RCI is not a Baby Sitter

[abridalmaven]

We all should DO something and maybe if we embarrass the lazy parents enough, it may change. On a trip to Fla one Christmas week in our timeshare resort some teens were tearing up the pool & hot tub area and waking many of us up. Of course we called security but when they got there, thay had dispersed. So after 3 nights, my BIL waited up ( we did not have plans the next day and we just watching movies) BIL chased one of them and dragged him back to his room, and woke up the parents who had NO IDEA their son was even out.

The security guards also kept a vigil and they were all caught. I hear some families were asked to leave as damage was extensive to soda machines and so on.
If we sit around and let it happen, it will never stop!

[PTarbay]

I think most of the time this behavior happens when there are large groups of children together.Peer pressure and trying to impress other kids sometimes makes an otherwise well behave kid do things they would not normally do.Parents need to realize this and know where their kids are and what they are up to.I've been on several cruises and the only time it was a real problem was spring break.Most of the kids are fine and it is the minority that cause the problems.I think it would help if the cruiselines would release information on how many kids are booked so people could make a decision on what cruise to book.Some people actually like to cruise with lots of kids on board.One of the lines,not positive but I think it was Princess gave us a number 3 or 4 years ago and we changed our date.No,it wasn't too many kids actually it was only 2 and we were taking 3 15 year olds so we felt it was pretty much an adult cruise and would not be enjoyable for the kids.I also would never cruise again on a sailing with 300 kids.It was a total nightmare.I like the idea Princess limits kids because they know how many their programs can comfortably accomodate which is great for the other passengers and the kids.I also do not understand parents who do not watch their children.The best word I can think of is SELFISH!!!Kids learn by example and when they see their parents acting irresponsibly and not caring they act the same way.These are the same people who when confronted about their kids behavior are annoyed because they have been bothered and don't really care that their child has been ruining other peoples vacation.One idea is the first time a child misbehaves a warning and if there is a second time that child would not be allowed to go anywhere without being with one of the parents.I think some of these parents would pay a lot more attention to their kid's behavior that way.Imagine their horror with actually having to supervise their own child.

[ABoatNerd]

Good cruising fellow CC members:

My sympathies to you for the negative impact of "free range kids". The inevitable consequences of today's permissive parenting is showing up more and more on cruises, at school, in backyards across N.America and in the rise of youth crime.

There is a new book out called ""Epidemic - The rot of American Culture - Absentee and Permissive Parenting - The Resultant Plague of Joyless, Selfish Children" author is Robert Shaw. This book has received very significant coverage, most positive, because he has chosen not to be politically correct and say what many of us think (and include on the many CC threads on this topic). Mr. Shaw says we are "reaping what we sow". True.

Being child free by choice, my husband and I are extremely careful to avoid cruising during the summer, holiday periods. Generally we stick with Celebrity and may patronize Crystal. I would note that RCL is assertively pursuing the "nuclear family" market ie kids, so there will be MORE OF THIS type of cruise experience. If this bothers you, TAKE YOUR BUSINESS AWAY FROM RCL, they are deliberately "courting" the family market.

You know, it is not just cruises where this is happening. This summer we were run out of a provincial camping park (we are Canadian) because the unsupervised children ran around the park screaming all day. Once they got on their sites, the parents started to yell. There was no quiet until midnight and frankly I have had enough. The park was an out of control daycare.

The vast % of parents do a good job (at the toughest and most important job there is!), but an increasing % are ignoring basic duties. However, I would suggest to all of you reading this thread, that there are no COMMON rules/codes/decorum left in North America. It is do what I want (remember all the dress code threads etc). Therefore, how does one raise children with class and decorum and respect when the parents are "riff raff"?

SECONDLY, RCL and any cruise line will do nothing to enforce general decorum on their ships. It is not politically correct to do so and frankly they do not care. As long as we are all lemings, keep booking cruises no matter what we get, nothing will change.

ABoatNerd

[bUU]

joyceyw made a great point: Beyond that, not only does the crew have adequate means to address unruly adults, but we all do our part with relatively little concern about being accused of abuse. Adults-not-the-parents of little hellions, who try to impart some discipline on them, are as likely as not to be accused of malfeasance themselves.

[bUU]

It should be noted that there is already a contract between the cruise line and the parents of minor children:
[quote]Carrier reserves the right to terminate a Passenger's cruise at any time, at the risk and expense of the Passenger disembarked, when in the opinion of the Carrier, Passenger is believed to be a danger to himself or a [b]disturbance[/b] or danger to others.[/quote]Emphasis added.

The contract further makes it clear that parents and guardians of minor children are completely responsible for the behavior of the children.

[dougp26364]

[quote name='bicker']Parents are already responsible for their children's behavior. [/QUOTE]

Allow me to rephrase my "hold the parent's responsible" statement. Make that hold the parents accountable for their childs actions. So many times they just let it go and there are no consequences to the action. IMO, that's a mistake.

[nrdsb4]

My husband and I were on a HAL cruise a few years ago in July. One morning the captain came on the speaker and said that he had just put a family off in our port because there had been disrespect shown for the policies and rules of the ship. The captain said there would be more of the same if others did not follow the rules of the ship. It caused quite a buzz on the ship and all the feedback I heard was supportive of the captain.

I agree that there's too much permissive parenting going on. One day I was watching Dr. Phil while folding laundry. A couple was on bemoaning their totally out of control brats. Dr. Phil said, "You make threats and then you don't follow through on them! Why do you do this?" The mother giggled and said "Because we love them so much and we are afraid if we are too strict they will get upset." Dr. Phil, looking incredulous said, "Whoever said children should never get upset?! So what if they get upset? They'll get over it." I don't think Oatmeal for Brains Mama absorbed anything he said, and you can imagine what kind of adults those kids will turn out to be.

[springtxbill]

She will be back on Jerry Springer later with her out of control kids.:)

[sbpdkp]

enough bashing of which I am even at fault. After re-reading this thread, one would think that there aren't any children who are disciplined or parents who really do follow the rules. I think what often happens - even children who are normally good - they go on these cruises and are just so excited and they go in very large groups - that the normal controls aren't always there. And there are just as many adults, who come on these cruises with a sense of "entitlement" because they paid for this cruise and they are going to get everything they feel they are "entitled" to and the rest of the passengers - too bad! They are the ones who cut in line, don't say thank-you when doors are opened for them and just expect everyone to wait on them! For now, we have teenagers and we will cruise the Voyager class ships because it is a lot of fun for the entire family - despite chair hogs and rowdy kids! When our kids grow up and leave the nest, then we'll cruise on the ships that cater to a different crowd!

[gkrebs]

[quote name='caribbeandiva']Can you say where these cruises are leaving from? I have a horrible sinking feeling in my stomach.:eek:[/QUOTE]
The NJ kids could be on the ships leaving from NYC, Bayonne, or any port in Florida most likely. Hmmm I wondering if there is a 9 night Voyager sailing that week

[royalT]

spbdkp, You touched a nerve when you mentioned my pet peeve - people who don't say "Thank you" when I hold a door open for them. I always think to myself that this action probably sums up their attitude in life, hence we have chair hogs, etc.

[Maria65]

[quote name='sayhello']Totally OT here, but you really have to wonder how many of these NJ families have made provisions for absentee ballots? This kind of encourages folks to forget to vote, seeing as they'll be far, far away on election day.... :(

sayhello[/QUOTE]


I can't speak for my fellow New Jerseyans but I put mine in the mail today. And I have to defend the children of NJ a little in that I don't think they're any worse than kids from anywhere else. Overall, there will still be far less children cruising this week than a random week in the summer. It just illustrates that there really is no child free week to be had on RCI. They market heavily to families and at any given time of the school year, some state has some random week off, and don't forget homeschoolers.

[goodml]

[quote name='royalT']spbdkp, You touched a nerve when you mentioned my pet peeve - people who don't say "Thank you" when I hold a door open for them. I always think to myself that this action probably sums up their attitude in life, hence we have chair hogs, etc.[/QUOTE]
This is a HUGE pet peeve of mine. You know, people often say to my husband and I, 'you must be so proud of your kids - they have such nice manners.' I am proud, don't get me wrong, but I think it's such a shame that common courtesy and good manners in a child (and adults too) is becoming so much rarer that people are motivated to comment on it when they do see it. One day in Starbucks, my son (14) wanted to buy himself a frappucino and I really wasn't paying much attention to the conversation he was having with the girl behind the counter. After he was done I ordered myself something and the girl behind the counter asked me if that was my son and I said yes and she said, 'then your cappucino and croissant are on the house because that kid's manners are so great and you deserve a treat for raising him that way.' To that I said, 'thanks and I'll take that freebie but you know what, teaching them good manners and respect for others is absolutely the easiest part of parenting. You just have to practice it yourself and expect nothing less than the same from them.' Sometimes our kids drive US nuts but I always say at least if we know that they know how to behave with others then we must be doing something right. My sister-in-law's kids drive me around the bend because I've never heard them say please or thank you to anyone for anything ever and that's their parents' fault. Sorry - ranting I know but that one touched a nerve with me too.

[mammallama]

[quote name='goodml']Sometimes our kids drive US nuts but I always say at least if we know that they know how to behave with others then we must be doing something right. [/QUOTE]This is a conversation my DH and I have frequently, [i]especially[/i] when the kids are driving us nuts! Let them act out at home but by golly, they better act right in public. When my son was about 4 or 5 yrs old, we took him to a restaurant and he decided to have a little hissy fit right there at the table. My DH hauled him out to the car (gently but persuasively), paddled his canoe and waited for him to be 'ready' to go back in and finish his meal. [i]To this day[/i] (he's now 18), my son clearly remembers that incident and says [i]that's[/i] how he learned to behave in a restaurant. Same thing applies when going on a cruise. Sure he tested the limits...but he tested [i]our[/i] limits, [b]not[/b] the limits imposed (expected, implied, choose your term) while in the company of other people.

[caribbeandiva]

[quote name='gkrebs']The NJ kids could be on the ships leaving from NYC, Bayonne, or any port in Florida most likely. Hmmm I wondering if there is a 9 night Voyager sailing that week[/QUOTE]
Sweet Jesus, please be merciful! There is nothing that I despise more than rude, unruly, obnoxious children. Don't get me wrong, I love kids, but from what I have read on these boards, my maiden cruise will be totally ruined if I run into what the OP experienced. How can some parents be so irresponsible?

Now I am depressed...Perhaps Folgy will organize an "adults only" cruise soon.

[Folgy]

Believe me ...I am working hard on it. The problem is ship/itinerary/time of sail. Much easier to find family cruises. I am getting into cruise withdrawl with my stubborness to have an Adult cruise. :confused:

[caribbeandiva]

[quote name='Folgy']Believe me ...I am working hard on it. The problem is ship/itinerary/time of sail. Much easier to find family cruises. I am getting into cruise withdrawl with my stubborness to have an Adult cruise. :confused:[/QUOTE]
Folgy, old buddy,old pal..try a little harder, you have people waiting to sign up! Just give me the date and ship, I,m right behind ya...;)

Caribbean Diva.

[Folgy]

Now I am inspired..... :D (gotta try harder)

[caribbeandiva]

[quote name='Folgy']Now I am inspired..... :D (gotta try harder)[/QUOTE]
Atta boy! I,m starting to pack!:D...now I have something to look forward to!

[parothead]

let me know when we leave for the adults only cruise i am going with you. in the meantime i will take my digital camera with me and "catch" the little buggers in the act and turn the photos over to the purser.

[springtxbill]

Very good idea.:)

[PTarbay]

[QUOTE]enough bashing of which I am even at fault. After re-reading this thread, one would think that there aren't any children who are disciplined or parents who really do follow the rules. I think what often happens - even children who are normally good - they go on these cruises and are just so excited and they go in very large groups - that the normal controls aren't always there. And there are just as many adults, who come on these cruises with a sense of "entitlement" because they paid for this cruise and they are going to get everything they feel they are "entitled" to and the rest of the passengers - too bad! They are the ones who cut in line, don't say thank-you when doors are opened for them and just expect everyone to wait on them! For now, we have teenagers and we will cruise the Voyager class ships because it is a lot of fun for the entire family - despite chair hogs and rowdy kids! When our kids grow up and leave the nest, then we'll cruise on the ships that cater to a different crowd![/QUOTE]
You are absolutely right!I have been on several cruises and while there are bad experiences such as the OP had I think most of the kids are pretty well behaved.RCI caters to families and I can't even imagine not bringing my daughter on a family vacation.It's a great way to spend some quality family time and do our own things also.While there are definitely some badly behaved kids there are some people who who have no tolerance of kids at all.[QUOTE]Sweet Jesus, please be merciful! There is nothing that I despise more than rude, unruly, obnoxious children. Don't get me wrong, I love kids, but from what I have read on these boards, my maiden cruise will be totally ruined if I run into what the OP experienced. How can some parents be so irresponsible? [/QUOTE]
Why are you assuming this will be the case on your cruise?If you read all the posts most people have a wonderful cruise.While what happened to the OP is absolutely unacceptable behavior and they shouldn't have had to put up with it don't assume this happens on every cruise.RCI is a family cruiseline and there will be kids on every sailing but that doesn't mean they will ruin your cruise.While the OP on this thread has a legitimate complaint it seems every thread involving children or teens ,even innocent ones turns into kid bashing.
[QUOTE]Now I am depressed...[/QUOTE]
Don't be depressed before you go on your first cruise.Read through all the positive threads and look forward to all the great experiences.Believe me,once you cruise you will be addicted.Think positive and have a great cruise!!!

[eguiney]

As the OP for this thread, let me say I did not know I would touch such a nerve. A few comments:
Yes a VERY FEW of the large group of kids on the cruise were rude, disrespectfull and just plain brats. But also there were a very large number of well behaved kids who had a good time and did it without disturbing other passengers. I would dare say that most of these came from families like many described here. The parents like we did with our children have have taught their kids respect and responsibitlity. If our kids were younger again, i would not hessitate to take them along, but rest asured that we would know where they were and what they were doing, but that said, we would also not worry much because we feel we have taught them how to behave. For the most part the actions we observed are not the kids fault, it is the parents.
While the actions of a few made the first part of the cruise less than desireable, it it no way made the trip bad. A cruise is what you make of it and we had a blast. As my signature shows we are already booked back on the Rhapsody next October.
Thanks for all the comments. It would be nice if RCI monitored these threads and saw how folks feel, buit hey it is about money and as long as the money keeps flowing they are not going to "rock the boat" - no pun intended!.

[happysinglemom]

[quote name='PTarbay']Why are you assuming this will be the case on your cruise?[/QUOTE]

Absolutely correct. Let's not get carried away and imply that the problems of the OP are the norm. They most definitely are not. My own experience was fantastic - and I cruised in the summer. No rude kids running amuck - no whining in the dining room - zip, nada. So while we know it DOES happen, good grief people - get a grip - the odds are greatly in your favor that you will have a wonderful time even with rugs rats on board. ;)

[bUU]

I'm not sure there is anything they could really do, that wouldn't hurt their profitability, and thereby represent a violation of their fiduciary responsibility.