Daily Mass

[lysolqn]

Please tell me where I am wrong.

 

Gladly.

 

A Catholic priest can attend to all faiths.

 

Perhaps a Catholic priest can attend to those of other Christian faiths, but he cannot minister (no pun intended!) to those of the Jewish faith.

 

The Catholic Church is the one faith that requires it's members to attend services a minimum of once a week. With other faiths, it is not a requirement.

 

While the Catholic Church may, in fact, require its members to attend services a minimum of once a week, the Jewish faith requires a quorum of adult males for prayer three times a day. Muslims are likewise required to gather for prayer several times a day.

[sailsalot]

In reply to the above poster, the difference with Catholics is that there NEEDS to be a priest to have a Mass. No one has yet to state that this same requirement exists in other faiths. I, and others, understand there are prayer requirements, but does this require the presence of a minister or other clergy? If that is the case, then please let us know. Otherwise, the cries of those seeking equal treatment among all faiths on a cruiseship hold no water since all faiths do NOT have the same requirements for observation.

[Cruise Arizona]

Holy Communion is the central part of Catholic worship. While lay people may minister in other aspects of Catholic worship, they cannot consecrate the Communion Hosts, only an ordained Priest may do that.

 

In mission parishes, in the rural US for example, that do not have a full time priest, a visiting priest can consecrate the hosts to be used at a later date in their absences, but they are then stored in the church's sacred tabernacle until the next service. They cannot be stored in a casual place.

 

While Catholics could meet, pray, sing and worship together, they would not be able to receive communion unless a priest is present since there is not Holy place to store the consecrated hosts onboard a cruise ship. I guess they could build a little chapel with a tabernacle, but a live priest seems to be more in line.

 

I do find it odd that people of other faiths would actually have a problem with this, but I guess it is just political correctness gone wrong.

 

Heck, why not have the Priest, Rabbi and Minister room together. I'm sure some great jokes would come out of that living arrangement.

[FinelyCruising]

 

After many internal discussions, external research, and marketing investigations, Celebrity Cruises will only place Roman Catholic Priests on sailings that take place over the Easter and Christmas holiday. This has not been an easy decision for the corporate office, and many hours of meetings, reviews, emails, discussions, and conversations took place.

 

This change will be effective upon the first sailing of each vessel in 2010."

 

Just thought you'd all like to know what Celebrity's "official" position is on the matter. So it seems that a group of people with the mentality of "If them, why not me?" has effectively done away with the religious needs of a large group of both passengers and crew. I hope they're happy with themselves.

 

I think that its important to understand that Celebrity agreed they were being exclusionary and found that they were suggesting that one religion or two religions were more important than another so they determined this was an amenity that they have decided to eliminate. I appreciate that this response was posted and that they addressed the question in the manner that they have.

 

As for the crew....on one of the closed threads I asked to consider what employers provide spiritual leadership to their employees. I don't know if there ever was a response since the thread went poof at some point.

[usha]

As for the crew....on one of the closed threads I asked to consider what employers provide spiritual leadership to their employees.

Well, Holland America comes to mind.:cool:

and their crew Masses are packed.

[hancock]

The difference is that the employees can leave their place of business to go home and to worship as they choose. The crew has very little opportunity to leave their place of employment, the ship.

[usha]

As for the crew....on one of the closed threads I asked to consider what employers provide spiritual leadership to their employees.

There's always the U.S. armed forces....

[usha]

I was interested to see that Celebrity is at least making some attempt to give us an opportunity to attend Mass.

http://www.celebritycruises.com/beforeyourcruise/faq/home.do;jsessionid=0000OtteDsNFxoLTyn2OhSC3PTu:12hdebdrn?faqSubjectName=Onboard+Services&faqId=3977&pagename=faq_answers

[Cruise Arizona]

"In-Port Catholic Mass Where available, the ship will make arrangements with a local parish to provide a priest for Saturday or Sunday Catholic Mass (applicable only to ships while in port). Please check with the Guest Relations Desk or the Groups Bulletin Board onboard for more information."

 

That is at least a step in the right direction. Perhaps when in port on a Saturday, they could have anticipated mass on Saturday at 4:00 or so for a 5:30 departure. That would definitely help, because Saturday night mass in port is usually after departure time. That is actually very helpful, perhaps this is in response to those who have expresses a desire to retain the ship board priests.

[FinelyCruising]

The difference is that the employees can leave their place of business to go home and to worship as they choose. The crew has very little opportunity to leave their place of employment, the ship.

 

I recognize that but if you take a look at the homelands of many of the workers, India, South Africa, Phillipines...I think you find a different spiritual base than the United States and a much broader base as well.

[Gablin]

I have been contemplating this issue since the first time it was posted. My first reaction was the self-centered one that says "well, why should they pay for a cruise for clergy of one religion and not for all of the other ones?" After reading so many replies from devout Catholics, I believe I understand their angst better than I did.

 

In fact, my brother is a very conservative Lutheran and believes that he is obligated to participate in communion each week. A Catholic priest would not give him communion, however, so he might feel discriminated against if a cruise line paid the way for the priest, but not for a Lutheran minister (of the correct synod, of course.)

 

What if Catholics contacted each other (Roll Calls here would be one way to do it.) when booking a cruise and pooled their funds to pay the way for a priest to be on the same cruise? I know it's cumbersome, but it would solve the problem, I think. I am acquainted with a Catholic family who has a priest for the family. In other words, they pay his salary and expenses, and then he travels with them. This is, of course, beyond the finances of most families, but the concept would be the same.

 

Groups of Baptists, Jews, Unitarians, Lutherans, Muslims, Bahais, Christian Scientists, Buddhists, Mormons, Methodists (Free or United) etc., could do the same - pay the way for a clergy member or spiritual leader to travel with them.

 

I suppose it is likely that religious leaders would be willing to cruise in an inside cabin, but what a gift it would be to one to buy them a veranda cabin and a bit of onboard credit or dinner in one of the ports!

 

I believe that most of the ships would be willing to make space available for services provided by volunteer spiritual leaders.

 

Those who contributed to paying the way for the priest/rabbi/minister/leader would be doing a nice favor for the others of their faith who had not known of the opportunity, and who would receive the blessings.

 

My second idea is for the individual religious denominations to fund the cruises for their priests, etc., much as they have sent missionaries to places not served by local priests.

 

Passengers who have a favorite cruise line could check with their denomination to see if they provide clergy on those ships and request it, if they don't.

 

I'm not even Buddhist, but I would put a small contribution in to help to pay the way for the Dalai Lama, although I suppose he might be unwilling to accept a cruise. How interesting it would be to attend something he would put together on a cruise ship!

[keela1eva2]

I would doubt very much whether a Priest would be available to say Mass whilst a Ship was in Port. With the decline of Priests generally they are often stretched and have to say Mass in more than one Parish and elsewhere. I think this would be unrealistic but it may suit X to state this as a possibility.

 

Sue

[usha]

I recognize that but if you take a look at the homelands of many of the workers, India, South Africa, Phillipines...I think you find a different spiritual base than the United States and a much broader base as well.

86% of those from the Phillipines are Catholic.:cool:

[Gablin]

I would doubt very much whether a Priest would be available to say Mass whilst a Ship was in Port. With the decline of Priests generally they are often stretched and have to say Mass in more than one Parish and elsewhere. I think this would be unrealistic but it may suit X to state this as a possibility.

 

Sue

 

Then, how was it possible to have a priest on every Celebrity sailing in the past?

[annierie]

Then, how was it possible to have a priest on every Celebrity sailing in the past?

 

Free vacation ;)

[FinelyCruising]

86% of those from the Phillipines are Catholic.:cool:

 

I think its a bit less than that, but close in any event. What about the others? Croatia, Roman Catholic too. Can you name other homelands on Celebrity that you noticed in addition the the others that I had listed before that travel as crew?

 

While it is assumed that the mix of the crew is from homelands that are of a predominant Roman Catholic religion, and when for the purpose of speaking about the affect on the crew, I think its correct to not eliminate any single religion if the argument is 'what about the crew'.

 

What about the crew? Each and every one of them. The Hindu's get passed over because there are not enough of them to get represented? The B'hai get overlooked because there are not enough of them too? What about those who are of the Church of the King?

 

Take a look at the crew and see the diversity and then apply it toward all those who cruise on Celebrity and the magnitude of the problem is then obvious. If the idea is that there are more of one religion than another and so it should be the majority rule then that statement speaks volumes.:cool:

[usha]

Free vacation ;)

you mean WORKING VACATION?????:)

[Dabu17]

Holiday Catholic Mass: A Roman Catholic Priest will conduct services daily during Lent and on Palm Sunday, Easter Sunday and Christmas Day.In-Port Catholic MassWhere available, the ship will make arrangements with a local parish to provide a priest for Saturday or Sunday Catholic Mass (applicable only to ships while in port). Please check with the Guest Relations Desk or the Groups Bulletin Board onboard for more information.

 

Holy Land Voyage Catholic MassA Roman Catholic Priest will conduct Catholic and Interdenominational services daily during each Holy Land voyage.

 

Jewish ServicesA Jewish Rabbi or Cantor will conduct services during Passover, Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur, and Hanukkah.

 

Holiday Protestant ServicesA Protestant Minister will conduct daily services during Lent and on Palm Sunday, Easter Sunday and Christmas Day.

 

Holiday Interdenominational ServicesA Protestant Minister will conduct daily services during Lent and on Palm Sunday, Easter Sunday and Christmas Day.

 

 

This is the new policy.

[Shirley and Les]

Well, Holland America comes to mind.:cool:

and their crew Masses are packed.

