W5 show in Canada about safety on cruiseship

[vickie_bernie]

I am just watching a W5 show on how safe it is on ships. It talks about crime onboard and how if you sail you are 50% more likely to be sexually assaulted than on land in the U.S. or Canada.

 

A shocking story of a 12 year old being sexually assaulted and the cruise line paid her off to drop her story or else.

 

They talk about how your cruise card has so much info on it that most staff can attain.

 

The removal of evidence by the staff cleaning the rooms, and removal of the perpetrators in the first port of call!

 

They showed a video of the bar staff hitting on women and actually asking her to come with him to somewhere private.

 

Now I know that this happens. When I first started sailing I remember being hit on numerous times by staff. And we all see it still, the attention given to the single women.

 

They clearly state that this isn't to scare people but it is important that people are aware that there are no laws goverened by any country when you are onboard. Silly me actually thought that US laws would be in place, but my eyese are wide open now.

 

Here is the link to the show...http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071114/wfive_cruiseships_071117/20071117?hub=WFive

[kruisey]

I am just watching a W5 show on how safe it is on ships. It talks about crime onboard and how if you sail you are 50% more likely to be sexually assaulted than on land in the U.S. or Canada.

 

A shocking story of a 12 year old being sexually assaulted and the cruise line paid her off to drop her story or else.

 

They talk about how your cruise card has so much info on it that most staff can attain.

 

The removal of evidence by the staff cleaning the rooms, and removal of the perpetrators in the first port of call!

 

They showed a video of the bar staff hitting on women and actually asking her to come with him to somewhere private.

 

Now I know that this happens. When I first started sailing I remember being hit on numerous times by staff. And we all see it still, the attention given to the single women.

 

They clearly state that this isn't to scare people but it is important that people are aware that there are no laws goverened by any country when you are onboard. Silly me actually thought that US laws would be in place, but my eyese are wide open now.

 

Here is the link to the show...http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071114/wfive_cruiseships_071117/20071117?hub=WFive

 

I watched it too and apparently Canadians have no protection from the RCMP or the Canadian Government.

It certainly was an eye opener.

[thesawch]

I will be watching my teenage daughters closly and if anyone hits on them at sea i will be contacting a officer to complain immediatly.My kids are aware of the TV program tonight and we are preapred for our cruise.

I could not belive what i seen tonight on W5 also.We will most likely not have any problems but i am now informed of what is happening.It is actually a disgrace and am very disapointed in the legal system when it comes to passenger safety in international waters.

Carnival,RCCL etc. you should be ashamed of yourselves!!!!!

.

[vickie_bernie]

this isn't meant to scare people from cruising, but to educate them that these things can happen.

 

And even though the show dealt with carnival and RCCL trust me I am sure it happens on Princess too!

[DanJ]

I'd like them to compare that 250 complaints of sexual harassment (and I say harrassment instead of assault because that list they quickly showed had complaints of staff talking to them too much list amongst the various infractions) in a 3 year span on RCI to what a college has, or what a hotel resort has. Not to mimimize what the more serious cases were about, but given the 30,000+ passengers carried per week, 250 complaints in 3 years sounds pretty small to me. But they have to have something juicy to report on.

[kruisey]

I'd like them to compare that 250 complaints of sexual harassment (and I say harrassment instead of assault because that list they quickly showed had complaints of staff talking to them too much list amongst the various infractions) in a 3 year span on RCI to what a college has, or what a hotel resort has. Not to mimimize what the more serious cases were about, but given the 30,000+ passengers carried per week, 250 complaints in 3 years sounds pretty small to me. But they have to have something juicy to report on.

Dan its good to have a programme like that.I've seen young innocents chatting up the employees in a provocative way..........Have thought to myself at the time that a certain one could be asking for trouble.Not realizing it themselves......

Sooo I do feel that W5 did a good job letting persons know to take care of themselves whether on land or sea.

[spongerob]

Here's an eye-opener, folks. When you travel outside your country, you are protected by and subject to the laws existing in the places you visit. The Mounties' horses aren't amphibious! For example, what recourse does a Canadian citizen have in Cuba, should something happen? Think about it, this is not unique to cruising.

 

No one is going to claim that cruising is 100% safe, but then again, no place you go is going to be 100% safe either. The story as posted is not very objective and given the hysteria present in this discussion appears to have done its job in sensationalizing the story. How about a story about what goes on during college spring break?

 

As for single women and cruising - read the "Shipboard Love Stories" board to see some of the behavior that encourages crewmembers to hit on single women (and men).

 

A useful exercise is a comparison of violent crime rates in your own city or town, and compare those to the figures used in these programs. You might be surprised at the results particularly if you live in a large urban area.

[emily rose]

The show was an eye opener.It was not the percentage of assaults that surprise me but the percentage that pertain to staff.I would think that percentage of staff to customer assaults is one of the highest in any given town or college... It is a learning lesson to be aware of your surroundings.

[suntan]

The W5 program was certainly an eye opener to any woman cruising whether from the U.S., Canada or Europe and whether they were single or not.

 

What disturbed me the most was that Canadian have absolutely no protection from the Canadian government, the U.S. government, or any island police force. I say the latter because it stated in the program that most island police forces do not want to get involved in a crime commited in international waters.

 

To address Spongebob's comments re what recourse do Canadians have if something happens in Cuba. I would presume that Canadians, or any traveller, would contact their respective Consulate or Embassy.

 

I guess, from this program, that all women should take a CSI course :D because one of the women was told to collect her own evidence. :mad:

 

Will this stop me from cruising? No, but I certainly will take extra precautions to ensure that no one gets the opportunity to take advantage of me and my family.

[spongerob]

To address Spongebob's comments re what recourse do Canadians have if something happens in Cuba. I would presume that Canadians, or any traveller, would contact their respective Consulate or Embassy.

My point was simply that you knowingly take a risk when you leave your country. You might not have much legal recourse regardless of where you travel because you are operating under the laws and procedures of the places you visit.

 

I always advise to be careful, but caution people not to fall victim to sensationalism and hysteria. That's how we get bad laws, or laws that address only a part of the problem.

 

As far as Princess goes, I know of only one instance that took place during a cruise. Our friends, who happened to be in the cabin adjacent to the incident, witness something that involved a crewmember (deckhand) who attempted to molest teenage girls who were alone in their own cabin. He was caught, and we saw him on the dock, in chains, being turned over to the local authorities. What happened to him from then on, I can only guess but I hope it wasn't pleasant. Princess took swift action and took the extra step of assigning a security guard to mind their cabin for the remainder of the cruise.

[BobBeaSea]

I will be watching my teenage daughters closly and if anyone hits on them at sea i will be contacting a officer to complain immediatly.My kids are aware of the TV program tonight and we are preapred for our cruise.

I could not belive what i seen tonight on W5 also.We will most likely not have any problems but i am now informed of what is happening.It is actually a disgrace and am very disapointed in the legal system when it comes to passenger safety in international waters.

Carnival,RCCL etc. you should be ashamed of yourselves!!!!!

.

 

You better be careful as the officers will be among the "hitters". Just keep an eye on them, give them some rules to follow and all should be well. Consider the ship a town and act accordingly.

[Casshew]

I'm sailing on the Star in 3 days with my 13year old daughter.... saw the show, nothing I wasn't already aware of.

 

You have to be careful EVERYWHERE in life, from your own home, to your neighbourhood, to family acquaintances, to school staff - no place is immune to having creeps and predictors - (look at the Church scandals!)

 

cruiseships are a little city ~ women/girls/boys need to pay attention. No need to be afraid of traveling though, use common sense and go with your instinct.

[thesawch]

We all know there are predators all over the place.The problem with what the show said is that there is no LAW on mthe high seas.if your raped the only thing that will happen is the rapest will be let off at the next port and sent home.There is almost nothing legaly you can do.That is the problem.if you are raped in Cuba,Mexico the local ploice will in most cases get something done or try.However on the high seas there is almost no law.What would happen if an outraged father through a crew mwmber over board for sexualy assualting his daughter.Would they let him off at the next port also to fly home???? thesawch

[Casshew]

Hopfully, they'll throw him a party. :) I would.

[Shogun]

Hi Folks,

 

Different parts of the world see things in a different light to us,

 

there is a story here on the world news just now, about a lady who was gang raped, she is going to be punished for allowing this to happen to her, the court found should should not have been in a situation that would allow this to happen, she has appealled and lost and now will be flogged as well for going to appeal.

 

 

yours Shogun

[BobBeaSea]

Hi Folks,

 

Different parts of the world see things in a different light to us,

 

there is a story here on the world news just now, about a lady who was gang raped, she is going to be punished for allowing this to happen to her, the court found should should not have been in a situation that would allow this to happen, she has appealled and lost and now will be flogged as well for going to appeal.

 

 

yours Shogun

 

Interesting case, the female victim was initially given a sentence of 90 lashes (for being in a car with an non relative male), upgraded to six months jail and 200 lashes. The six males (who were also armed at the time of the attack) were initially given jail terms of 1 to 5 years, since upgraded to 2 to 9 years. It doesn't help that the victim was Sh'ite and the criminals Sunni. Anyone who knows anything about Islam and the Middle East will know what this means.

[Albino Mosquito]

I am doing my first cruise in about 50 days or so, with my best friend (It will be her first cruise too).

 

Naturally my mother in law insisted I watch this show with her :) (She loves me)

 

But I think you can greatly minimize the risk if you just use your head.

 

Don't follow strangers off to secret areas, if someone does make you uncomfortable contact someone immediately! That one woman on the show was grabbed on the arm, then received inappropriate calls from the same man. She should have called someone immediately!

 

I don't get why people would post their cabin number along with their sailing date, where they are headed and the ship they are on! Sounds like trouble to me!

 

I don't think my friend and I will even decorate our door... We initially wanted to, but I think it could be asking for trouble if we are publicizing two young women are in the cabin. :(

[Chuck1j]

It would be a good thing, if people traveling the world would remember one thing, don't be doing anything you wouldn't be doing at home. I have seen it all over the world. People mis behaving because they are away from home. I asked one person who was robbed in a back alley of Montego Bay, if he would wear a $10,000.00 watch in certain areas of Detroit where he was from. His answer was a resounding NO. Then why the hell would you wear it in a depressed area of another city. I could go on for ever, use your head and take heed of what someone else said in this thread. The laws of your country DO NOT apply elsewhere in the world.

 

The crew member being lead off the ship in chains was for show. The security guards will escort him expeditiously to the airport and on too the next plane to a country he won't be extradited from. Case CLOSED. This is not speculation this is what the cruise lines do to protect their image.

[dot73]

Before I get flamed, let me state that any type of sexual assault is totally unacceptable and cannot be excused in any way whatsoever. However, having been on a few cruises, what I can't understand is the lack of supervision by parents of their children, especially teenagers. I have seen so many young girls (under 16) hanging around in bars and discos very late and some of them inebriated. Some parents seem to think that once they board a ship, their parental responsiblities are no longer necesary and nothing will happen to their kids. I have witnessed teenage girls (some of them quite young) chatting up the crew in a seductive manner and literaly draping themselves over them. I wonder if any of those "assaults" were reported because some young girls got caught doing someting inappropriate and then made up a story so as to not get into trouble with their parents. It happens. Where were the parents of this 12 year old girl featured on the program?

 

As for the cruise lines, shame on them for trying to cover up actual crimes. It seems to me that there is a lack of supervision of the crew also. I have witnessed senior crew, who should be making sure that their workers are behaving, making total asses of themselves with young women and totally ignoring their responsibilities. As for the officers, while most take their responsiblities seriously, there are some that are definitely not "officers and gentleman". I have seen them hit on women, but they tend to be smart enough to stick to women and not young girls. Something about those uniforms that make even mature women lose their heads.

 

I think the responsibility lies on both sides. Parents must educate their children before the cruise about what can happen and how to avoid trouble and where to seek help if they find themselves in trouble. They should also supervise their teenagers. Overworked and stressed out parents need to let loose and have a great time, but if they bring their children with them, their responsibilities also come with them. It is the cruise lines' responsiblity to make sure their employees are trained in how to behave with passengers. Unfortunately, when a crew member is thrown off a ship for inappropriate behaviour, there is nothing to prevent them from just getting another job with another cruise line.

 

I still believe cruising is a very safe way of travelling. With a little common sense by passengers, and the cruise lines admitting that problems exist and dealing with them, it can be even safer. I see both sides of this story but I think the media shows only side of the story and tends to embellish for ratings.

