Suggestions for St. Thomas/St. Marteen?

[laddcalcagno]

Hey,

 

Going on Oasis in 2010. Looking for accessible beaches and transportation for St. Thomas and St. Marteen. I know St. Thomas will probably be easier, (US Virgin Island = ADA Compliant). Just want to start researching places to go when down there.

 

Anyone been down there and had a good experience? Would love to know what you did/saw and what you would not recommend. Person in party that is in WC cannot transfer except to take a few steps with assistance. Transferring out of wheelchair for taxi or other form of transportation is not an option.

 

Thanks!

[Splinter]

St. Thomas is limited to one accessible tour company which you will probably have to book through the ship. They are iffy...if not enough people book, they will cancel. There are no accessible cabs. Just because they are a USA territory does not mean that there is full ADA enforcement. It is poor at best.

 

If the person can stand, they should be able to transfer to a car cab...I don't understand why that would not be an option??? Don't think about taking a scooter or power chair ashore in the Caribbean. Leave those on the ship and take a folding manual chair (not a transport chair) ashore.

[laddcalcagno]

St. Thomas is limited to one accessible tour company which you will probably have to book through the ship. They are iffy...if not enough people book, they will cancel. There are no accessible cabs. Just because they are a USA territory does not mean that there is full ADA enforcement. It is poor at best.

 

If the person can stand, they should be able to transfer to a car cab...I don't understand why that would not be an option??? Don't think about taking a scooter or power chair ashore in the Caribbean. Leave those on the ship and take a folding manual chair (not a transport chair) ashore.

 

 

Its not an option because we're not talking about an old person. This is someone who can't walk on their own. They have extremely limited mobility due to flexibility and strength issues. A few steps on their own is just not possible, they require help at all times from someone. Getting into a car at home isn't possible, we have a special chair lift and van. And they don't use a power chair because the person in question doesn't have the capabilities to steer on their own.

 

Honestly, I hate to sound nasty here, but if you can't be positive and helpful please don't reply. We almost canceled our first cruise due to negative (and coincidentally incorrect) information given by a poster on this site. People make it sound like anyone who uses a wheelchair should just stay home because there's nothing for them to do, no place that's accessible, and no one that will help. I've found that with enough research and finding the right people to help its very easy for someone who can't get around without the aide of a wheelchair. That includes cruises.

 

I'll try and be more specific here....i'm looking for real help, suggestions of places to sightsee in St. Thomas and St. Marteen and suggestions for beaches. I'd like real stories and experiences as well as links for websites if available. Through this site I was already able to find a Trolley that is accessible for tours on St. Thomas as well as an aquarium. I'd still like more info on St. Marteen and beaches.

 

Negative, uninformed post from people who don't understand the real challenges of accessibility are a waste of my time.

[NorthernLite]

You just slammed the person who with the right information is most likely to be able to point you in the right directions to have a great cruise. She asks the right questions because she works with people like me, a quadriplegic, every day and cruises with one. I'd also wonder why someone who can take a few assisted steps on flat ground can't be helped into a large size taxi. I assume most who need any assistance to take a few steps can't climb up into a tour bus. That's a given on this board.

 

You practically describe me except I can only stand with help and then do a pivot and my husband and I use taxis all over the world. No steps even with help although I can use my arms. Once we do a 90 degree turn from my chair to where my butt faces the, normally, front seat of the taxi I sit. The DH helps lift my legs around and secure my seat belt. The manual chair I cruise with is torn down and most fits in the trunk. What doesn't travels in back with the spouse.

 

There is one bus/trolley company in St Thomas that does a tour with a stop halfway up the mountain and another up at the summit for banana daiquaris and shopping. You're supposed to book through the ships but if you need a ramp/lift it's a good idea to email them which ship you'll be on because the ships don't tell them how many need wheelchair access. They have been working on making Magen's Bay accessible to wheelers. I believe their website is http://www.accessvi.com. As a territory not a commonwealth St Thomas is not as tied to the ADA as Puerto Rico is. It's complicated. The dock area in St Thomas is very accessible if you're into jewelry, t-shirts and one outside restaurant. Do you have a web site for the aquarium?