We were on a 16 night Panama Canal cruise on the Millie last October. Believe it or not, we had two priests working the cruise. One was designated (hired) and he brought along another priest that shared his cabin. They had done this on previous cruises and it was a way for them to enjoy two vacations at minimal cost.

 

We were absolutely astounded at the number of people attending both Sunday and daily Mass during this cruise. On several occasions, the 3rd floor theater was filled to capacity during Mass. Personally, we are disappointed with Celebrity's policy change and we will look at Holland America very closely for our next cruise.

 

I am surprised, and disappointed, that Celebrity would blame this policy change on complaints from passengers. We always include a comment about the availability of Mass in our comment card. Cruise lines do their best to cater to all types of different groups. I don't think they have instituted a policy prohibiting wheeling your hog on board during a Harley cruise. I personally feel =X= is just cutting costs again with this new policy.

[usha]

I think its a bit less than that, but close in any event. What about the others? Croatia, Roman Catholic too. Can you name other homelands on Celebrity that you noticed in addition the the others that I had listed before that travel as crew?

 

While it is assumed that the mix of the crew is from homelands that are of a predominant Roman Catholic religion, and when for the purpose of speaking about the affect on the crew, I think its correct to not eliminate any single religion if the argument is 'what about the crew'.

 

What about the crew? Each and every one of them. The Hindu's get passed over because there are not enough of them to get represented? The B'hai get overlooked because there are not enough of them too? What about those who are of the Church of the King?

 

Take a look at the crew and see the diversity and then apply it toward all those who cruise on Celebrity and the magnitude of the problem is then obvious. If the idea is that there are more of one religion than another and so it should be the majority rule then that statement speaks volumes.:cool:

Here are some statistics on the largest Catholic populations in the world:

 

 

 

Top 10 Nations with Most Catholics

Nation Percent Number of baptizedCatholics

Brazil 86.50% 134,818,000

Mexico 95.30 86,305,000

USA 26.00 61,000,000

Philippines 83.60 58,735,000

Italy 97.20% 55,599,000

France 82.10 47,773,000

Spain 94.20 36,956,000

Poland 95.40 36,835,000

Colombia 91.90 32,260,000

Argentina 90.70 31,546,000

Germany 34.80 28,403,000

 

Source: 1998 Catholic Almanac: Our Sunday Visitor: USA (1997), pg. 333-367. Except U.S. figures, which are from general sources.

 

 

There are a lot of us all over the place.:) Looking at these statistics, I would bet that the vast majority of the crew on Celebrity is probably Catholic.

FC, it sounds like your argument is that Celebrity can't accommodate pax of every single religion, so they shouldn't accommodate anyone at all. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face...:confused:

Well, at least the new program Celebrity is rolling out shows some effort on their part to provide as many pax as it will with opportunities for worship.

[Sea and Me]

Some of you have sent emails to Celebrity and I was wondering what is their address? I would like to tell them of my disappointment in not offering daily mass.

 

Thanks,

Carol

[usha]

This should be a little easier to read::o

Top 10 Nations with Most Catholics

Nation------ Percent ----Number of baptizedCatholics

Brazil -------86.50% ----134,818,000

Mexico ------95.30 ------86,305,000

USA--------- 26.00 ------61,000,000

Philippines--- 83.60 ------58,735,000

Italy --------97.20%----- 55,599,000

France ------82.10 ------47,773,000

Spain -------94.20 ------36,956,000

Poland ------95.40 ------36,835,000

Colombia ----91.90 ------32,260,000

Argentina ---90.70 ------31,546,000

Germany ----34.80 ------28,403,000

[sailsalot]

To Carol P. and anyone else interested,

 

If you want the information on a specific person to email to express your displeasure at Celebrity's new policy of not having priests onboard each sailing, please email me directly and I will get that information to you. My email address is xrayjon1@yahoo.com.

 

Thanks!

[usha]

Carol, here's a link to Celebrity's email form:

https://secure.celebritycruises.com/contactus/custSvcsForm.do;jsessionid=0000bMJN98ax6tzdy2huBT97FkB:12hdebebp

[Cruise Arizona]

We have had about 8 waiters, assistant waiters, and cabin attendants from Goa, India, where the population is almost 26% Christian,(Roman Catholic). However, all of the crew members we met from that area were devout Roman Catholic. Perhaps they were comfortable choosing to work for Celebrity because they had the opportunity to attend Mass.

 

One of the earlier posters mentioned Croatia. Lots of Croatians working for Celebrity too. Croatia is 88% Roman Catholic.

 

I do think it is sad for the crew, because for those of us that are guests, we are only there for one week, and have enough time or frees schedule to attend mass in port. But crew, I think really appreciated having a Priest on board.

 

For those of us who find a priest important, please keep reminding the powers that be at Celebrity that this is important to you. It is the only way that they will take notice.