[Melxx]

This incident of sexual assault was reported in the UK press this week it happened on broad P & Os cruise ship Aurora

 

http://www.thisissouthampton.co.uk/mostpopular.var.1824557.mostviewed.cruise_ship_waiter_jailed_for_sex_assault_on_teenager.php

 

It does seem that it was acted on very quickly.

 

Mel

 

PS some of the comments below the report beggar belief.

[quincytoo]

I watched the show last night with my 15 year old son and we were both wondering where the parents of the 12 year old girl were?? Please know I am NOT blaming them just wondering where they had been?? We started watching the show about 15 mins into it.

 

As the girl who had been attacked ..I felt bad for her BUT why would any female open the door to an unknown male in the middle of the night?? Especially a man who had scared her so badly a few hours ago??

 

I would have been on the phone to security so fast......I travel a quite deal and have to stay alone in hotels and I wouldn't think of opening my door to a stranger even if he did work for the hotel I was staying at.

 

Also where was the roommate?? Sorry but friends don't let friends go off alone to a room after said friend has been scared by a strange male.

 

Las Nov we were on the Diamond Princess Nov 4 Mex RIV cruise a few weeks before there had been a story on the major new channels about a man (I thinki he was a newscaster or something like that) who had been reported by one or two boys of acting badly towards them in the sauna area not once but twice ?? Not sure what happened but I think he was arrested.

 

The boys had no business being in the spa area (not that that excuses the horrible behaviour of the man) and I wondered then where were the boys parents??

 

We sat our 14 year old down and explained to him what had happaned and what could happen to both boys and girls. I think the buddy system works great for kinds and young females.

 

Yes once we got on board we did let him out of our sight but we knew where he was always!!! , he loved the Teen Center and he spent many a happy hour there with his new friends. We checked in constantly and the TC staff had our room number along with the assurances that we would be checking in 24/7.

 

I realize that bad things happen everywhere in the world but think with a few simple precautions cruising is as safe as you expect it to be.

 

Add me to the list that thinks media distorts for veiwings

[Albino Mosquito]

From what I understood of the show, I may be wrong but, the girl was led away from her group (the teen group, that did have counselors, staff etc.) By a uniformed officer.

 

He promised to take her to a special area to see a pod of dolphins playing in the wake of the ship. Now while the girl should not have gone, it is quite easy to see how a 12 year old would go off. After all, he was in uniform, and she was told if there ever was trouble she should go find someone just like him. That he was the guy to find if she needed help.

 

As to her parents, they felt completely safe entrusting her to the organized, supervised teenage activities. They didn't even imagine a cruise member, would lure away and assault their daughter.

 

Once she was back with her group she was upset and the counselor asked her what was wrong. She only admitted that he inappropriately touched her, she withheld the info on the actual rape for years.

[kruisey]

Thought that was dreadful for that young girl.A person in uniform that she thought she could trust....That man should have been locked up for life and the key thrown away.:cool:

On the other hand I personally have always felt safe on Princess Cruises....one of the advanges of being old.:D :D

I had occasion in January this year to have to walk from the front to the back of my corridor during the evening on Diamond Princess due to the fact my traveling companion

had a medical problem (Not Infectious) and was confined to cabin.......not many persons around at that time......but never once did I feel threatened.........I think the cabin crew got used to my walking up and down,we would give a friendly smile to one another.

What I am trying to say is unpleasant things can happen to anyone of us.....Its very improbable we just have to use our common sense.....It should be emphasized by parents of teenagers and children to watch out for this few pedophiles in our society.

[georges_chris]

There are negative possibilities when 200-3000 people gather somewhere, whether it be a city or a ship. Being aware and careful are of the utmost importance, and any digression by someone on staff or on board should be immediately reported. We were on a cruise with my daughter and 2 nieces and there were no problems. Hopefully any incidences are few and far between.

g

[spongerob]

The crew member being lead off the ship in chains was for show. The security guards will escort him expeditiously to the airport and on too the next plane to a country he won't be extradited from. Case CLOSED. This is not speculation this is what the cruise lines do to protect their image.

I guess the Mexican naval police who came on board and took custody provided the limo service. :rolleyes: