The Good Old Days When cruise ships were Liners

[glojo]

The transatlantic I did in 2010 was 6 or 7 nights (I can't remember) and I thought it was over all too soon as well. If you live near Southampton or New York then the shorter transatlantics are probably very welcome, however if you have to come a long way to get to either New York or Southampton, a longer voyage is more desirable.

 

What was the French line like?

 

 

From your postings I believe you would of LOVED the FRANCE. I was young but still recall the FRANCE - she was a bit different than the QE2...on the FRANCE the food & service was exceptional....all the crew & officers were French. The only comparison I can make to Cunard is that both ships were representative of their homeports. The France was considered to be the ultimate - the cabins were typical of QE2 but the public rooms were designed w/ archtecture & art of the highest level. The First class diningroom was designed so you entered & walked down a wide staircase of about 12 steps - so one was seen & could see...the clothes & jewels(on both the men & women) were fabulous. The ships were smaller - as QE2 - so the social aspects were more abounding than today. restful days & dazzling nites! People dressed formally each evening except first & last nights..when men wore suits & ties and the women travelling suits or cocktail type clothing. People smoked & drank & dressed for cocktails & dinner......I LOVED IT - even as young man(still do & here in NYC that type of style is still alive somewhat).

 

Back then cocktail hour was mandatoiry & people stayed in the lounges all night having fun. The crossings were only 5 days back then.....but when air travel became more prevalent you could do a crossing & spend the weekend in Paris or London all in a week. I did that once & it was fun tho we were exhaisted when we returned home - we hardly slept - but the parties & shopping were fantastic. One great aspect was also that everyone had Bon Voyage parties in NYC before sailing. For a few hours friends & family partied - champagne was the drink of choice, canapes & nibbles...so everyone was well primed by the time the gong was sounded for all ashore thats going ashore( on French Line the asst stewards were called "Monkeys" )

 

 

The ship itself was a bit of a roller due to its hull design but otherwise sailed beautifully - her smoke stacks were iconic.

 

Back in the 1970's one could sail from NYC westside piers many home ports in Europe...so the France went to Le Harve, QE2 to Southampton, the Italian Line ships to Italy & Hapag Lloyd to Northern Europe(there was also the Swedish & Norwegian Lines).

 

The Italian Line also had ships that were cutting edge - great great fun in that Italian way.

 

Thanks again for your efforts....hope you have your next voyage booked already!

 

What a really nice post that describes a bygone era of which we will probably never see again although there was a class system and perhaps those in steerage might not have the same, fond memories.

 

In defence of the SS France I think it fair to suggest that contrary to rose tinted impressions, most if not ALL ocean going liners were 'a bit of a roller' ;):)

 

I dread to think of the complaints this generation would be making if they had to put up with the conditions these ships regularly encountered.

 

As soon as the ship encounters adverse sea conditions, one of the duties of cabin staff was to run out ropes in all corridors to enable passengers safe passage as they strolled along the corridors. Rolling to an angle of twenty degrees was common and although ships that did not have stabilisers would possibly go into refit and have them fitted, they were still not comparable to what is fitted on modern, much larger ships that we see today.

 

Bottom line.... ALL older cruise liners were a slave to the acts of mother nature.

[balf]

LOL ,who told you?:confused:

 

A relative who had never sailed before went to Canada to visit relatives. He said it was not a pleasant trip.

 

I think the ship was designed to double as a troop carrier hence the very high speeds possible. Is this correct?

 

David.

[turquoise 6]

A relative who had never sailed before went to Canada to visit relatives. He said it was not a pleasant trip.

 

I think the ship was designed to double as a troop carrier hence the very high speeds possible. Is this correct?

 

David.

Hi David: It was designed as a sleek,all Aluminum,Steal . No Wood on Board. It was a luxury Ocean Liner with 3 classes. A favorite of celebrities and socialites in First class.

it was designed for speed. It was very nice!

[glojo]

A relative who had never sailed before went to Canada to visit relatives. He said it was not a pleasant trip.

 

I think the ship was designed to double as a troop carrier hence the very high speeds possible. Is this correct?

 

David.

Surely converting large passenger ships into vessels that can transport large numbers of troops might be considered suitable when an island is engaged in hostilities with a foe on a different land mass? Recent history would highlidht how quickly and relatively easily this can be done including the fitting of helicopter decks!! Not sure they were designed at the outset for carrying troops in bunks four high??

[turquoise 6]

Surely converting large passenger ships into vessels that can transport large numbers of troops might be considered suitable when an island is engaged in hostilities with a foe on a different land mass? Recent history would highlidht how quickly and relatively easily this can be done including the fitting of helicopter decks!! Not sure they were designed at the outset for carrying troops in bunks four high??

I don't know about the s/s United States as being a troop ship. WW2 was over when the United States was built and went into service.

I can assure you that the S/S UNITED STATES remained a true ocean liner and never did cruises!!!!! Unlike the QM2:cool:

[glojo]

I don't know about the s/s United States as being a troop ship. WW2 was over when the United States was built and went into service.

I can assure you that the S/S UNITED STATES remained a true ocean liner and never did cruises!!!!! Unlike the QM2:cool:

In the grand scheme of things very, very few cruise ships have needed conversion, but when needs must, the GREAT in Great britain will always come to the fore. It is only the famous liners that got the publicity regarding their troop ship role but without them I am guessing we would all be now be speaking a different language :)

 

A shame that such a great ship was only used as a ferry!:eek:;)

[balf]

Surely converting large passenger ships into vessels that can transport large numbers of troops might be considered suitable when an island is engaged in hostilities with a foe on a different land mass? Recent history would highlidht how quickly and relatively easily this can be done including the fitting of helicopter decks!! Not sure they were designed at the outset for carrying troops in bunks four high??

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_United_States

 

David.

[Whitemarsh]

I don't know about the s/s United States as being a troop ship. WW2 was over when the United States was built and went into service.

I can assure you that the S/S UNITED STATES remained a true ocean liner and never did cruises!!!!! Unlike the QM2:cool:

 

Perhaps if she had of done some cruises she'd still be around, instead of rotting to death in Philadelphia.

 

Cruising on QM2 is very enjoyable, you should give it a go sometime.

[Whitemarsh]

From your postings I believe you would of LOVED the FRANCE. I was young but still recall the FRANCE - she was a bit different than the QE2...on the FRANCE the food & service was exceptional....all the crew & officers were French. The only comparison I can make to Cunard is that both ships were representative of their homeports. The France was considered to be the ultimate - the cabins were typical of QE2 but the public rooms were designed w/ archtecture & art of the highest level. The First class diningroom was designed so you entered & walked down a wide staircase of about 12 steps - so one was seen & could see...the clothes & jewels(on both the men & women) were fabulous. The ships were smaller - as QE2 - so the social aspects were more abounding than today. restful days & dazzling nites! People dressed formally each evening except first & last nights..when men wore suits & ties and the women travelling suits or cocktail type clothing. People smoked & drank & dressed for cocktails & dinner......I LOVED IT - even as young man(still do & here in NYC that type of style is still alive somewhat).

 

Back then cocktail hour was mandatoiry & people stayed in the lounges all night having fun. The crossings were only 5 days back then.....but when air travel became more prevalent you could do a crossing & spend the weekend in Paris or London all in a week. I did that once & it was fun tho we were exhaisted when we returned home - we hardly slept - but the parties & shopping were fantastic. One great aspect was also that everyone had Bon Voyage parties in NYC before sailing. For a few hours friends & family partied - champagne was the drink of choice, canapes & nibbles...so everyone was well primed by the time the gong was sounded for all ashore thats going ashore( on French Line the asst stewards were called "Monkeys" )

 

 

The ship itself was a bit of a roller due to its hull design but otherwise sailed beautifully - her smoke stacks were iconic.

 

Back in the 1970's one could sail from NYC westside piers many home ports in Europe...so the France went to Le Harve, QE2 to Southampton, the Italian Line ships to Italy & Hapag Lloyd to Northern Europe(there was also the Swedish & Norwegian Lines).

 

The Italian Line also had ships that were cutting edge - great great fun in that Italian way.

 

Thanks again for your efforts....hope you have your next voyage booked already!

 

I agree with Glojo, what a wonderful post. It all sounds wonderful, you are lucky you got to experience that.

 

The First class diningroom was designed so you entered & walked down a wide staircase of about 12 steps - so one was seen & could see...the clothes & jewels(on both the men & women) were fabulous.

 

You can still do this on Mary. The Britannia Restaurant has that marvellous staircase and the Grills restaurants have their runways. There is always the opportunity to make an entrance. ;)

 

Just ask the countess.... :D

[vjmatty]

Perhaps if she had of done some cruises she'd still be around, instead of rotting to death in Philadelphia.

 

Cruising on QM2 is very enjoyable, you should give it a go sometime.

 

I agree... to me, crossing over and back without visiting Europe, either by cruise or land vacation, would be like flying to the moon but never getting out of the spaceship.

 

Chacun a son gout, I guess.

[Rotterdam]

I agree with Glojo, what a wonderful post. It all sounds wonderful, you are lucky you got to experience that.

 

You can still do this on Mary. The Britannia Restaurant has that marvellous staircase and the Grills restaurants have their runways. There is always the opportunity to make an entrance. ;)

 

Just ask the countess.... :D

 

I actually remember a tall blonde in a gown trailing a fox stole on the floor exiting the DR - w/ great effect....drama drama drama!!!!

 

Funny - I did a 12 day carib cruise on QM2 a couple of years ago & I don't remember the Brittania Restaurant's entrance.....The runways in the Grills were fun but unfortunately for us there wasn't a Countess to be seen anywhere. I really did enjoy the ship & all its offerings....

[glojo]

I actually remember a tall blonde in a gown trailing a fox stole on the floor exiting the DR - w/ great effect....drama drama drama!!!!

 

Funny - I did a 12 day carib cruise on QM2 a couple of years ago & I don't remember the Brittania Restaurant's entrance.....The runways in the Grills were fun but unfortunately for us there wasn't a Countess to be seen anywhere. I really did enjoy the ship & all its offerings....

 

Where did you say that tall blonde stole the fox she was dragging around the dining room? :eek:;)

 

to me, crossing over and back without visiting Europe, either by cruise or land vacation, would be like flying to the moon but never getting out of the spaceship.

;)

 

I know exactly what you mean but I for one would LOVE to just fly to the Moon and return! (note that last word)

 

Hi VJ,

I totally accept your point and I have just had to take some extra medication which makes me say silly things :o

[turquoise 6]

Perhaps if she had of done some cruises she'd still be around, instead of rotting to death in Philadelphia.

 

Cruising on QM2 is very enjoyable, you should give it a go sometime.

 

The S/S United States, A true Ocean Liner,a Pedigree of Ocean Liners.Did her service as Ocean Liner. Today , The S/S United States Is resting .

The QM2 is a much younger ship,of the 21st. century. I am sorry to say that

the QM2(Carnival line,Registered in Hamilton,Bermuda) never liveD up to the reputation of a Ocean Liner.

The S/s United States ,when in service ,would never gone to Australia.! on a cruise. Those liners were called .BLUE SEA LINERS.

I am sorry to inform you :o

[turquoise 6]

Anyone born before 1969 ostensibly could have sailed the SS United States and lived to tell about it.

1969, 1969, 1969,1969:eek::eek::eek:

[Salacia]

Thanks for pointing that out Salacia.... I hadn't noticed there was a documentary on the website. :)

 

You're welcome. And now part 3 is available for viewing on line.:)

http://www.ssusc.org/news/ss-united-states-made-in-america-2/#ch3

[Salacia]

1969, 1969, 1969,1969:eek::eek::eek:

 

Time it was, and what a time it was, it was

A time of innocence, a time of confidences ...

-Simon and Garfunkel

 

1969 - What a year! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1969

[vjmatty]

Where did you say that tall blonde stole the fox she was dragging around the dining room? :eek:;)

 

;)

 

I know exactly what you mean but I for one would LOVE to just fly to the Moon and return! (note that last word)

 

Hi VJ,

I totally accept your point and I have just had to take some extra medication which makes me say silly things :o

 

LOL I want to return too, but I would still want to get out and walk around.... it is one of the disagreements DH and I are having about a cruise to Antarctica. I think it is more important to set foot on the continent, while he is all about sailing into the circle, for which I could care less. :rolleyes:

[vjmatty]

Time it was, and what a time it was, it was

A time of innocence, a time of confidences ...

-Simon and Garfunkel

 

1969 - What a year! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1969

 

Thank you for that informative link.... and for the song that will now play in my head for the rest of the day :)

 

Interesting it was the same year as Neil Armstrong walking on the moon.... I didn't realize the significance when I made my earlier analogy.

 

FYI- regarding the reference to "Midnight Cowboy", it would go on to be the first X-rated movie to win an Oscar for best picture.

 

If you like current movies that take place in the 1960's, check out Pirate Radio, about a ship that broadcasts rock and roll off the coast of Britain to avoid censorship laws... good cast and awesome soundtrack. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1131729/

 

Also, Men in Black III had some really good retro scenes from the 1960's.... the clothing, the hair, the cars... all spot on.

[turquoise 6]

Time it was, and what a time it was, it was

A time of innocence, a time of confidences ...

-Simon and Garfunkel

 

1969 - What a year! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1969

Amazing , I asked for it!

Thanks,Salacia:)

[glojo]

The S/S United States, A true Ocean Liner,a Pedigree of Ocean Liners.Did her service as Ocean Liner. Today , The S/S United States Is resting .

The QM2 is a much younger ship,of the 21st. century. I am sorry to say that

the QM2(Carnival line,Registered in Hamilton,Bermuda) never liveD up to the reputation of a Ocean Liner.

The S/s United States ,when in service ,would never gone to Australia.! on a cruise. Those liners were called .BLUE SEA LINERS.

I am sorry to inform you :o

Many apologies but I am not sure I agree with you regarding this ship. As an ocean going liner I would certainly not consider her to be luxurious. (not you, Whitemarsh or anyone else I hold in high regard, but I do not) The biggest issues might be in her design and by this I mean the ship was heavily subsidised by the US government on the understanding that in times of need she would be used as a troop ship and part of this deal was that she was built to military naval specifications which in layman's terms means she had to have lots of small compartments with water tight doors, something not conducive to home comforts with lots of sills to trip the unsuspecting and lots of low beams to rattle the dandruff.

 

The ship was built to capture the Blue Riband and no expense was spared in doing that but at what cost? Could a private company afford to operate a ship with the amount of power that fine ship needed to cross the Atlantic? We can all have our opinions on that question but the bottom line is that the Queen Mary and the Queen Elizabeth could and did operate as both a ship to ferry passengers back and forth across the Atlantic and then as aircraft started to break into this market they adapted and started to also offer cruises. The United States was put up for sale but apart from some half hearted interested no one purchased her. This is a brief extract about the ship:

 

the ship construction made no use of wood. Fireproofing throughout included marinite, treated fabrics, aluminum furniture and specially formulated fire-retardant paints. Her steel and aluminum construction also made her more fire resistant as well as more stable.

 

The stability issue is extremely subjective and rolling to 20 degrees in a moderncruise ship would be UNACCEPTABLE, yes by having the aluminium superstructure she had slightly less top weight but she will still roll and at high speed would they deploy stabilisers (question not statement)

 

I have found some references that claim the SS United States 'pioneered':eek: the use of stabilisers??? Something I fear does not make sense and then we have a more realistic assessment:

 

The SS United States is said to have handled "like a Chris Craft." The ship was remarkably stable at high speeds and in rough seas, although she tended to roll up to 20 degrees in rough weather. Stabilisers were not likely incorporated into the SS United States because they would have reduced the ship's speed.

 

My experience of stabilisers is that at high speeds we withdrew them and during manoeuvring they would not be deployed so I tend to lean toward the latter. The Queen Mary had stabilisers fitted during one of her extended refits but when she was built, when she operated as a 'ferry' ;)she certainly did not have them.

 

Again a topic way above my pay grade but even now in the 21st century the American Navy is having significant problems with using two different types of metal when building their ships. The aluminium superstructure built onto a steel hull is a recipe for electrolysis.

 

Yet, in the mid-1970s, the US admiralty reportedly began to question this policy, allegedly due to high maintenance costs caused by cracks in the deck houses built from aluminium, according to an issue of the New York Times from 1987. Apparently, the problem was particularly severe on said Oliver Perry-class frigates. Whereas the Ticonderoga-class frigates have an aluminium superstructure, the Arleigh Burke -class of guided missile destroyers which were built from 1991 onwards features, essentially, an all-steel design. Apart from this issue, the lower melting point of aluminium raises questions of a more general nature in a military setting.

 

I have no idea what is meant by aluminium is more fire resistant but it certainly melts at a much LOWER temperature than steel.. Melts = burns = looses it shape = looses its water tight integrity

 

Not a pretty sight

 

Superstructure cracking, frankly, is not uncommon, especially in ships that have aluminum superstructures.Aluminiumm is lighter by weight, it has the strength to hold the ship together and is more resistant to oxidation corrosion, and you don't have to paint it. But it has to be treated more carefully in terms of its fatigue life. We have the technology to get that right.

 

Basically the SS United States was a formula 1 racing car built as light as possible but also as strong as possible and as powerful as possible. Luxury was a low priority as right from the outset the military had a significant input into its design.

 

This is just my opinion and I respect the fact you consider her to be a luxury liner and thankfully we all have different prefences to likes and dislikes.

[Jim Avery]

Time it was, and what a time it was, it was

A time of innocence, a time of confidences ...

-Simon and Garfunkel

 

1969 - What a year! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1969

 

'69 I was 21 and I called the world my own". Jackson Browne.

Yes it was! I was 21 and I first sailed QE2.:D

[Rotterdam]

The summer of LOVE???????

 

 

Time it was, and what a time it was, it was

A time of innocence, a time of confidences ...

-Simon and Garfunkel

 

1969 - What a year! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1969

[Rotterdam]

mine was Chinchilla........

 

 

 

Where did you say that tall blonde stole the fox she was dragging around the dining room? :eek:;)

 

;)

 

:o

[vjmatty]

The summer of LOVE???????

 

Um excuse me but the summer of LOVE was 1967.... which also happens to be the year I was born :o

[turquoise 6]

Many apologies but I am not sure I agree with you regarding this ship. As an ocean going liner I would certainly not consider her to be luxurious. (not you, Whitemarsh or anyone else I hold in high regard, but I do not) The biggest issues might be in her design and by this I mean the ship was heavily subsidised by the US government on the understanding that in times of need she would be used as a troop ship and part of this deal was that she was built to military naval specifications which in layman's terms means she had to have lots of small compartments with water tight doors, something not conducive to home comforts with lots of sills to trip the unsuspecting and lots of low beams to rattle the dandruff.

 

The ship was built to capture the Blue Riband and no expense was spared in doing that but at what cost? Could a private company afford to operate a ship with the amount of power that fine ship needed to cross the Atlantic? We can all have our opinions on that question but the bottom line is that the Queen Mary and the Queen Elizabeth could and did operate as both a ship to ferry passengers back and forth across the Atlantic and then as aircraft started to break into this market they adapted and started to also offer cruises. The United States was put up for sale but apart from some half hearted interested no one purchased her. This is a brief extract about the ship:

 

 

 

The stability issue is extremely subjective and rolling to 20 degrees in a moderncruise ship would be UNACCEPTABLE, yes by having the aluminium superstructure she had slightly less top weight but she will still roll and at high speed would they deploy stabilisers (question not statement)

 

I have found some references that claim the SS United States 'pioneered':eek: the use of stabilisers??? Something I fear does not make sense and then we have a more realistic assessment:

 

 

 

My experience of stabilisers is that at high speeds we withdrew them and during manoeuvring they would not be deployed so I tend to lean toward the latter. The Queen Mary had stabilisers fitted during one of her extended refits but when she was built, when she operated as a 'ferry' ;)she certainly did not have them.

 

Again a topic way above my pay grade but even now in the 21st century the American Navy is having significant problems with using two different types of metal when building their ships. The aluminium superstructure built onto a steel hull is a recipe for electrolysis.

 

 

 

I have no idea what is meant by aluminium is more fire resistant but it certainly melts at a much LOWER temperature than steel.. Melts = burns = looses it shape = looses its water tight integrity

 

Not a pretty sight

 

 

 

Basically the SS United States was a formula 1 racing car built as light as possible but also as strong as possible and as powerful as possible. Luxury was a low priority as right from the outset the military had a significant input into its design.

 

This is just my opinion and I respect the fact you consider her to be a luxury liner and thankfully we all have different prefences to likes and dislikes.

Thank you!!! Very Well done and Interesting. I will re reread this informative post. :) This is what a reply should be: Stay focused and informative