I'm still not quite reconciled to losing the Dominica stop, but like many of you, I save for a long time and need to plan ahead for costs. So, though we really wanted to try Celebrity, we are getting used to the idea of Princess instead.

 

So sorry for all of you that have been caught up in this itinerary change. For those that might want to try and switch--albeit last minute, here are the Golden Princess' two southern Caribbean itineraries. They are pretty similar, so may be an acceptable compromise for some. They don't alternate, exactly, so check the web site for which one on which weeks.

 

11/26/05 to 12/3/05 - Depart San Juan, sea day, Barbados, St. Lucia, Antigua, St. Maarten, St. Thomas, arrive San Juan

 

12/3/05 to 12/10/05 - Depart San Juan, St. Thomas, St. Kitts, Grenada, Isla Margarita, Aruba, sea day, arrive San Juan

 

**Note that Isla Margarita has been semi-permanently substituted for the Caracas stop.

 

When I last spoke to my TA in early September, both of these weeks were supposedly sold out, but I have been hearing about recent cancellations due to Katrina & Rita. Good luck to all, whatever you choose. If any of you end up on either of these weeks, we have roll calls going, and we're dying to hear from more fellow cruisers. We would welcome you.

[new_cruiser]

For those that might want to try and switch--albeit last minute, here are the Golden Princess' two southern Caribbean itineraries. They are pretty similar, so may be an acceptable compromise for some. They don't alternate, exactly, so check the web site for which one on which weeks.

 

11/26/05 to 12/3/05 - Depart San Juan, sea day, Barbados, St. Lucia, Antigua, St. Maarten, St. Thomas, arrive San Juan

 

Those are the same ports Connie was doing when went (Dec 2003). We really enjoyed that itinerary. Nice cultural variety and plenty of nice snorkeling. However, I doubt any of the November December folks are in a positition to switch.

[new_cruiser]

Ingrid, LOVE THAT IDEA! I am really wondering why X has developed this sttitude of customer be damned? I am on the 11/19 and I vote for the jeans and flip flops on first formal night!

That seems silly. It would only punish your shipmates (both passengers and crew) who aren't responsible for the change. The people back at the office who plan the itinerary wouldn't be affected at all. The suggestion to try to minimize your extra ship charges during these cruises makes more sense to me - though that only works to the extent that you can do it and still enjoy the cruise.

 

To those who say "ports change, get over it". Yes, ports can change, but if the company gets in the habit of making undesireable port changes without good reason (like weather or safety) or just in the company's financial interest after people are locked into the cruise then it is reasonable to not want to do business with that company anymore. There are a lot of ports in that area. Even if Grenada is not available for some reason, it seems like they could have come up with better alternatives for the passengers then the itinerary that is showing now.

 

The reason I have booked cruises that originate in the Southern Caribbean in the past rather than cruises out of Maimi is that the ports and port times are so much better that way. Probably a lot of the other people who chose these cruises are also people who rate itinerary as important.

[new_cruiser]

Andy, you have brought up some of the same points that I and others have been making on various threads. It's not so much the changes as the timing and the lack of explanation. While most of us seem to be in agreement that we booked mainly for Grenada, we would have been less disappointed if St. Lucia or St. Maarten, for example, were the substitute. And the reason for losing four hours in Casa de Campo, especially for those who were hoping to play golf or participate in some other daytime excursion, continues to be a mystery.

When they are at Casa de Campo, don't they do a day excursion to Catalina Island? It would be nice if something could be arranged the other direction for the golfers and others who would like daylight hours in Case de Campo.

 

However, I agree that it is a mystery why they are arriving so late in Casa de Campo. It is a relatively short distance that the ship has to cover.

[adegner]

I just want to make one comment. Please don't blame the staff on the ships for RCI's customer service and corporate port decisions. I'm sure the shipboard staff will do everything they can to make your cruise experience fantasic.

 

I would continue to write to the head of customer service and maybe they will change their ways. It is the only way we can fight this. Good luck.

[sacway]

Great posts, all. And thanks, Host Andy, for your comments.

