Costa Concordia SINKING

[crusinpsychRN]

We were on board and we survived, thank God! It was horrible but today finally Costa is helping us with travel plans and we are being looked after it seems. So thankful. Something we will never forget.

 

So glad you're safe!

[PRgymnast]

I don't believe this has been reported yet but apparently, someone had a heart attack on Costa Serena as it passed the accident scene.

 

Last night in a bizarre twist a male passenger had to be taken off the Concordia's sister ship Serena after suffering a heart attack as the liner sailed past Giglio at the start of a seven-day cruise.

 

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2088821/Costa-Concordia-Domnica-Cemortan-captain-Francesco-Schettino-cruise-ship-hit.html#ixzz1jvJxW1IH

[IRL_Joanie]

"Schettino' date=' in a dark uniform, was sat in front of a young woman," Angelo Fabbri told newspaper Il Secolo XIX. "She appeared young, initially we thought she could even be his daughter. A beautiful woman, 35 to 40, slim, shoulder length blonde hair, a black dress with bare arms. They were laughing, they were informal, it was very merry. "The wine?" he added. "There is no doubt they drank, at least a whole decanter, the last drops were poured into the commander's glass."

 

[img']http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2012/1/19/1326973437853/screen-grab-of-Moldovan-w-007.jpg[/img]

 

One wonders if she also slipped into the lifeboat along with Schettino and the other Officers:rolleyes:

 

What morons do they take us, the passengers for???:mad:

 

Joanie

[Uniall]

I think in my mind, in this case, a P{assenger Rep = A "Special" friend to the Captain. One who if his wife finds out about will be cause for Divorce, murder etc... Or one who pays her/his way of vacationing by providing special duties for said Captain...

 

Joanie

 

Oh, geez...what an assumption! As a member of the female gender, you should be ashamed!

 

I think former Italian Prime Minister, Berlusconi, created a more apt definition. Passenger Rep = Bunga Bunga :p

[Charles4515]

OK, On the Holland America Boards we have a Cruise Critic Member who's Brother in Law is a Senior Malvage Master ON SCENE for Titan Salvage

 

Anyway, if you go to the link and (at the end of this Paragraph) start at the very bottom and read his posts upwards, you can see what his Brother In Law is relaying to him on the status of the Recovery/Salvage Operation of the Concordia. http://boards.cruisecritic.com/search.php?searchid=27774084

 

As of last night it does not look good for Titan being able to salvage the ship:(

 

QUOTE: "Just got off the phone with the Brother-in-law (Senior Salvage Master for Titan Salvage)... It doesn't look good. The ship has sunk a meter in a day and there is an extremely amount of stress on the middle of the ship. The BIL is worried that she will literally break in half. They are rushing to remove all the fuel (which is still on) and they hope to remove most of it tomorrow. The explosions (the ones used to get to the bodies yesterday) were on extreme structural points on the ship and the BIL is angry that they didn't go a foot to the left to avoid the structural steel. The ship is still salvageable, but it will be extremely hard and they have to start in the next few days or he will be turning down the job and returning back to Florida. Mainly because salvage companies don't get paid unless they save the ship... They get 10% of the total value of the ship + cargo (~$57 Million in terms of the Concordia), so it's a good return. So thats my update... Remember, it may not be exactly what is happening. Things are changing every day. I'll keep you update and answer questions if you have any... "UNQUOTE

Joanie

 

The BIL is supposed to be angry because they put holes in the ship as part of the rescue effort? He thinks his making money is more important! Disgraceful person if true.

 

From what I read a Dutch company is doing the salvage. I have not seen Titan mentioned. I would take the supposed BIL report with a grain of salt...

[alwayshappytocruise]

One wonders how many seamounts the captain hit that day.

 

 

:eek::p:o::eek:

[TVMet]

Question, do we know anything about the cruise director? I haven't seen a thing, is he/she safe? How did the CD do in the emergency. We've all heard what a fantastic job John Heald did in the Carnival Splendor fire, in keeping everyone calm and informed.

[IRL_Joanie]

Oh, geez...what an assumption! As a member of the female gender, you should be ashamed!

 

You are right, as a female I should be, but I am not. Others come to conclusions and we are all assuming. My apologies for doing the same AND most specifically NOT putting a smiling Icon or a Sarcastic wink st the end of my sentence(s)

 

I was being sarcastic, but in retrospect, can see no other reason for this person to have been on the bridge or being so chummy with the Captain whilst having at minimum a drink with him.

 

Also, from the rime she states that she was on the Bridge with him (I believe 11:23 p.m.) was that not around the same time Coast Guard Captain De Falco was Ordering Schettino to get back on the ship???

 

Joanie

[Jo-Bob]

One wonders if she also slipped into the lifeboat along with Schettino and the other Officers:rolleyes:

 

What morons do they take us, the passengers for???:mad:

 

Joanie

 

Not calling anyone in particular a 'moron'....but, considering the trend of many to believe each and every bit of media, then 'forward', pass on, or provide links as PROOF.....I'd say 'spot on'.:rolleyes:

[dmwnc1959]

The BIL is supposed to be angry because they put holes in the ship as part of the rescue effort? He thinks his making money is more important! Disgraceful person if true.

 

From what I read a Dutch company is doing the salvage. I have not seen Titan mentioned. I would take the supposed BIL report with a grain of salt...

 

Re-read the post. He was upset because uninformed recovery personnel placed the explosives on 'extreme structural steel', structural support steel, which may now cause the ship now to break in half because the structure of the ships hull is now weakened and compromised even greater. This could in turn cause an environmental disaster unless they are able to get all the fuel off the ship before something happens prematurely.

[LovingCrusing]

*your slandering your own industry. impressive. not like claims people ever make mistakes. perhaps some of those issues you are handling were people that did not divulge their true operations? never think outside the box right? dangerous. *

 

Since your credibility to me is a lost cause. And you obviously have a loose sense of this industry, I will leave this at that. I am a bigger person to have the ability to walk away and perhaps this thread can go back to being what it is. Information about a sad and tragic loss.

I can walk away. Can you? or are you going to post a retort?

 

Let's see.

 

He posted a slam on another thread. Obviously truth hurts.

[LovingCrusing]

My husband and I have decided not to cruise. With the information provided we are still quite nervous about cruising and will maybe wait till the children are grown up and there is a better safety record for cruising.

 

He's more nervous than I am. But it's still a concern.

 

Thank you for all your feed back on my post about considering cruising.

 

We have been on smaller boats and feel comfortable on those at this point so we may just limit our "cruising" to that for now.

 

Still cruising, just not a large liner quite yet.

[LovingCrusing]

Re-read the post. He was upset because uninformed recovery personnel placed the explosives on 'extreme structural steel', structural support steel, which may now cause the ship now to break in half because the structure of the ships hull is now weakened and compromised even greater. This could in turn cause an environmental disaster unless they are able to get all the fuel off the ship before something happens prematurely.

 

I wonder, is it weakened because of the damage or because of the nature of the water it is sitting in?

It can't be good for steel to be sitting in (is it salt water?) water all this time either? Especially if it's compromised.

[jules1121]

The BIL is supposed to be angry because they put holes in the ship as part of the rescue effort? He thinks his making money is more important! Disgraceful person if true.

 

 

From the quote I took it to mean that the BIL is angry about the PLACEMENT of the openings made (i.e. avoiding spots that could endanger the structural integrity of what remains of the ship). The quote said he felt they should have been done a few feet farther away from structure points I believe (like not knocking out a support beam in a building).

[Cruzin-K]

The BIL is supposed to be angry because they put holes in the ship as part of the rescue effort? He thinks his making money is more important! Disgraceful person if true.

 

From what I read a Dutch company is doing the salvage. I have not seen Titan mentioned. I would take the supposed BIL report with a grain of salt...

 

Read much?

 

Talking of disgraceful, making stuff up and putting words in other peoples mouths is disgraceful. Nowhere did I see where the BIL said making money was more important than rescue. Why blow a hole in the ship at a critical structural place when ONE FOOT further could make a difference in salvage vs scrap?

 

Your quote "he thinks his making money is more important" is disgraceful to me

[frediver]

What makes you think they didn't? It was an italian-flagged vessel, all the names of officers that have come out so far have been italian.

That is what I just said, they might have all been speaking the same language, It might alrady be a requirement BUT communication among the crew has also been offered as an explanation for this disaster so why not eliminate That issue!

[jopocop]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-16620807

 

More testimony released where the Captain told the judge that he does not know why he did not turn his ship sooner as he was getting close to the Island. He was doing a salute to a former Captain on the Island.

 

He said he did this procedure 3-4 times in past, but, this time, he said he gave the command to turn away too late.

 

Still, he has helpers on the bridge and they could or appreciate everything about the approaching danger on the approach to the Island.

 

Anyway, the case is really over legally with this Captain. He is going to jail, as he has really nothing to rely upon as a defense.

[moniquet]

Anyone seen the video of the very first call from the Coastguard to the ship. 20 mins into blackout and still denying there was a list. Crew member had contacted them. Released today by italian TV.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-16637189

[mferris77]

The BIL is supposed to be angry because they put holes in the ship as part of the rescue effort? He thinks his making money is more important! Disgraceful person if true.

 

From what I read a Dutch company is doing the salvage. I have not seen Titan mentioned. I would take the supposed BIL report with a grain of salt...

 

Smit (the Dutch company) is in charge of fuel removal. Titan Salvage (US-based) is in charge of recovering the vessel itself. If they can't save the ship, they don't get paid.

 

Here is an excellent (sort of long read) story from Wired magazine about Titan Salvage, when they had to rescue a ship carrying thousands of new Mazda vehicles which had nearly capsized. I wonder if the BIL is one of the people in the article.

 

http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/magazine/16-03/ff_seacowboys?currentPage=all

[dmwnc1959]

I wonder, is it weakened because of the damage or because of the nature of the water it is sitting in?

It can't be good for steel to be sitting in (is it salt water?) water all this time either? Especially if it's compromised.

 

Most likely the angle of the hull and the rocky sea bottom it is sitting on, as well as now that explosives have been used in sensitive structural areas. There's no way they could have known exactly what they were doing when placing the explosives unless they were familiar with builders plans for the ship.

 

PS Millions, upon millions, upon millions, upon millions of people cruise, and on the bigger ships. Don't give up on them because of one incident. You don't quit flying or driving because of a plane crash or highway pile up. Big ships are just as safe, if not safer than the small ships you speak of. If I'm going to be hit by something, I want to be in a Hummer and not a Ford Aspire.

[DinghyRacer]

My husband and I have decided not to cruise. With the information provided we are still quite nervous about cruising and will maybe wait till the children are grown up and there is a better safety record for cruising.

 

He's more nervous than I am. But it's still a concern.

 

Thank you for all your feed back on my post about considering cruising.

 

We have been on smaller boats and feel comfortable on those at this point so we may just limit our "cruising" to that for now.

 

Still cruising, just not a large liner quite yet.

 

You are far, far safer on a cruise liner than just about any other mode of transport except maybe train.

[SomeBeach]

My husband and I have decided not to cruise. With the information provided we are still quite nervous about cruising and will maybe wait till the children are grown up and there is a better safety record for cruising.

 

He's more nervous than I am. But it's still a concern.

 

Thank you for all your feed back on my post about considering cruising.

 

We have been on smaller boats and feel comfortable on those at this point so we may just limit our "cruising" to that for now.

 

Still cruising, just not a large liner quite yet.

 

If you don't feel you can be comfortable then you have made the right decision for your family.

If you do indeed like cruising another option to consider is riverboat or steamboat travel. It is a slower pace and they don't have the kid's big play areas but it's something you could look at. I have a friend that has taken her young daughter on several steamboat cruises and the child has always enjoyed it.

[Quasar1011]

You are far, far safer on a cruise liner than just about any other mode of transport except maybe train.

 

Life is not without risk. The key is determining your acceptable level of risk- and that varies from person to person, and situation to situation.

[bobsig]

My husband and I have decided not to cruise. With the information provided we are still quite nervous about cruising and will maybe wait till the children are grown up and there is a better safety record for cruising. He's more nervous than I am. But it's still a concern. Thank you for all your feed back on my post about considering cruising. We have been on smaller boats and feel comfortable on those at this point so we may just limit our "cruising" to that for now. Still cruising, just not a large liner quite yet.

 

Cruising is NOT UNSAFE - 14.3 million people took a cruise in 2010 and you can count on one hand the number of fatalities. Most of those fatalities appear to have fallen overboard while drunk or impaired.

 

Here's something to think about - at any one day there are probably 40,000 or more people at sea on cruise ship. I live in a town of about 40,000. We have more crime, auto accidents, and stupid accidents killing people than ever would occur on a daily basis on a cruise ship. Staying home is much more dangerous.

[deckofficer]

Most likely the angle of the hull and the rocky sea bottom it is sitting on, as well as now that explosives have been used in sensitive structural areas. There's no way they could have known exactly what they were doing when placing the explosives unless they were familiar with builders plans for the ship.

 

PS Millions, upon millions, upon millions, upon millions of people cruise, and on the bigger ships. Don't give up on them because of one incident. You don't quit flying or driving because of a plane crash or highway pile up. Big ships are just as safe, if not safer than the small ships you speak of. If I'm going to be hit by something, I want to be in a Hummer and not a Ford Aspire.

 

Of course don't give up on them, a cruise makes for a great holiday. Your analogy with the Hummer and Aspire works well being hit my an outside source, but what is at issue on a cruise ship is that its positive stability is the lowest of any vessel, even lower than a RORO (roll on roll off car carrier). With that in mind, you have to accept the risk that your cruise ship when holed or being rolled by sea state has the least righting motion of any vessel and can capsize long before a smaller vessel. Since I have been flamed so much on this forum, I will include the textbook explanation below.........

 

GM and rolling period

Metacentre has a direct relationship with a ship's rolling period. A ship with a small GM will be "tender" - have a long roll period. An excessively low or negative GM increases the risk of a ship capsizing in rough weather, for example HMS Captain or the Vasa. It also puts the vessel at risk of potential for large angles of heel if the cargo or ballast shifts, such as with the Cougar Ace. A ship with low GM is less safe if damaged and partially flooded because the lower metacentric height leaves less safety margin. For this reason, maritime regulatory agencies such as the International Maritime Organization specify minimum safety margins for sea-going vessels. A larger metacentric height on the other hand can cause a vessel to be too "stiff"; excessive stability is uncomfortable for passengers and crew. This is because the stiff vessel quickly responds to the sea as it attempts to assume the slope of the wave. An overly stiff vessel rolls with a short period and high amplitude which results in high angular acceleration. This increases the risk of damage to the ship and to cargo. In contrast a "tender" ship lags behind the motion of the waves and tends to roll at lesser amplitudes. A passenger ship will typically have a long rolling period for comfort, perhaps 12 seconds while a tanker or freighter might have a rolling period of 6 to 8 seconds.

The period of roll can be estimated from the following equation[2]

 

Where g is the gravitational constant, k is the radius of gyration about the longitudinal axis through the centre of gravity and is the stability index.