 

St Maarten has Charlie's, a Caribbean/French casual restaurant bar that is ramped all the way around to their back terrace area. Food is great and reasonable, or was, as the local boaters go there. Another place has opened near by http://www.greenhouserestaurant.com that appears to be accessible also. I was supposed to be the test person to see if a WW2 ducks group would be accessible but that cruise stop was cut short by a medical emergency onboard. I hope to find out in November now. The only short cut into Phillipsburg proper from the dock is by tender size boats or taxis. The small vans do not have lifts or ramps. We'll either roll on the sidewalk over or if I hear the ducks don't work we'll probably head over to Marigot by taxi.

 

Um, I'm now 49. Injured at 33. Does that make me old?

 

Its not an option because we're not talking about an old person. This is someone who can't walk on their own. They have extremely limited mobility due to flexibility and strength issues. A few steps on their own is just not possible, they require help at all times from someone. Getting into a car at home isn't possible, we have a special chair lift and van. And they don't use a power chair because the person in question doesn't have the capabilities to steer on their own.

 

Honestly, I hate to sound nasty here, but if you can't be positive and helpful please don't reply. We almost canceled our first cruise due to negative (and coincidentally incorrect) information given by a poster on this site. People make it sound like anyone who uses a wheelchair should just stay home because there's nothing for them to do, no place that's accessible, and no one that will help. I've found that with enough research and finding the right people to help its very easy for someone who can't get around without the aide of a wheelchair. That includes cruises.

 

I'll try and be more specific here....i'm looking for real help, suggestions of places to sightsee in St. Thomas and St. Marteen and suggestions for beaches. I'd like real stories and experiences as well as links for websites if available. Through this site I was already able to find a Trolley that is accessible for tours on St. Thomas as well as an aquarium. I'd still like more info on St. Marteen and beaches.

 

Negative, uninformed post from people who don't understand the real challenges of accessibility are a waste of my time.

[selma]

I would also have to agree with Sue. I think you overreacted a bit, Danielle. Like Sue and Splinter, I do have a hard time understanding why somebody can walk some steps with assistance, but not transfer into a taxi. When walking a few steps assisted, one would have to get up from the wheelchair, walk and get back into the chair. Maybe silly me, but those are the same types of movement one has to make to get from a wheelchair into a taxi. One might need a car with a seat at a certain height and/or a certain amount of space when the door is open, but still. With those limitations I would think it would be doable to make an assisted transfer into a taxi. It might not be the most desirable, but that's something different from not possible.

 

The link about St. Thomas/St. John is already posted, so I'm not going to bother by that. A quick question for own interest though; anyone out here that has gone to either St. John or Tortola from St. Thomas using a wc? Anyone done any of the dolphin excursions on Tortola?

 

Splinter, about your comment powerchair/ecv versus manual chair. What experience is that based upon? I'm not counting on accessibility to such an extend we'll run into nicely made curbcuts and no thresholds getting into any/most buildings, but that would still make one wonder. The 'bigger' stuff would be a problem when looking at it from a taxi standpoint. Apart from that, I however still can see possible advantages to the first over a manual chair, especially if one is venturing out without a set of 'helping/pushing hands'. But than again, maybe that's me being used to poorer accessibility due to the fact I'm not living in the US?

 

About St. Maarten; http://www.stmaarten.org/DisabledTravelers.html Allthough I did found this to be a bit too negative. But again; I'm pretty used to the state of accessibilty I was able to uncover about the caribbeans so far. It is a good source to get started to get some basic info.

 

An option for an accessible tour on St. Maarten; http://www.joyceprince.com/

 

While it isn't cheap (will be less expensive with a group), it is an option. One can customize their own personal tour of the island and this person works with accessible transportation.

[Splinter]

Its not an option because we're not talking about an old person. This is someone who can't walk on their own. They have extremely limited mobility due to flexibility and strength issues. A few steps on their own is just not possible, they require help at all times from someone. Getting into a car at home isn't possible, we have a special chair lift and van. And they don't use a power chair because the person in question doesn't have the capabilities to steer on their own.

 

I don't know what the person's age has to do with this issue at all. My mother is totally tetraplegic due to MS. Yes, she is now 80, but this has been the case for her for the last 15 years, and she has had some limitations due to MS for nearly 30 years now. She cannot walk or stand at all. At home we also use a van with a ramp and a power chair and an automatic EZ lock tie down. If we restricted ourselves to that, we would never travel. When we travel, we take a manual chair for shore excursions because we can fold this and put it in a cab, bounce it up a curb or two when there are no curb cuts, and do up to two steps into a shop or museum without ramps. Otherwise, we don't go to those places. We don't expect to find ramped or lift equipped tour buses, which even in the USA are difficult to find. I can either do a "quad pivot" transfer or a slide board transfer for her into a cab.

 

I work (and have worked for the last 30 years) as a a rehabilitation nurse. I have a masters degree in rehabilitation nursing and am a recently elected member of the SCI Hall of Fame, but I guess you don't think I know anything about severe disability for some reason, and you are an expert. I teach my clients how to do these transfers with a family member. Most do not have the money to purchase a van with a lift or ramp, so their only options are paratransit or the family car.

 

Honestly, I hate to sound nasty here, but if you can't be positive and helpful please don't reply. We almost canceled our first cruise due to negative (and coincidentally incorrect) information given by a poster on this site.

 

So, why do you post here if you don't believe the very experienced people on this site and have such little respect for them? How many cruises have you taken with a person with a severe disability? I have had over 15, and we don't let anyone tell us to stay home. I don't know what your problem is, but your attack on me was unwarranted and mean.

[leoandhugh]

I do not know what the OPs problem is, but he or she needs to get a life. I agree the mean attack on Splinter who is probably the most helpful and knowledgable respondent on this board is totally unwarranted. I surely hope that this is not the response he/she gives to others who try to be helpful. Sorry, as a full leg amputee who travels with both fold up wheelchair and scooter, I just had to get that off my chest. I know that Splinter is more helpful than anyone else that I have experienced in more than 4years on this board.

[JNCRUISEBUMS]

I agree! Amen! Nancie:cool:

[laddcalcagno]

I'm sorry for those of you who are offended by my posts, but the general consensus here is obviously I have no clue what I'm taking about when it comes to the welfare of the person in question. I assure you, I haven't adopted a wheelchair bound person to cruise within the past couple of days since my first post. My life, as one of you suggested I need to get, has been about living with the challenges of his disablities. He's never had the luxury of use of his legs or arms as many of you do. Nor the mental capacity to ask these questions for himself. He was born with his disability and will never have those chances. And while we are lucky enough to be able to afford an adaptive van for him, a normal car is not possible because he does not have enough trunk control to hold himself steady without supportive equipment on either side of him. We've tried getting him into our normal cars at home....he ends up lying on his back in the back and it takes two people to lift him into a sitting position. He can't lift himself up into a sitting position. And in a moving car he has trouble holding himself up in the position.

 

Believe me I have a lot of respect for those of you who get out there and refuse to let any place that isn't easy to get around hold you back, but every case is different, limitations are different. When I refer to age, it is very often and very incorrectly assumed that everyone in a wheelchair but can take a few steps with assistance is someone who is older and simply has issues with walking long distances. You have to understand that point of where I am coming from. Because his body fights natural movements, because he can't help us in any way, we try to avoid making anything any more difficult for us. I myself have been seriously injured whileon vacation in the US when just trying to help him take a few steps.

 

And yet we consider ourselves extremely lucky. Throughout our more then 20 years dealing with the limitations of disability, we have seen far worse. Kids we've come in contact with who can't even control their heads, forget the rest of their bodies, who are confined to a bed their whole lives who will never have the chance to go anywhere. People who were born without both legs and arms and have had to be carried around their whole lives. We've thank god never had to worry about a feeding tube, or breathing problems, or other of the more basic body functions being a problem. But we have seen them all.

 

And Splinter, please don't misunderstand, I fully respect your level of experience as a traveler and in your job. I know it takes a lot of work to get where you are, I know many people in that field, as someone who's lived with this my whole life I know I could not commit myself to working with it as well. But you obviously don't respect that when I say transferring is not possible I don't know my own situation well enough to what the limitations are. You went right into questioning why. Our experiences while similar in length are very different in origin.

Finally - to Selma and NortherLite, thank you for your suggestions, I shall look into them in more detail to see if they are something that would be possible to do and would hold interest for us.

[NorthernLite]

Hey,

 

Person in party that is in WC cannot transfer except to take a few steps with assistance. Transferring out of wheelchair for taxi or other form of transportation is not an option.

 

Thanks!

 

Sorry but your first sentence here normally equals that the second sentence has not been tried or you need to try a different type of transfer.

 

The vast amounts of money that St Thomas takes in at the main port with it's miles or so of jewelry and high end duty free stuff tend to go right back to the European and US companies that own them. The only real US tax dollars returned to the island is from personal income tax of fulltime citizens. Once outside the dock area and a few well gated resorts and vacation private homes of the rich poverty is rampant. Curb cuts are well done in the dock area and if you stop at Walmart. Sorry but that was how I saw it in 2003.

 

The trolley/bus tour is rather winding and hits sharp turns. If your friend/son? has balance problems I strongely suggest using a chest strap and an extra gait belt for the trip. Explain to the tour director and they'll make sure his chair is well secured and sit you behind or next to him if at all possible. The view from the summit is wonderful and highly enhanced by a daiquari or two. :-) I'm not up on Magen's Bay just the director of accessvi told me they were working hard on a hard pack trail in and buying the large wheeled beach wheelchairs to rent. They also had plans to make this an accessible scuba area. I'd email and ask if the beach has a hard top area with shade and snacks and if they have an accessible way to get there. That woman worked hard to just get the money for a short lift inside the summit area so we could get out to the viewing platform. The taxi union has fought accessible ramp van taxis and they were still fighting over accessible boats to St John when I spoke to her.

 

We're going back to St Maarten the end of October. Royal Caribbean/Celebrity offers SM12, an accessible boat and shipwreck snorkel adventure. I may try that without the snorkeling. Still having a lot of pain in one shoulder. If not it's a taxi to Marigot on the French side. We will check out the Green House Restaurant since it is a smooth wheel from the dock and close by so easy to stop to check out on the way back.

 

I hate to say it but we found Arica, Chile, once out of the port, to be more accessible than St Thomas as far as curb cuts, level store ways and outdoor cafes. They even have accessible public bathrooms with showers to one side of the nearest public park. As of 2004 none of the public high schools on St Thomas were accredited. It's a terrible state of things in a US territory. We did find a bookstore within the dock area, not very wide aisles but it is locally owned and you'll find books not readibly found on the mainland. I believe the restaurant at the dock, it has an outside deck with shady pam trees, is also locally owned as is accessvi. IOWs to improve things down there you need to support local companies and I don't mean Walmart.

 

I'll report back on St Maarten when we return but we don't have a cruise booked presently that includes St Thomas.

[TigerLady]

Its not an option because we're not talking about an old person. This is someone who can't walk on their own. They have extremely limited mobility due to flexibility and strength issues. A few steps on their own is just not possible, they require help at all times from someone. Getting into a car at home isn't possible, we have a special chair lift and van. And they don't use a power chair because the person in question doesn't have the capabilities to steer on their own.

 

Honestly, I hate to sound nasty here, but if you can't be positive and helpful please don't reply. We almost canceled our first cruise due to negative (and coincidentally incorrect) information given by a poster on this site. People make it sound like anyone who uses a wheelchair should just stay home because there's nothing for them to do, no place that's accessible, and no one that will help. I've found that with enough research and finding the right people to help its very easy for someone who can't get around without the aide of a wheelchair. That includes cruises.

 

I'll try and be more specific here....i'm looking for real help, suggestions of places to sightsee in St. Thomas and St. Marteen and suggestions for beaches. I'd like real stories and experiences as well as links for websites if available. Through this site I was already able to find a Trolley that is accessible for tours on St. Thomas as well as an aquarium. I'd still like more info on St. Marteen and beaches.

 

Negative, uninformed post from people who don't understand the real challenges of accessibility are a waste of my time.

 

Hello, my name is Robyn and like you, we have wheelchair issues in ports as well. Let me explain. My22 y/o son is wheelchair bound from Spina Bifida. Walking is NOT an option as well. When we contacted the RCCL excursion people, they weren't real helpful. They told us what their tour operators couldn't do. They didn't give any suggestions on what was available. I'll enclose their email address, maybe you can get moe assistance from them. I understand you position, and wished more poepl would understand ours. Have a Blessed day.

ShorexAccess@rccl.com Good Luck!!

[AJTWC]

If I may add my two cents......

 

As the mother of a child with multiple disabilities, I totally understand the meaning of "transfer is not an option". My adult son has cerebral palsy and is developmentally delayed. His weight bearing is extremely limited; to transfer him requires most of my strength. Being in my mid-fifties, it can be hazardous. We have both fallen while I was trying to pivot him from the car into his wheelchair. It's not a task I would care to attempt in a foreign country. In addition, his mental abilities preclude him from understanding what is required of him. I'm sure he would do his best to help out if he were able to understand the situation.

 

Seriously, if someone posts and says "transfer is not an option", why can't we take that person at his/her word? Who better understands the situation than the person involved?

 

There are all kinds of disabilities. Some are acquired, some are congenital, some are physical, others are mental or emotional. Unfortunately some people have more than one disability. It is difficult to grasp all the limitations on such a life unless one is living it, or caring for that person.

 

As for my advice in this situation..... I'm not familiar with the particular destinations, but there is time to do enough investigating before the travel date. Try contacting the Chamber of Commerce - they are familiar with local people who can provide the needed service/vehicle. RCCL, while a wonderful cruise line, is sadly lacking in shore excursions for disabled people. When I tried calling that department, I was informed that there are only TWO people working it, and that is for the ENTIRE cruise line.

 

Good luck.

[NorthernLite]

Selma, Thanks for the info on Joyce Prince. I'm emailing her tonight. We'd really rather see Marigot and Gran Case if there are no ducks splashing through the salt ponds on the Dutch side. Our friends will be heading to Orient Beach. LOL I haven't even gone topless since I was about 30. Now? Well, that's one way to clear an area for sunning. LOL

 

AJTWC, I'd suggest leaving out the assisted steps and add "due to balance problems" and most here would understand CP was then likely. It does help to start with all the information possible to help.

[JNCRUISEBUMS]

Selma, Thanks for the info on Joyce Prince. I'm emailing her tonight. We'd really rather see Marigot and Gran Case if there are no ducks splashing through the salt ponds on the Dutch side. Our friends will be heading to Orient Beach. LOL I haven't even gone topless since I was about 30. Now? Well, that's one way to clear an area for sunning. LOL

 

AJTWC, I'd suggest leaving out the assisted steps and add "due to balance problems" and most here would understand CP was then likely. It does help to start with all the information possible to help.

We are going with Joyce Prince all day Nov. 28th. Can hardly wait! She has been wonderful to email to, very prompt responses! We are doing this with another couple and it is $300 for the whole day. You can do less. Have fun! Nancie:cool:

[rangeley]

We have used ShoreTrips.com They have some accessible trips, you have to click on the trip and read the info to see if its accessible. You can email them and they are very good answering your questions.