Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #151 Share Posted October 19, 2016 An articulated rudder specifically requested for berthing at Castaway Cay.Nice shot of a thruster too. Those are huge. I did not know that about the rudders :) The thrusters are are huge, you are right. Maybe 15' diameter given the hight of the worker below it? ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chengkp75 Posted October 19, 2016 #152 Share Posted October 19, 2016 I did not know that about the rudders :)The thrusters are are huge, you are right. Maybe 15' diameter given the hight of the worker below it? ex techie Actually, virtually every cruise ship I've seen with rudders has a "trim tab" or Becker rudder. Rudders tend to lose effectiveness with ship speeds below 3 knots, which is why thrusters were introduced. Thrusters on the other hand, tend to lose effectiveness when ship speeds are above 3 knots. Becker rudders were introduced to bridge that zone and provide redundancy. These rudders will act like airplane ailerons and provide sideways "lift", even at slow forward ahead or astern speeds, because the water flow from the propeller is enough to create the lift. Our Captains and Staff Captains would practice making dockings and undockings with various systems "out of order" (still running but not used), like not having stern thrusters and using the propellers ("splitting" them, or putting one ahead and the other astern) and rudders only. When trained, performance was nearly identical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #153 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Vendors are leaking photo's now ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #154 Share Posted October 19, 2016 ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #155 Share Posted October 19, 2016 ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #156 Share Posted October 19, 2016 ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #157 Share Posted October 19, 2016 The propellors are back on (might be new blades or refurbished) The painting done, and Donald and Nephew back in their rightful place! Won't be long until she is wet again and on her way home :) ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #158 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Tiana's faux brick walls ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #159 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Actually, virtually every cruise ship I've seen with rudders has a "trim tab" or Becker rudder. Rudders tend to lose effectiveness with ship speeds below 3 knots, which is why thrusters were introduced. Thrusters on the other hand, tend to lose effectiveness when ship speeds are above 3 knots. Becker rudders were introduced to bridge that zone and provide redundancy. These rudders will act like airplane ailerons and provide sideways "lift", even at slow forward ahead or astern speeds, because the water flow from the propeller is enough to create the lift. Our Captains and Staff Captains would practice making dockings and undockings with various systems "out of order" (still running but not used), like not having stern thrusters and using the propellers ("splitting" them, or putting one ahead and the other astern) and rudders only. When trained, performance was nearly identical. Cool facts Chief! ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chengkp75 Posted October 19, 2016 #160 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Those are one piece propellers, no separate blades. They just polished them with angle grinders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #161 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Those are one piece propellers, no separate blades. They just polished them with angle grinders. Ah OK. I said maybe new because they have MMG stamped on them and thought that polishing them with a grinder would remove that. ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #162 Share Posted October 19, 2016 ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 19, 2016 Author #163 Share Posted October 19, 2016 This is a few days old, but she's coming along! ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tkerniroc1986 Posted October 19, 2016 #164 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Great pictures today!!!! She's certainly nearing completion!!! Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 20, 2016 Author #165 Share Posted October 20, 2016 (edited) I was surprised when I saw this as the chandelier for the Wonder as it is obviously very different from the horrible piece they chose for the Magic. Although it is more in keeping with the Dream and Fantasy, I can't say I'm wow'd by it. What are others opinions and thoughts? ex techie Edited October 20, 2016 by Ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 20, 2016 Author #166 Share Posted October 20, 2016 (edited) Hi Chief, I just wondered about your opinion on this shot. Assuming this is not a bad artefact of the picture upload, and since you mentioned that the prop blades are not replaceable as the whole prop is one piece, what happens if one blade is damaged? Do you just live with it and accept less efficiency? Could damage like that be repaired with new metal? That is, as above, if that is damage and not a photo defect. ex techie Edited October 20, 2016 by Ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 20, 2016 Author #167 Share Posted October 20, 2016 "Arty" Propellor shot :) ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chengkp75 Posted October 20, 2016 #168 Share Posted October 20, 2016 I suspect that what you see is a defect in the photo image, as any "sawtooth" damage like that would at least have been "faired" smooth. As that is on the trailing edge of the blade, it isn't as critical, but it would affect balance. For a one piece wheel like this, if there is a bent or cracked blade, they will shape a new piece ( large yards like this typically have a propeller manufacturer shop on site (subcontractor)), cut out the damage and weld in the new piece. They do this all the time, and do it so well, that unless the prop is newly polished, like this one, you won't notice the repair, and even when polished, you'll just see a line of different color where the weld metal is slightly different chemically than the base metal. Bronze wheels, the most common by far, are quite easy to weld repair like this. Stainless wheels, most common on smaller thrusters, are real specialty jobs, and frequently have to have that particular propeller's manufacturer do the repair, and even then they don't always warrantee the work. Sometimes, when a one piece prop is damaged, the damage isn't too bad, and the ship isn't scheduled for drydocking for a couple of years, they will have divers cut away the damaged part, and then cut away the corresponding area of the opposite blade. Sometimes this requires a few attempts by divers over several ports to get the balance nearly right. It ain't a great solution, but it saves on emergency drydockings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PopFla Posted October 20, 2016 #169 Share Posted October 20, 2016 (edited) I was surprised when I saw this as the chandelier for the Wonder as it is obviously very different from the horrible piece they chose for the Magic.Although it is more in keeping with the Dream and Fantasy, I can't say I'm wow'd by it. What are others opinions and thoughts? ex techie I still don't understand why they replaced the Chilhuly chandeliers on both ships, unless perhaps they were "on loan" to DCL for a set number of years. And I wonder what became of them when they were removed. I agree 100% that the new "ice cream cone" chandelier on Magic is just flat out ugly. This new one for Wonder isn't quite as bad, IMHO. Edited October 20, 2016 by PopFla Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PopFla Posted October 20, 2016 #170 Share Posted October 20, 2016 The "Ice Cream Cone" chandelier on Magic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonka's Skipper Posted October 20, 2016 #171 Share Posted October 20, 2016 (edited) I still don't understand why they replaced the Chilhuly chandeliers on both ships, unless perhaps they were "on loan" to DCL for a set number of years. And I wonder what became of them when they were removed. I agree 100% that the new "ice cream cone" chandelier on Magic is just flat out ugly. This new one for Wonder isn't quite as bad, IMHO. Hi Popfla. Both chandeliers, due to the vessels motions and movements, could actually be seen to sway and were showing signs of Fatigue. DCL was worried that they could come apart and fall into the lower lobby area. Hence the much smaller replacements. I was told the one off the Magic is going to, at some point, be put into the PC Terminal. The one off the Wonder I have not heard anything. AKK Edited October 20, 2016 by Tonka's Skipper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PopFla Posted October 20, 2016 #172 Share Posted October 20, 2016 I was told the one off the Magic is going to' date=' at some point, be put into the PC Terminal. The one off the Wonder I have not heard anything. AKK[/quote'] They did tend to sway a bit depending on the motion of the ship. The terminal would seem to be a fitting location. That's better than having them end up in a landfill. One thing I've heard over the years is that the originals, designed by world-famous glass artist Dale Chihuly, were actually made of plastic. Anyone know for certain ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moki'smommy Posted October 20, 2016 #173 Share Posted October 20, 2016 (edited) The originals were owned by DCL. There is a story about how Chihuly had to develop a plexiglass material that he could work like glass because real glass was too heavy for a ship. I've also heard stories about them being too heavy, too dangerous (after 15 years???), too hard to clean, etc. Then there was the story about making all the ship lobbies look "similar" which was used to justify the destruction of the Magic's beautiful double staircase, the ugly light fixture, etc. The staging they could do with that double staircase was super! The one on the Wonder, IMHO is weird. It is better than the piece of junk they put on the Magic, but still--an odd choice. However, the Imagineers didn't confer with me before they allowed their quirkiness to run wild. Edited October 20, 2016 by moki'smommy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 20, 2016 Author #174 Share Posted October 20, 2016 I suspect that what you see is a defect in the photo image, as any "sawtooth" damage like that would at least have been "faired" smooth. As that is on the trailing edge of the blade, it isn't as critical, but it would affect balance. For a one piece wheel like this, if there is a bent or cracked blade, they will shape a new piece ( large yards like this typically have a propeller manufacturer shop on site (subcontractor)), cut out the damage and weld in the new piece. They do this all the time, and do it so well, that unless the prop is newly polished, like this one, you won't notice the repair, and even when polished, you'll just see a line of different color where the weld metal is slightly different chemically than the base metal. Bronze wheels, the most common by far, are quite easy to weld repair like this. Stainless wheels, most common on smaller thrusters, are real specialty jobs, and frequently have to have that particular propeller's manufacturer do the repair, and even then they don't always warrantee the work. Sometimes, when a one piece prop is damaged, the damage isn't too bad, and the ship isn't scheduled for drydocking for a couple of years, they will have divers cut away the damaged part, and then cut away the corresponding area of the opposite blade. Sometimes this requires a few attempts by divers over several ports to get the balance nearly right. It ain't a great solution, but it saves on emergency drydockings. Thanks for the great info as always Chief! ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex techie Posted October 20, 2016 Author #175 Share Posted October 20, 2016 ex techie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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