Internationally Adopted refused boarding?

[brooklynfc]

A former professor and now co-worker of mine posted this article on her Facebook. She has 2 children adopted from Ethiopia, so she posted it for FYI to her network of friends with internationally adopted children. However, it peaked my interest b/c my brother and his wife had US adopted children, one of which (not official YET) is another race. I was just wondering if this family really did meet all the requirements, but were still denied boarding. Of course, I don't know if Carnival is really to blame. Wouldn't Customs dictate what paperwork is okay? I'm not trying to start anything here. Just looking for facts for my friends and family.

 

http://graspingwind.blogspot.com/2013/10/bon-voyage.html

[Tithonus]

I remember reading a Carnival representative posting on that thread to contact her. Was that done? What was the outcome? All I remember was that the mother didn't have the necessary documentation, probably sparked by the kid not looking like her.

 

Anything else will be speculation.

[shof515]

It seems they cause more harm by bringing digital copy of the documents on the phone. Carnival/CBP/Custom, etc want real original paper documents in hand. Faxing/emailing documents can cause problems

[brooklynfc]

I remember reading a Carnival representative posting on that thread to contact her. Was that done? What was the outcome? All I remember was that the mother didn't have the necessary documentation, probably sparked by the kid not looking like her.

 

Anything else will be speculation.

 

I read all the comments and didn't see any Carnival response. Though, the owner of the blog may have deleted it (for whatever reason). I guess I don't understand if the child is legally a US citizen, why they would have to have anything but the US birth certificate, which they had. I'm not taking sides, just really want to know the facts, so that I can help my friends in the future.

[Tithonus]

I read all the comments and didn't see any Carnival response. Though, the owner of the blog may have deleted it (for whatever reason). I guess I don't understand if the child is legally a US citizen, why they would have to have anything but the US birth certificate, which they had. I'm not taking sides, just really want to know the facts, so that I can help my friends in the future.

 

I would hope not. All I saw was someone posting on that families behalf, but assumed it would be handled offline. I gather that cruiser or the one posting on her behalf never came back with a "settlement".

[CruisinCarps]

Can you direct us/me over to that other thread or remember how it was titled? (I would like to read what was posted over there.)

 

I read her blog entry and she states they had an original birth certificate for them...so I am not sure what the problem is. ?? We are also going on a closed-loop cruise as well, and it states we only need those items to board. (We have passports we're using though- easier than carrying B.C.s on board).

[Tithonus]

Can you direct us/me over to that other thread or remember how it was titled? (I would like to read what was posted over there.)

 

I read her blog entry and she states they had an original birth certificate for them...so I am not sure what the problem is. ?? We are also going on a closed-loop cruise as well, and it states we only need those items to board. (We have passports we're using though- easier than carrying B.C.s on board).

 

It was just a Facebook post, either on the Carnival page, or John Healds page. It was posted on her date of embarkation, so a lot of scrolling may be involved, if it's still there at all.

[rdler]

I feel awful for that family.

 

I adopted my son internationally. I am pink, he is brown. For years, he travelled exclusively on his Certificate of Citizenship which, at least until the recent past, was listed as a document that was acceptable for travel. In fact, my son made platinum before we finally got him a passport!

 

That North Carolina birth certificate should have been more than adequate. I think Carnival made a big mistake.

[Elaine5715]

http://www.uscis.gov/adoption/bringing-your-internationally-adopted-child-united-states/certificate-citizenship-your-internationally-adopted-child

 

The family did not have the proper documents.

[ronandannette]

I read all the comments and didn't see any Carnival response. Though, the owner of the blog may have deleted it (for whatever reason). I guess I don't understand if the child is legally a US citizen, why they would have to have anything but the US birth certificate, which they had. I'm not taking sides, just really want to know the facts, so that I can help my friends in the future.

 

If the kids were born in Ethiopia, they would not have US birth certificates even if they now are US citizens.

 

Can you direct us/me over to that other thread or remember how it was titled? (I would like to read what was posted over there.)

 

I read her blog entry and she states they had an original birth certificate for them...so I am not sure what the problem is. ?? We are also going on a closed-loop cruise as well, and it states we only need those items to board. (We have passports we're using though- easier than carrying B.C.s on board).

 

If they are not yet legal US citizens it may have been something along the lines of the countries where they were going requiring travel visas for citizens from their country of origin. There are relatively few countries that a US citizen will need a visa to visit; nationals from many, many other countries aren't so fortunate.

[brooklynfc]

http://www.uscis.gov/adoption/bringing-your-internationally-adopted-child-united-states/certificate-citizenship-your-internationally-adopted-child

 

The family did not have the proper documents.

 

So they need this Certification of Citizenship rather than the US B/C?

[Elaine5715]

So they need this Certification of Citizenship rather than the US B/C?

 

yes

[brooklynfc]

Okay.....I'm going to ask nicely, one last time.

 

Let's drop the race thing now. We are talking about proper documentation, not trying to solve the world's discrimination problems. While that is important, this is not the forum for it nor the purpose of the thread. I'm sure moderators would agree with me. So before this thread gets pulled due to off topic discussions, let's return to the issue at hand.

 

So according to the website Elaine posted, they needed this certification and not the birth certificate. Now, I would guess (since I'm a US born citizen, I'm guessing) that Carnival's site probably doesn't go into details about this, but if I remember, it does have a link to US Customs page, right?

[txponycruiser]

I am an adoptive parent and recently took our son on his first cruise. The poster stated that the child was re-adopted in the US (not sure what that means) and had an US issued birth certificate with both adoptive parents name on it.

 

It is my understanding that once that US birth certificate is issued to the parents no other documentation is needed to prove the parentage of the child. Therefore, the child should have been allowed to board. If it was a US certificate, you can't tell that the child was adopted by looking at the BC. My son's BC looks exactly like his original one with the exception that my husband and my name is on it instead of his birth parents.

 

I think I have to side with the family on this one but I think they may have complicated the matters by presenting the VISA. The child is a legally adopted child in the US with a US birth certificate. Unless of course their facts are wrong.

[rdler]

As I understood it, the Certificate of Citizenship (which no one ever understood, and I had to explain) was in lieu of an original state birth certificate or a US passport and some other items.

 

As my son got older, Customs would sometimes pull us aside and question my son and me independently. I didn't mind this. I was glad they were paying attention.

[Tithonus]

I am an adoptive parent and recently took our son on his first cruise. The poster stated that the child was re-adopted in the US (not sure what that means) and had an US issued birth certificate with both adoptive parents name on it.

 

It is my understanding that once that US birth certificate is issued to the parents no other documentation is needed to prove the parentage of the child. Therefore, the child should have been allowed to board. If it was a US certificate, you can't tell that the child was adopted by looking at the BC. My son's BC looks exactly like his original one with the exception that my husband and my name is on it instead of his birth parents.

 

I think I have to side with the family on this one but I think they may have complicated the matters by presenting the VISA. The child is a legally adopted child in the US with a US birth certificate. Unless of course their facts are wrong.

 

Uow can the US issue a birth certificate for someone born outside the US? I can't even get a reissue unless I go back to my town of birth.

[Herbaltees]

I am an adoptive parent and recently took our son on his first cruise. The poster stated that the child was re-adopted in the US (not sure what that means) and had an US issued birth certificate with both adoptive parents name on it.

 

It is my understanding that once that US birth certificate is issued to the parents no other documentation is needed to prove the parentage of the child. Therefore, the child should have been allowed to board. If it was a US certificate, you can't tell that the child was adopted by looking at the BC. My son's BC looks exactly like his original one with the exception that my husband and my name is on it instead of his birth parents.

 

I think I have to side with the family on this one but I think they may have complicated the matters by presenting the VISA. The child is a legally adopted child in the US with a US birth certificate. Unless of course their facts are wrong.

 

I have to agree with you there, I'm siding with Carnival. I think they over complicated things with the child's Ethiopian passport, and entry Visa etc. I think once they received the NC BC, they should have applied for a US passport and relegated that other one to the memories box.

 

I also think the mother should have spent more time researching exactly what was needed for the vacation. High resolutions images on a cell phone? Get real, they won't even accept that at the DMV, let alone US Customs!

 

To the OP, I don't have an answer to your original question, but I would like to suggest that you tell your family and friends to apply for US docs as soon as they are able to simplify the whole transaction.

Edited October 30, 2013 by Herbaltees

[boo214]

i think some posters may be confused. according to the link at the beginning of the thread they state they had their original birth certificates and the childs ethiopian passport with entry visa. also states the reason for not bringing original green card because it was not listed as required. here it is from the link:

Why couldn’t he board?

Carnival’s supervisor was requiring more documentation (either a US Passport or an original of his USCIS [green] card) to prove our internationally adopted son’s US citizenship, stating we weren’t compliant “with the US Government’s travel documentation requirements.” We had all of the following papers:

• An original, embossed birth certificate issued by North Carolina Vital Records, showing both my wife’s name and mine with our birthplaces.
  
• His current Ethiopian passport with entry Visa (Child Citizenship Act of 2000 allows an adopted child’s foreign passport with US entry stamp as proof of US citizenship).
  
• High resolution scan of his USCIS (green card) on my phone. We didn't take the original because it wasn't listed as a required document (see below). Still, we offered to fax or email it immediately AND to overnight the original so they could have it upon our return.
  

[Herbaltees]

Uow can the US issue a birth certificate for someone born outside the US? I can't even get a reissue unless I go back to my town of birth.

 

My brother was born abroad to our US citizen parents. The birth certificate states "US citizen born abroad", or something like that. It's not uncommon Military families do it all the time.

[rdler]

An internationally adopted child, Tithonus, can get a birth certificate issued by his state of residence after the child is "readopted" after a court proceeding in that state. The child is already a U.S. Citizen, and is so upon entering the United States with the appropriate documentation.

 

International adoption is a long and involved process.

[Tithonus]

An internationally adopted child, Tithonus, can get a birth certificate issued by his state of residence after the child is "readopted" after a court proceeding in that state. The child is already a U.S. Citizen, and is so upon entering the United States with the appropriate documentation.

 

International adoption is a long and involved process.

 

Thank you.

[richraven]

i think some posters may be confused. according to the link at the beginning of the thread they state they had their original birth certificates and the childs ethiopian passport with entry visa. also states the reason for not bringing original green card because it was not listed as required. here it is from the link:

Why couldn’t he board?

Carnival’s supervisor was requiring more documentation (either a US Passport or an original of his USCIS [green] card) to prove our internationally adopted son’s US citizenship, stating we weren’t compliant “with the US Government’s travel documentation requirements.” We had all of the following papers:

 

• An original, embossed birth certificate issued by North Carolina Vital Records, showing both my wife’s name and mine with our birthplaces.
  
• His current Ethiopian passport with entry Visa (Child Citizenship Act of 2000 allows an adopted child’s foreign passport with US entry stamp as proof of US citizenship).
  
• High resolution scan of his USCIS (green card) on my phone. We didn't take the original because it wasn't listed as a required document (see below). Still, we offered to fax or email it immediately AND to overnight the original so they could have it upon our return.
  

Now that's more like it. I agree with your point and it didn't have anything to do with wheather the children are the same "color" as the parents...Great point.:D

[cmitch9999]

I believe Carnival messed up on this one.

 

The child's Ethopian passport had the correct entry visa which had automatically given that child US citizenship when he came to the US...

 

I don't believe the staff member was aware of this situation and therefore wanted something 'else' to prove the child was a permanent resident or citizen of the US.

 

They did a re-adoption in the US to be able to get a US birth certificate for their child. It will state on that birth certificate that it is NOT proof of citizenship.

 

I have 2 sons adopted internationally before they changed that entry visa automatic citizenship amendment.. I traveled with their naturalization certificates before we had passports for them. The traveling family above doesn't have that paperwork since they had the citizenship granted by the time they brought their child into the usa.

 

Passports are the best way to insure you will not have a hold up at the port...

 

I would have been on the phone to my local US senator and tried to get someone to override the carnival rep ....

 

Hopefully Carnival will find a way to provide a future cruise to the family.

[42CruiseCrazy]

http://www.uscis.gov/adoption/bringing-your-internationally-adopted-child-united-states/certificate-citizenship-your-internationally-adopted-child

 

The family did not have the proper documents.

 

The parents had the child's passport and proof that the child had entered the US legally and was legally adopted. That is all that should be required. Many people on this thread think that only US citizens are allowed to cruise on Carnival which is nonsense. If they would have taken the cruise they would not have been denied re-entry into the US so Carnival had no right to turn them away. The Carnival person screwed up and the corporation should take responsibility and make it right for this family. :mad:

[Tithonus]

The parents had the child's passport and proof that the child had entered the US legally and was legally adopted. That is all that should be required. Many people on this thread think that only US citizens are allowed to cruise on Carnival which is nonsense. If they would have taken the cruise they would not have been denied re-entry into the US so Carnival had no right to turn them away. The Carnival person screwed up and the corporation should take responsibility and make it right for this family. :mad:

 

I must have missed where someone said on US citizens are allowed to cruise Carnival.