Robbed in Jamaica on CCL excursion, story for sale on Ebay???

[halos]

I think a lesson one could learn from this situation (one among many) is that you should never believe anyone can guarantee your safety. I could invite you to my house for dinner, which is in a nice neighborhood with very little crime, but if I guarantee your safety you should be skeptical. There have been home invasions in beautiful neighborhoods that see very little crime (think the recent horrific home invasion in an affluent Connecticut neighborhood which resulted in multiple murders), airplanes have recently fallen out of the sky onto homes, killing innocent bystanders. It happens, rarely, but it happens.

 

No one can EVER guarantee your safety, anywhere, anytime. If a Carnival employee said this, at minimum he should probably receive extra training. But adults listening to this should also have called him to the carpet on just exactly how they were going to "guarantee" this safety. I'm not the most cynical person on the planet, but I would have found this claim to be a little over the top. That said, I'm not assigning any blame to the victims. In my view, the blame pretty much belongs to the criminals. Just MHO.

 

You're 100% right that no one can guarantee you safety (or anything else for that matter) but, I still think, even knowing this, IF I were on a ship, I'd trust the cruiseline if they were offering excursions and I booked with them, that THEY would be aware of the dangers. Every time I've taken a tour that was offered through the cruiseline, I went into it with the feeling that 'they know what they're doing.' Isn't that the point of booking through the line??? To me, booking through the line, is something I do when I'm going to a port that I'm not 100% comfortable with...I'm figuring that they'll keep us out of danger. I think in most places this is exactly what they do, but it seems that in Jamaica, there may not be ANY safe place to go...so my feeling on this is that the ships should discontinue this place as a port stop. If the cruiselines did this, the government or authorities or whom ever, would eventually be forced to do what needed to be done in order to get the tourists back.

[nrdsb4]

You're 100% right that no one can guarantee you safety (or anything else for that matter) but, I still think, even knowing this, IF I were on a ship, I'd trust the cruiseline if they were offering excursions and I booked with them, that THEY would be aware of the dangers. Every time I've taken a tour that was offered through the cruiseline, I went into it with the feeling that 'they know what they're doing.' Isn't that the point of booking through the line??? To me, booking through the line, is something I do when I'm going to a port that I'm not 100% comfortable with...I'm figuring that they'll keep us out of danger. I think in most places this is exactly what they do, but it seems that in Jamaica, there may not be ANY safe place to go...so my feeling on this is that the ships should discontinue this place as a port stop. If the cruiselines did this, the government or authorities or whom ever, would eventually be forced to do what needed to be done in order to get the tourists back.

 

I think you may be right about Jamaica. I don't argue that at all. However, no matter where you are, I just don't think blind faith should ever be placed in someone who "guarantees" safety, no matter what kind of uniform they are wearing or who they work for. This event proves exactly that. Obviously, there are going to be excursions that are "relatively safe." But there is no place where anyone can completely protect you. I have never had the mindset that I would book a tour through the cruiseline because it guaranteed my safety, more that it guaranteed me the ship would wait in the event my excursion was late. Recent threads have shown that to be a less than accurate assumption as well.

 

I am probably just more skeptical than most about these things. I was mugged and robbed at gunpoint years ago in an area that was sold to me as being "very safe." Now I know that there really is no place that is exempt from bad people, so if ever anyone told me an excursion was "perfectly safe," I would probably be questioning that.

 

It sounds as in this situation, not only did the CD make a silly promise about "guaranteeing" safety, he might actually have gone even further than that by withholding important information from the passengers. I agree with the victims here that a passenger has a reasonable expectation that they will not be carted unknowingly into a dangerous area.

[standby 06.30]

Actually on the other thread you asked 3 times, so you also qualify as a member of numerically challenged posters.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=11142488&postcount=816

I am, it was out of boredom waiting for you to respond to the same question, I repeat and I have lost count now, are you a carnival shareholder, simple yes, or no, dont be tangentle, dont bloviate, try once to answer a simple question with a simple answer,what have you to hide, or do you belong to the ethically challenged, I think you know the answer to both, that is 2 which follows 1 and preceeds 3, I wont go over 5 that may cause you to check, which would mean you would have to remove your other hand from its normal duties Sarge, keep it up you are helping, regards

[Sargent_Schultz]

I DO NOT CARE WHAT ANY FINE PRINT CONTRACT SAYS....IF THE CONTRACT SAYS THAT THEY ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR YOUR PERSONAL PROPERTY, BUT YOUR PROPERTY IS STOLEN BY A CRUISE LINE EMPLOYEE, SHOULD THEY SAY, "OH WELL, IT IS IN OUR CONTRACT, WE ARE NOT LIABLE".

.....................

 

You scenario of AIDS does not fit. By that, you are saying that if you do not participate, your chances are 0%. We were not participating and our chances were 100%.

 

......................

 

 

If I had property stolen I would say, sure glad I have insurance, or gee, maybe I should have purchased insurance. The cruise lines only have limited liability but do offer you insurance if you wish to purchase.

 

My scenario is perfectly valid.

 

Once you are a statistic, the odds are 100% that you are a statistic. It is possible to "predict" the past with certainty. It is a primary reason they don't allow betting on horse races that have already occurred.

 

No, Compton to Jamaica comparisons are not valid and not just because of population density.

 

But speaking of Compton, instead of screwing up other nations struggling with their own problems, why don't we do better job of fixing what is wrong with ours? If America could effectively deal with its drug addiction issues, poor countries like Jamaica wouldn't get caught in the middle. Since we can't (or so far haven't been able to) we choose to blame anyone other than ourselves.

[Sargent_Schultz]

I am, it was out of boredom waiting for you to respond to the same question, I repeat and I have lost count now, are you a carnival shareholder, simple yes, or no, dont be tangentle, dont bloviate, try once to answer a simple question with a simple answer,what have you to hide, or do you belong to the ethically challenged, I think you know the answer to both, that is 2 which follows 1 and preceeds 3, I wont go over 5 that may cause you to check, which would mean you would have to remove your other hand from far more important duties Sarge, keep it up you are helping, regards

 

How do you keep a moron in suspense?

[halos]

I am probably just more skeptical than most about these things. I was mugged and robbed at gunpoint years ago in an area that was sold to me as being "very safe." Now I know that there really is no place that is exempt from bad people, so if ever anyone told me an excursion was "perfectly safe," I would probably be questioning that.

 

There ya go.

Perceptions and experience mean everything in life.

You have to understand that people like yourself who have had scary experiences like that are more apt to be 'street smart'. I grew up in a big city and have some street smarts, but I have never experienced what you have so I wouldn't be as skeptical as you...or as wise in matters such as safety. Where I live now, people have NO clue as to what dangers lurk outside their mega-safe environment....it's people like this, that have no concept that are in danger of being mislead. The cruiselines need to take responsibility. Not everyone has the 'advantage' of being hardened.

[standby 06.30]

How do you keep a moron in suspense?

I dont know, but I of course bow to your first hand knowledge, dont keep that second hand too busy, repetative strain injuries do affect the brain,but of course you probably have both hands (thats 2) knowledge of that, you little shareholder you, keep it up you are doing O K regards

[Sargent_Schultz]

I dont know,

 

They never do.

[Sargent_Schultz]

There ya go.

Perceptions and experience mean everything in life.

You have to understand that people like yourself who have had scary experiences like that are more apt to be 'street smart'. I grew up in a big city and have some street smarts, but I have never experienced what you have so I wouldn't be as skeptical as you...or as wise in matters such as safety. Where I live now, people have NO clue as to what dangers lurk outside their mega-safe environment....it's people like this, that have no concept that are in danger of being mislead. The cruiselines need to take responsibility. Not everyone has the 'advantage' of being hardened.

 

I disagree that it is the cruise line's job to maintain a sheltered existence for someone. Not everyone, as in most people, don't have the means to live in a gated, patrolled, white bread world. The cruise lines tell you to investigate and even how to investigate and leave it up to you to decide.

[Sargent_Schultz]

For those who thought the Department of State was not aware Jamaica existed, they have issued a warning:

 

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/tw/tw_3768.html

 

This information is current as of today, document.write(Date()+".") Fri Aug 17 19:10:39 2007.

JAMAICA AND THE CAYMAN ISLANDS

 

August 17, 2007

This Travel Warning is being issued to urge U.S. citizens to carefully consider the risks of travel to Jamaica and the Cayman Islands at this time due to the threat posed by Hurricane Dean. The Department of State has authorized the departure of non-emergency personnel and eligible family members of the U.S. Embassy in Kingston, Jamaica. The storm is predicted to pass over Jamaica and the Cayman Islands on August 19.

 

 

The U.S. Embassy in Kingston will be available over the weekend for emergency American Citizens Services, but may be forced to suspend operations without notice. U.S. citizens in areas likely to be impacted by Hurricane Dean who do not have access to adequate and safe shelter should consider departing until the storm has passed while commercial flights are still available. Seating capacity on commercial flights is extremely limited. Flights into and out of Kingston and Montego Bay international airports, and the Grand Cayman Airport may be suspended at any time. If staying in Jamaica or the Cayman Islands, U.S. citizens are urged to locate shelter, monitor media reports, and follow all official instructions. Visitors to Jamaica or the Cayman Islands should be familiar with their hotel or cruise ship evacuation plans, policies, or procedures. Please see the Caribbean Public Announcement regarding hurricane season dated August 16, 2007, on the Department’s website at www.travel.state.gov.

 

 

U.S. citizens should carry their travel documents (i.e. U.S. Passport, Birth Certificate, picture ID’s, etc.) with them at all times or secure them by placing them in a safe, waterproof location. Additionally, all American citizens in the area are reminded to stay in contact with friends and family in the United States to keep them apprised of their current whereabouts.

Americans living or traveling in Jamaica or the Cayman Islands are encouraged to register with the U.S. Embassy through the State Department’s travel registration website, https://travelregistration.state.gov.

 

 

Updated information on travel in Jamaica or the Cayman Islands may be obtained from the Department of State by calling 1-888-407-4747 within the United States, or from overseas, 1-202-501-4444. For further information please consult the Consular Information Sheets for Jamaica and the Cayman Islands available via the Internet at http://travel.state.gov or contact the U.S. Embassy in Kingston at (876) 702-6000, after hours (876) 702-6055.

 

 

---------------------------------------

 

Nothing about murders, rapes, etc. as it should be, because nothing along that line is warranted.

[mamaskittles]

For those who thought the Department of State was not aware Jamaica existed, they have issued a warning:

 

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/tw/tw_3768.html

 

This information is current as of today, document.write(Date()+".") Fri Aug 17 19:10:39 2007.

JAMAICA AND THE CAYMAN ISLANDS

 

August 17, 2007

This Travel Warning is being issued to urge U.S. citizens to carefully consider the risks of travel to Jamaica and the Cayman Islands at this time due to the threat posed by Hurricane Dean. The Department of State has authorized the departure of non-emergency personnel and eligible family members of the U.S. Embassy in Kingston, Jamaica. The storm is predicted to pass over Jamaica and the Cayman Islands on August 19.

 

 

The U.S. Embassy in Kingston will be available over the weekend for emergency American Citizens Services, but may be forced to suspend operations without notice. U.S. citizens in areas likely to be impacted by Hurricane Dean who do not have access to adequate and safe shelter should consider departing until the storm has passed while commercial flights are still available. Seating capacity on commercial flights is extremely limited. Flights into and out of Kingston and Montego Bay international airports, and the Grand Cayman Airport may be suspended at any time. If staying in Jamaica or the Cayman Islands, U.S. citizens are urged to locate shelter, monitor media reports, and follow all official instructions. Visitors to Jamaica or the Cayman Islands should be familiar with their hotel or cruise ship evacuation plans, policies, or procedures. Please see the Caribbean Public Announcement regarding hurricane season dated August 16, 2007, on the Department’s website at www.travel.state.gov.

 

 

U.S. citizens should carry their travel documents (i.e. U.S. Passport, Birth Certificate, picture ID’s, etc.) with them at all times or secure them by placing them in a safe, waterproof location. Additionally, all American citizens in the area are reminded to stay in contact with friends and family in the United States to keep them apprised of their current whereabouts.

Americans living or traveling in Jamaica or the Cayman Islands are encouraged to register with the U.S. Embassy through the State Department’s travel registration website, https://travelregistration.state.gov.

 

 

Updated information on travel in Jamaica or the Cayman Islands may be obtained from the Department of State by calling 1-888-407-4747 within the United States, or from overseas, 1-202-501-4444. For further information please consult the Consular Information Sheets for Jamaica and the Cayman Islands available via the Internet at http://travel.state.gov or contact the U.S. Embassy in Kingston at (876) 702-6000, after hours (876) 702-6055.

 

 

---------------------------------------

 

Nothing about murders, rapes, etc. as it should be, because nothing along that line is warranted.

 

I am just curious as to why you seem to be so angered by this gentleman posting about his experience in Jamaica. We all know it happened, and everyone (exception you) has appreciated his personal reasons for wanting to warn other travelers about things that did happen to him, and could happen to others. I read no where that he said "do not go to Jamaica". He seems to be honestly trying to share his first person knowledge with others. There is some old saying about learning history so as not to repeat it.

I am sure Jamaica is lovely and I would love to see it. I will someday and I will also be much more aware of my surroundings and plan accordingly thanks to Mr. Williams.

I would have also believed that the tour sold by the cruise was safer than a private tour. I would have also believed that they couldn't tell me that if it wasn't true.

The cruise lines know all about the crime in the areas they visit, it just isn't financially in their best interest to provide that info to the guests.

I seriously doubt that if asked now regarding a tour in Jamaica any CD on any cruise would declare any tour as completely safe. If I am correct than Mr. Williams has achieved his goal. So where is the problem.

[Vanessa L]

I am just curious as to why you seem to be so angered by this gentleman posting about his experience in Jamaica. We all know it happened, and everyone (exception you) has appreciated his personal reasons for wanting to warn other travelers about things that did happen to him, and could happen to others. I read no where that he said "do not go to Jamaica". He seems to be honestly trying to share his first person knowledge with others. There is some old saying about learning history so as not to repeat it.

I am sure Jamaica is lovely and I would love to see it. I will someday and I will also be much more aware of my surroundings and plan accordingly thanks to Mr. Williams.

I would have also believed that the tour sold by the cruise was safer than a private tour. I would have also believed that they couldn't tell me that if it wasn't true.

The cruise lines know all about the crime in the areas they visit, it just isn't financially in their best interest to provide that info to the guests.

I seriously doubt that if asked now regarding a tour in Jamaica any CD on any cruise would declare any tour as completely safe. If I am correct than Mr. Williams has achieved his goal. So where is the problem.

 

Speaking from the position of being a mental health professional mamaskittles, you can rest assured this has nothing to do with Mr. Williams. People like shultz have many, many issues that therapy can help. But until they realize they have a problem will continue to prey on others. This is why I suggested that Mr. Williams back off. When you are dealing with true mental illness, there is no rational thinking. We would all do well to ignore this type of post.

[mamaskittles]

Speaking from the position of being a mental health professional mamaskittles, you can rest assured this has nothing to do with Mr. Williams. People like shultz have many, many issues that therapy can help. But until they realize they have a problem will continue to prey on others. This is why I suggested that Mr. Williams back off. When you are dealing with true mental illness, there is no rational thinking. We would all do well to ignore this type of post.

 

Thank you that makes more sense than anything he has written.:)

[pjtulsa]

I was sailing on the Conquest in Oct. 06 with 5 teens. In Jamacia My husband took the 4 boys white water rafting with no problems. I took my daughter tubing and were in this van with only a Grandfather 65yrs old and his 14 yr old daughter. We got about a mile from the port and the van began to overheat, we sat there for 1 hour in the sweltering heat and the driver wouldnt let us get out of the van for safety!!!!! He kept calling for another pickup but no one came. When we returned to the ship I contacted the CD & The Customer Service desk if thats what you want to call it, to report a problem with the excursion we went on. To say the least they simply were not interested! The sent me a form letter that briefly explained thier liablilty... or for better words,,,Lack of Liability.

 

If nothing else, they should have acknowled there was a problem & that they would look into it. I do think there should be some kind of compensation. They are selling the pasengers a service which they are making a profit on and if that service is not provided they should be held accountable. I agree with many others, I wont get off the ship in Jamacia again!

 

We were also in Panama on the Carnival Spirit several years ago when a passenger was stabbed 2 blocks from the port. In Carnival's defense they did warn us NOT to leave the gated area unless you were on an excursion but after reading this story and my own experience you cant depend on the safety of thier excursions either.

[Sargent_Schultz]

Prey on others? How? By my (and others) attempts to defend a nation not present to defend itself?

 

Carnival clearly states that they cannot guarantee the guest's safety at anytime in any port. What part of that is so hard to understand?

 

I have no problem with KW telling his story and it should certainly not be covered up. But the statistics he likes to keep quoting are not applicable to the incident nor to tourists in Jamaica in general.

 

The problem is that many people, for whatever reason, seem to accept as gospel anything they read on the Internet including Cruise Critic. I don't want them to think they will be murdered as soon as they get off the ship because they won't be. Too many times I have read on Cruise Critic of people heeding advice they had read, only to discover it was not true.

 

Carnival states where you can find reliable information including the Department of State.

 

If you look on the Department of State's website they have information on US Citizen Deaths from Non-Natural Causes by Foreign Country.

 

In Jamaica, so far in 2007 they list 10 deaths. 5 from drowning, 3 from automobile accidents, 1 from other accident and 1 homicide. Homicide does not necessarily indicate murder and certainly doesn't indicate cruise ships. Cruise ships only stay for a few hours and not overnight. 1 homicide per how many hundreds of thousands of cruise ship visitors? Last year there were over 1.3 million cruise ship passengers (over 3 million total) and the number has been growing annually for some time.

 

I will even quote my sources:

http://www.carnival.com/CMS/Static_Templates/ticket_contract.aspx

http://travel.state.gov/family/family_issues/death/death_594.html

http://www.investjamaica.com/sectors/tourism/stats.php

 

Check out some of the other countries if you think Jamaica is risky.

 

Unlike others who insist on interpreting the numbers for you, I prefer you to use your brain. Sort of what Carnival is also suggesting you do.

 

If trying to get people to think rationally and objectively indicates I have mental issues, well, so be it.

[standby 06.30]

Speaking from the position of being a mental health professional mamaskittles, you can rest assured this has nothing to do with Mr. Williams. People like shultz have many, many issues that therapy can help. But until they realize they have a problem will continue to prey on others. This is why I suggested that Mr. Williams back off. When you are dealing with true mental illness, there is no rational thinking. We would all do well to ignore this type of post.

Thank you for the advice regards

[standby 06.30]

Speaking from the position of being a mental health professional mamaskittles, you can rest assured this has nothing to do with Mr. Williams. People like shultz have many, many issues that therapy can help. But until they realize they have a problem will continue to prey on others. This is why I suggested that Mr. Williams back off. When you are dealing with true mental illness, there is no rational thinking. We would all do well to ignore this type of post.

Thank you for your advise regards

[bunting]

 

The problem is that many people, for whatever reason, seem to accept as gospel anything they read on the Internet including Cruise Critic. I don't want them to think they will be murdered as soon as they get off the ship because they won't be. Too many times I have read on Cruise Critic of people heeding advice they had read, only to discover it was not true.

 

Carnival states where you can find reliable information including the Department of State.

 

I will even quote my sources:

http://www.carnival.com/CMS/Static_Templates/ticket_contract.aspx

http://travel.state.gov/family/family_issues/death/death_594.html

http://www.investjamaica.com/sectors/tourism/stats.php

 

Check out some of the other countries if you think Jamaica is risky.

 

Unlike others who insist on interpreting the numbers for you, I prefer you to use your brain. Sort of what Carnival is also suggesting you do.

 

If trying to get people to think rationally and objectively indicates I have mental issues, well, so be it.

 

Sargent, but surely you contradict your statements by listing all these internet sources and opening them to your own interpretation. Surely kwilliams is trying to do the same thing as Carnival, State Gov, Jamaica even you etc but he does it much better than you or any of us who were not there can do, he is telling us facts....no source tells me the incident did not happen....he is telling people be careful, ultimately trust yourself for the final decision after all the decisions are made...

 

I followed your links about the hurricane, which you posted in a way to suggest there is no State Department warnings about Jamaica which is true but then when I went to the Consular Information Sheet I found more information that should be known to all tourists, and yes, all the countries are listed so its a better source for people intending to travel abroad, dont just look at the Warnings for any country look at the CIS since it tells you what the conditions are there on a normal basis and not Warnings issued only in response to events....yes, other countries do have crime but kwilliams is issuing his own Warning and it is based on fact, he is not telling people not to go, not to cruise, he is just issuing a warning, it is up to all of us to decide our choices.........

 

oh here´s an internet link

 

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1765.html

[Sargent_Schultz]

Thank you for your advise regards

 

Thank you for the advice regards

 

Is it just me or is your MPD showing?

[LoneStarJeffe]

To those joining this thread late, here is a recap:

 

Sargent_Shultz discusses the current limits of liability as stated in your cruise contract as far as what the cruise line owes you for shore excursion safety. He also provides links about how to stay informed given those liability limits.

 

kwilliams discusses why based upon a very negative personal experience he believes cruise lines can and should do more then just the minimum required.

 

Both discuss how safe Jamaica really is. Various other posters chime in one way or another.

 

I see that both Sargent Shultz and kwilliams agree people have to take personal responsibility and make informed decisions about safety when traveling. I also do not think anyone else disagrees with that position.

 

I also see agreement that in any third world country, including Jamaica, you cannot assume the local government can do as much to support your safety as a first world country would do. That does not mean they are not doing what they can.

 

Recap over. I would like to interrupt this dsicussion to point out that hurricane Dean is bearing down on Jamaica. They are likely to be hit with a cat 5 level storm. Please keep all the people in Jamaica in your thoughts and prayers.

[Sargent_Schultz]

Sargent, but surely you contradict your statements by listing all these internet sources and opening them to your own interpretation. Surely kwilliams is trying to do the same thing as Carnival, State Gov, Jamaica even you etc but he does it much better than you or any of us who were not there can do, he is telling us facts....no source tells me the incident did not happen....he is telling people be careful, ultimately trust yourself for the final decision after all the decisions are made...

 

I followed your links about the hurricane, which you posted in a way to suggest there is no State Department warnings about Jamaica which is true but then when I went to the Consular Information Sheet I found more information that should be known to all tourists, and yes, all the countries are listed so its a better source for people intending to travel abroad, dont just look at the Warnings for any country look at the CIS since it tells you what the conditions are there on a normal basis and not Warnings issued only in response to events....yes, other countries do have crime but kwilliams is issuing his own Warning and it is based on fact, he is not telling people not to go, not to cruise, he is just issuing a warning, it is up to all of us to decide our choices.........

 

oh here´s an internet link

 

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1765.html

 

Yes, and note how they mostly refer to Kingston, but no cruise ships stop in Kingston. They port on the other side of the island.

 

I didn't interpret the numbers, I presented them and suggested individuals do more research and interpret for themselves. I provided some links so they can do as you have done.

 

They even have one for Mexico - imagine that!

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/pa/pa_3028.html

 

No Internet access- no problem Mon:

Up-to-date information on safety and security can also be obtained by calling 1-888-407-4747 toll free in the U.S. and Canada, or for callers outside the U.S. and Canada, a regular toll-line at 1-202-501-4444. These numbers are available from 8:00 a.m. to 8:00 p.m. Eastern Time, Monday through Friday (except U.S. federal holidays).

[bunting]

They even have one for Mexico - imagine that!

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/pa/pa_3028.html

quote]

 

Thanks for that, firstly, I was not saying you interpet the numbers what I was saying was you said dont trust the internet sources, not to take as gospel... then you give a lot of internet souces. To me a bit of a contradiction. And thanks for your info about Mexico but of course I knew that since I am not from here originally and chose to live here after research...........And sorry I don´t get your bit about no internet access or are you suggesting that people on a cruise call the numbers before arriving in a port of call?

 

And Sargent, IMHO if by publicizing the incident, kwilliams brings pressure on the government of Jamaica to make changes then maybe things will improve for the Jamaican people and that can only be best for everyone!

 

LoneStarJeffe, thank you for the most important part of your recap...we do have many Jamaican friends, many within the port industry and some within law enforcement, on the island and pray that all goes well for them..

 

Finally, listening to the advice of Vanessa L, I think its time to bow out from this one........

[Jeanne B]

Recap over. I would like to interrupt this dsicussion to point out that hurricane Dean is bearing down on Jamaica. They are likely to be hit with a cat 5 level storm. Please keep all the people in Jamaica in your thoughts and prayers.

 

Bravo, it's hard to be on this board and think of anything but this at the moment.