Large group on my cruise

[sandiego1]

I just called my TA to switch my dining time from 8:30 to 8:00 for my 2/4 Westerdam cruise. She called Ship Services. She was told that HAL moved us from our confirmed 8:30 slot to 6:15 because they have a huge church group on this ship and they have reserved all of the 8:00 and 8:30 dining slots. The church group was so large that they almost had enough people to charter the entire ship. I don't know what % you need to fill in order to do a charter.

 

Since the entire dining room is booked for 2 seatings, I would assume that about 50% of the cruise will be people from this organization. Since the ship can hold about 1850 people, I would expect almost 1000 would be w/ this group.

 

I have concerns about going on a ship w/ so many people from 1 organization (regardless of type of organization - I don't care if it's a church or some other affiliation/group). They will likely have lots of private parties and block off entire areas of the ship for their exclusive use.

 

Has anyone else had any experience w/ this? Do I have any cause for concern?

[bdcbbq]

I would sure be hesistant to cruise with a single interest group that big.

[kryos]

Has anyone else had any experience w/ this? Do I have any cause for concern?

I will say that I would be less concerned with a church group than with another type of group only because church groups tend to be "better behaved" than possibly a large singles group or a corporate incentive group.

 

However, that said ... if the group is truly 50% of the Westerdam's capacity ... that is close to a thousand people. That's a big group, and you'd better believe, the HAL staff will kotow to them. If they want a private sailaway party on the Lido deck, they will get it and you will have to go elsewhere to enjoy Sailaway. If they want an evening concert in the Crow's Nest ... guess what? Either you will not be able to use the Crow's Nest that evening, or ... if it is open to you ... get ready to listen to Christian entertainers playing Christian music (or whatever other religion this group practices). The bar may be closed too ... because if the group doesn't drink, it's unlikely HAL will bother keeping the bar open and staffed in the area where their special event is going on.

 

So, yes ... I guess there is some cause for concern ... if they've already taken all the late dining slots in the dining room ... I would wonder what other things they will take ... such as the pool deck for their services on a nice sunny sea day or priority tendering to one of the ports where they may be having a special event and need to get all their people there from the ship as quickly as possible.

 

Personally, I wouldn't be crazy about sailing with any group this large. Smaller groups are okay ... because they don't have enough people to really impact the cruise experience of non-group members. But anytime you have a group this big ... the cruise, of necessity, is gonna be geared first to their needs. That's just the way it is.

 

If it were me, and if I were still in the cancellation period, I might consider switching my booking to another cruise. But, then ... who knows? You might get an even larger group on that one. So, what I would do is switch to a cruise of a bit longer in length ... maybe ten days ... that will lessen the chance of you encountering any group this size.

 

Good luck in whatever you decide to do.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Davey Interweb]

This would definitely be a cruise that I'd bail on, or at least I'd move to a sailing the week prior or after. Large groups do have a tendancy to overrun or commandeer areas of the ship.

[kakalina]

I too would find this cause for concern. We have cruised when there was a large group and at times it was very irritating. They would take over the Crows Nest, and the smoking area at that, so that we couldn't go there several evenings. And they took over many other places on the ship without thought for the others that weren't in their groups.

[sandiego1]

I just called Ship Services. They told me that they have a group of 400 booked for the dinner at 8:00, another 400 for the 8:30 and 50 for the 6:15. He wouldn't tell me if they were all part of the same organization or what type of organization it was.

 

It really doesn't matter too much too me what type of organization. I'm more concerned w/ them taking over the ship as others have pointed out.

 

ARRGGHH! This cruise has become a nightmare. First we booked w/ 1 travel agent. Then switched to someone else since their price was $500 cheaper. I had to have TA#1 contact HAL and convert the rez to TA#2 so we could keep our selected cabins (she was a doll to do that). Then I go to book hotels for the night before. All of Ft. Lauderdale is sold out. Come to find out it's SUPERBOWL Sun. Had to fly into West Palm Beach, stay up there and rent a car for the night. Flights were expensive and had limited availability. I finally found a Hampton Inn for $300 (yes, $300!! but it was better than sleeping in the car). Now this!!!

 

Guess I need to start all the research over and try to find another cruise that leaves FLL on the same day. Unfortunately it won't be HAL :( Or pay a lot of money to switch our flights. We come in from San Diego (obviously from my user name), but my in-laws are in the NorthEast. So I have to make 2 different sets of arrangements.

 

I have about 3 wks to get this done before final payment is due. What a hassle!!

 

I did post a notice on the Roll Call board so CC members are aware of this large group on this cruise.

[cruznon]

Hmmmm.....I wouldn't want to be on a ship with any group this size. I'm switch. You've got three weeks as least....think how upset you'd be if you found out a week or two before sailing.

If you change to another ship, you could vary sailing day by a a day or two and perhaps check out Miami sailings....just a few miles away....that might give you more options.

 

It's upsetting that HAL ships services wouldn't tell you the group or the actual size of the group. I think they owe their passengers that info.

Good luck....

[Davey Interweb]

Ugh, I feel bad for you :( My question is, would the cost of switching your flights around offset the inflated cost of the hotel, the rental car, etc.?

 

The Millenium sails from Ft. Lauderdale the same day and the pricing actually isn't bad at all. The itinerary isn't quite as attractive as Westerdam's, but hey.

[sandiego1]

I also found a Carib Princess from FLL that day. I'll call the TA and try to get pricing for that one and the Millenium. that would be the easiest since I don't have to change flights.

 

Next choice would be HAL for different dates.

 

Miami is a no-go. It's Superbowl Sun (in Miami) and I don't want to go anywhere near the city that day.

 

What a bummer. But better now than 1 or 2 wks before as Cruznon pointed out.

[cruisinbulldog]

It's upsetting that HAL ships services wouldn't tell you the group or the actual size of the group. I think they owe their passengers that info.

Good luck....

 

My thoughs exactly!! We all pay hard earned $$'s..

 

Understand HA wanting to fill the ship, but have the courtesy to let the others that are not part of the group know.. They may not have the run of the ship, which they paid for!!!:mad:

[innlady1]

I also found a Carib Princess from FLL that day. I'll call the TA and try to get pricing for that one and the Millenium. that would be the easiest since I don't have to change flights.

 

Next choice would be HAL for different dates.

 

Miami is a no-go. It's Superbowl Sun (in Miami) and I don't want to go anywhere near the city that day.

 

What a bummer. But better now than 1 or 2 wks before as Cruznon pointed out.

 

Better a church group than the nude group that's a charter on one of the February sailings of the Maasdam! ;)

 

In all seriousness, I wouldn't want to be on a ship with a group that size of any kind. You know the ship will cater to their every need. We sailed the Caribbean Princess last February and loved it, so no worries there. If you are booking a balcony cabin, try for the Caribe Deck. The balconies are twice as large there than on any other deck!

 

And, our cruise this year was a toss-up between the Noordam and the Millenium...I voted for the Millenium but DH and the couple we travel with outvoted me. I think you should be fine with either.

 

My question: Is there any place on line one can check to see if there's a group of any size on any given sailing?

[Schplinky]

I must be in the monority who does not find church groups better behaved but then again, I used to work in a christian bookstore and then in a mainstream one and my experience of the two different groups leads me to say to you that you should bail. Any group that is large enough to take over a space will likely do so and christian groups are no different.

 

Interestingly, we've discovered that on our Westerdam cruise in January, there is a christian group of 200 or so and we're going anyway because we also discovered there is a gay group of the same number. While this shouldn't matter in the least, I'm guessing the people watching should be fun. Although I would qualify for both groups, we are cruising with neither.

[kryos]

I must be in the monority who does not find church groups better behaved but then again, I used to work in a christian bookstore and then in a mainstream one and my experience of the two different groups leads me to say to you that you should bail. Any group that is large enough to take over a space will likely do so and christian groups are no different.

Oh, please understand ... when I say a Christian group would be "better behaved" than most, I'm not saying they won't take over public areas and such for their events. I just meant that a Christian group would more likely control their kids better, not be drinking to excess, not be carousing ... that sort of thing. But, surely they will take everything they are entitled to, and with a group of this size, frankly, they are entitled to have some private parties for their people. So, if the group's leaders decide it would be nice to have a PRIVATE sailaway party just for their group out by the Lido pool ... they will negotiate that with the cruise line and will likely get it. Then everyone else will have to find someplace else to enjoy sailaway, because that Lido pool area will be closed off. Same with special shows and services. If the Christian group wants to have a special show in the theater one night, guess what? There will be perhaps only an early ... very early as in before first seating dinner ... show for the general ship population ... and then the theater will be off limits to the regular passengers so that the Christian group can have their private show.

 

That's just the way it is with groups. The bigger the group, the more bennies they get ... and the more parts of the ship they can lock up for their special functions.

 

I personally would prefer to sail with no group that constitutes anywhere near 50% or higher of the total capacity of the boat ... because a group of that size will definitely color the entire sailing for everyone else. If you have a large Christian group onboard ... obviously the whole environment of the sailing is gonna be geared to their preferences. Comedians will be told clearly to "tone it down," music played in the lounges will be geared to their preferences, they will get all the available slots in the dining room seating of their choice ... and everyone else will just have to go along ... and adjust their own cruise expectations around those of this large group.

 

And don't think this just applies to HAL. It applies to all cruise lines ... even the luxury ones. Groups are big business and the cruise lines fight for them. They welcome them with open arms and will gladly negotiate special perks to get a large group onboard. I seem to recall reading about a large group on a Regeant cruise (luxury line) ... on the Paul Gaugin. People were paying top dollar for that cruise ... far more than I ever would have paid ... and they were made to feel like second class citizens all week ... because the group got priority for everything ... dining rooms, tender service, private parties, the works. I think I recall one woman referring to the group as "first class" while the rest of the passengers were relegated to "coach." Wouldn't be so bad if the rest of those passengers were paying coach fares. Problem was they weren't. In fact, they probably paid a heck of a lot more than members of the group paid since they surely got advantageous group rates.

 

So ... sailing with any large group can be a bummer. The only good thing with a Christian group is that you usually won't have to worry about excessive drunkenness or their kids (and generally they will bring their children cause family time is a big deal to them) running around unsupervised at all hours of the night on the ship. But, other than those benefits, you're right ... a Christian group will be no different as to taking over the ship and making their cruise exactly what THEY want it to be ... and too bad if any of the other passengers don't like it.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[kryos]

Interestingly, we've discovered that on our Westerdam cruise in January, there is a christian group of 200 or so and we're going anyway because we also discovered there is a gay group of the same number. While this shouldn't matter in the least, I'm guessing the people watching should be fun.

LOL ... I'd almost consider booking this cruise myself just to watch the "fireworks." I wonder if the Christian group knows about the gay group? LOL ... should be interesting if they start trying to "convert" them. :)

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[kryos]

Understand HA wanting to fill the ship, but have the courtesy to let the others that are not part of the group know.. They may not have the run of the ship, which they paid for!!!:mad:

Unfortunately, the cruise lines ... none of them ... will release information about groups on various sailings. I guess they figure that's none of other passengers' business ... and as long as the group is not too big, I would be inclined to agree with them. But I really feel that travel agents need to band together and force the cruise lines to divulge if there is any group scheduled to be onboard a sailing where the group comprises 50% or more of the total capacity of the ship ... because that is when a group could totally ruin the sailing for others. The smaller groups don't have the clout to do much to impact the sailing for other passengers. Oh, they might get a lounge for a private party for an hour or so one night ... but they certainly won't be able to lock up any of the larger venues for any of their private functions.

 

I've read some nightmare posts on both this board as well as others about sailing with large groups, and the non-group passengers having to take a back seat to the needs of the group throughout the week. I read about one Alaska sailing where the group had one of the outside decks completely blocked off for a private party as they sailed past a glacier ... leaving all of the other passengers onboard the ship to fight for space along the rail of the one remaining outside deck. The group members all had these logo'd rain slickers issued to them. If you weren't wearing a rain slicker, you didn't get out on that one deck and had to go to the limited remaining outdoor space to view the glacier. That kinda sucks.

 

Then I heard about tender service being prioritized for a group because they were having some special games and such out on the cruise line's private motu. Everyone else had to wait while the group was shuttled to shore first. Same for disembarkation day. The group got priority transfer service to the airport, and other passengers had to wait until the entire group was transported before going to the airport ... and then having to wait in line behind ALL the group members for Customs.

 

I think only travel agents can get this group thing handled more fairly ... and it is they who need to band together for the rights of their clients. They have to force the cruise lines to disclose when there is going to be a large group on a sailing, and then the TA's in turn can inform their clients and offer them the chance to switch to another sailing.

 

It's the only fair way to handle this sort of thing.

 

As for finding out if there is a group on your sailing, without the cruise lines divulging this information, you only have the hit and miss method of a google search. Maybe you might find something and then again, maybe you won't. If the group sailing is heavily advertised on the internet, you may get a "hit," but if it's a large corporate incentive group ... by invitation only ... you won't find it advertised on the internet, and thus google will not pick it up. In that case, you won't find out about those 1200 party hearty folks from the national restaurant chain until you bump into them at embarkation. Nothing much you can do about it then. :(

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Krazy Kruizers]

We were unfortunate on a couple of our cruises -- big groups -- they did take over everything!! Closed off Crow's Nest for parties. Had one group where they showed movies nearly every morning and afternoon in the main show lounge, thus certain activities weren't held while others were moved to various other spots on the ship. Yes we knew that certain activities weren't held because we were just on the ship the previous week.

[Krazy Kruizers]

Do let us know what happens to you -- if you stay with the cruise or change to another cruise line.

[Babr]

There was a thread not too long ago about how to find out if a large group is on your sailing. I think someone said that you type the name of the ship and the date into Google. I don't know if that will work for a church group because it may be a local thing and not posted on the internet - maybe some mega church in a metropolitan area. Someone found a group of alumni sailing with them, but it turned out not to be as large as the group you are facing. Sometimes groups of doctors do workshops at sea. I don't know of any other way to find out about groups if the cruise line won't tell you. It may not even show up on the roll call if the group isn't savvy about that.

[Schplinky]

Oh, please understand ... when I say a Christian group would be "better behaved" than most, I'm not saying they won't take over public areas and such for their events. I just meant that a Christian group would more likely control their kids better, not be drinking to excess, not be carousing ... that sort of thing.

 

 

Actually, Rita, that's exactly what I meant. When I worked in the christian bookstore, people let their kids run all over because they had this "we're all good family people so you'll excuse my children" attitude. Kids would make huge messes and then the family would leave with the Mom smiling this sort of "surely you understand" look and I would clean up the mess. That didn't happen as much in a regular bookstore when I worked there.

 

Also, and much more odd, I thought, the customers were more likely to get testy at the christian bookstore. I know that sounds ludicrous but I swear it's true. I've thought about this for years (my book-selling career ended a few years ago) and I think that the answer to why this was is that they felt less inclined to make a "good witness" while they were "among their own" and so they didn't. It confounds me even now, to think of how some people behaved. We used to sell a bumper sticker that said "I'm not perfect, just forgiven" and that surely applied to many.

 

On the ship, I would fear that the large group will take over spaces. Even on our sailing, with the christian group of a couple hundred, I know there will be moonlight communion on the deck one night, although that will likely inconvenience few. With 1000 on this other sailing, I would expect (and they likely will, too) that the services will be most tailored to their needs.

[Schplinky]

LOL ... I'd almost consider booking this cruise myself just to watch the "fireworks." I wonder if the Christian group knows about the gay group? LOL ... should be interesting if they start trying to "convert" them. :)

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

 

I'm rather certian that neither group knows about the other. I suppose I could let them know but then that would affect my people watching! :)

[seniormiss]

I must be in the monority who does not find church groups better behaved but then again, I used to work in a christian bookstore and then in a mainstream one and my experience of the two different groups leads me to say to you that you should bail. Any group that is large enough to take over a space will likely do so and christian groups are no different.

 

Interestingly, we've discovered that on our Westerdam cruise in January, there is a christian group of 200 or so and we're going anyway because we also discovered there is a gay group of the same number. While this shouldn't matter in the least, I'm guessing the people watching should be fun. Although I would qualify for both groups, we are cruising with neither.

I think I may switch to your cruise it sound like it might be very interesting!!!!

[bepsf]

I don't care what size/type group it is:* after you've made your reservation and confirmed your dinner seating, what right do they have to swoop in and change your reservation like that? *Would they be allowed to take your stateroom too???

 

I'd be on the phone to the TA in a flash changing/cancelling my reservation.

[Schplinky]

I don't care what size/type group it is:* after you've made your reservation and confirmed your dinner seating, what right do they have to swoop in and change your reservation like that? *Would they be allowed to take your stateroom too???

 

I'd be on the phone to the TA in a flash changing/cancelling my reservation.

 

Brian,

 

I don't think it was HAL but groups have actually taken rooms in the past (it was either Celebrity or RCL because those are the onlyn other boards I read). The group in question wanted all their rooms togehter and the line simply moved others in order to sell 50 cabins at once. Like you, this would exasperate me and I would consider cancelling.

[we2cruisers]

We just found out the our westerdam 12/10 cruise has a group, AJLI, on board. When I went to their website it states that the price includes a 1 hour cocktail party and dinner at the pinnacle. Does anyone know of a way that we could find out how many from this group will be on this cruise? We have already completed our final payment so changing is not really an option at this point.

[kryos]

I don't care what size/type group it is:* after you've made your reservation and confirmed your dinner seating, what right do they have to swoop in and change your reservation like that? *Would they be allowed to take your stateroom too???

Sure. That's called a charter.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita