Rhine water levels 2023 and similar topics

[notamermaid]

1 hour ago, sjrhdavis said:

Can you advise as to when we need to start looking at the water levels to judge the likelihood of problems during our trip? 

You can start looking now - sort of - as the probability chart shows 14 days into the future. But it obviously is computer modelling which becomes more vague each day we look at.

1 hour ago, sjrhdavis said:

Am I right that things are looking better looking ahead in October/early November or is it too early to say yet?

You are right in that this computer modelling shows better conditions for next week so not too early to say that yet. Kaub has seen a bit of a drop today and is now at 71cm. That means it is lower than the forecast for today suggested. With the figures we have now a few centimetres can make all the difference. Which makes me a bit careful about saying how this week will progress. But next week is indicated as being better so even if this week is worse than anticipated, after that we will probably see higher figures that may well improve the conditions at Kaub enough, meaning just easing the situation (90cm to 100cm is within grasp, perhaps a bit more). By Saturday things should be clearer for your sailing date.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

If you are new to this topic of river levels and happen to find this thread before booking a river cruise perhaps the following is helpful.

 

For a little recap of what the year so far has been like as regards river conditions when we compare the Danube and the Rhine we can say that the Rhine has fared much better. Flooding this year has been almost negligible on both the Danube and the Rhine with no ban on river traffic on the Rhine and just a few days of interruptions on the Danube.

 

Low water on the Danube has been extensive with the Rhine following suit much later and having only reached critical levels in the last week. It is a little difficult to sum up and compare what impact this has had on cruises but I think it is fair and accurate if I put it as "confirmed days of ship swaps": Danube 20plus versus Rhine 0.

 

notamermaid

 

 

[notamermaid]

The level at Kaub remained at 71cm during much of the night and picked up early this morning. It is now at 74cm. A "wobbly" day today seeing that the forecast is not favourable but the level is above the forecast.

 

notamermaid

 

 

 

[Rikboatman]

We are in Vienna for today and tomorrow, Budapest is Friday then Saturday fly home. Other than the boat swap it has been a wonderful experience and can't believe it went so fast. Thank you notamermaid for your updates and all of the information. 

[notamermaid]

20 hours ago, Rikboatman said:

We are in Vienna for today and tomorrow, Budapest is Friday then Saturday fly home. Other than the boat swap it has been a wonderful experience and can't believe it went so fast. Thank you notamermaid for your updates and all of the information. 

My pleasure. I hope sailing into Budapest goes ahead as planned and you have a great time in the fascinating city.

 

Good to hear you enjoyed your cruise so much. Safe travels.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Despite some rain the river has had an unexpected turn for the worse, at least the level at Kaub. 68cm. The forecast says that this should really be the low. More rain is coming from the South and Southwest, that is Alsace and Switzerland, so I am willing to believe that at least for tomorrow we can expect somewhat better sailing conditions. It is suggest that we then may see the figure 80 again.

 

notamermaid

 

[Rikboatman]

2 hours ago, notamermaid said:

My pleasure. I hope sailing into Budapest goes ahead as planned and you have a great time in the fascinating city.

 

Good to hear you enjoyed your cruise so much. Safe travels.

 

notamermaid

 

Found out last night that we can't sail for Budapest because of low water. Going as far as Komaron and if we want to see Budapest we will have to take a bus. 

[notamermaid]

39 minutes ago, Rikboatman said:

Found out last night that we can't sail for Budapest because of low water. Going as far as Komaron and if we want to see Budapest we will have to take a bus. 

Sorry to read that, I admit I expected as much. Conditions still are not good around Budapest.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

A slight change of subject from low water, but not fully. Yesterday lunchtime a ship hit a bridge at the entrance to the harbour at Cologne-NIehl. The bridge has got a lot of headroom but the crane construction that the ship's captain had extended, apparently to later lower a car onto land was too high. The damage to the bridge is extensive, the crane fell into the river. This is a German report with photo: https://www1.wdr.de/nachrichten/rheinland/schiff-beschaedigt-bruecke-koeln-100.html

 

Now the structural assessment has started, meaning the bridge is closed and will only be reopended after a long wait and may if the outcome is bad need to be demolished. Now to river cruising and low water. The entrance to the harbour area is reduced for ship traffic, i.e. a narrower lane than usual, but accessible. Especially in situations of low water river cruise ships dock there during the season, specifically Viking at their designated harbour area. Off- season a lot of river cruise ships dock there, it is a safe winter harbour.

 

If you happen to dock in Niehl - I hope you do not, I have been there and it is boring and unpleasant in the dark - you may spot the damage to the bridge.

 

A bit of ship spotting. Which ships are in Niehl tonight?

 

notamermaid

 

Edited October 19, 2023 by notamermaid
grammar

[notamermaid]

Okay, so the Bragi is not staying for winter in the harbour yet, she sailed on this morning, presumably on a standard itinerary, to the Netherlands:

 

Kaub gauge at 79cm. That looks promising. 90cm forecast for tomorrow.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Kaub gauge at 90cm. That is good, a nice rise in reaction to all the rain we have had. Stable conditions are expected for today with a further rise anticipated for tomorrow. Mild storm warning.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Kaub gauge at 85cm. Stable conditions yesterday as forecast but a slight decline has followed. Long-term modelling a bit too unpredictable but we can say that better conditions will follow closer to November. For now a bit wobbly but most likely stable above 80cm today and tomorrow.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Unfortunately a slight change to what was forecast, Kaub gauge at 80cm. We may well see a couple of centimetres less during the afternoon and evening. A return to 80cm and over should happen by lunchtime tomorrow. If all goes well the 90cm will be back later in the week.

 

notamermaid

 

[smithp7]

Hi everyone, we just completed the Romantic Danube from October 7 through the 14th and had low water level so we were not able to go to Budapest or Regensburg, which was a disappointment on both ends. I’m trying to book another river cruise to give it one more try and that would be from Paris to the Swiss Alps on the Rhine. I know you can’t predict water levels. However, I would love input as to how you feel a sailing from May 31 to June 9th 2025.We would be starting in Paris and sailing from Trier to Basel Switzerland. Do you think there is a better month to try and do it? We will be going in 2025.look forward to hearing from others.Thanks, Pat

[notamermaid]

Sorry to read about your experience on the Danube.

2 hours ago, smithp7 said:

However, I would love input as to how you feel a sailing from May 31 to June 9th 2025.We would be starting in Paris and sailing from Trier to Basel Switzerland.

Trier to Koblenz is on the Moselle, so no low water issues. Koblenz through the Rhine Gorge is the tricky part. From about Rüdesheim it is better and the last stretch is again lock-controlled so no issues there. I would say that is a very nice time to sail for weather and landscape and low water is almost non-existent in that time. A no-brainer really. However, there is the small risk of high water that is tricky when it becomes official flooding. In such a case your ship may not even leave the port. The cruise may be non-existent in the worst case scenario, i.e. when both Moselle and Rhine have flooding at the same time both rivers may have all sailing suspended and that means all ships. That is not likely to happen in May, flooding happens more in February to April, but can never be ruled out completely. Shipping can be halted from just a few hours to several days and never be known more than five days before it starts; see that as a general rule only, it depends on how accurate the computer modelling for the water levels is.

 

2 hours ago, smithp7 said:

Do you think there is a better month to try and do it?

From my point of view I would say no but shifting it later into June may be nice as well.

 

Over to others who hopefully will rave about Spring on the Moselle and Rhine.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Just confirming that Kaub has dropped below 80cm and is now at 76cm.

 

notamermaid

 

[smithp7]

8 hours ago, notamermaid said:

Sorry to read about your experience on the Danube.

Trier to Koblenz is on the Moselle, so no low water issues. Koblenz through the Rhine Gorge is the tricky part. From about Rüdesheim it is better and the last stretch is again lock-controlled so no issues there. I would say that is a very nice time to sail for weather and landscape and low water is almost non-existent in that time. A no-brainer really. However, there is the small risk of high water that is tricky when it becomes official flooding. In such a case your ship may not even leave the port. The cruise may be non-existent in the worst case scenario, i.e. when both Moselle and Rhine have flooding at the same time both rivers may have all sailing suspended and that means all ships. That is not likely to happen in May, flooding happens more in February to April, but can never be ruled out completely. Shipping can be halted from just a few hours to several days and never be known more than five days before it starts; see that as a general rule only, it depends on how accurate the computer modelling for the water levels is.

 

From my point of view I would say no but shifting it later into June may be nice as well.

 

Over to others who hopefully will rave about Spring on the Moselle and Rhine.

 

notamermaid

 

Thank you so much for your quick response. It sounds like a beautiful time of year and normally we travel in the fall so I am excited to see the spring into the summer months in Paris, Germany and Switzerland. We will keep our fingers crossed on Weather as always. I follow your information about the Danube and the Rhine on this board  and find it so informative. I want to thank you for all the time that you put into providing this very valuable information.Sincerely, Pat Smith

[Canal archive]

We did Amsterdam to Budapest 15 day with Scenic leaving towards the end of April. It a tad fresh - freezing in Amsterdam but seriously not slippy underfoot so toured the city warming up in shops as we went, you must try the fish tasting from the street stalls. The weather gradually got warmer so by the time we arrived in Budapest we were occasionally in shirt sleeves. The most challenging thing about that time of year is what clothing to pack. Enjoy, Pat

[notamermaid]

Kaub gauge at 80cm. Back on track to 90cm on Thursday and potentially a bit more than that.

 

Grey, rainy days so the outlook for river levels is rather favourable for the weekend.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Open ship day in Basel

 

On 3 and 4 November four ships of Thurgau Travel can be inspected in Basel. If you happen to be there and would like to compare do have a look at the ships of this Swiss company.

It appears that you need to book: https://tdos.thurgautravel.ch/

 

notamermaid

 

 

[notamermaid]

Low water is not necessarily a problem for sailing at this time and I have read of no confirmed ship swaps but docking can be problematic. The extra-large Arosa Sena only sails from Cologne downstream due to her size (although technically she is allowed to go further upstream). Cologne and downstream ports are more favourable in low water as the navigation channel is deep. But, as I said, the docking is another matter. So this has hit the Arosa Sena and she could not reach her docking location in Cologne. According to a German cruise website, she has picked up her next passengers in Duisburg instead. The next sailing should revert to standard procedures as the river is due to rise.

 

Fancy checking out the Arosa Sena?

https://www.arosa-*****/river-cruises/a-rosa-fleet/a-rosa-sena.html

 

notamermaid

 

 

[notamermaid]

On 7/11/2023 at 6:25 PM, notamermaid said:

In other news: the old steamer "Mainz", built in 1929, has been the "Mannheimer Museumsschiff" for many years now. It needs the special Schiffs-TÜV, a check-up like an MOT just the equivalent for a ship. For that reason it has been towed from Mannheim to a Cologne shipyard alongside a tanker.

The Mannheimer Museumsschiff's check-up has been completed. She will return to Mannheim and is expected there on Friday. Note that the ship's home is not on the Rhine but on the other side of Mannheim on the Neckar: https://museen.de/museumsschiff-mannheim.html

 

notamermaid

 

 

[notamermaid]

Kaub gauge at 83cm centimetres. That is still a bit uncomfortably on the low side but while the forecast may differ in a few centimetres from what the river actually does and today may be a grey rainy day with slow sailing, the level will go up soon and the slow sailing will go away - while the rain stays. Forecast is for a return to 90cm tomorrow and a quick rise to 100cm. At Maxau in the Upper Rhine valley a rise of 90cm is indicated which may translate in a similar rise at Kaub in the following 48 hours. This will also depend on what happens on the Main river.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Well, that was quicker than expected. Kaub gauge at 108cm. All good.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

So, back to more relaxing topics. Exciting somewhat for ship spotters, but unfortunately for me all in the dark, so no photos. The Mannheim Museumsschiff is on its journey, no webcam sighting last night for me but an eager spotter was at the harbour before the convoy left:

https://www.binnenschifferforum.de/showthread.php?13114-Mannheim-PSRD-Baujahr-1929-(Museumsschiff)&p=463991#post463991

 

No time to run to the river today, so I will try and catch a glimpse of it on a webcam later. Lost signal puts her at the estimated location of beginning of the Rhine Gorge now, if there was no scheduled stop at Koblenz.

 

notamermaid