QE Cruise to nowhere

[sogne]

The power of thrusters is physically limited. It is not a matter of money.

 

there are gales currently 41 knots at Ijmuiden, it simply would have been impossible to enter the lock for the North Sea Canal in those conditions, thrusters would have been unable to counter the leeway on the ship (windage) and if the ship had got in yesterday under favourable conditions it may well have been unable to leave today. It is nothing to do with money simply basic seamanship. These short Xmas trips are always fraught with the danger of being unable to dock either through pilots being unable to board or those encountered on QE.

[BlueRiband]

.. we noticed there was still a lot of passengers in line at the pursers desk. I hope they weren't all asking for the auto tips to be removed!

 

I'm afraid that is exactly why they are in line. Experienced sailors know that sea and weather conditions will mean a port has to be skipped, but newbies see this as their dream vacation being ruined. They think removal of autotips is "getting back" at the cruise line for their disappointment. They don't realize that hundreds of crew members also had their time ashore cancelled too. And now the people who worked hard to make their voyage as memorable as possible are getting screwed. :(

Edited December 22, 2014 by BlueRiband

[Curlu]

We're onboard and have thoroughly enjoyed having 3 days at sea! I think speaking to other passengers it was the lack of info early on that people are most disgruntled about and no visible presence of the Captain or senior crew that just made passengers feel unhappy. I really do hope that it's a minority that cancel their gratuity so but as its a short cruise hopefully the loss will not be too great! We've chosen to disembark this evening instead of staying onboard overnight- never thought I would do but it just makes sense to get home earlier if possible.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Salacia]

There's just been a near mutiny here with hundreds of passengers in the grand lobby demanding some sort of action! We just happened by. A passenger then read out a statement which ended in saying the captain would make a message soon. The captain then came on explaining the work that needed to be done on the ship and it had to be in port to do it. He said they had asked about docking in Rotterdam and Zeebrugge and that we would needs tugs to hold the ship into the pier at Zeebrugge (which is what they did last week) and he said this was not safe to do. So he said there would be compensation of $75 put on each account. A lot of passengers were not impressed by this but we thought it was good and unexpected.

 

After this meeting, we noticed there was still a lot of passengers in line at the pursers desk. I hope they weren't all asking for the auto tips to be removed!

 

What an unfortunate situation! I can certainly understand passenger's disappointment, but personally, I would not question the Master of the Ship's decision. A ship is not a democracy, and any one who sails the seas needs to accept that or find alternative modes of transport.

 

Since your disembarkation time remains as scheduled, technically, is this voyage considered an early termination since the ship will be returning to port early? If so, I don't know how compensation for a voyage that is terminated early is calculated, but I noticed this on the voyage contract (US version):

 

"...(D) If the Voyage is terminated or ends early Carrier, at its option, may issue a voyage credit, make a proportionate refund of Your Voyage Fare, transfer You to another ship or transport You to the scheduled final port..." copied from http://www.cunard.com/legal-information/

 

As I read it, if it's not considered an early termination, no compensation is required - in which case the 75USD on board credit seems like a nice gesture (albeit a modest one) because there is no obligation for Cunard to offer any compensation (if I understand correctly?).

 

Anyway, best wishes to all on board for a safe onward journey.

 

Salacia

Edited December 22, 2014 by Salacia

[Kynance]

I'm on the trip too and feel we have been kept well informed about the non-call at Amsterdam. The Captain first alerted us to the possibility at about 5pm on Saturday and then made three further announcements on Sunday at 0900, midday and mid-afternoon. In the circumstances there seems to have been nothing he could do: the safety of the passengers and crew obviously must come first.

 

The cancellation must have been very disappointing for anyone for whom this was a one-off or special trip, especially families with young children. I'm lucky in that this was an "extra" cruise we were squeezing in this year and I also have another one to look forward to next October.

 

The Captain clearly had to wait for approval from shoreside before making the announcement about the OBC - it came just after the start of afternoon tea. It was a little late, but better late than not at all and certainly in keeping with the season. Given that Cunard weren't obliged to do anything I'm glad they've taken the obvious disappointment of many aboard into account and made a small gesture. It won't make up for the missed call but in the circumstances, was the "right" thing to do.

[etruriaguy]

I agree.

 

I would never grumble at the captains decision to keep the ship and all its inhabitants safe.. Its a no brainer...

 

I was on the Queen Victoria's cruise to Norway and Iceland in june/july this year, and we missed the faroe islands due to a strong weather front that brought high winds.. It was THE stop i'd been looking forward to the most on the trip for over a year..... sigh lol

 

They first alerted us to the possibility of not getting into port the day before then made an announcement on the day of the "call" to inform us of why they decided not to go into port.. Ie safety would have been compromised due to prevailing winds.

 

The crew did their best to scramble together a programme of entertainment etc and we had a lovely day bouncing about on the sea...

 

Those complaining, even though I understand the disappointment, need to look at the bigger picture I think..

 

:) :)

[laktex]

I'm afraid that is exactly why they are in line. Experienced sailors know that sea and weather conditions will mean a port has to be skipped, but newbies see this as their dream vacation being ruined. They think removal of autotips is "getting back" at the cruise line for their disappointment. They don't realize that hundreds of crew members also had their time ashore cancelled too. And now the people who worked hard to make their voyage as memorable as possible are getting screwed. :(

 

A good reason to include gratuities into the price??

[Shallwe123]

Safety at sea for vessel, passengers and crew is paramount and is controlled by the Captain.

 

Unfortunately the weather does what it pleases and is totally uncontrollable.

 

Sorry for some that they are not happy but hope they enjoyed the ship and the wonderful crew. ( and hope its not too windy for us to enter at Amsterdam for New Year !!! )

 

Thanks to Ray66 for posting. Happy Christmas.

[cunardaddict]

A good reason to include gratuities into the price??

 

Absolutely.

 

We had again a very good dinner last night served by a highly motivated team.

 

Airport transfer is scheduled for 08:15.

[Salacia]

Absolutely.

 

We had again a very good dinner last night served by a highly motivated team.

 

Airport transfer is scheduled for 08:15.

 

I also agree, H&D charge should be included in the fare.

 

Cunardaddict, happy to hear your dinner was enjoyed. Were you in the Grills or Britannia?

 

Safe journey home, and thanks again for your on board posts. -S

Edited December 23, 2014 by Salacia

[MawganTr]

You've made it to the Daily Mail! They love a good drama and disgruntled passengers.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[Salacia]

You've made it to the Daily Mail! They love a good drama and disgruntled passengers.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

This?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2884383/Cruise-Christmas-markets-spends-four-days-doing-circles-Channel-Furious-tourists-stage-mutiny-ship-forced-turn-bad-weather.html

 

Hard to believe, this bit is: "They stormed the reception desk and clapped and chanted, ‘We want the captain’ demanding to know what was going on."

Edited December 23, 2014 by Salacia

[Mysticalmother]

This?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2884383/Cruise-Christmas-markets-spends-four-days-doing-circles-Channel-Furious-tourists-stage-mutiny-ship-forced-turn-bad-weather.html

 

Hard to believe, this bit is: "They stormed the reception desk and clapped and chanted, ‘We want the captain’ demanding to know what was going on."

 

Much of what is written in the Daily Mail is hard to believe! :)

[funinhounslow]

Just got back :)

 

Yes it was disappointing not being able yo

[sogne]

Much of what is written in the Daily Mail is hard to believe! :)

 

the name of the reporter might give a clue

[cunardaddict]

This?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2884383/Cruise-Christmas-markets-spends-four-days-doing-circles-Channel-Furious-tourists-stage-mutiny-ship-forced-turn-bad-weather.html

 

Hard to believe, this bit is: "They stormed the reception desk and clapped and chanted, ‘We want the captain’ demanding to know what was going on."

 

There were not all 2.000 unhappy passengers, probably some 200 barristers only.

[themanwithahat]

This?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2884383/Cruise-Christmas-markets-spends-four-days-doing-circles-Channel-Furious-tourists-stage-mutiny-ship-forced-turn-bad-weather.html

 

Hard to believe, this bit is: "They stormed the reception desk and clapped and chanted, ‘We want the captain’ demanding to know what was going on."

 

Got off it this morning. It's absolute c**p basically. There were a lot of people wanting to know what was going on, well maybe 100 or so. No aggro. Most people we spoke to were disappointed but pragmatic about it. We saw it as a double edged sword ; we did want to see the markets (there *are* Xmas markets in Amsterdam, though it isn't Bruges or Koln) but then we got more time on the boat.

 

Other fantasies ; there was a diesel spill, briefly, yesterday, near the theatre (or it smelt like that) but it was dealt with rapidly (it wasn't far from our cabins)

 

Entertainment ; they did the best they could. Martin Bell did an extra lecture and poetry reading. The Ents.Manager who is a serious amateur astronomer gave a lecture on the Solar System. The various bands/musicians did overtime I reckon. Usual quizzes and things were added. Spa reopened. They can't magically make other lecturers appear on the ship. Most of these people (and other staff) missed out on down time.

 

The boat didn't 'go round in circles' - it went pretty much all the way to Amsterdam, then back to Cherbourg area, then to Soton. There was the odd 'wiggle' but it was a slow cruise anyway.

 

Basically on the Amsterdam day they planned to shut everything down during the day more or less because they thought most people would be off the boat ; by about 10:00 (I think) there was a revised entertainment for the day more appropriate to a sea day.

 

Basically ; the whiners here and in the Mail are not representative ; they are probably after money. Mrs Hat. spent a fair chunk of the return trip home reading out and commenting on some of the abject nonsense in the comments.

[themanwithahat]

There were not all 2.000 unhappy passengers, probably some 200 barristers only.

 

Pretty much, probably not even that. Sad rather than unhappy. There is an old saying that 10% of anything is rubbish ; this applies here.

[balf]

A good reason to include gratuities into the price??

 

Yes of the many good reasons.

 

David.

[redfrock]

The company knew in advance about the weather. Sailing enthusiasts among the guests said even they had known about this weather front for over a week. We took 36 hours to get to Holland at a snail's pace and 12 hours to be back level with Southampton. We passed ports in Holland, Belgium, France, The Channel Islands and the UK. The weather in the English Channel wasn't nearly as bad. No port, not even Southampton, was deemed possible to dock, until it suited Cunard to dock early for repairs.

 

Moreover, if the weather was known about, why wasn't there a contingency plan for entertainment? The afternoon of the second day (when we were supposed to arrive in Amsterdam) had nothing to offer most passengers - 2 lots of televised football, bingo or a quiz. The rest of the so-called entertainment involved hard-sell shopping promotions - Tag Heuer watches and the Cunard spa packages.

 

Most people I spoke to weren't angry about missing Amsterdam if it was unsafe to proceed. The extremely quick decision that no other port was suitable and that we were going to spend 4 days just circling the English Channel was what infuriated most guests. It's somewhat different to miss a port when it's the last day of the cruise, but not many people would pay out for a trip to nowhere at all, particularly when no effort was made to lay on anything for the trapped guests to do. People were just sitting around staring into space, because there was next to no entertainment laid on.

 

The atmosphere on board was awful: everywhere people were angry and complaining. Cunard's reception staff couldn't have been more cavalier or disdainful. I wanted to register a complaint about the lack of entertainment. After being called over to one of the receptionists, she cut me short while she tidied up something in her drawer. I waited until she'd finished, began again, but then her colleague had a little joke to involve her in, so I had to wait until she'd had her laugh. That's pretty typical of the attitude that the guests experienced.

 

As if to rub it in, Cunard put on a 'Christmas Market' of a few stalls of stuff from their shops - with mulled wine, if you were prepared to pay for it. The other stall had waiters rolling napkins into shapes. I wouldn't have been surprised to see one rolled into a 2-finger salute.

 

People were queueing to get off the ship 12 hours before the end of the cruise. I've never seen anything like it.

 

I'm a Gold Member cruiser with Cunard, but I no longer trust this company with my money or precious holiday time. This is from someone who has experienced the disappointment of missed ports before - this was of a different order. Some people are saying 'get over it', but really, you had to be there to experience the feeling that we, and our money, were being taken for a ride in every sense of the phrase.

[nain and taid]

Just to emphasise: No passengers wanted the Captain to put the ship in jeopardy. The root cause of the problems encountered was the lack of communications. Saturday evening we learned the visit to Amsterdam was in peril. Not until late Sunday morning did we get another announcement that the wind had beaten us, and then it was Monday afternoon before the captain announced that we would be returning to Southampton early. No attempt to communicate in between times - just the map in the cabin to update us.

 

Also, no effort to say sorry/ sound contrite. Just a bland statement of fact.

 

When will big companies learn that if they have a problem/strike/mechanical failure/weather malfunction/what ever, all the people affected need to be told what is happening. If the management don't know, tell us that. Don't leave us in limbo, looking out of the windows and wondering. Communications are everything.

[balf]

Just to emphasise: No passengers wanted the Captain to put the ship in jeopardy. The root cause of the problems encountered was the lack of communications. Saturday evening we learned the visit to Amsterdam was in peril. Not until late Sunday morning did we get another announcement that the wind had beaten us, and then it was Monday afternoon before the captain announced that we would be returning to Southampton early. No attempt to communicate in between times - just the map in the cabin to update us.

 

Also, no effort to say sorry/ sound contrite. Just a bland statement of fact.

 

When will big companies learn that if they have a problem/strike/mechanical failure/weather malfunction/what ever, all the people affected need to be told what is happening. If the management don't know, tell us that. Don't leave us in limbo, looking out of the windows and wondering. Communications are everything.

 

Yes as always. I can never understand why the captain can't have a chat in the theatre where he can explain in person what the situation is. Like why the Marco Polo could dock but not QE. Ok we all know, but there seemed to be some who didn't.

 

"We want the captain". Indeed.

 

David.

[Heisenberg18]

Redfrock has hit the nail on the head! While no one disagrees with the safety decision, it was the level of collusion amongst the crew, that they continued to pretend that the ship would dock in Amsterdam, that infuriates me.

 

As professionals the Captain and bridge crew would have known the ship's wind limits and studied the forecast winds days in advance. Without a doubt the day we left Southampton they would have known the chances of making it safely up the canal were nill. Indeed it was not the first time this had happened and they would have been aware of this also. But the pretence was maintained and the decision not to dock presented as a surprise, having passed many alternative port and diversion opportunities.

 

Would we have done anything different had we known the realities of sailing in a 13 storey liner in the English Channel in December? Well, yes we would. We looked initially at the Marco Polo, which I understand actually docked, but we decided to opt for the luxury of Cunard. Or, like last year,we would have flown to the Xmas markets.

 

I feel almost 'scammed' if that is the right word for it. Will we ever sail with Cunard again, I doubt it!

Edited December 23, 2014 by Heisenberg18

[themanwithahat]

The company knew in advance about the weather. Sailing enthusiasts among the guests said even they had known about this weather front for over a week. We took 36 hours to get to Holland at a snail's pace and 12 hours to be back level with Southampton. We passed ports in Holland, Belgium, France, The Channel Islands and the UK. The weather in the English Channel wasn't nearly as bad. No port, not even Southampton, was deemed possible to dock, until it suited Cunard to dock early for repairs.

 

The Boat arrived in Amsterdam on time, pretty much (about 4am) . One sea day was always part of the itinerary. It was supposed to go that slowly. And it didn't "take 12 hours to be back level with Southampton".

 

It docked slightly early - during the Beatles first "second" performance, about 8:45 PM. Hardly enough time to make any sort of significant repair. I know this because the 'Beatles' were joking about it.

 

Moreover, if the weather was known about, why wasn't there a contingency plan for entertainment? The afternoon of the second day (when we were supposed to arrive in Amsterdam) had nothing to offer most passengers - 2 lots of televised football, bingo or a quiz. The rest of the so-called entertainment involved hard-sell shopping promotions - Tag Heuer watches and the Cunard spa packages.

[/Quote]

 

There is some truth in that. Though it was always like that, of course (and is on other cruises) as the second day is and always was a sea day.

 

It was the third day that was completely rewritten by about 10AM. I can post both versions of the onboard magazine if you like. This was the day when the crew expected the vast majority of the staff to be off the boat in Amsterdam, and as such there was nothing much happening. The spa staff said this quite openly and it is obvious anyway.

 

We were supposed to arrive in Amsterdam early on the morning of Day 3 (e.g. Day 1 leave Soton, Day 2 Sea Day, Day 3 Amsterdam)

 

Most people I spoke to weren't angry about missing Amsterdam if it was unsafe to proceed. The extremely quick decision that no other port was suitable and that we were going to spend 4 days just circling the English Channel was what infuriated most guests.

[/Quote]

 

You have no idea whether that is true or not.

 

The final announcement was made quite late, following three or four 'updates' even though it was fairly obvious building up to it that it was a likely outcome.

 

It didn't "infuriate most guests". I met one or two who were infuriated, and enough who could see for themselves what the weather was like and that there were problems thoughout the North Sea. People I met were mostly disappointed but nothing more. The family on our table wanted to visit their favourite Chinese Restaurant (in Amsterdam) so they were sad to miss out on that, a little, but they weren't *cross* about it, they were just philosophical about it.

 

Perhaps I meet nicer people than you.

 

It's somewhat different to miss a port when it's the last day of the cruise, but not many people would pay out for a trip to nowhere at all, particularly when no effort was made to lay on anything for the trapped guests to do.

[/Quote]

 

This is simply a lie. When it became clear that Day 3 was not going to be on a largely empty ship the timetable was expanded significantly, this was done (i.e. printed and available) by 10 at the latest (and probably earlier) and staff were distributing the rewritten daily paper in various areas of the ship and explaining what was happening and why.

 

Some things were moved. Martin Bell's lecture on his time in Politics was moved to Day 3 (when the boat would have been largely empty) and he gave another lecture (and a poetry reading) on Day 4, for example. I know additional things were put on , we attended them. Daily things like (say) the Bridge classes were reinstated.

 

People were just sitting around staring into space, because there was next to no entertainment laid on.

[/Quote]

 

This is also a lie. The level of entertainment was pretty much the same as the original sea day. If this was insufficient, that may be a general Cunard problem.

 

The atmosphere on board was awful: everywhere people were angry and complaining.

[/Quote]

 

This is also a lie. One of the Entertainment staff told me someone got in her face - literally, a distance of a few inches. I spoke to one person who was unhappy, and heard of another (a stag do who missed out on the Red Light District, I gather). There were not hordes of miserable people on the ship.

 

The supposed 'mutiny' was a few people - probably less than 80 or so - in the reception immediately after the announcement of no alternative port. It is nonsense.

 

This is an exaggeration for money (like the Diesel, which we know about because the worst smell point (actually outside the theatre on L1) was about 10 yards from our cabin. We smelt it once and we went past that spot endlessly (because it was between our two cabins)

 

Cunard's reception staff couldn't have been more cavalier or disdainful.

[/Quote]

 

When I spoke to them they were perfectly reasonable and pleasant.

 

I wanted to register a complaint about the lack of entertainment. After being called over to one of the receptionists, she cut me short while she tidied up something in her drawer. I waited until she'd finished, began again, but then her colleague had a little joke to involve her in, so I had to wait until she'd had her laugh. That's pretty typical of the attitude that the guests experienced.

[/Quote]

 

To quote Alan Shearer, have you ever thought it might be you ?

 

As if to rub it in, Cunard put on a 'Christmas Market' of a few stalls of stuff from their shops - with mulled wine, if you were prepared to pay for it. The other stall had waiters rolling napkins into shapes. I wouldn't have been surprised to see one rolled into a 2-finger salute.

[/Quote]

 

Yes, this is correct.

 

They were trying to do something (you claim above no effort was made, I seem to recall). Given that short of ordering a fleet of helicopters to drop things onto the ship, this is the best one could reasonably expect. They were trying to get a "Christmas Market" feel. I would agree it was not terrific, and it was stuff on sale in the shops, but what else have they got ? Do they magically make Dutch stallholders appear ? somehow ?

 

People were queueing to get off the ship 12 hours before the end of the cruise. I've never seen anything like it.

[/Quote]

 

That's because it got in early enough for them to do so. We arrived just before 9.00. Those who wanted to leave could leave, some did, some didn't.

 

If I lived in Winchester rather than South Norfolk I probably would have as well.

 

I'm a Gold Member cruiser with Cunard, but I no longer trust this company with my money or precious holiday time. This is from someone who has experienced the disappointment of missed ports before - this was of a different order. Some people are saying 'get over it', but really, you had to be there to experience the feeling that we, and our money, were being taken for a ride in every sense of the phrase.

 

I'm not thinking "get over it" so much as "get a grasp on reality".

 

*and* "get over it".

[themanwithahat]

Just to emphasise: No passengers wanted the Captain to put the ship in jeopardy. The root cause of the problems encountered was the lack of communications. Saturday evening we learned the visit to Amsterdam was in peril. Not until late Sunday morning did we get another announcement that the wind had beaten us, and then it was Monday afternoon before the captain announced that we would be returning to Southampton early. No attempt to communicate in between times - just the map in the cabin to update us.

 

Some of us had the brains to look at the live map when we woke up early on the morning we were supposed to be in Amsterdam to find ourselves still at sea. The 'trail' made it obvious what was happened. Looking out of the window worked as well.

 

The 'return to Soton' was that late because they were trying to keep open the option of going elsewhere. It must be said for accuracy's sake that the messages coming out at this point were that it was unlikely the QE would be going anywhere other than Soton.

 

Also, no effort to say sorry/ sound contrite. Just a bland statement of fact.

[/Quote]

Not actually true, so not a statement of fact.