Safety of Princess Ships

[pablo222]

One my two trips so far, that were something like 150 days at sea I never saw the crew even run out a fire hose, let alone check them.

 

I knew a girl who worked at the purser's desk. She took firefighting

training at some shore facility during a port call. She had pictures on

FB of the bunker gear, and her operating the hoses.

 

There is also a traning facility near the port in Ft. Lauderdale.

 

I have seen bunker gear and hoses deployed (but not used)

during a helo evacuation.

 

Most of the crew drills are conducted in port, while the passengers

are off the ship.

[pablo222]

It was listing in relatively calm seas. It would not have take much of a sea to 'Poseiden' that ship.

 

You're absolutely right -- except for gravity.

[Shogun]

Hi All

 

As to trianing have been onboard when Princess cut all electric power,

 

and ran safety drills,

 

even in the day time the inside of a cruise ship is a very dark place

 

with no lights.

 

yours Shogun

[dickwho]

Most of the crew drills are conducted in port, while the passengers

are off the ship.

 

As a teenager I scored an apprenticeship in the Royal Australian Navy [RAN] and like ALL sailors we were trained in shipboard fires.

 

There's a bit more to it than doing some shore training facility, like doing it at 3am with a good sea running and the lights in the area supposedly under threat, turned off. You also need breathing apparatus because something like 50-60 poisonous gases are generated by paint, polyvinylchloride, linoleum & other nasties, and they kill you. Furthermore, you have to be trained in the use of breathing apparatus. It ain't just grab a fire hose & off we go.

 

There's a few other things that sailors can do do alleviate problems on ships, not just the rust chippers and occasional tender drivers you see on cruise ships, here I'm referring trained personnel rigging up tow lines, transferring generators, pumps and palletised items from helos. I haven't heard of this occurring. They merely stayed flat in the water, with little power, no sanitation and from all accounts a problem with food. But they did get offered a dressing gown, WOW!

 

I'd love to be a fly on the wall when they 'supposedly' do their fire fighting training when the ship is in port, and the stewards are rushing about preparing rooms, food and grog coming on board, and refuelling. It would be 'The Keystone Cops' revisited.

[pablo222]

There's a few other things that sailors can do do alleviate problems on ships, not just the rust chippers and occasional tender drivers you see on cruise ships, here I'm referring trained personnel rigging up tow lines, transferring generators, pumps and palletised items from helos.

 

If you are on a war ship, in a battle zone, and you are unable

to keep the ship operating, you die.

 

So, you better have lots of people with lots of skills and the

required equipment to make emergency repairs without

relying on outside help.

 

With the Carnival Triumph -- the emergency -- the fire -- was controlled.

And, outside help was on scene within a few hours.

[davecttr]

So far most only hint at the real terror of what happened on Triumph. The fire knocked out power AND stabelizers! It was listing in relatively calm seas. It would not have take much of a sea to 'Poseiden' that ship. Without power to cut the surf, or stabelizers to make the force go along rather than across it, the danger of mega-disaster was very real. I think they were plain lucky.

 

Oddly, I now have two cruises in the pipeline, one I book since this happened. Guess I just cannot believe this sort of thing would dare happen to ME! Crazy, huh?

 

Doug is still sailing. :confused:

If that ship had to rely on stabilizers to survive a rough sea it would never have been issued with a safety certificate!. stabilizers are for passengers comfort only.

 

I believe the idea is to keep the ships head into the waves so that it piches rather than rolls. Incidently stabilisers are no use if the ship is pitching.

 

I am sure in extremis they would try anything to keep the ship head into wind, deploy anchors, drogues, anything.

[tom_uk]

Readers might be interested to know that in the case of ships registered in Bermuda (like most Princess ships, I think), the UK's Marine Accident Investigation Branch takes the lead in 'after the event' accident investigation, on behalf of the flag state. Here's a link to the MAIB website.

 

Of particular interest to Princess passengers might the MAIB reports into the fire on Star Princess in 2006. The main document (star_princess.pdf) looks to me like a detailed and thorough investigation. Princess passengers might also be interested in this statement near the front of the report which covers some aspects of jurisdiction:

 

"The MAIB has conducted this investigation on behalf of the Flag State, the Bermuda Maritime Administration, with the MAIB taking the lead role pursuant to the IMO Code for the Investigation of Marine Casualties and Incidents (Resolution A.849(20)). MAIB wishes to acknowledge the pivotal contributions made to the investigation by the US Coast Guard and the National Transportation Safety Board of the United States, and to thank them for their exemplary cooperation and support."

[Shogun]

Hi All

 

Tom UK, thanks for the link very interesting, lots of info on the Star Princess

 

 

there is a very detailed report of two men over board during a life boat drill on the Saga Sapphire,

 

well worth a read if you have ten minutes, so many little things, which lead up to accident,

 

yours Shogun

[pablo222]

So far most only hint at the real terror of what happened on Triumph. The fire knocked out power AND stabelizers!

 

Stabilizers aren't used to correct list, they are used to correct

roll. Stabliziers add drag. You would correct list, on in this

case wind-induced heel by shifting ballast. Usually water or

fuel in tanks.

[DShock]

God bless the U.S. Coast Guard and all who serve...these men and women do a remarkable job that often places them in danger.

 

You can bet we will see the Coast Guard implement new inspection directives in light of what happened with Triumph.

[WVBill]

Thank you for that Link Tom UK -

Until such a report is issued for the Carnival incident, all else, ( including my own posts ), is pure speculation regardless of the "reliable" sources quoted.

[dickwho]

If you are on a war ship, in a battle zone, and you are unable to keep the ship operating, you die.

 

So, you better have lots of people with lots of skills and the

required equipment to make emergency repairs without

relying on outside help.

 

With the Carnival Triumph -- the emergency -- the fire -- was controlled.

And, outside help was on scene within a few hours.

 

We were never in a battle zone. Most of the voyages I did was going from place to place training as the navy does.

 

In wartime, the ship's company is increased by about one third, but nevertheless, fire fighting, damage control, towing and the things that are done to remain afloat & save life at sea are practiced, practiced and practiced. So when something does go belly up, it is dealt with. The engine room fire in the HMAS Westralia circa 1998, is a case in point, where pressurised fuel lines ruptured in the engine spaces and a fire ensured. It was quickly extinguished.

 

My experience in two fairly lengthy voyages in cruise liners did not give me a great deal of confidence in the abilities of the crew. Crikey, they could barely handle the tenders, and that was in sheltered waters. How would it go if something serious occurred at night in a running sea. What do we do, bend over and kiss ........... goodbye.

 

One good thing that may come out of the Triumph incident is that the Government of the U.S. may get their act together and start to impose greater restrictions of those companies operating cruise ships. Of course any improvements will have to be met by us - the passengers.