Long distance International flights??

[bazzaw]

I am interested to hear how experienced long distance International flyers go about making their bookings - especially in regard to practicality and feasibility questions.

 

We have flown many times to Europe and the US - but always non-stopover return flights from Brisbane. Earlier in our travels, we used shopfront TA's - and lately have been using online TA's. Either way, it has been easy to obtain/organise flights.

 

Now however, we are considering both one way and return flights - involving stopovers - and this appears to be somewhat more difficult.

 

For example, it is easy to use an online TA to organise a one way non-stopover flight Australia to Europe -- but try a oneway flight with a couple of stopovers from Europe to Australia. The online TA that we have usually used does not even have a search engine that allows us to search for a flight from a European city - and their search engine does not allow the selection of stopover cities.

 

Is it just a matter that we are going to have to return to using shopfront TA's??

 

Next question - how to cruisers find specialist cruise TA's to be in arranging non-cruise associated activities , like flights, hotels, etc ??

 

Thanks for any thoughts

 

Barry

__________________

[auntiedodo]

I make all my flight arrangements on-line. That way I can book a stop off point and spend a few days.

[bazzaw]

Well that is interesting - but HOW do you do it??.

 

As I said - more complex flights involving either one way flights and/or stopovers don't seem to be too easy to do online. Simple return fares with no stopovers are easy!

 

Barry

[bobhsv]

I know what you mean Barry. We are having the same difficulty. Looking at a cruise from Galveston, but you really do have to know your geography and the airline names and flight routes before you can begin to organise it yourself. Tricky.

Jen

[sheridan318]

Hi Barry we have been on a well known air craft site here in Oz that let you put in a multi stop route, or you could try a round the world fare they work out quite cheap for what you can do in multi stops hope that helps:D

Jacquie

[Guest012]

Hi Barry......I have done our international flights for many years now....firstly i start with a google search to find airlines that do the specific route i want to do....then i hunt down the best fare and of late that has always been direct with the airline's own site... trip in Oct 2010 were all one way fares all booked online by me....first flight was Singapore Airlines Bne - Heathrow booked direct with them during a sales period...great fare they were the lowest price of all the carriers doing that route at the time we were flying.........our return home with stop-overs was Edinburgh to Rome with British Airways booked here in Australia via their U.K site....next flight was Rome to Kuala Lumpur with Qatar Airways booked through their .com site....few days later we headed from K.L to Phuket fare bought very very cheap on AirAsia's .com site.....5 days on we flew home from Phuket to Bne with VAustralia...bought online during a sale......all this took time and patience but we got what we needed and were very happy with prices we paid........ i get newsletters from the airlines we prefer to use so always have a fair idea of what specials are on..... You will have trouble booking one-way fares that do not originate in Australia through .com.au sites....for those I always go to the airline site in the country we are departing to get my booking...for eg: if you want to book Qantas:rolleyes: Los Angeles - Brisbane the Australian site won't let you but if you change to the US site it will....i have to admit however if i was doing flight hopping in obscure destinations i would probably enlist the help of a travel consultant here:D:D.......Hope this helps.....cheers Shiona

[bazzaw]

Hi Shiona

 

Thanks for that - I must admit that I had not thought about booking direct with the airlines ( I know -- DUH!!) - have never ever done that for overseas trips, just domestic ones. I will look further into that.

 

I am looking more at convenience and practicality - than the very lowest fare. I have always found the very lowest fares often have a sting in the tail - like my son flying out to London this week from Brisbane - starting a 24 hour flight at 11.30PM.:rolleyes:

 

You have reminded me that TA's can't (by some International agreement) sell airfares from airports other than those in their own country.

 

I do prefer to undertake my own research and bookings - rather than place myself into an agents hands.

 

Barry

[Guest012]

Being a Scot price tops the list followed very very closely by convenience:D:D..

Got to love the late departures at Brisbane International...no one ever comes to see us off........not sure why:rolleyes::rolleyes:....flying to Singapore at lunchtime in a few weeks what a treat in the daylight....:D:D

[NSWP]

I booked our flight on Tuesday, Sydney - Bangkok - Rome on Thai International, direct with Thai A/L site. Best price I could get $900 each inc taxes.

 

Post Ruby/Coral cruises, flying out of LAX on Qantas, using FF points.

 

However.. with the Thai Flights, Sydney - Bangkok, A340 in seat entertainment OK. But on the Bangkok - Rome, Boeing 747, may not be in seat entertainment as only 6 of Thai's 12 Jumbos have it fitted, bit of a problem, but will be sleep time anyway BKK to FCO Rome.

 

So always check what aircraft you will be in re facilities. I had no choice.

 

Next year, post Arcadia, Sydney - Southampton. After some time driving UK, will be flying Virgin Atlantic,( Air NZ Codeshare)LHR to San Francisco. 8 nights in SF, then Air NZ, SF to Sydney via Auckland. I booked both those flights direct on Air NZ site, best price. Boeing 747's both flights.

[bazzaw]

I have just discovered that you can book flights from airports other than those in Oz ( eg - Singapore to Frankfurt) on the Oz Expedia site . That is interesting - because I know of no others that allow this.

 

Barry

[wotaripper]

I am interested to hear how experienced long distance International flyers go about making their bookings - especially in regard to practicality and feasibility questions.

 

We have flown many times to Europe and the US - but always non-stopover return flights from Brisbane. Earlier in our travels, we used shopfront TA's - and lately have been using online TA's. Either way, it has been easy to obtain/organise flights.

 

Now however, we are considering both one way and return flights - involving stopovers - and this appears to be somewhat more difficult.

 

For example, it is easy to use an online TA to organise a one way non-stopover flight Australia to Europe -- but try a oneway flight with a couple of stopovers from Europe to Australia. The online TA that we have usually used does not even have a search engine that allows us to search for a flight from a European city - and their search engine does not allow the selection of stopover cities.

 

Is it just a matter that we are going to have to return to using shopfront TA's??

 

Next question - how to cruisers find specialist cruise TA's to be in arranging non-cruise associated activities , like flights, hotels, etc ??

 

Thanks for any thoughts

 

Barry

__________________

I booked 9 flights for 8 of us for a 6 week trip last year mostly through the airlines themselves which involved flights to hong kong then after a few days on to manchester then after a couple of weeks manchester to hamburg, later new york to vegas then after a stopover vegas to l.a and on to sydney with no problems I found you just have to do your research and be patient you dont always have to book them all at one time I found over the last 2 overseas trips the Virgin group where always very competitive and often the cheapest,As to flying late at night we prefer that as once settled on the plane are body clock is ready for sleep .

[oskarNZ]

Hi Barry,

 

I always book my own airfares and I always book them with stopovers - as many as possible because I hate long distance flights and I like having a chance to stop for a few days and experience a new city. My last long distant flight went from London - Vienna - Beijing. A land tour to Shanghai, then a flight to Hong Kong - Singapore - Auckland. This was with 3 different airlines and it was only marginally more expensive than a direct flight from London to Auckland. However it did take patience and many hours of research.

 

I gave up on using travel agents with these bookings many years ago. I would ask them to find me a fun and affordable way of getting to my destination and they just weren't prepared to put in the time and research. Instead they wanted to know the exact day I wanted to fly and the exact cities I wanted to stop at. By being a bit flexible with these two things, along with your choice of airline, you can find some great deals. For example mid week flights are usually a bit cheaper thatn Friday and weekend ones. Also, some airlines provide opportunities to stop at some fun and interesting locations, which can really add to the overall experience of your holiday. e.g On a flight from Las Vegas to Europe, I chose KLM because of it's stopover in Memphis. I'm not an Elvis fan, but Graceland was fabulous.

 

Booking directly with the airline is usually your best bet. Many airline booking sites will have a option that says something like 'advanced search' or multi-stop bookings. Click on these as they usually allow you to book flights with stopovers. Alternatively ring the airlines booking number and get them to help you.

For a bit of fun (but perhaps not necessarily the best price) go to the One World or Star Alliance websites and put together a Round the World flight made up of a mixture of airlines. From memory they do allow for land sectors.

 

Lastly, if you book flights with cheaper or domestic airlines, be aware that many charge more for luggage. E.g. Southwest airlines are one of the few domestic carriers in the US that don't charge for baggage. Because of this they often work out cheaper than the competition.

 

Hope this helps a bit.

[moyaroo]

Hi Barry,

 

' ' '

 

I gave up on using travel agents with these bookings many years ago. I would ask them to find me a fun and affordable way of getting to my destination and they just weren't prepared to put in the time and research. Instead they wanted to know the exact day I wanted to fly and the exact cities I wanted to stop at. . . .

Hope this helps a bit.

 

If you think about it the TA is not being lazy, just frustrated. If the job is to find something then the TA will find it, but you are really interested in the process of investigation of possibilities, this behavior does not move toward a sale and thus to the individual working on a small commission basis not energy well spent. For you, however, the search is energizing fun and productive .

 

I must admit that I enjoy doing much the same for my personal travel but not when it is for another and the commission is likely to be under $100 for several hours work. As a result the only time I get involved in complex itineraries for clients is when they are planning a multi country trip with pre planned destinations. Ie a business passenger wanting to go to Moscow, Warsaw, Dehli in that order on given dates. Even when the stops are known the routing can be tough when connections are involved.

[thied]

These flights are a killer with a toddler.

[oskarNZ]

If you think about it the TA is not being lazy, just frustrated. If the job is to find something then the TA will find it, but you are really interested in the process of investigation of possibilities, this behavior does not move toward a sale and thus to the individual working on a small commission basis not energy well spent. For you, however, the search is energizing fun and productive .

 

I must admit that I enjoy doing much the same for my personal travel but not when it is for another and the commission is likely to be under $100 for several hours work. As a result the only time I get involved in complex itineraries for clients is when they are planning a multi country trip with pre planned destinations. Ie a business passenger wanting to go to Moscow, Warsaw, Dehli in that order on given dates. Even when the stops are known the routing can be tough when connections are involved.

 

Just to be clear, I would never expect an agent to spend the hours doing research that I do to find the best deals. Hence the reason I stopped using them years ago. I do find the research process fun and have spent many hours booking flights not just for myself, but for family and friends.

 

I also agree that choosing not to put in hours of research doesn't make an agent 'lazy' (a word I never used). However, with the age of the internet, and the increasing ease of booking holidays yourself, I do think agents need to find ways of going that extra mile in order to secure customers. Even if it's just to price up flights across a week to tell their customer which day is the cheapest to fly. I've had agents not even prepared to do that.

 

I actually think part of the problem lies in their systems and the time it takes to go through middle men/suppliers to get the information I can find in just in just a few minutes on the net. On a recent holiday to the Gold Coast, I went and spoke to an agent just in case she had access to some special deals not available on the net. My request was, as far as I was concerned, simple: "I am looking for the cheapest price I can get on a four star or higher 2 bedroom apartment in Broadbeach". The agent started flicking through the brochure and recommended a few properties. I said that they both looked lovely, but were they the cheapest? She then rang her suppiler, got a price for just these two apartments, and then went on to explain why these 2 properties would suit our family more than the dozen or so others in Broadbeach.

 

Frustrated, I went home and in less than half an hour, using just one booking website, I had found at least 4 considerably cheaper and equally desirable options.

[bazzaw]

Thanks for all the input so far.

 

I think that this discussion can go further - but I first must say that 1. one of the reasons I now avoid TA's is that I know they are very busy and cannot possibly do the research to the degree that I am able to. I take one look at the numbers of customers sitting at the counter across from young TA's in the shopfront stores and decide that their service is not for me. 2. I am also not looking for "cheapest" prices. What I look for is solutions that are practical, convenient and reasonably priced. Show me a "cheapest price " solution and I will surely find its associated "bite in the A****". There are reasons why services are priced at the cheapest level - other than simply resulting from supply and demand. The airfare that involves departures and arrivals at inconvenient times, long layovers, unpopular airlines etc is just one example.

 

Oh - and I won't fly with Emirates anymore - not while they use Boeing 777's set up with a 3,4,3 configuration in Economy class for 8 hour flights.

 

So far - I have gotten from this discussion the suggestion to use the actual airlines websites more often (although I must admit that in the past , I have done this sometimes and found them to be much more expensive than TA consolidators - nevertheless, I will explore that avenue again ) - and also my discovery that Expedia allows bookings of flights starting from overseas cities

 

To OskarNZ - could you expand on this further please " On a flight from Las Vegas to Europe, I chose KLM because of it's stopover in Memphis." -- There are "stops" in a flight - and "stopovers" --- two different things. I often see flights with a stop in them - the question is how to convert a stop into a stopover. ??

 

Thanks for any further input

 

 

Barry

[bazzaw]

Thanks for all the input so far.

 

I think that this discussion can go further - but I first must say that 1. one of the reasons I now avoid TA's is that I know they are very busy and cannot possibly do the research to the degree that I am able to. I take one look at the numbers of customers sitting at the counter across from young TA's in the shopfront stores and decide that their service is not for me. 2. I am also not looking for "cheapest" prices. What I look for is solutions that are practical, convenient and reasonably priced. Show me a "cheapest price " solution and I will surely find its associated "bite in the A****". There are reasons why services are priced at the cheapest level - other than simply resulting from supply and demand. The airfare that involves departures and arrivals at inconvenient times, long layovers, unpopular airlines etc is just one example.

 

Oh - and I won't fly with Emirates anymore - not while they use Boeing 777's set up with a 3,4,3 configuration in Economy class for 8 hour flights.

 

So far - I have gotten from this discussion the suggestion to use the actual airlines websites more often (although I must admit that in the past , I have done this sometimes and found them to be much more expensive than TA consolidators - nevertheless, I will explore that avenue again ) - and also my discovery that Expedia allows bookings of flights starting from overseas cities

 

To OskarNZ - could you expand on this further please " On a flight from Las Vegas to Europe, I chose KLM because of it's stopover in Memphis." -- There are "stops" in a flight - and "stopovers" --- two different things. I often see flights with a stop in them - the question is how to convert a stop into a stopover. ??

 

Thanks for any further input

 

 

Barry

[bazzaw]

Thanks for all the input so far.

 

I think that this discussion can go further - but I first must say that 1. one of the reasons I now avoid TA's is that I know they are very busy and cannot possibly do the research to the degree that I am able to. I take one look at the numbers of customers sitting at the counter across from young TA's in the shopfront stores and decide that their service is not for me. 2. I am also not looking for "cheapest" prices. What I look for is solutions that are practical, convenient and reasonably priced. Show me a "cheapest price " solution and I will surely find its associated "bite in the A****". There are reasons why services are priced at the cheapest level - other than simply resulting from supply and demand. The airfare that involves departures and arrivals at inconvenient times, long layovers, unpopular airlines etc is just one example.

 

Oh - and I won't fly with Emirates anymore - not while they use Boeing 777's set up with a 3,4,3 configuration in Economy class for 8 hour flights.

 

So far - I have gotten from this discussion the suggestion to use the actual airlines websites more often (although I must admit that in the past , I have done this sometimes and found them to be much more expensive than TA consolidators - nevertheless, I will explore that avenue again ) - and also my discovery that Expedia allows bookings of flights starting from overseas cities

 

To OskarNZ - could you expand on this further please " On a flight from Las Vegas to Europe, I chose KLM because of it's stopover in Memphis." -- There are "stops" in a flight - and "stopovers" --- two different things. I often see flights with a stop in them - the question is how to convert a stop into a stopover. ??

 

What I have also discovered – is that it seems that with return flights , you can only have a stopover in one of the legs ie in either the outward leg or the homebound leg. It appears that the only way you could have say a stopover in Singapore on a return flight Oz to Europe is to book two single flight legs , an expensive exercise!! Is there any way around this???

 

 

 

Thanks for any further input

 

 

Barry

[bazzaw]

Sorry about the above three posts - CC didn't respond to my post - so I did it again and again - :o

 

On the third attempt I also added this

 

What I have also discovered – is that it seems that with return flights , you can only have a stopover in one of the legs ie in either the outward leg or the homebound leg. It appears that the only way you could have say a stopover in Singapore on a return flight Oz to Europe is to book two single flight legs , an expensive exercise!! Is there any way around this???

 

 

Barry

[moyaroo]

Just to be clear, I would never expect an agent to spend the hours doing research that I do to find the best deals. Hence the reason I stopped using them years ago. I do find the research process fun and have spent many hours booking flights not just for myself, but for family and friends.

 

I also agree that choosing not to put in hours of research doesn't make an agent 'lazy' (a word I never used). . . . Even if it's just to price up flights across a week to tell their customer which day is the cheapest to fly. I've had agents not even prepared to do that.

 

I actually think part of the problem lies in their systems and the time it takes to go through middle men/suppliers to get the information . . .. My request was, as far as I was concerned, simple: "I am looking for the cheapest price I can get on a four star or higher 2 bedroom apartment in Broadbeach". The agent started flicking through the brochure and recommended a few properties.. . .

 

Frustrated, I went home and in less than half an hour, using just one booking website, I had found at least 4 considerably cheaper and equally desirable options.

 

Sorry didn't mean ot put words in your mouth. Part ofthe problem is as you have guessed the multiple sytems that are in use, some of which are better at getting good fares. (Virgin Australia and Qantas both give prices for days before and after, something we don't get so much on this side of the pond. But the supplier checker, I am familiar with. I try to sell only the things I know well so I don't get into that predicament

 

It is pretty crazy out there, but still fun once you get through security.

[oskarNZ]

Thanks for all the input so far.

Show me a "cheapest price " solution and I will surely find its associated "bite in the A****". There are reasons why services are priced at the cheapest level - other than simply resulting from supply and demand. The airfare that involves departures and arrivals at inconvenient times, long layovers, unpopular airlines etc is just one example.

 

While I agree that 'cheapest' doesn't always equate to being good, I've also found that with a bit of research the two needn't be mutually exclusive either.

By booking early, as close to a year out as possible, I have found that you can often get the best flights, at the best times and at the best price.

If booking early is not an option, that's when it does pay to be a bit flexible with your travel dates and look at prices over a week. For an upcoming trip to Fiji I have flights booked for a Wednesday. Not only were they the best price I could find (of all the airlines), but they were the best timed flights also.

 

Similar with hotels. It is not as difficult as one might think to find some really nice hotels at some very cheap prices. I would never book a hotel, no matter how cheap it was, before researching it first. Just to give you an idea how pedantic I am, I've even been known to go onto google maps before and take a cyber-walk down a hotels street to get an idea how busy the road is, how safe the street looks, and what sort of shops and restaurants are within walking distance.

 

In regards to how to book stopovers, it's unfortunately not something that is easy explained over the internet. Most airlines have different booking systems and admitedly, some of them aren't very user friendly. For those airlines, it's sometimes easier to just ring them directly and speak to someone.

It's possible also that the booking websites you are seeing in Australia are not exactly what I'm seeing here in NZ. However, do look for those 'advanced search' or 'multi-stop' options/icons as these will often allow you to book stopovers.

 

I am surprised that some airlines are only allowing you a stopover in one place in one direction. I haven't encountered this problem before and am not sure why this would be the case. The KLM flight I did was return to London and included a different stopover on the way back in Detroit (we wanted to see the Ford Motor Museum). It also included stops (or stopovers should we have chosen them) in Amsterdam. This was annoying, but for us it was still worth it for the price and options that the flight otherwise provided.

