Trouble getting refund. Any suggestions?

[ledaebel]

I contacted my CC and whey were helpful advising me to call NCL again and check the status before starting any actions. They also gave me the names of the VP, CEO, Mr. Andrew Stuart, 7665 Corporate Drive, Miami, Fl 33126, to write about my dissatisfaction.

 

They also gave me the web address for the South Eastern Florida BBB. Interestingly, they had 491 complaints in the past 12 months and about 400+ resolved.

 

Again, the wait on hold was over 35 minutes. Later, she said it was mailed on the 26th. She requested I give it until next Wednesday, Sept. 7 to arrive before I take action to have the check reprinted. And, yes, I'd have to wait on hold, again. I mentioned that the message before being placed on hold says that if you are calling about a refund they would be processed 5 days after return from the cruise.

 

I will wait and I think I will write Mr. Stuart and include some other issues like having sales persons all over the main floor, in the way, selling jewelry, art work and the high cost of playing one game of Bingo.

[LadyShiva]

Some free advice: read this article on how to write a complaint letter: https://consumerist.com/2011/10/05/write-a-complaint-letter-like-a-pro/

 

Don't put in everything--make a streamlined, easy to address complaint letter that says explicitly what you would like NCL to reimburse you for.

 

Good luck!

[mom2tcdx2]

You can't dispute it with the CC company. It doesn't work that way. The CC company is not going to get involved in this situation. The advice that people give to go through the CC company is never correct, and people that think that will work are delusional.

 

Why would you tell them the credit card company won't get involved. You absolutely have the right to dispute any and all transactions if they are placed on your credit card. I have worked in the chargeback department for an internet retailer and you would be amazed the things credit cards allow people to dispute and all the charges to be reversed. They would issue a chargeback to NCL who would have 30 days to respond to the dispute. Otherwise NCL provides proof the charge is valid, responds it has already been refunded, or does nothing and allows the chargeback to stand.

 

Perhaps you are delusional as I have seen many valid charges that credit card companies allowed customers to dispute and also responded in favor of the customer over the retailer.

[fshagan]

Some free advice: read this article on how to write a complaint letter: https://consumerist.com/2011/10/05/write-a-complaint-letter-like-a-pro/

 

Don't put in everything--make a streamlined' date=' easy to address complaint letter that says explicitly what you would like NCL to reimburse you for.

 

Good luck![/quote']

 

I totally agree with your advice in this case!

 

At least until you get your money back. Until that time, don't give them a single thing they can argue with .... just state the facts about the refund they owe you.

 

Then, when you have deposited the check and it has cleared, write the letter about your general dissatisfaction.

 

The reason I say this is I can't tell you how many times I have seen a client's refund delayed time and time again because the person keeps bringing up things, or is hard to understand as to what, exactly, is the problem. Pretty soon the people in the refund department are thinking that no matter what they do the person won't be happy, so why do anything? Let her go to small claims court. Punish the person asking for the refund with what I call "malicious compliance" with the company's rules, making it akin to dealing with DMV.

 

Keep it simple, laser focused, at least until the check clears. Then express your general dissatisfaction afterwards.

[goldesq]

You can't dispute it with the CC company. It doesn't work that way. The CC company is not going to get involved in this situation. The advice that people give to go through the CC company is never correct, and people that think that will work are delusional.

 

You are 100% incorrect. The OP can dispute it with his CC or with NCL. He should try and get the refund first through NCL but if he has problems with NCL, or if he wants to go first to the CC, he can.

 

The CC company will probably ask if they took any steps to get the refund on their own and what steps were taken. They might ask him this over the phone or they might ask him to fill out some paperwork. Either way, the credit card company might freeze the $2K and provisionally return it (especially if he is a good customer) AND/OR then contact NCL on behalf of the OP and try and resolve the issue. When NCL responds, the OP might need to send a response back (with proof or paperwork regarding the cancellation policy) or NCL does not respond within a set amount of time, the CC company might just return the money to the OP.

 

The CC company most certainly would want to get involved because their customer is the OP and they want to keep their customer happy.

 

I have never once contacted my CC with an issue similar to this and not had it resolve in my favor. Granted, it hasnt been for $2K (tops maybe $1600) but close enough and similar situation enough. Also, I think Amex (and customers with higher credit ratings or credit history with that card) is quicker to resolve issues than other cards.

[goldesq]

Not really relevant here, but yes, I got $240 back for the $120 they owed me, for the reasons you stated.

 

Air Canada didn't see that I charged back (or the CC company just ate it), so I also got my regular $120 processed after 12 weeks.

 

I did not call up Air Canada begging for them to take the money back.

 

This "double dip" was their fault. They didn't staff properly, and were holding my money hostage for 3 months. I didn't set out to double dip, but I felt they didn't deserve for me to chase them down to return it once I got it twice as a result of having to charge back due to their unethical refund practices.

 

And 7 weeks or 12 weeks doesn't really matter. Anything more than 2 weeks is unacceptable for a refund for unused services, especially an amount like $3000.

 

NCL will not let you pay 7 weeks late, so they should refund money owed to you in a timely fashion.

 

You DID double dip. You should have called your CC company and told them you finally received the money back from the airline. Why should the CC company get stuck holding the bag when you were eventually made whole? Its really isnt right.

[goldesq]

I contacted my CC and whey were helpful advising me to call NCL again and check the status before starting any actions. They also gave me the names of the VP, CEO, Mr. Andrew Stuart, 7665 Corporate Drive, Miami, Fl 33126, to write about my dissatisfaction.

 

They also gave me the web address for the South Eastern Florida BBB. Interestingly, they had 491 complaints in the past 12 months and about 400+ resolved.

 

Again, the wait on hold was over 35 minutes. Later, she said it was mailed on the 26th. She requested I give it until next Wednesday, Sept. 7 to arrive before I take action to have the check reprinted. And, yes, I'd have to wait on hold, again. I mentioned that the message before being placed on hold says that if you are calling about a refund they would be processed 5 days after return from the cruise.

 

I will wait and I think I will write Mr. Stuart and include some other issues like having sales persons all over the main floor, in the way, selling jewelry, art work and the high cost of playing one game of Bingo.

 

A bit of advice: when you write a letter about something so substantial about a $3K refund that is owed to you, don't toss in unnecessary dribble like sales people and bingo prices. It detracts from the real issue. It also doesnt make you look too serious.

 

Also, when you called your credit card company, you should have been a bit more aggressive and demanded that they start a charge back. You werent calling for NCL contact information. You were calling for help with a refund which they didnt help you do.

[pokerpro5]

You DID double dip. You should have called your CC company and told them you finally received the money back from the airline. Why should the CC company get stuck holding the bag when you were eventually made whole? Its really isnt right.

 

I didn't ask the CC company to ever hold the bag or eat the $120.

 

In fact, I don't know if they did. They won't tell me.

 

All I was told was that they agreed with me, and that the $120 was returned to my account. When I asked if it actually came from the merchant, they said yes, but they often say that just to make the customer feel better (that the crooked merchant didn't get to keep the money).

 

I wanted the $120 to come from Air Canada. If it actually did (which is possible), then I got $240 out of Air Canada instead of the $120 owed, which I feel is fitting because they attempted to hold my money hostage for 3 months because they were too cheap to staff properly.

 

If the bank ended up eating the $120 and simply claimed they charged it back in order to make me feel better, then that's their problem. I didn't ask them to do this, and I didn't want them to do this. I'm not going to chase them down afterwards and say, "Hey look! Air Canada paid me after holding my money hostage for 3 months! Take the $120 back!"

 

Screw that.

 

If banks are going to go the lazy route with chargebacks, I'm not going to hold their hand in the cases when I (unintentionally) get a double refund.

 

Furthermore, I've had really frustrating/annoying situations in the past where a merchant has scammed/cheated/stiffed me for a relatively small amount of money (like $30), and when I attempt to charge it back, the CC company just eats it (they will almost always eat it for small amounts like that). I really, really, really don't want the slimy merchant to get away with keeping the money, but there's literally nothing I can do to stop it, because of the bank's policy to just eat it and cut investigative/chargeback costs.

 

In short, don't hate the player, hate the game.

Edited September 5, 2016 by pokerpro5

[goldesq]

I didn't ask the CC company to ever hold the bag or eat the $120.

 

In fact, I don't know if they did. They won't tell me.

 

All I was told was that they agreed with me, and that the $120 was returned to my account. When I asked if it actually came from the merchant, they said yes, but they often say that just to make the customer feel better (that the crooked merchant didn't get to keep the money).

 

I wanted the $120 to come from Air Canada. If it actually did (which is possible), then I got $240 out of Air Canada instead of the $120 owed, which I feel is fitting because they attempted to hold my money hostage for 3 months because they were too cheap to staff properly.

 

If the bank ended up eating the $120 and simply claimed they charged it back in order to make me feel better, then that's their problem. I didn't ask them to do this, and I didn't want them to do this. I'm not going to chase them down afterwards and say, "Hey look! Air Canada paid me after holding my money hostage for 3 months! Take the $120 back!"

 

Screw that.

 

If banks are going to go the lazy route with chargebacks, I'm not going to hold their hand in the cases when I (unintentionally) get a double refund.

 

Furthermore, I've had really frustrating/annoying situations in the past where a merchant has scammed/cheated/stiffed me for a relatively small amount of money (like $30), and when I attempt to charge it back, the CC company just eats it (they will almost always eat it for small amounts like that). I really, really, really don't want the slimy merchant to get away with keeping the money, but there's literally nothing I can do to stop it, because of the bank's policy to just eat it and cut investigative/chargeback costs.

 

In short, don't hate the player, hate the game.

 

Sure...if that makes you feel better about it.....

[SheehanDJ]

This is kind of a generic response, but is on topic.

 

Why you SHOULD involve your CC company or Bank if using Debit Card if you are having an issue with a refund:

 

Reading posts, a lot of folks were directing you to social media to help shame NCL into processing your refund. They will act faster with bad press, etc. While this may be true, it really isn't hurting NCL. It may for the very short term, but long term it will just end up a minor blip on the radar buried beneath 1000's of reviews of what a wonderful time people had on an NCL cruise.

 

Now imagine if NCL could no longer accept MasterCard because MasterCard doesn't want to deal with them anymore. That's a long term hit, that's a potential company destroying hit. Will it ever happen? No. But, if there are a lot of complaints about refunds and MasterCard has to get involved to help settle them, then MasterCard is going to start charging NCL more to processes transactions to offset the costs.

 

What NCL is doing by issuing checks is a bit shady, not illegal, but shady. Reading what is happening to OP and others, NCL is waiting to refund until they have the option of refunding in cash instead of back to the CC used. Why do this? Because refunding back to the card also generates a transaction fee with the card issuer. However, issuing that check is in effect giving you a cash advance on your CC for free. Your CC company won't be happy with that.

 

So why is the refund taking so long? Because the average person doesn't understand how money works anymore. We assume there is someone looking at a refund, approving it, writing a check, and signing it. Those people don't exist, they have been replaced by computer's long ago. Your refund can happen as quickly as you paid for something, we as consumer's accept the 3-5 business days answer as acceptable though.

 

Why? Next time you end a cruise go up to customer service and tell them you will be happy to settle your bill in 3-5 business days. Next time you fill your car with gas, just leave pay for it within 3-5 business days. Companies won't accept that from us the consumer's why do we accept it from them? Because we believe there is somebody somewhere approving and writing checks.

 

The fact is, you are never going to get it quicker that 3-5 business days, but at day 3 you need to escalate your complaint and take it to your bank or CC company.

 

Specifically to this problem, OP, sue them in small claims court. It will cost you a very small fee up front, ask for that fee, your original $3,000 and an additional $1,000 for your trouble. They will call you then and settle immediately because it will cost them more to find and hire a local attorney that knows nothing about the case. Depending upon your state and it's rules about small claims court they may have to actually fly a company rep out.

[ledaebel]

Now I can happily head to Ireland for a week or so.

 

Thanks everyone for your suggestions.

[sparks1093]

Thanks for the update.

[Medtech2]

This is kind of a generic response, but is on topic.

 

Why you SHOULD involve your CC company or Bank if using Debit Card if you are having an issue with a refund:

 

Reading posts, a lot of folks were directing you to social media to help shame NCL into processing your refund. They will act faster with bad press, etc. While this may be true, it really isn't hurting NCL. It may for the very short term, but long term it will just end up a minor blip on the radar buried beneath 1000's of reviews of what a wonderful time people had on an NCL cruise.

 

Now imagine if NCL could no longer accept MasterCard because MasterCard doesn't want to deal with them anymore. That's a long term hit, that's a potential company destroying hit. Will it ever happen? No. But, if there are a lot of complaints about refunds and MasterCard has to get involved to help settle them, then MasterCard is going to start charging NCL more to processes transactions to offset the costs.

 

What NCL is doing by issuing checks is a bit shady, not illegal, but shady. Reading what is happening to OP and others, NCL is waiting to refund until they have the option of refunding in cash instead of back to the CC used. Why do this? Because refunding back to the card also generates a transaction fee with the card issuer. However, issuing that check is in effect giving you a cash advance on your CC for free. Your CC company won't be happy with that.

 

So why is the refund taking so long? Because the average person doesn't understand how money works anymore. We assume there is someone looking at a refund, approving it, writing a check, and signing it. Those people don't exist, they have been replaced by computer's long ago. Your refund can happen as quickly as you paid for something, we as consumer's accept the 3-5 business days answer as acceptable though.

 

Why? Next time you end a cruise go up to customer service and tell them you will be happy to settle your bill in 3-5 business days. Next time you fill your car with gas, just leave pay for it within 3-5 business days. Companies won't accept that from us the consumer's why do we accept it from them? Because we believe there is somebody somewhere approving and writing checks.

 

The fact is, you are never going to get it quicker that 3-5 business days, but at day 3 you need to escalate your complaint and take it to your bank or CC company.

 

Specifically to this problem, OP, sue them in small claims court. It will cost you a very small fee up front, ask for that fee, your original $3,000 and an additional $1,000 for your trouble. They will call you then and settle immediately because it will cost them more to find and hire a local attorney that knows nothing about the case. Depending upon your state and it's rules about small claims court they may have to actually fly a company rep out.

I thought you had to file a claim in the locale where the business is located. If so, it would greatly inconvenience the consumer, not the company.

 

I've been told this several times when I wanted to file a claim against a large company...

[goldesq]

I thought you had to file a claim in the locale where the business is located. If so, it would greatly inconvenience the consumer, not the company.

 

I've been told this several times when I wanted to file a claim against a large company...

 

Not necessarily. I would check the contract (cruise ticket) and see what it says. Usually the ticket will indicate that by purchasing the cruise you agree to sue in a certain location. Frankly, I would sue locally, they wont show, then you get a default judgment. Try collecting on that judgment though. It wont likely happen. They will then pobably move to reopen the case and if they reappear, which they probably will, they will argue venue was improper and the case will be dismissed with prejudice.

 

However, in other cases (not cruises), its a case by case basis but typically where either the plaintinff or defendant resides. Again, its a case by case bass depending on the circumstances.

 

PS Yes. I am an attorney.

[aladin553]

Dispute it with your credit card. Send email correspondence to NCL if you paid them or the tour operator if you paid them. Once you have the reply you can submit that with your Dispute and that should take care of it right away. Also write a long terrible review on Yelp.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums