Customs Alert!!!

[dc-snoopy]

[quote name='pbhunt']I respectfully disagree with those of you that say that a photo taken on your kitchen table with date is not enough to provide proof of prior ownership. We are not talking about ways to defraud customs. I am an Agricultural Inspector, and if you have sufficient proof, or the forethought to provide documentation that the item was purchased from a reliable source, such as a receipt; your commodity will probably be allowed entry.

I am an inspector and regulatory official, and we generally believe that people are honest. It is really deception or ignorance that will get you into trouble. Most people on a cruise are not going to have the means or facilities to falsify documents.

Snoopy, your writing style, at times sounds a little arrogant. You are indeed prolific, with only 2 cruises under your belt. :)[/QUOTE]

First, the number of cruises that I've taken does not equate with the number of times that I've gone through customs. I've travelled via other means through customs and I was unaware that cruising customs were significantly different than the other times I've gone through customs.

My writing style sounds arrogant? Your tone as "an inspector and regulatory official" certainly doesn't sound so much more humble than mine. Nor does your comment about my "prolific" number of cruises. You've established your superiority pretty easily.

I got my opinion directly from the US Customs and Border Police (CBP) web-site:

[i][b]"Q: How Can I Prove I Didn't Buy My Watch/Camera During My Trip Outside the United States?

A: Foreign-made personal articles taken abroad are subject to duty each time they are brought back into the United States unless you have acceptable proof of prior possession. Documents which fully describe the article, such as a bill of sale, insurance policy, jeweler's appraisal, or receipt for purchase, may be considered reasonable proof of prior possession.

Items such as watches, cameras, compact disc players, or other articles which may be readily identified by a permanently affixed serial number or marking, may be taken to the CBP office nearest you and registered before your departure. The Certificate of Registration (CBPF 4457) that you will be given will expedite the free entry of these items when you return. Keep the certificate as it is valid for as long as you own the article(s)."
[/b][/i]
The problem with a photograph is that you can take a photograph of any item that you purchase while abroad. You can bring any piece of documentation that may be in the photograph with you and take the photograph while abroad. It does not provide any more verifiable proof than a letter from your mother saying you are bringing her jewelry with you on your cruise. You can certainly try and it may get you through, but there is no guarantee that it will. Unless you have something a little more documentable, like a bill of sale, insurance policy, appraisal, etc. you might have a hard time getting through without paying duty. My point is that if you encounter a customs official whose had a hard day, or been reprimanded by a superior or any number of other things that might make them follow the letter of the law rather than the spirit of the law, you might have a problem. You can take the risk, but why bother? To me, if you are going to document the prior ownership, why not do the official document?

[PhoenixCruiser]

[quote name='dc-snoopy'] My writing style sounds arrogant?
/QUOTE]

Yes Snoopy you do come across as being arrogant IMO. For someone who "supposedly" works for NASA (one who cannot be without cell phone connection while on vacation) you seem to have ample time to read and post on this board day and night. Since this is a "critical/vital" time for NASA one has to wonder just how safe the next adventure will be :confused:

Just my opinion :eek:

###

[dc-snoopy]

[quote name='PhoenixCruiser'][quote name='dc-snoopy'] My writing style sounds arrogant?
/QUOTE]

Yes Snoopy you do come across as being arrogant IMO. For someone who "supposedly" works for NASA (one who cannot be without cell phone connection while on vacation) you seem to have ample time to read and post on this board day and night. Since this is a "critical/vital" time for NASA one has to wonder just how safe the next adventure will be :confused:

Just my opinion :eek:

###[/QUOTE]

Warning: long and off-topic.

I'm sorry that my "tone" comes off as arrogant. That's not my intention. I have my opinions just as many others do. After the last exchange that I had over my writing style, I've tried to add more IMO's, "my personal view is" and other phrases to more correctly connote personal opinion. Any other tips on toning down the arrogance level?

First, I do officially work for NASA. You can send e-mail to [email="ted@milkyway.gsfc.nasa.gov"]ted@milkyway.gsfc.nasa.gov[/email] (GSFC is the Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, MD) and I will be glad to respond to your e-mail. Note, you cannot send my work account mail from a public system like Yahoo, AOL, starpower, juno, or hotmail. As this department does not have any business with the general public, the network administrator has blocked mail from many of those public sites to cut down on SPAM and viruses coming from those sites. I have no jurisdiction over the blackhole list. Regarding the next mission, you can rest assured...although I spent 5 years working on the Hubble Space Telescope, I no longer work with any flight missions so you can rest assured that my leisure activities will not cause any mission problems. I currently work in the Earth Sciences Directorate and provide computer system adminstration support for one of the largest Earth Science (telemetry data from satellites surveying the Earth) databases around. My duties require a lot of system support which includes running commands or scripts that can take a while to process. In between commands, I will often keep something going on to scan back and forth against. That said, you will note that starting this week, I'll be cutting back. They've just revised the "acceptable use" policies at the center and bulletin boards are no longer acceptable use (before they had restricted IM and chat rooms, but not bulletin boards). So, I'll no longer be posting during the days.

As I've mentioned before on the boards, the reason that I cannot go on vacation without emergency contact available (such as a cell phone where I can check voice mail and an electronic connection) is that NASA has been cutting back on the number of support staff provide the same amount of support. We have smaller teams of people providing the support. In our case, our systems can go about 48-72 hours with a downtime while ingesting data into the system. If we go longer, we run out of disk space for the staging area before it has to be rolled off to other media, like our data archive large capacity tapes. If this isn't fixed, then we lose data which is expensive in wasted satellite time for taxpayer money. The last emergency that I've been called on while on vacation was when my partner was so sick that he couldn't get out of bed and I had to be able to log in across the firewall and perform certain tasks requiring administrator privileges to repair the ingest flow. That was when we only had 2 staff with these privileges. We now have 4 staff so the odds are less likely that it will happen, but I still have to have the emergency contact available when I vacation. It's hardly a critical component of running the agency, but I still agreed to these conditions when I accepted the job and due to the decreased staffing, I have to live with that if I want to continue working here and I do like the environment I have at work, so I choose to live with the restrictions. It's the cost of the "better faster cheaper" policy that came out in the last 10 years and the significant trimming of virtually all components of agency staffing. Welcome to the new leaner government.

Explanations of personal situation are long and OT...that's why in the past, my responses to the "leave the cell phones home and just go on vacation" have been shorter with "some of us have job responsibilities that don't allow us to go on vacation without being able to be called on in an emergency". But, apparently, that just makes me sound self-important and arrogant, so I took the time and space here. I suppose I could just reply "my job requires it...my only other choice is to quit my job to be able to go on vacation without a cell phone emergency contact, which I'm unwilling to do." But the first time I said that I got a response that was rather insulting.

[1corona4u]

[quote name='PhoenixCruiser'][quote name='dc-snoopy'] My writing style sounds arrogant?
/QUOTE]

Yes Snoopy you do come across as being arrogant IMO. For someone who "supposedly" works for NASA (one who cannot be without cell phone connection while on vacation) you seem to have ample time to read and post on this board day and night. Since this is a "critical/vital" time for NASA one has to wonder just how safe the next adventure will be :confused:

Just my opinion :eek:

###[/QUOTE]

My thoughts exactly. I don't know what was said by dc, because I have an "ignore" button, and I know how to use it. LOL :D I find more and more lately that I keep adding people to the list here....some people's post are just not worth reading in my opinion.

As for this topic, I intend to just fill out the form that I posted earlier. Better safe than sorry.

[Schplinky]

[quote name='pbhunt']I don't think the Caribbean is known for fancy electronic equipment either. But you know what? It is a great idea to have a photo record of the expensive items that you are taking with you on vacation, if only for insurance purposes. You'd have to use someones digital camera to take a photo of your own. But you could include a newspaper or date stamp, and just print it out and throw it in your carryon, just to have a record of the item. I may think about doing it, I have a couple shots left in my print camera. :)[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't count on customs accepting this, especially when they have their own form for declaring ownership.

[Schplinky]

[quote name='pbhunt']I am an inspector and regulatory official, and we generally believe that people are honest. It is really deception or ignorance that will get you into trouble. Most people on a cruise are not going to have the means or facilities to falsify documents.

Snoopy, your writing style, at times sounds a little arrogant. You are indeed prolific, with only 2 cruises under your belt. :)[/QUOTE]

When you read these two paragraphs in a row, there is now doubt as to who is being arrogant. A customs official is not trained to presume that people are generally honest, especially those who travel with expensive items that they could have "officially" decalred before they left home. As has been discussed here, it is very easy to fake the picture.

Snoopy was trying to explain why he/she disagrees and gave good examples. The fact that she/he disproved you or that you think he/she is wrong does not make him/her arrogant.

Of course, I haven't cruised yet so I'm sure that I'm incredibly snotty but you can rest assured that I have travelled a great deal and have seen customs deal with all sorts of passengers. This presumption of honesty you speak of has not been witnessed by many customs officials I've seen. What I have seen is officials who are annoyed by passengers who think they've figured out ways of scamming the system or who display impatience when customs is trying to do its job by asking for official documentation.

They have a system to help passengers declare items of value before they leave home and to advise that other "home-made" methods will work just as well is a dis-service to some trusting reader who might think that you are right and will have their items confiscated.

[Schplinky]

[quote name='1corona4u'][quote name='PhoenixCruiser']

My thoughts exactly. I don't know what was said by dc, because I have an "ignore" button, and I know how to use it. LOL :D I find more and more lately that I keep adding people to the list here....some people's post are just not worth reading in my opinion.

As for this topic, I intend to just fill out the form that I posted earlier. Better safe than sorry.[/QUOTE]

Corona, you might be interested to know, then, that you are agreeing with Snoopy. that's exactly the advice they offered. LOL:D

[1corona4u]

[quote name='Schplinky'][quote name='1corona4u']

Corona, you might be interested to know, then, that you are agreeing with Snoopy. that's exactly the advice they offered. LOL:D[/QUOTE]

Oh, LOL, but as to the other comments, I often wondered how he has so much free time.... he does post as to know [b]everything,[/b] lol......:D ...maybe it's just his delivery.....that's what gets me in trouble...;)

Well, I think it's the right thing to do really. Part of me says that none of this will be an issue, but I just don't feel like taking the chance. I have 2 Bulova's, identical watches, one for work, which is trashed, and the other I bought because I liked it so much, which I have only worn once, and I planned to take this one on the cruise. Both are 4 years old, and I have no idea where the receipts are... I never had any issues on my other cruise, but we are living in a new day and age....

[madforcruising]

[quote name='1corona4u']My thoughts exactly. I don't know what was said by dc, because I have an "ignore" button, and I know how to use it. LOL :D


Oh, LOL, but as to the other comments, I often wondered how he has so much free time.... he does post as to know [b]everything,[/b] lol......:D ...maybe it's just his delivery.....that's what gets me in trouble...;)

[/QUOTE]

Well said!

[Schplinky]

[quote name='1corona4u']


Well, I think it's the right thing to do really. Part of me says that none of this will be an issue, but I just don't feel like taking the chance. I have 2 Bulova's, identical watches, one for work, which is trashed, and the other I bought because I liked it so much, which I have only worn once, and I planned to take this one on the cruise. Both are 4 years old, and I have no idea where the receipts are... I never had any issues on my other cruise, but we are living in a new day and age....[/QUOTE]

I agree. We're getting the form for our camera. As for most of the thnigs I own, I think the customs officers are likely wondering why I can afford to go on such nice holidays but have such crummy watches, etc.:eek:

In terms of "how" snoopy says things, I think that's a weakness of the internet. It's so hard to tell if a person's tone is arrogant or helpful or neutral. That's why I wish so much there were enough CC folk going on our cruise to merit a meet and mingle but there don't seem to be. What I do like about Snoopy is that he/she often does research and comes back with information that others haven't posted, as opposed to just guessing what makes sense to them.

[Angel in FL]

When my sister & I sailed on the VOS last April, the only shopping we did was a few items on board ship. I declared mine & she hers. The custom agent was quite confused. He asked us several times if we had done any shopping in the ports. The truth was & still is for those of you who will find this hard to believe, NO! I was sick in Jamicia & we didn't get off the ship, and the other two stops our tours ran long, so we just made it back to the ship. If customs has a computerized list of what you bought, why was this agent so puzzled? My answer is he's never seen two women take a cruise and not "shop until they drop.":D Just a true story, thought it might bring a little humor back to this very interesting thread for the most part.

[Schplinky]

I can't imagine what would motivate a store to have to report their sales to customs.

[dc-snoopy]

Apparently it is my "delivery" as 1corona4u puts it. I am and have been for many years and Internet geek (since before the days of the term Internet). I do a lot of searching with several search engines and when a question comes up that I am interested in and don't know...I go and Google. I spend a alot of time reading multiple web-sites and doing a comparison to verify information and then I try to pass that research information on.

Obviously, rather than helpful it's coming out 'know-it-all' which isn't or wasn't the intent. As I'll be cutting back on posting anyways, I'll be out of most of your hair and you won't have to worry about the know-it-all bothering you anymore.

[Iamthesea]

I for one appreciate your help. :) I like to Google as well. :D

I was also impressed with your job description and everything that goes on at NASA. We had a relative, Dick Scobee that was killed in the Challenger explosion.:(

[MrsPete]

I find that the older I get (gosh, I sound old -- I'm only 38), the less "stuff" I want. In the first decade of our marriage, we accumulated "stuff" -- it seemed to be the thing to do. At first we didn't have anything, so we bought things (basic cookware and Salvation Army furniture). Then as our jobs improved and our net worth increased, we wanted to move up to nicer things (waterless cookware and nicer furniture). Then we had two children and the stuff really accumulated. Somehow -- suddenly -- we could barely walk through the house, and our lives were ruled by all our stuff.

So we started purging and purging and purging. At this point in my life, I have literally everything I NEED at home and most of the things I WANT, and I don't want more clutter just for the sake of having bought something on a vacation. The result: My bank account is increasing, and I can pack in one suitcase. I just don't buy much "stuff" on vacation.

However, I do love photography. I always take several cameras on vacation: a digital SLR worth well over $1000, a point-and-shoot digital, and a couple disposables for the beach. Snoopy, I appreciate the info on proving that my cameras aren't new-purchases. I have receipts for all my equipment (because it's insured); would it be "enough" to slip those receipts (proving my equipment is US-bought) into my camera bag?