 

Lastly, as you are probably aware, stopovers can become quite expensive if they are not at an airlines home country and/or major hubs. To keep prices down, it could be worth picking an airline based on it's hubs. Detroit and Memphis (at least at the time) seemed to be hubs for KLM flights coming into the States from Europe so it was easy (and only a tiny bit more expensive) to stop for a few days at each.

 

Similarly, it used to be cheap and easy to stop in Hawaii on the way to the States. Now that planes are capable of getting all the way to LAX non-stop, Hawaii stopovers can be quite expensive and difficult to arrange. If someone wanted a beach break at the end of their trip, I would look into Air Pacific or Air Tahiti as they both stop in a beach location regardless and they shouldn't charge you too much more (if anything at all) for the luxury of stopping for a few days there. In fact sometimes, in order to support the economy of their country, certain airlines will provided incentives for stopping over. I once flew to L.A on Air Tahiti and decided to grab the opportunity to stopover for a few days (why wouldn't you? :) ). Not only did my airfare not increase by doing this, but the airline hooked me up with a very good deal at a 5-star resort.

 

Sorry I can't be of more help than this, but good luck with your booking :)

[Guest012]

What I have also discovered – is that it seems that with return flights , you can only have a stopover in one of the legs ie in either the outward leg or the homebound leg. It appears that the only way you could have say a stopover in Singapore on a return flight Oz to Europe is to book two single flight legs , an expensive exercise!! Is there any way around this???

 

 

Barry

 

 

Some airlines allow stopovers each way this is where research comes in Barry.....read the ticket conditions on sites like bestflights.com.au....ooops that one slipped out:D:D:D and you will get an idea of what is out there and what you can get........We have flown Thai International and they allowed stopovers each way but only in Bangkok which was fine for us ......For those airlines only allowing one stopover you can actually request a second one but be prepared to pay extra.....have done so in the past cost was around $120.00 pp..............cheers Shiona

[oskarNZ]

Hi again,

 

I just did a quick google and discovered that there do seem to be quite a few airlines that allow only one stopover. I can see why this may be making your search frustrating.

However, as mentioned by Badgerbill, it is usually possible to add stopovers, but you may need to pay a little bit more for it.

 

Also, I just wanted to add, incase I cause confusion for anyone, that the US hubs I mentioned are in fact the hubs of Delta (a large partner of KLM). The flights I flew were a codeshare between the two. Looking for codeshares might be another way of increasing your stopover options.

[ckl001]

just to join in on this conversation, I have booked all my flights for next year myself. I went the the airlines website and found a price and then called the airline booking number and got an other quoted price much cheaper than the website. It does pay to do your own investigations.

From now on I will be checking the airlines website and then calling the airlines and getting quotes.

 

chez

[LuckiePuris]

I am interested to hear how experienced long distance International flyers go about making their bookings - especially in regard to practicality and feasibility questions.

 

We have flown many times to Europe and the US - but always non-stopover return flights from Brisbane. Earlier in our travels, we used shopfront TA's - and lately have been using online TA's. Either way, it has been easy to obtain/organise flights.

 

Now however, we are considering both one way and return flights - involving stopovers - and this appears to be somewhat more difficult.

 

For example, it is easy to use an online TA to organise a one way non-stopover flight Australia to Europe -- but try a oneway flight with a couple of stopovers from Europe to Australia. The online TA that we have usually used does not even have a search engine that allows us to search for a flight from a European city - and their search engine does not allow the selection of stopover cities.

 

Is it just a matter that we are going to have to return to using shopfront TA's??

 

Next question - how to cruisers find specialist cruise TA's to be in arranging non-cruise associated activities , like flights, hotels, etc ??

 

Thanks for any thoughts

 

Barry

__________________

 

Hi Barry, I am now a travel consultant at a well known travel agency, and may be able to give you some general advice.

 

For your one way and/or return flights, where are you looking to have stopovers?

 

Just to clarify that you are after stopovers, and not transit stops?

 

Depending on the fare type, many airlines allow stopovers either included in the fare or for a cost.