NCL Suffers By Comparison .....

[Medtech2]

great post, happy belated annivesary and I bet whether you are upper class, lower class or what you have class. That is something money will never buy. Many with money are totally boring and classless. I would love to cruise with you..

 

Nita

Thank you!!

[Medtech2]

great post, happy belated annivesary and I bet whether you are upper class, lower class or what you have class. That is something money will never buy. Many with money are totally boring and classless. I would love to cruise with you..

 

Nita

Thank you!!

[gottahavefun]

for us, more than an actually decline has been changes. Some I don't like, some I love, but overall cruising is still a great way to spend a vacation. In fact all vacations should be fun and most are, as long as people do not think they are slightly above the rest of the world.

 

Nita

 

Amen!

[gottahavefun]

for us, more than an actually decline has been changes. Some I don't like, some I love, but overall cruising is still a great way to spend a vacation. In fact all vacations should be fun and most are, as long as people do not think they are slightly above the rest of the world.

 

Nita

 

Amen!

[CanadianTwosome]

Could you please point out to me the post where anyone accused the cruiselines of false advertising? I must have missed that post. I did see some posts where people commented that the cruiselines do business in a different way these days than they used to, or that they pushed harder to sell things but I can't find the one accusing them of false advertising.

 

 

 

I'm going to try to explain my view point once again and then if you still don't get it, I give up.

 

For me it is not that I can't resist or can't say no to something. It is simply that when I am on vacation I prefer not to have to deal with it every second minute.

 

 

In my everyday life I am always making spending decisions (as I"m sure most of you are) do we use this money to remodel the bathroom or do we put it aside to replace the car which is getting a little old and may need major repairs soon? Is it better to rent an apartment near to the university with a higher monthly rent ot live further away for cheaper, but add the cost of transportation to the budget? Do I buy shoes for $20 and probably replace them in a couple of months or pay more and hope they will last longer? I know how to make choices and tradeoffs I just happen to prefer not to have to do it all the time for those few precious days or weeks I am on vacation.

From the posts here it seems obvious that a lot of other posters don't feel that way, and that is fine for them, but please, don't presume that just because someone doesn't enjoy living a la carte while on vacation that they need a lecture on self-control or budgeting.

 

How odd... I have no recollection whatsoever of quoting you, addressing you, or in any way singling you out, but you seem to have taken my post - or at least the exerpt you quoted - quite personally. Unlike some on these boards, however, unless I've specifically quoted or addressed someone, my posts are general - they are simply an expression of my thoughts/feelings/opinions about whatever it is I'm talking about. In the case of my last post, the topic was the number of posts I've seen in this thread and others in which people have expressed negative feelings about NCL or other lines having 'too many' pay options, the idea that all/most of the current pay options were included in the 'good old days', not being able to know in advance what the total for their cruise is, and the idea that marketers are so good at their jobs that they know how to 'trick' people into spending money even if they don't want to. I have no idea exactly which posts or posters expressed these ideas, and I haven't got time to weed back through the thread looking for every reference, but the ideas are here. It's possible that I even misunderstood some of them, but that doesn't change the fact that what I said in my post is relevant. :)

 

If you'd like my opinion on what you have said specifically, I think NCL is not the line for you. If I'm reading your posts correctly, you're looking for something in between NCL and Cunard - a line that will provide everything (or as much as possible) that you want to experience on a cruise, and include it in your fare - without resulting in a prohibitively high ticket price. I'm sure there's at least one or two lines out there that do this. If I felt as you do, I wouldn't even bother coming to the NCL boards; I'd spend my time researching other lines looking for one that provides the product I'm looking for at a price I'm willing to pay. Please understand I'm not suggesting that you aren't welcome here. I just don't have a lot of free time, so the idea of spending it on a board that represents a product that doesn't interest me seems like a waste to me.

 

As for vocal travellers having the power to change things (which I believe you referenced in a later post), I agree that it has happened. There was a recent decision to stop offering bar set ups (I think that's what it was) and an email campaign instigated on this board restored the program within two days. The Freestyle sytem, however, is absolutely here to stay in my opinion. There are just too many of us who prefer the choice system of paying for extras. It may seem petty, but I don't want to have $15 added to my fare so that other passengers can enjoy cappucino and bowling; I'd rather spend it on a dinner at LeBistro - something I enjoy that I don't expect other passengers to supplement. :)

[CanadianTwosome]

Could you please point out to me the post where anyone accused the cruiselines of false advertising? I must have missed that post. I did see some posts where people commented that the cruiselines do business in a different way these days than they used to, or that they pushed harder to sell things but I can't find the one accusing them of false advertising.

 

 

 

I'm going to try to explain my view point once again and then if you still don't get it, I give up.

 

For me it is not that I can't resist or can't say no to something. It is simply that when I am on vacation I prefer not to have to deal with it every second minute.

 

 

In my everyday life I am always making spending decisions (as I"m sure most of you are) do we use this money to remodel the bathroom or do we put it aside to replace the car which is getting a little old and may need major repairs soon? Is it better to rent an apartment near to the university with a higher monthly rent ot live further away for cheaper, but add the cost of transportation to the budget? Do I buy shoes for $20 and probably replace them in a couple of months or pay more and hope they will last longer? I know how to make choices and tradeoffs I just happen to prefer not to have to do it all the time for those few precious days or weeks I am on vacation.

From the posts here it seems obvious that a lot of other posters don't feel that way, and that is fine for them, but please, don't presume that just because someone doesn't enjoy living a la carte while on vacation that they need a lecture on self-control or budgeting.

 

How odd... I have no recollection whatsoever of quoting you, addressing you, or in any way singling you out, but you seem to have taken my post - or at least the exerpt you quoted - quite personally. Unlike some on these boards, however, unless I've specifically quoted or addressed someone, my posts are general - they are simply an expression of my thoughts/feelings/opinions about whatever it is I'm talking about. In the case of my last post, the topic was the number of posts I've seen in this thread and others in which people have expressed negative feelings about NCL or other lines having 'too many' pay options, the idea that all/most of the current pay options were included in the 'good old days', not being able to know in advance what the total for their cruise is, and the idea that marketers are so good at their jobs that they know how to 'trick' people into spending money even if they don't want to. I have no idea exactly which posts or posters expressed these ideas, and I haven't got time to weed back through the thread looking for every reference, but the ideas are here. It's possible that I even misunderstood some of them, but that doesn't change the fact that what I said in my post is relevant. :)

 

If you'd like my opinion on what you have said specifically, I think NCL is not the line for you. If I'm reading your posts correctly, you're looking for something in between NCL and Cunard - a line that will provide everything (or as much as possible) that you want to experience on a cruise, and include it in your fare - without resulting in a prohibitively high ticket price. I'm sure there's at least one or two lines out there that do this. If I felt as you do, I wouldn't even bother coming to the NCL boards; I'd spend my time researching other lines looking for one that provides the product I'm looking for at a price I'm willing to pay. Please understand I'm not suggesting that you aren't welcome here. I just don't have a lot of free time, so the idea of spending it on a board that represents a product that doesn't interest me seems like a waste to me.

 

As for vocal travellers having the power to change things (which I believe you referenced in a later post), I agree that it has happened. There was a recent decision to stop offering bar set ups (I think that's what it was) and an email campaign instigated on this board restored the program within two days. The Freestyle sytem, however, is absolutely here to stay in my opinion. There are just too many of us who prefer the choice system of paying for extras. It may seem petty, but I don't want to have $15 added to my fare so that other passengers can enjoy cappucino and bowling; I'd rather spend it on a dinner at LeBistro - something I enjoy that I don't expect other passengers to supplement. :)

[CanadianTwosome]

What would you choose?

 

THIS or THAT?

 

#1, #2, #3 or #4... descriptions below were taken from 4-different cruise line descriptions.

 

 

#1

Relive the Golden Age of travel. Experience six unforgettable days to revel in activities and fascinating enrichment programs. Your days and nights at sea offer an abundance of possibilities. Spend a refreshing moment beneath a waterfall in the AquaTherapy Centre of the Canyon Ranch SpaClub®, browse the books in the largest library collection at sea, attend lavish Royal Nights balls, indulge in traditional Afternoon Tea in the Queens Room, or enrich yourself during a ?????? Insights™ lecture program. Dine on fine cuisine and, perhaps best of all, be among the privileged travelers who can say they have experienced an extraordinary legacy.

 

#2

If your family just can't get enough Nickelodeon™, imagine their excitement when you tell them they'll be sailing on a Nickelodeon All Access Cruise vacation. Nickelodeon will take over the entire ship with imaginative surprises around every corner. The whole family will love this Bahamas vacation. With ports-of-call near Orlando's theme parks, NASA's Port Canaveral, and Atlantis Casino's Aquaventure; there's fun to be had by everyone. Plus you'll experience three fun days at sea with your favorite cast and shows on Nickelodeon.

 

#3

Set sail on the new ship ????? and discover an array of exotic western Caribbean ports to be explored. Aboard the ????, you’ll be one of the first to experience the ship’s many exciting entertainment options, nightlife and 17 dining choices.

 

 

#4

An architectural marvel at sea, ?????? ℠ spans 16 decks and carries 5,400 guests. The ship is the first to tout the cruise line’s new neighborhood concept of seven distinct themed areas, which includes Central Park, Boardwalk, and the Royal Promenade.

 

For me, none of these are enough to make a decision. I research all of our family travel exhaustively, so mere little blurbs would never be the basis of a decision for me. All four appeal to me because they're describing cruises. After that, I've got too many questions that aren't answered: What are the departure ports? What is the itinerary? How long are the cruises? How much is the base fare? Do they have a good kids' program?

 

It has been recently mentioned in this thread that some feel the 'special' feeling that people expect from cruising is no longer there. For me it is, and I expect it always will be, but I'm sure that's due to my personal perspective on cruising - and really, vacation travelling in general. When I'm away from home and I don't have to work, don't have to do any housework, and am completely free to choose what I want to do, when I want to do it - or to do nothing at all - that makes me feel special. I guess I'm easy to please, but while it appears sometimes that some of the posters here think that's a bad thing, I think it's the best way to be. I'm happy a LOT. :) Just having my daughter want to sit beside me on the couch and put my arm around her shoulders and rest her head on mine makes me feel special - so when she does the same thing on the deck of a cruise ship sailing in beautiful warm waters while my house is covered in snow... well, 'special' doesn't even cover it, really. :)

[CanadianTwosome]

What would you choose?

 

THIS or THAT?

 

#1, #2, #3 or #4... descriptions below were taken from 4-different cruise line descriptions.

 

 

#1

Relive the Golden Age of travel. Experience six unforgettable days to revel in activities and fascinating enrichment programs. Your days and nights at sea offer an abundance of possibilities. Spend a refreshing moment beneath a waterfall in the AquaTherapy Centre of the Canyon Ranch SpaClub®, browse the books in the largest library collection at sea, attend lavish Royal Nights balls, indulge in traditional Afternoon Tea in the Queens Room, or enrich yourself during a ?????? Insights™ lecture program. Dine on fine cuisine and, perhaps best of all, be among the privileged travelers who can say they have experienced an extraordinary legacy.

 

#2

If your family just can't get enough Nickelodeon™, imagine their excitement when you tell them they'll be sailing on a Nickelodeon All Access Cruise vacation. Nickelodeon will take over the entire ship with imaginative surprises around every corner. The whole family will love this Bahamas vacation. With ports-of-call near Orlando's theme parks, NASA's Port Canaveral, and Atlantis Casino's Aquaventure; there's fun to be had by everyone. Plus you'll experience three fun days at sea with your favorite cast and shows on Nickelodeon.

 

#3

Set sail on the new ship ????? and discover an array of exotic western Caribbean ports to be explored. Aboard the ????, you’ll be one of the first to experience the ship’s many exciting entertainment options, nightlife and 17 dining choices.

 

 

#4

An architectural marvel at sea, ?????? ℠ spans 16 decks and carries 5,400 guests. The ship is the first to tout the cruise line’s new neighborhood concept of seven distinct themed areas, which includes Central Park, Boardwalk, and the Royal Promenade.

 

For me, none of these are enough to make a decision. I research all of our family travel exhaustively, so mere little blurbs would never be the basis of a decision for me. All four appeal to me because they're describing cruises. After that, I've got too many questions that aren't answered: What are the departure ports? What is the itinerary? How long are the cruises? How much is the base fare? Do they have a good kids' program?

 

It has been recently mentioned in this thread that some feel the 'special' feeling that people expect from cruising is no longer there. For me it is, and I expect it always will be, but I'm sure that's due to my personal perspective on cruising - and really, vacation travelling in general. When I'm away from home and I don't have to work, don't have to do any housework, and am completely free to choose what I want to do, when I want to do it - or to do nothing at all - that makes me feel special. I guess I'm easy to please, but while it appears sometimes that some of the posters here think that's a bad thing, I think it's the best way to be. I'm happy a LOT. :) Just having my daughter want to sit beside me on the couch and put my arm around her shoulders and rest her head on mine makes me feel special - so when she does the same thing on the deck of a cruise ship sailing in beautiful warm waters while my house is covered in snow... well, 'special' doesn't even cover it, really. :)

[Mr. Luckytoo]

What would you choose?

 

THIS or THAT?

 

#1, #2, #3 or #4... descriptions below were taken from 4-different cruise line descriptions.

 

 

#1

Relive the Golden Age of travel. Experience six unforgettable days to revel in activities and fascinating enrichment programs. Your days and nights at sea offer an abundance of possibilities. Spend a refreshing moment beneath a waterfall in the AquaTherapy Centre of the Canyon Ranch SpaClub®, browse the books in the largest library collection at sea, attend lavish Royal Nights balls, indulge in traditional Afternoon Tea in the Queens Room, or enrich yourself during a ?????? Insights™ lecture program. Dine on fine cuisine and, perhaps best of all, be among the privileged travelers who can say they have experienced an extraordinary legacy.

 

#2

If your family just can't get enough Nickelodeon™, imagine their excitement when you tell them they'll be sailing on a Nickelodeon All Access Cruise vacation. Nickelodeon will take over the entire ship with imaginative surprises around every corner. The whole family will love this Bahamas vacation. With ports-of-call near Orlando's theme parks, NASA's Port Canaveral, and Atlantis Casino's Aquaventure; there's fun to be had by everyone. Plus you'll experience three fun days at sea with your favorite cast and shows on Nickelodeon.

 

#3

Set sail on the new ship ????? and discover an array of exotic western Caribbean ports to be explored. Aboard the ????, you’ll be one of the first to experience the ship’s many exciting entertainment options, nightlife and 17 dining choices.

 

 

#4

An architectural marvel at sea, ?????? ℠ spans 16 decks and carries 5,400 guests. The ship is the first to tout the cruise line’s new neighborhood concept of seven distinct themed areas, which includes Central Park, Boardwalk, and the Royal Promenade.

 

You see this is a great example of people's desires/wants and bias/preconcieved notions.

 

I would take #1 in a heartbeat.

 

If I had young kids then I'd take #2 - not having children I would definately AVOID #2

 

#3 tell me NOTHING about the ship - all promises and nothing to back it up - oh wait that was the Epic right

 

#4 - like #3 it doesn't tell me much about the ship just that there will be LOTS of people on board and since I don't like larger ships not my cup of tea.

 

However several people show a disdain for #1 when in reality that is the best descriptive, most relaxing and choices of the four listed.

 

I guess one of the problems I have with lots of people who cruise is typified with the Carnival Cruise ad. It well done don't get me wrong. However it shows a family (WASP) where the dad acts like a bozo on the cruise, especially on the dance floor where it appears he's having a seizure. His daughter pop's the bubblegum in total disbelief. Here's the link to the video so there is no confusion.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmFr-wrtsF0

 

From a technical POV I think the video/ad is great. What I don't like is the implication that 'fun' and relaxation means behavior that is not everyday normal. It's ok to have fun but does that mean you have to scream, yell, shout and act ridiculous as some CD's would have you believe?

 

Now in another cruise ad for Celebrity it takes a total 180 degree approach to the vacation experience. Instead of focusing on transforming into someone else it focuses on relaxation, special treatment, etc.,

 

 

These are obviously different demographics that the cruiselines are attempting to attract and to be honest I think both Carnival and Celebrity do a GREAT job in identifiying their brand and what they stand for.

 

NCL - not so much as they try to be all things to all people....

[Mr. Luckytoo]

What would you choose?

 

THIS or THAT?

 

#1, #2, #3 or #4... descriptions below were taken from 4-different cruise line descriptions.

 

 

#1

Relive the Golden Age of travel. Experience six unforgettable days to revel in activities and fascinating enrichment programs. Your days and nights at sea offer an abundance of possibilities. Spend a refreshing moment beneath a waterfall in the AquaTherapy Centre of the Canyon Ranch SpaClub®, browse the books in the largest library collection at sea, attend lavish Royal Nights balls, indulge in traditional Afternoon Tea in the Queens Room, or enrich yourself during a ?????? Insights™ lecture program. Dine on fine cuisine and, perhaps best of all, be among the privileged travelers who can say they have experienced an extraordinary legacy.

 

#2

If your family just can't get enough Nickelodeon™, imagine their excitement when you tell them they'll be sailing on a Nickelodeon All Access Cruise vacation. Nickelodeon will take over the entire ship with imaginative surprises around every corner. The whole family will love this Bahamas vacation. With ports-of-call near Orlando's theme parks, NASA's Port Canaveral, and Atlantis Casino's Aquaventure; there's fun to be had by everyone. Plus you'll experience three fun days at sea with your favorite cast and shows on Nickelodeon.

 

#3

Set sail on the new ship ????? and discover an array of exotic western Caribbean ports to be explored. Aboard the ????, you’ll be one of the first to experience the ship’s many exciting entertainment options, nightlife and 17 dining choices.

 

 

#4

An architectural marvel at sea, ?????? ℠ spans 16 decks and carries 5,400 guests. The ship is the first to tout the cruise line’s new neighborhood concept of seven distinct themed areas, which includes Central Park, Boardwalk, and the Royal Promenade.

 

You see this is a great example of people's desires/wants and bias/preconcieved notions.

 

I would take #1 in a heartbeat.

 

If I had young kids then I'd take #2 - not having children I would definately AVOID #2

 

#3 tell me NOTHING about the ship - all promises and nothing to back it up - oh wait that was the Epic right

 

#4 - like #3 it doesn't tell me much about the ship just that there will be LOTS of people on board and since I don't like larger ships not my cup of tea.

 

However several people show a disdain for #1 when in reality that is the best descriptive, most relaxing and choices of the four listed.

 

I guess one of the problems I have with lots of people who cruise is typified with the Carnival Cruise ad. It well done don't get me wrong. However it shows a family (WASP) where the dad acts like a bozo on the cruise, especially on the dance floor where it appears he's having a seizure. His daughter pop's the bubblegum in total disbelief. Here's the link to the video so there is no confusion.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmFr-wrtsF0

 

From a technical POV I think the video/ad is great. What I don't like is the implication that 'fun' and relaxation means behavior that is not everyday normal. It's ok to have fun but does that mean you have to scream, yell, shout and act ridiculous as some CD's would have you believe?

 

Now in another cruise ad for Celebrity it takes a total 180 degree approach to the vacation experience. Instead of focusing on transforming into someone else it focuses on relaxation, special treatment, etc.,

 

 

These are obviously different demographics that the cruiselines are attempting to attract and to be honest I think both Carnival and Celebrity do a GREAT job in identifiying their brand and what they stand for.

 

NCL - not so much as they try to be all things to all people....

[Mr. Luckytoo]

Just having my daughter want to sit beside me on the couch and put my arm around her shoulders and rest her head on mine makes me feel special - so when she does the same thing on the deck of a cruise ship sailing in beautiful warm waters while my house is covered in snow... well, 'special' doesn't even cover it, really. :)

 

A great definition of a special moment-thanks for sharing...

[Mr. Luckytoo]

Just having my daughter want to sit beside me on the couch and put my arm around her shoulders and rest her head on mine makes me feel special - so when she does the same thing on the deck of a cruise ship sailing in beautiful warm waters while my house is covered in snow... well, 'special' doesn't even cover it, really. :)

 

A great definition of a special moment-thanks for sharing...

[Mr. Luckytoo]

#1 reminds me of only 1 thing...there's a reason why the Golden Age isn't the Present Age.... it's a has-been.

 

No it's no longer considered the Golden Age because of the continuous lowering of standards.

 

Thanks forced tolerance...thanks multi-cultural aspeasment...at least according to German leaders

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/atlantic/20101018/cm_atlantic/germanchancellorsaysmulticulturalismhasfailed5423_1

 

The Present Age may also be referred to the Decline of Western Civilization.

[Mr. Luckytoo]

#1 reminds me of only 1 thing...there's a reason why the Golden Age isn't the Present Age.... it's a has-been.

 

No it's no longer considered the Golden Age because of the continuous lowering of standards.

 

Thanks forced tolerance...thanks multi-cultural aspeasment...at least according to German leaders

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/atlantic/20101018/cm_atlantic/germanchancellorsaysmulticulturalismhasfailed5423_1

 

The Present Age may also be referred to the Decline of Western Civilization.

[marinaro44]

No it's no longer considered the Golden Age because of the continuous lowering of standards.

 

Thanks forced tolerance...thanks multi-cultural aspeasment...at least according to German leaders

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/atlantic/20101018/cm_atlantic/germanchancellorsaysmulticulturalismhasfailed5423_1

 

The Present Age may also be referred to the Decline of Western Civilization.

True colors are starting to emerge, just like the autumn leaves.

[jeannep]

You see this is a great example of people's desires/wants and bias/preconcieved notions.

 

I would take #1 in a heartbeat.

 

If I had young kids then I'd take #2 - not having children I would definately AVOID #2

 

#3 tell me NOTHING about the ship - all promises and nothing to back it up - oh wait that was the Epic right

 

#4 - like #3 it doesn't tell me much about the ship just that there will be LOTS of people on board and since I don't like larger ships not my cup of tea.

 

 

These are obviously different demographics that the cruiselines are attempting to attract and to be honest I think both Carnival and Celebrity do a GREAT job in identifiying their brand and what they stand for.

 

NCL - not so much as they try to be all things to all people....

 

Different strokes for different folks. We were just on Carnival and had a great time but give me NCL any day. Freestyle is the way to go (for me).

 

Jeanne

[DandyCandy]

Ok so if people in the "good old days" were so civil and proper, who raised all of us rude,pushy,ignorant no mannered children and young adults?

 

And really, do you need a stranger/someone else to make you feel special? I don't get that. I have never gone on vacation to have someone else make me feel special. I feel special because I can go on vacation.[/ntsquote]

 

 

Perfect response! If you need a stranger/vacation to feel "special" maybe you should try a psychiatrist. They will make you feel "special" for at least 30 minutes if not more and if talking to them doesn't do the trick, the drugs they can prescribe you will.

 

This thread is the perfect example with what's wrong with the world today. People want something for nothing, and that something is never enough.:cool:

[sjbdtz]

No it's no longer considered the Golden Age because of the continuous lowering of standards.

 

Thanks forced tolerance.

 

 

True colors are starting to emerge, just like the autumn leaves.

 

 

Indeed.

 

The very idea that tolerance should NEED to be forced, is repugnant.

 

The Golden Age of anything would continue to persist, if it had any inherent value.

 

If it had inherent value, then there would still be a market for it.

 

If there was a market, there would be a provider. I guess Cunard still strives for that....what? They've changed too?

[nycruise]

These Are The Good Old Days!;)