Question about Service Charge

[Globaliser]

Further, I can't imagine that they'd actually turn the $$$ over if they WERE required. How could that possibly be enforced?

A ship's crew is a very small and confined community. Everyone knows what everyone is up to - all the way down to who is sleeping with whom, which nights of the week. There is no privacy and there are no secrets.

 

Then remember that if they are required to turn in the cash because it's supposed to be shared out, and they don't, they are effectively taking money from their colleagues who would expect to share in that money. That includes many people who will never receive cash tips from passengers - making sure those crew members get paid is one of the reasons why there's a pool.

 

Now imagine that a crew members isn't turning in his cash tips, but keeping them. He'll be getting paid his share from the pool, too. Suddenly, he's rich. And suddenly, the other three people sharing his cabin - and everyone else on boad who knows him - will want to know where the money's come from. It won't take them long to work it out - and then he's got three enemies who have every incentive to turn him in.

 

And then it's end of lucrative job for him.

 

So there are plenty of reasons for crew members to abide by these rules.

[newmexicoNita]

Thank you all for the information. I apperciate your time to response..

 

I hope I didn't stir up too much trouble asking that question.. and if I did I'm sorry I'm just a newbie cruiser :cool:

 

Don't worry about it, at least once every 2 or 3 weeks the subject comes up and we all go around and around.

 

Nita

[newmexicoNita]

Thank you all for the information. I apperciate your time to response..

 

I hope I didn't stir up too much trouble asking that question.. and if I did I'm sorry I'm just a newbie cruiser :cool:

 

Don't worry about it, at least once every 2 or 3 weeks the subject comes up and we all go around and around.

 

Nita

[nezume]

A ship's crew is a very small and confined community. Everyone knows what everyone is up to - all the way down to who is sleeping with whom, which nights of the week. There is no privacy and there are no secrets.

 

Then remember that if they are required to turn in the cash because it's supposed to be shared out, and they don't, they are effectively taking money from their colleagues who would expect to share in that money. That includes many people who will never receive cash tips from passengers - making sure those crew members get paid is one of the reasons why there's a pool.

 

Now imagine that a crew members isn't turning in his cash tips, but keeping them. He'll be getting paid his share from the pool, too. Suddenly, he's rich. And suddenly, the other three people sharing his cabin - and everyone else on boad who knows him - will want to know where the money's come from. It won't take them long to work it out - and then he's got three enemies who have every incentive to turn him in.

 

And then it's end of lucrative job for him.

 

So there are plenty of reasons for crew members to abide by these rules.

 

Not to say that I agree or disagree with waiving the service charge but there's a flaw in your theory. While crew members share rooms with each other and can have fairly easy access to each others belongings at any given time, I doubt there's any easy way for them to access each other's personal financial records.

 

So if a crew member were to be collecting cash tips and not turning them in, if he/she were smart about it, they wouldn't spending it lavishly and looking rich. If they're smart about it they'd wouldn't be be stashing the cash away between the mattresses or in the back of their sock drawer, they probably would send it home to family or stash it in a bank account. That way, none of their coworkers would know how much or how little money they have in their possession.

 

Not trying to argue, just hoping you have a better explanation than "other people would know because they'd be rich!":rolleyes:

[nezume]

A ship's crew is a very small and confined community. Everyone knows what everyone is up to - all the way down to who is sleeping with whom, which nights of the week. There is no privacy and there are no secrets.

 

Then remember that if they are required to turn in the cash because it's supposed to be shared out, and they don't, they are effectively taking money from their colleagues who would expect to share in that money. That includes many people who will never receive cash tips from passengers - making sure those crew members get paid is one of the reasons why there's a pool.

 

Now imagine that a crew members isn't turning in his cash tips, but keeping them. He'll be getting paid his share from the pool, too. Suddenly, he's rich. And suddenly, the other three people sharing his cabin - and everyone else on boad who knows him - will want to know where the money's come from. It won't take them long to work it out - and then he's got three enemies who have every incentive to turn him in.

 

And then it's end of lucrative job for him.

 

So there are plenty of reasons for crew members to abide by these rules.

 

Not to say that I agree or disagree with waiving the service charge but there's a flaw in your theory. While crew members share rooms with each other and can have fairly easy access to each others belongings at any given time, I doubt there's any easy way for them to access each other's personal financial records.

 

So if a crew member were to be collecting cash tips and not turning them in, if he/she were smart about it, they wouldn't spending it lavishly and looking rich. If they're smart about it they'd wouldn't be be stashing the cash away between the mattresses or in the back of their sock drawer, they probably would send it home to family or stash it in a bank account. That way, none of their coworkers would know how much or how little money they have in their possession.

 

Not trying to argue, just hoping you have a better explanation than "other people would know because they'd be rich!":rolleyes:

[DandyCandy]

So you spend all that money on a cruise to go and sit by the service desk to see who has their DSC removed (and listen in on everyone's conversation at the service desk)? :rolleyes:

 

Oh brother!

 

 

LOL! I was thinking that too. Some people do though. Usually the ones sitting in the chairs near the desk are the culprits.:rolleyes:

[DandyCandy]

So you spend all that money on a cruise to go and sit by the service desk to see who has their DSC removed (and listen in on everyone's conversation at the service desk)? :rolleyes:

 

Oh brother!

 

 

LOL! I was thinking that too. Some people do though. Usually the ones sitting in the chairs near the desk are the culprits.:rolleyes:

[sjbdtz]

Not to say that I agree or disagree with waiving the service charge but there's a flaw in your theory. While crew members share rooms with each other and can have fairly easy access to each others belongings at any given time, I doubt there's any easy way for them to access each other's personal financial records.

 

So if a crew member were to be collecting cash tips and not turning them in, if he/she were smart about it, they wouldn't spending it lavishly and looking rich. If they're smart about it they'd wouldn't be be stashing the cash away between the mattresses or in the back of their sock drawer, they probably would send it home to family or stash it in a bank account. That way, none of their coworkers would know how much or how little money they have in their possession.

 

Not trying to argue, just hoping you have a better explanation than "other people would know because they'd be rich!":rolleyes:

 

 

Well... I'm not sure I'd want to leave accumulated sums of cash in my room with 3 roommates.

 

If I added it to my shipboard bank-account in order to send home, then others may question where this cash is coming from.

[sjbdtz]

Not to say that I agree or disagree with waiving the service charge but there's a flaw in your theory. While crew members share rooms with each other and can have fairly easy access to each others belongings at any given time, I doubt there's any easy way for them to access each other's personal financial records.

 

So if a crew member were to be collecting cash tips and not turning them in, if he/she were smart about it, they wouldn't spending it lavishly and looking rich. If they're smart about it they'd wouldn't be be stashing the cash away between the mattresses or in the back of their sock drawer, they probably would send it home to family or stash it in a bank account. That way, none of their coworkers would know how much or how little money they have in their possession.

 

Not trying to argue, just hoping you have a better explanation than "other people would know because they'd be rich!":rolleyes:

 

 

Well... I'm not sure I'd want to leave accumulated sums of cash in my room with 3 roommates.

 

If I added it to my shipboard bank-account in order to send home, then others may question where this cash is coming from.

[nezume]

Well... I'm not sure I'd want to leave accumulated sums of cash in my room with 3 roommates.

 

If I added it to my shipboard bank-account in order to send home, then others may question where this cash is coming from.

 

I'm not saying their bank account is onboard. They could set up something in port and then deposit the cash on each stop... or wire it home again through something on shore. Since most crew members are paid in cash anyways I don't think most banks in port are going to question it too much.

[brfan]

I'm not saying their bank account is onboard. They could set up something in port and then deposit the cash on each stop... or wire it home again through something on shore. Since most crew members are paid in cash anyways I don't think most banks in port are going to question it too much.

 

One other incentive to turn the money in is they will be asked by their boss if they received any tips. If they lie and say no, then their boss will assume they provided bad service and it will go on their record. The crew member will run the risk of losing perks like time off, the types of assignments they get, lose promotion opportunities and even non renewal of their contracts if this happens too often.

 

Also your suggestion of them using port banks may not be very practical since they only get a handful of port days off each month. So they'd have to find a place to hide this money until they were able to get off the ship.

[SilentHill]

I just got off the Jewel on 10/17/2010.

 

I would seriously consider removing my service charge on the next cruise.

 

On the TV. The day before disembarkation it said that the $12/day pool got split between the room stewards and the food service staff. Room service, and any other staff were not included in the pool.

 

I know if we were to order the food we ordered on the cruise even tipping 20% It would not even come close to the $24 a day my wife and I spent in service charges.

 

From what I've gathered (unless it was just me) Unless you have a suite, (my) room stewards are detached from being personal. Aside from the mandatory duties like making towel animals and saying hi to every person on the hallway I didn't feel they did anything that a maid at the motel 6 would have done and should be evenly compensated.

 

IMHO most of them have the "I got the tip already" attitude.

[roveer]

Here's the retired Army in me coming out. You pay for a cruise on NCL with full knowledge that it will cost $12 per day for a Daily Service Charge. It isn't a surprise once you board the ship. No one is sneaking it onto your bill. If it is a deal breaker, don't book on NCL. There aren't many NCL cruises that go to ports that no one else visits, so if it is that bothersome, just book another line. It really is that simple. There are about five hundred threads about the DSC and every argument from every angle has been discussed, rehashed, argued for and against, clarified, and then discussed some more.

 

Normally I would agree with you. What's got me a little steamed is that I've been booked for the past 2 weeks and just read about the "service charge" while perusing my cruise documents. We've cruised DCL in the past and didn't have a service charge tacked on. We tipped.

 

You see for me, and my family os 6 this equates to an additional 504 dollars that (like I said above), I just learned about today. Why would that NOT be accounted for in the cost of the cruise since it's divided across so many people? I'm getting that nickle and dime feeling. If it was included in the fare than I would have seen the number when I booked. The fact that I read it in the book I received after final payment, that shure as heck is small print stuff and I don't like it one bit. If they are being true to the concept of service, then let me decide. If they are making sure everone who participates in the process gets compensated, then put it in the darn fare. Sneaky, that's what I call it.

[johnql]

We've cruised DCL in the past and didn't have a service charge tacked on. We tipped.

To-ma-toes...to-mah-toes. Adds up to the same thing. You should have budgeted for it either way.

[ohioNCLcruiser]

When you tip a certain person instead of the service charge that crew member is not going to pocket it all and "stiff" their junior waiter, assistant cabin steward etc. Those people are their ship mates, coworkers and most important of all their ship family. They can't do their job without the help of those people, so keeping a few extra dollars wouldn't be worth it. The ships are designed and operated that everyone is helping someone. If the certain crew member isn't working for the guest directly they are doing something for a crew member that is. I think that if the people that do adjust the service charge knew the actual amount of passenger that do it..they would be rather embarrassed. Its not a big number at all. Remember the daily charge is about the price of a fancy drink in a NCL glass. Making a huge scene at the reception desk over not wanting to tip that amount for several meals, turn downs etc..no reason for it! You're on vacation, spend less time worring about it and spending time in line. Enjoy the upper decks. :)

[brfan]

I just got off the Jewel on 10/17/2010.

 

I would seriously consider removing my service charge on the next cruise.

 

On the TV. The day before disembarkation it said that the $12/day pool got split between the room stewards and the food service staff. Room service, and any other staff were not included in the pool.

 

I know if we were to order the food we ordered on the cruise even tipping 20% It would not even come close to the $24 a day my wife and I spent in service charges.

 

From what I've gathered (unless it was just me) Unless you have a suite, (my) room stewards are detached from being personal. Aside from the mandatory duties like making towel animals and saying hi to every person on the hallway I didn't feel they did anything that a maid at the motel 6 would have done and should be evenly compensated.

 

IMHO most of them have the "I got the tip already" attitude.

 

Don't think of it as a tip, think of it as what it is a service charge. The DSC comprises the majority of their salary. If your cabin is cleaned and made up then they have done their job and deserve to be paid for that job. If you have issues with the service, speak with someone (either head of housekeeping or guest services) to try to fix the problem.

 

By the way does the maid at the last motel 6 you stayed at make up your room twice a day?

[nezume]

One other incentive to turn the money in is they will be asked by their boss if they received any tips. If they lie and say no, then their boss will assume they provided bad service and it will go on their record. The crew member will run the risk of losing perks like time off, the types of assignments they get, lose promotion opportunities and even non renewal of their contracts if this happens too often.

 

Also your suggestion of them using port banks may not be very practical since they only get a handful of port days off each month. So they'd have to find a place to hide this money until they were able to get off the ship.

 

 

Excellent point! That's an added incentive I never thought about. Although I would hope their boss wouldn't be so arbitrary as to assume that every cabin that removes the service charge and doesn't leave a cash tip recieved bad service (some people are just cheap). I would imagine they keep an eye on averages for that and if one steward has more than most then they might start to look into it.

 

Although I will say I think how much time off on port days largely depends on your position. IE room stewards still must make up cabins and turn them down regardless of if it's a sea day or a port day. However I would imagine food service staff is in less demand since most people are ashore dining, so they may have more time to deal with onshore financial institutions.

[johnql]

I just got off the Jewel on 10/17/2010.

 

I would seriously consider removing my service charge on the next cruise.

 

On the TV. The day before disembarkation it said that the $12/day pool got split between the room stewards and the food service staff. Room service, and any other staff were not included in the pool.

 

I know if we were to order the food we ordered on the cruise even tipping 20% It would not even come close to the $24 a day my wife and I spent in service charges.

 

From what I've gathered (unless it was just me) Unless you have a suite, (my) room stewards are detached from being personal. Aside from the mandatory duties like making towel animals and saying hi to every person on the hallway I didn't feel they did anything that a maid at the motel 6 would have done and should be evenly compensated.

 

IMHO most of them have the "I got the tip already" attitude.

I'd like to know where you can vacation and spend less than $60 a day on food alone for 3+ meals. Then, add the $1-2 a day for the hotel maid. There's no way you could keep it under $12 a day.

 

As for the staff's attitude, I think you're in the minority. Most people here on CC report that NCL's staff is very welcoming, courteous and extremely helpful. I, for one, based on 9 NCL cruises, can confirm that as my experience. I'm sorry if your experience was lacking.

[boxerjake]

I just got off the Jewel on 10/17/2010.

 

I would seriously consider removing my service charge on the next cruise.

 

On the TV. The day before disembarkation it said that the $12/day pool got split between the room stewards and the food service staff. Room service, and any other staff were not included in the pool.

 

I know if we were to order the food we ordered on the cruise even tipping 20% It would not even come close to the $24 a day my wife and I spent in service charges.

 

From what I've gathered (unless it was just me) Unless you have a suite, (my) room stewards are detached from being personal. Aside from the mandatory duties like making towel animals and saying hi to every person on the hallway I didn't feel they did anything that a maid at the motel 6 would have done and should be evenly compensated.

 

IMHO most of them have the "I got the tip already" attitude.

 

First of all, I am sure that your tips would add up to OVER $ 24 per day ALONE for 3 meals for two people. Every hotel I ever stayed in I have left a tip for the maid. You know the charge when you book the cruise...talk about nickle and diming..wanting to remove you DSC because you don't think they DESERVE it....That's nickle and diming.

[roveer]

To-ma-toes...to-mah-toes. Adds up to the same thing. You should have budgeted for it either way.

 

Yeah, I was tracking, soda estra's, restaraunt extras etc, fuel surcharges, but must have missed the section where they decided to raise the fair. Can you provide the link. I'm sure It's right there on the main page, or where I got the costs: Here, they talk about the fuel surcharge, I'm sure that will be back before we cruise. Where is this sucker buried???

 

7-Day Bahamas & Florida Round-Trip New York

 

Ship: Norwegian Jewel

Embarkation port: New York City

Embarkation: Nov 21, 2010

Disembarkation: Nov 28, 2010

Ports of call: New York City; Orlando (Port Canaveral); Great Stirrup Cay; Nassau

View itinerary detail 1932468 16061 Number of guests: 6

 

Fares shown are in U.S. dollars and are per person. Government taxes, fees, and fuel supplement, (where applicable) are additional. NCL is suspending the company's fuel supplement for all voyages departing at this time. The Company reserves the right to re-instate the fuel supplement for all guests should the price of light sweet crude oil according to the NYMEX (New York Mercantile Exchange Index) increase above $65 per barrel. NCL may collect any fuel supplement charge in effect at the time of sailing, even if the cruise fare has been paid in full. Onboard service charges are additional and will be automatically added to your onboard account, and are subject to your discretion. Offers are for new reservations only, based on availability, capacity controlled, not combinable with other offers, subject to change or cancellation without notice, and may be withdrawn at any time. Other restrictions apply.

 

So, no-place I visited on the NCL website showed this fee. I booked through a travel agent and he did not disclose these fees. I was not made aware of this fee until I received my documents. No tomatos here, just rotten vegtables.

 

Not up front. Fees all over the entire web site, not in one place. Why? To make it easier for someone to figure out what the trip will cost? I think not. And don't try to make it the PAX fault that we didn't know about it. Other companies go to great lenghts to put all the costs in one place to avoid confusion. NCL did not.

[Micchi]

Don't think of it as a tip, think of it as what it is a service charge. The DSC comprises the majority of their salary. If your cabin is cleaned and made up then they have done their job and deserve to be paid for that job. If you have issues with the service, speak with someone (either head of housekeeping or guest services) to try to fix the problem.

 

By the way does the maid at the last motel 6 you stayed at make up your room twice a day?

 

I think the DSC is reasonable but I wouldn't use this as an argument. It's not the responsibility of the pax to pay the wages of the crew.

 

I have said many times that these arguments would not occur if NCL would just add the DSC to the final cost of the cruise. It's not so hard to have "cruise fare," "government taxes and fees," and "service charges." The secrecy and "surprise~ that'll be $300 MORE" feeling of the way they handle this is what causes people to balk - NOT having to pay a fair gratuity.

[boxerjake]

Yeah, I was tracking, soda estra's, restaraunt extras etc, fuel surcharges, but must have missed the section where they decided to raise the fair. Can you provide the link. I'm sure It's right there on the main page, or where I got the costs: Here, they talk about the fuel surcharge, I'm sure that will be back before we cruise. Where is this sucker buried???

 

7-Day Bahamas & Florida Round-Trip New York

 

Ship: Norwegian Jewel

Embarkation port: New York City

Embarkation: Nov 21, 2010

Disembarkation: Nov 28, 2010

Ports of call: New York City; Orlando (Port Canaveral); Great Stirrup Cay; Nassau

View itinerary detail 1932468 16061 Number of guests: 6

 

Fares shown are in U.S. dollars and are per person. Government taxes, fees, and fuel supplement, (where applicable) are additional. NCL is suspending the company's fuel supplement for all voyages departing at this time. The Company reserves the right to re-instate the fuel supplement for all guests should the price of light sweet crude oil according to the NYMEX (New York Mercantile Exchange Index) increase above $65 per barrel. NCL may collect any fuel supplement charge in effect at the time of sailing, even if the cruise fare has been paid in full. Onboard service charges are additional and will be automatically added to your onboard account, and are subject to your discretion. Offers are for new reservations only, based on availability, capacity controlled, not combinable with other offers, subject to change or cancellation without notice, and may be withdrawn at any time. Other restrictions apply.

 

So, no-place I visited on the NCL website showed this fee. I booked through a travel agent and he did not disclose these fees. I was not made aware of this fee until I received my documents. No tomatos here, just rotten vegtables.

 

Not up front. Fees all over the entire web site, not in one place. Why? To make it easier for someone to figure out what the trip will cost? I think not. And don't try to make it the PAX fault that we didn't know about it. Other companies go to great lenghts to put all the costs in one place to avoid confusion. NCL did not.

 

You must have missed it.

[boxerjake]

I think the DSC is reasonable but I wouldn't use this as an argument. It's not the responsibility of the pax to pay the wages of the crew.

 

I have said many times that these arguments would not occur if NCL would just add the DSC to the final cost of the cruise. It's not so hard to have "cruise fare," "government taxes and fees," and "service charges." The secrecy and "surprise~ that'll be $300 MORE" feeling of the way they handle this is what causes people to balk - NOT having to pay a fair gratuity.

 

I agree with you. Just raise the fare and then no suprises.

[brfan]

I think the DSC is reasonable but I wouldn't use this as an argument. It's not the responsibility of the pax to pay the wages of the crew.

 

I have said many times that these arguments would not occur if NCL would just add the DSC to the final cost of the cruise. It's not so hard to have "cruise fare," "government taxes and fees," and "service charges." The secrecy and "surprise~ that'll be $300 MORE" feeling of the way they handle this is what causes people to balk - NOT having to pay a fair gratuity.

 

Actually it is the passengers responsibility. If the DSC is encorporated somehow into the cost of the cruise, the passenger will be paying their salary through higher cruise costs. No different then salary costs being incorporated into anything you buy. The store/cruiseline/company isn't going to pay their staff and not pass the cost along to the customer.

 

However the DSC/Tips/Hotel Service Charge or whatever it's called is how most if not all mainstream cruiselines pay their crew. It is unlikely to change unless they all agree to change as potential customers look at the cost and usually pick the cheapest price. If one cruise line adds the tips to the price their cost will appear higher than the ones that don't even though when all is said and done it will be roughly the same.

[brfan]

Excellent point! That's an added incentive I never thought about. Although I would hope their boss wouldn't be so arbitrary as to assume that every cabin that removes the service charge and doesn't leave a cash tip recieved bad service (some people are just cheap). I would imagine they keep an eye on averages for that and if one steward has more than most then they might start to look into it.

 

Although I will say I think how much time off on port days largely depends on your position. IE room stewards still must make up cabins and turn them down regardless of if it's a sea day or a port day. However I would imagine food service staff is in less demand since most people are ashore dining, so they may have more time to deal with onshore financial institutions.

 

Not always true for the food service people. Not sure what NCL does, but I do have friends that work in the dining room on another cruise line and they often have to do extra duties while in port and the dining room is closed. Things like inventory, extra cleaning, etc.