 

We wouldn't have known about the change without the CC boards -- first saw it on the Roll Call board, then came over here to get more of the full scoop. Any idea what percentage of TA's are calling their clients to say "guess what, your cruise that you've paid for in full, has changed into something quite different"? (imagine it's pretty low and not to beat up on TAs, they have a so many things to do in order to maintain a viable business) So thanks to CC for this intel. We've put our money where our mouth is, which is why we are taking our December trip on the Golden Princess (which has the same itinerary on 12/17, I think, as on 12/10, plenty good enough for us Southern Sunshine Seekers.) Even if the Grenada problem is "catching" we'll still have Aruba and a taste of Venezuela, highly unlikely we'll take a circle tour of DR.

 

Agree, any day cruising is a great day. But it's a highly competitive industry and it's reasonable for us to choose not just based on marketing promises, but also based on past and present actions directed toward us as customers. And frankly, in this era of "branding" I can't imagine much worse for a brand than the reputation of hiding information that your customers believe is important, leaving the impression you don't want them to find out before its too late to make a change. Plus, there's an economic value differential between "we are probably going to make a stop in Grenada" to "we now say we aren't going to stop anywhere near Grenada but maybe maybe we might make a change from going nowhere to going somewhere nice so don't worry be happy" I am willing to pay a different price for the former than the latter.

 

Again, the question is not the itinerary change per se, it's the way management is choosing to operate right now in 2005 vis-a-vis the customers who buy its products. X is committed to use of web-based automation about so many other things, why can't they include a web tab on the public home page that provides up-to-date notices (even though you can bring up a specific week's cruise and see the current itinerary, there's no flagging of changes).

 

As for Nov/Dec cruisers changing, the non-refundable amount increases in tiers. Because the prices are a bit higher on X, losing the initial deposit (early Dec cruisers' situation) turns out to be a smaller bite than first appears in making a jump to the Golden Princess. The bigger problem might be availability on these ships, though it was really easy for us to rebook last week (the Princess booking engine seems to be unavailable right now, so can't tell what's left). We've always enjoyed San Juan, you could probably find a hotel room for a week, drive around the island, make your own "shore excursions" modeled on the ones offered by X, eat the great local food, gamble in the local casinos, hit the beaches and the shops. One gets the impression sometimes that the cabin prices are almost "lost leaders" so we'll get on board to drink, gamble, shop, spend -- heck you might as well offer those dollars to a more grateful supplier of goodies.

 

Regardless of each's choice, I know X cruisers are a fun and inventive crowd. The "civil disobedience" in the restaurant concept is clever. If it'll make you feel better, you could all blow your whistles during the fire drill, too.

[JDSTURTZ]

I sent an e-mail to Mandoo asking if he had any information on the gov't banning X from entering port. This was his response:

 

"Dear don.

 

Thanks for your info. we just went through 2 hurricane, the economy has collapse, we need every ship we can get. that does not make any sense. I am in contact with the govt people and the ship agent everyday.

 

mandoo"

 

Sure doesn't sound like this was Grenada's decision.

[canderson]

 

Sure doesn't sound like this was Grenada's decision.

Maybe yes, maybe no. Last time we were in Grenada, they were limiting the number of ships per day that they would allow there and adding as they felt they were able to support more. Perhaps they've continued/reinstated their limits again. If so, who knows what sort of 'lottery' they're using to sort out who gets to port and who doesn't.

 

Last December, we didn't even port there due to local conditions (I believe it was 2/day at that time), and things were still really rough when we were there this last April.

[KevBew]

That seems silly. It would only punish your shipmates (both passengers and crew) who aren't responsible for the change.

I didn't ask nor do I care what you think is silly. It's my vacation. Should I decide to display my unhappiness with the decision to alter my vacation after it's too late to get a refund in a way I feel is appropriate, it is NONE OF YOUR CONCERN! Make your point without sounding like you know what's best for ALL.

[zelker]

We're on the Connie Thanksgiving, only our second cruise (first one last year on HAL), and not very happy with what's going on. I won't bore you with the full two pages of our letter to Hanrahan and Rice.... just know that the frustrations expressed on this web site were repeated in it. But here's the last paragraph - of which I must say I am quite proud!

 

"Tell me truthfully, Mr. Hanrahan, if you had ordered and paid for a Porsche and you received a Volkswagen instead – and the dealer told you that both cars are manufactured by the same company so in fact, you are still getting what you paid for (a car with an engine, 4 tires, seats, windows, etc.) – would that be acceptable to you?"

 

------------

 

Perhaps even more ironic -- and appropriate -- though is the fact that last week was National Customer Service Week! What were the chances??!! Therefore, to make our point even more blatantly, we included the following as an addendum to the letter:

 

National Customer Service Week – A Proclamation

 

In a thriving free enterprise system such as ours, which provides consumers with a wide range of goods and services from which to choose, the most successful businesses are those that display a strong commitment to customer satisfaction. Today foreign competition as well as consumer demands are requiring greater corporate efficiency and productivity. If the United States is to remain a leader in the changing global economy, highest quality customer service must be a personal goal of every employee in business and industry.

 

A business built on customer service understands and anticipates the customer's needs. It designs goods and services to meet those needs and builds products that perform to customer expectations. It then packages them carefully, labels them correctly, sells them at a fair price, delivers them as scheduled, and follows up, as necessary, to satisfy the customer. This kind of commitment to service leads to customer loyalty and to genuine improvements at the bottom line.

 

A business will do a better job of providing high quality goods and services by listening to its employees and by empowering them with opportunities to make a difference. Customer service professionals work in the front lines where a firm meets its customers; where supply meets demand. With responsive policies and procedures and with simple courtesy, customer service professionals can go a long way toward ensuring customer satisfaction and eliciting the next round of orders and purchases.

 

The Congress, by Senate Joint Resolution 166, has designated the week of October 4 through October 10, 1992, as "National Customer Service Week" and requested the President to issue a proclamation in observance of this week.

 

NOW, THEREFORE, I, GEORGE BUSH, President of the United States of America, do hereby proclaim the week of October 4 through October 10, 1992, as National Customer Service Week. I invite all Americans to observe this week with appropriate programs and activities.

 

IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this eighth day of October, in the year of our Lord nineteen hundred and ninety-two, and of the Independence of the United States of America the two hundred and seventeenth.

 

George Bush

 

---------------

 

National Customer Service Week is always celebrated the first full week of October. This year, it's October 3 - 7, 2005. Started by the International Customer Service Association in 1988, it has become a national event as proclaimed by the U.S. Congress. According to the ICSA, the purpose of National Customer Service Week is "to create a positive message that lasts all year long and to provide a productive opportunity to generate an even stronger commitment to customer service excellence."

 

------------

 

And our final statement was "How timely. Perhaps Celebrity should embrace some of these tenets."

 

Guess we'll see if it strikes a chord with either of them!

 

Barb

[ingrid295]

Barb -- Pleased to hear another cruiser has written to Hanrahan. Don't know what the real issue here is... but as I posted earlier, RCL is engaged in a major stock re-purchase through January '06. They need all their cash to buy back stock... may be a coincidence, or it may be the underlying cause for so many itinerary changes and cheap, cost-effective substitutions...

 

We looked at the Golden Princess & would really like to switch if we can get a refund from Celebrity... TA says there are still staterooms available for that sailing. Celebrity's revised itinerary really leaves me cold. Not what I wanted for my vacation cruise & I would welcome a refund in time to switch to the Princess which leaves San Juan the same date & time as X.

 

Ingrid.

[KevBew]

I sent letters to Hanrahan and Rice to join the chorus of discontent so we'll see what happens.

 

I called X today to ask if they would offer a full refund since the change was made after final payment was received. I was informed they have no intention of allowing anyone a full refund as the cruise is still scheduled and only the itinerary has changed. CS rep repeated "the carriers right to alter the itinerary" line a couple of times.

 

I am pretty much resigned to the fact we are going to be on this itinerary regardless and to try to make the best of it as has been mentioned by previous posters. It is a great ship to be on. I guess the first three days will have to be considered "sea days" as there will be little if any excursions available after dark in CDC, and I'm not much of a "lay on the beach" type.

 

The rest of my family made the switch to Radisson this summer because they felt X has changed too much. My parents were on Meridien years ago and can't get over how much things have changed with RCCL running things. They were very happy with Rad and begged me to switch. Next year, hello Radisson, Goodbye Celebrity.

[ingrid295]

Thanks for writing KevBew & posting what you learned from Celebrity.

 

We're not beach people either, so the first 3 days will be sea days for us as well. We have 3 ports on a 7 day itinerary... St. Kitts, Barbados and St. Thomas. We'll make the best of it this time....... but Princess, Radisson or HAL... here we come.

 

It is indeed unfortunate, and disturbing, that X holds the attitude that they don't need to worry about repeat business.

 

Ingrid

[mr green]

I started a thread in March with the self same heading! Celebrity must learn that their 'Public Relations' are next to non existent! john

[DisneyDestroyer]

We're on the Connie Thanksgiving, only our second cruise (first one last year on HAL), and not very happy with what's going on. I won't bore you with the full two pages of our letter to Hanrahan and Rice.... just know that the frustrations expressed on this web site were repeated in it. But here's the last paragraph - of which I must say I am quite proud!

 

"Tell me truthfully, Mr. Hanrahan, if you had ordered and paid for a Porsche and you received a Volkswagen instead – and the dealer told you that both cars are manufactured by the same company so in fact, you are still getting what you paid for (a car with an engine, 4 tires, seats, windows, etc.) – would that be acceptable to you?"

 

Hah, that's great! I made the same argument recently (see here), except replace "Porche" and "VW" with "Mustang GT" and "Focus" respectively. I'm sure some schmuck on these boards will try to argue with you that Porche and VW are different brand names, but it's still the same principle - they sold you on something better, and you paid extra for it, then gave you less without any compensation or opportunity to refuse or actually get what you wanted in the first place.

 

It's two things.

 

First, it is expanding the meaning of this element of the contract past its initial purpose to protect the cruise line when they are forced to make a change. Now they exercise this willy-nilly, without sufficient cause. As far as I'm concerned, this power should be severely limited in terms of when it can be triggered and how the customer is compensated for these changes.

 

Second, it shows complete disrespect for the customer. From the timing of the change, to the notification regarding the change, to what change was selected, there appears to be no thought as to what is best for the passengers. There is no concern for any subsequent actions you may have taken based on their change - what about the poor passenger who doesn't hear until they get onboard and they lose their money on that private excursion to the rainforest?

 

ARGH!

[Host Karen]

DD, you bring up what is often an overlooked point. Lucky for all of us here that people post information and alert us to changes. Some of us are also lucky to have TAs who are on the ball and let us know when changes occur. I can't imagine what will happen when some passengers receive their cruise documents or -- as you mention -- arrive at the pier to find the itinerary has undergone significant changes and they didn't know about it in advance.

 

X needs to stick closer to the adage that "you get what you pay for." If a balcony on the original itinerary were $500 per passenger, I wouldn't be too disappointed if the schedule changed because I got a steal. However, this wasn't the case. I expect the service and food to be the same quality, but the itinerary is part of the package price and in lieu of any mechanical or weather related problems, the amenities are not worth the price we paid for the altered itinerary.

[ingrid295]

Good point.

 

I only found out about the itinerary change from reading these boards.... if I learned of the change when I received my documents in the mail, I would be calling like a mad dog...

 

Then again, we could all get "Where's Grenada?" tee shirts printed & wear them on board during the cruise... think that would convey the message?

 

Ingrid.

[seahorse]

I don`t know when any of you are sailing........don`t have time to read this thread:o

 

The Grenada port call will again be on.. Nov. 19/dec.3&17/Jan.14&28/Feb. 11&25/ Mar.11.

[ingrid295]

Seahorse, you should take the time to read the posts... the Nov. 19th itinerary has been changed. Grenada is no longer a stop on this itinerary.

[zelker]

Ingrid - Seahorse is CORRECT! Go to the X web site. As of 4:00pm Mountain Daylight Time, our original itinerary, down to arriving at DR at 1:00 instead of 5:00 is back!! Although I have my doubts if this will hold and until I step foot on each and every one of these islands I won't believe it!! :>P

 

Celebrity - stop messing with our heads!!!!

 

Barb

[ingrid295]

Anyone feeling brave enough to telephone X to see if the itinerary has truly been restored?

 

Ingrid.