Fuel costs - yikes !!!

[exarolf]

Was doing a random search on fuel costs, and came up with some interesting facts:

 

It is largely reported that the QE2 gets ~200 gallons / 1 mile (probably when going full speed). Taking a real average in the 100 gallons for 1 mile (running the ship slower and efficiently), that adds up quick.

 

On an Eastern Caribbean itinerary, you can travel say 2500+ miles (ref Google earth measurements).

 

With fuel costing ~$4/gallon, that makes a typical 7 day cruise cost:

100 gallons/mile x 2500 miles x $4 = $1,000,000.

 

That doesn't even take into account running generators during dock time...

 

This means on a capacity boat of 4000 travelers, each person is putting $250 towards the fuel cost!!!

 

Am I missing something??? If not, that suddenly makes this a scary industry. If a boat isn't full, and cabins aren't sold at a premium, it's easy to see how any given cruise could actually lose money (???)...

[rummenroman]

And people have the guts to complain about an $80 fuel charge!!!!

[Jfultz81]

Ouch!

 

Rummenroman - love your quote, but then again, love LP too :)

[exarolf]

And people have the guts to complain about an $80 fuel charge!!!!

 

It's not just $80 anymore - at least for people who fly to a port.

 

I'm with the complainers... Don't call it a supplement - this is just marketing BS. Instead of adding line item charges like airlines, just raise the price of each cabin! A $80 supplement is nothing but a price increase...

 

With all these new boats and passenger capacity, something's gonna have to give. I predict a stormy season for the cruise lines...

 

RCL's next earnings release will be a very interesting one to read...

[rummenroman]

It's not just $80 anymore - at least for people who fly to a port.

 

I'm with the complainers... Don't call it a supplement - this is just marketing BS. Instead of adding line item charges like airlines, just raise the price of each cabin! A $80 supplement is nothing but a price increase...

 

With all these new boats and passenger capacity, something's gonna have to give. I predict a stormy season for the cruise lines...

 

RCL's next earnings release will be a very interesting one to read...

 

Seriously does it really matter what they call it? An extra charge or a price increase you are still paying the extra money. That is money that i won't be able to spend as i see fit.

 

In the greater picture cruising is still an AWESOME deal. I will be paying 629 plus fees taxes and charges for my January cruise per person.

 

That 629 would be a hotel stay for a week plus a bunch. Not to mention all the shows, food and what not. Not to mention i will be traveling to 6 different islands in 7 days. Tell me where else you can find a trip like this at that type of a price.

 

Jfultz - the quote couldn't be more true with the current situation going on in the world!

[exarolf]

Seriously does it really matter what they call it? An extra charge or a price increase you are still paying the extra money. That is money that i won't be able to spend as i see fit.

 

In the greater picture cruising is still an AWESOME deal. I will be paying 629 plus fees taxes and charges for my January cruise per person.

 

 

Is that $629 including fuel surcharge :rolleyes:

 

You are correct that it's a good deal - considering the percentage of your fare that goes towards fuel...

[mark290]

What if fuel is only $2 a gallon ? Not so bad then.

Likewise mayde fuel cost are more for a ship.

I would be curious to now what fuel for a ship cost.

I would hate to be the one that puts the nozzle in the

boat and has to wait until it clicks off.

[cruiserbryce]

yikes...I was complaining about a $58 fill up the other day

[sddsddean]

You americans don't know how good you've got it!! I run a 32 tonne truck and put in around 150 litres of diesel a day. Currently our diesel is about £1.31/lt, which (if my maths is right) works out about $9.50/US gal! I did read in the paper the other day that the cross channel ferries (Dover - Calais) are going slower. You used to be able to get to the ship about 4 minutes before sailing time and still get on for the 90 minute crossing. Now they leave about 15 mins early and arrive 10 mins late...and save 1 tonne of fuel (about £700/crossing).

 

Simon

[buzzor]

You americans don't know how good you've got it!! I run a 32 tonne truck and put in around 150 litres of diesel a day. Currently our diesel is about £1.31/lt, which (if my maths is right) works out about $9.50/US gal!

 

Simon

Fuel is an international commodity. The actual diesel cost is the same in the US and in the UK. The difference comes from taxes. Taxes are what is making the difference. But then again you Brits have the NHS and there is no such thing in the US. The money for the NHS has to come from somewhere, there is no free lunch.

[sddsddean]

I appreciate what you are saying buzzor and I know that over 70% of the cost of fuel in the UK is tax/duty, but these are not the things that run through your mind as you stand at the pump watching the dials turn at an alarmingly fast rate!!

 

Simon

[madforcruising]

Was doing a random search on fuel costs, and came up with some interesting facts:

 

It is largely reported that the QE2 gets ~200 gallons / 1 mile (probably when going full speed). Taking a real average in the 100 gallons for 1 mile (running the ship slower and efficiently), that adds up quick.

 

On an Eastern Caribbean itinerary, you can travel say 2500+ miles (ref Google earth measurements).

 

With fuel costing ~$4/gallon, that makes a typical 7 day cruise cost:

100 gallons/mile x 2500 miles x $4 = $1,000,000.

 

That doesn't even take into account running generators during dock time...

 

This means on a capacity boat of 4000 travelers, each person is putting $250 towards the fuel cost!!!

 

Am I missing something??? If not, that suddenly makes this a scary industry. If a boat isn't full, and cabins aren't sold at a premium, it's easy to see how any given cruise could actually lose money (???)...

 

 

While you are right in the fact that fuel costs are a huge factor for the cruise / travel industry I think you are in deed missing something in your calculation.

 

The QE2 was built in 1969 and as an ocean liner and not cruise ship in first place. So you can´t really compare her to modern ships.

The second point is that you can´t compare the price you are paying at the gas station whith what a cruise line is paying for a gallon.

 

I don´t have any figures to make up a calculation, but I´m sure the figures are different than the ones you used.

[FLACRUISER99]

Was doing a random search on fuel costs, and came up with some interesting facts:

 

It is largely reported that the QE2 gets ~200 gallons / 1 mile (probably when going full speed). Taking a real average in the 100 gallons for 1 mile (running the ship slower and efficiently), that adds up quick.

 

On an Eastern Caribbean itinerary, you can travel say 2500+ miles (ref Google earth measurements).

 

With fuel costing ~$4/gallon, that makes a typical 7 day cruise cost:

100 gallons/mile x 2500 miles x $4 = $1,000,000.

 

That doesn't even take into account running generators during dock time...

 

This means on a capacity boat of 4000 travelers, each person is putting $250 towards the fuel cost!!!

 

Am I missing something??? If not, that suddenly makes this a scary industry. If a boat isn't full, and cabins aren't sold at a premium, it's easy to see how any given cruise could actually lose money (???)...

Just curious where did you get the $4/gallon price for bunker?:confused:

[TEXASMUNK]

(at least to me)

 

Carnival has not done any buying the futures market while RCI has.

 

Southwest has bought on the futures market and is the only airline that has.

 

As for the $4 a gallon price the OP used. If you have a better number insert it, I would imagine that person merely used a price we are all too familiar with these days.

[exarolf]

While you are right in the fact that fuel costs are a huge factor for the cruise / travel industry I think you are in deed missing something in your calculation.

 

The QE2 was built in 1969 and as an ocean liner and not cruise ship in first place. So you can´t really compare her to modern ships.

The second point is that you can´t compare the price you are paying at the gas station whith what a cruise line is paying for a gallon.

 

I don´t have any figures to make up a calculation, but I´m sure the figures are different than the ones you used.

 

:-) I love these type of random statements - please explain how you are "sure" - too funny...

 

Now further form the net "FOS burns 12.8 tons/hr" - also it has 6 diesel engines (hence diesel fuel - hence a cost of $4/gal).

 

12.8 tons/hr = 25000 lbs/hr. 1 gallon = 7.3lbs (common weight), so the ship runs ~3500 gallons/hr. At 18 knots - or 20 miles/hr, that's 170 gallons per mile, or $650 (note rounding down) per mile.

 

From Google Earth, it looks like hitting the Eastern Caribbean (USVI) from Florida will set you back ~2500 miles.

 

That's $1.62 million bucks. Ether way it's a lot, and I am fairly confident that the cost is well over $1,000,000 per sail...

 

This makes filling a ship a VERY big deal for the cruise lines... $250+ per passenger, then adding OBC, and rising cost of food etc - this is a scary business to be in with our economy.

 

Makes shorting the stock when it bounces up to $20.5 / $21 very attractive...

[FLACRUISER99]

(at least to me)

 

Carnival has not done any buying the futures market while RCI has.

 

Southwest has bought on the futures market and is the only airline that has.

 

As for the $4 a gallon price the OP used. If you have a better number insert it, I would imagine that person merely used a price we are all too familiar with these days.

Correct me if I am wrong.

Spot price for bunker in Houston,TX = $740.00/Ton

Approximately 275 gal of oil/Ton

about $2.69/Gal not 4.00/gal Huge difference.

[TEXASMUNK]

instead of taking a "pot shot" at the OP, your info is extrememly accurate, post that the first time, make us all a little smarter.

 

This is not a competition, it is information sharing.

 

Your info is a good sign that maybe the costs will not break the cruise lines.

 

Another note. The diesel engines used in ship use what is known as "bunker oil" a much lower grade that the diesel used in trucks.

[exarolf]

Correct me if I am wrong.

Spot price for bunker in Houston,TX = $740.00/Ton

Approximately 275 gal of oil/Ton

about $2.69/Gal not 4.00/gal Huge difference.

 

Does bunker oil run in Diesel engines (???)??? It looks like Marine diesel is a mix.

[FLACRUISER99]

Does bunker oil run in Diesel engines (???)??? It looks like Marine diesel is a mix.

To the best of my knowledge all large ships use Bunker , Gas turbines (Radiance Class) use marine diesel in the Gas turbines.

[thesawch]

Jewel of the seas uses 30 gallons a minute in the turbines to run the generators.It works out to 1 gallon for every 46 feet it travels.I heard it from the first engineer at the captains meeting on the last day of sailing.And it is only a 90,000 ton ship.he new RCCL ships is 220,000 tons.

OUCH!!

[curley23]

Correct me if I am wrong.

Spot price for bunker in Houston,TX = $740.00/Ton

Approximately 275 gal of oil/Ton

about $2.69/Gal not 4.00/gal Huge difference.

 

Actually bunker oil is sold by metric tonne, which is about 7.5 bbl. or about 380 gal. which is about $1.95 per gal using your spot price. Last spot price I saw several weeks ago was about 692.00.

A voyager class ship uses on average 3000 gal of fuel per hour, 24 hrs a day, or a little over 500,000 gal per week. at almost $2 a gal you can do the math. Right now about $1,000,000 per week to fuel a voyager class ship. At $2 it is still pretty expensive.

BTW bunker oil a yr ago was at about $370 per metric tonne.

[FLACRUISER99]

Thanks for clearing up Gal/tonne curley23, I got todays spot price here http://www.bunkerworld.com/markets/prices/