Getting Passport for Underaged Child when Ex-Spouse is being Uncooperative

[threeofus]

Sorry, but legally this is one of those issues that he does not have to have a reason and all he would have to say is that he fears the child will be taken out of the country and not returned. The missing spouse wins.

 

 

 

Yes I believe that is true.

From the other side I know of woman who WON'T get her child a passport because she fears that once she has one the DAD WILL BE ABLE TO TAKE HER TO HIS HOMELAND WHERE HIS FAMILY RESIDES - AND WON't RETURN.

So although he is all for getting her a passprot she is cruising now while the passport rule is still a choice - with a birth certificate only.

Sad but makes sense.

[forpaws]

There is also a program where a parent can register a child with the agency if they have a fear that one parent may try to get a passport and then take the child out of the country without the others knowledge.

 

And this does happen! I have a friend whose daughter was taken out of the country by the non-custodial dad, and the child hasn't been seen since. She was 6 at the time, and that was 30 years ago. :( Although they tried desperately to find her, they just didn't have the resources to continue the search indefinitely and didn't get much help from the authorities.

 

So it DOES happen!

 

Just once, I would like those of you who do not have to deal with ex-spouses that are controlling, bullying, blaming, manipulative, abusive, rude and hurtful and left the marriage and their children, to experience life in our (and our childrens') shoes. :rolleyes:

 

OP, good luck with your situation !! I can totally empathize.

 

One thing I would like to add. Please understand I am sympathetic to the plight of mothers in this situation, BUT, please remember that there are dads out there who are dealing with mothers who are over the top crazy and controlling too.

 

My S/O of 4 years tries hard to be a good dad...ALWAYS pays child support on time...sees the child all the time...never misses a custody weekend (even if I offer to pay his way on a cruise! :p )...never misses a ballgame or a teacher's conference...they have joint custody, but she has primary physical custody. He got to spend another $1000 on lawyer fees a few weeks ago when the mother took him back to court for getting the 9 year old boy a haircut.

And before anyone starts on it being his fault they divorced, they did so because the ex-wife, who thinks she's very beautiful with her huge fake boobs, etc., (yes I get sick of hearing about this.. :D ), had too many "extracurricular" activities on the side, among other things. He was her 4th marriage, and she has a total of 3 children, each by a different dad.

At first, she took him to court every few months over anything she could come up with. Now that she has finally remarried (yes, it's the 5th marriage), it's decreased somewhat and has only been twice in one year! :rolleyes:

 

So, it needs to be said that not all divorced dads are bad. Some really do try, and the mother tries to block them from being a good dad at every opportunity.

[Iamthesea]

I did see a form online with the Passport Services where a parent can give consent or you can provide an explanation as to why the other parent is not signing. I guess if I put in the explanation portion that the father is being uncooperative and not making time to be present, perhaps they will also send him a letter and if he doesn't respond then they will go ahead and process.

 

I just sent the form to him asking for his signature. We'll see how that goes.

For your daughters sake, I hope your XDH cooperates and signs. Does your son already have a passport?

 

If your XDH doesn't sign and sends you another "I'll sign when I am good and ready" email, then I would politely ask him again and say that you "don't want to have to take this request to court."

 

I don't like threats, but the legal kind always seem to work. ;)

[roadnut]

I think Agrigar's Post #29 was put perfectly. A judge is not going to accept "Just because" or "she's a flight risk" without a reason. A judge is going to look at evolutiondob's past. If she's not in trouble with the law, has had a steady job, has family, etc, etc, etc, claiming that she's a flight risk is not going to work. Especially when, if she's a true flight risk, there's a lot of easier, less costly ways to escape the country!

 

The lawyer route sucks because of the expense, but otherwise he's just going to continue doing what he's doing. I hope that every email he sends you, you save. When you get your lawyer to file a motion, have him include these emails showing that he is controlling, and that he has repetitively refused to cooperate. Include in the motion to the judge that you want him paying your legal expenses. A judge hopefully will see that matters like this don't need court intervention, and may indeed slap him with your legal costs, as an incentive to him to resolve issues promptly.

[evolutiondob]

IamtheSeas, yes, my son has already applied for his passport. He didn't need his father's signature since he is over 16 years old.

 

I still haven't received a response from my email but I will wait and see what happens in the next few days.

[Merion_Mom]

And this does happen! I have a friend whose daughter was taken out of the country by the non-custodial dad, and the child hasn't been seen since. She was 6 at the time, and that was 30 years ago. :( Although they tried desperately to find her, they just didn't have the resources to continue the search indefinitely and didn't get much help from the authorities.

 

So it DOES happen!

 

 

One thing I would like to add. Please understand I am sympathetic to the plight of mothers in this situation, BUT, please remember that there are dads out there who are dealing with mothers who are over the top crazy and controlling too.

 

My S/O of 4 years tries hard to be a good dad...ALWAYS pays child support on time...sees the child all the time...never misses a custody weekend (even if I offer to pay his way on a cruise! :p )...never misses a ballgame or a teacher's conference...they have joint custody, but she has primary physical custody. He got to spend another $1000 on lawyer fees a few weeks ago when the mother took him back to court for getting the 9 year old boy a haircut.

And before anyone starts on it being his fault they divorced, they did so because the ex-wife, who thinks she's very beautiful with her huge fake boobs, etc., (yes I get sick of hearing about this.. :D ), had too many "extracurricular" activities on the side, among other things. He was her 4th marriage, and she has a total of 3 children, each by a different dad.

At first, she took him to court every few months over anything she could come up with. Now that she has finally remarried (yes, it's the 5th marriage), it's decreased somewhat and has only been twice in one year! :rolleyes:

 

So, it needs to be said that not all divorced dads are bad. Some really do try, and the mother tries to block them from being a good dad at every opportunity.

You are absolutely right; of course it goes both ways.

 

I think that there are more women than men on CC, though.........;)

[Merion_Mom]

Carol, not sure what you mean by "recently" but this went into effect July 2, 2001 from what I gather. It's Public Law 106-113, Sect 236. Basically states that both parents are required to execute the passport application for anyone under the age of 14.

There is also a program where a parent can register a child with the agency if they have a fear that one parent may try to get a passport and then take the child out of the country without the others knowledge.

 

That explains it. This was in 1998.

[Kaluha and Cream]

How are things going with the passport issue?

[evolutiondob]

Well, sent the ex the passport consent form off the Passport Services website and nicely asked him if he would be willing to sign it so that I could take my daughter in this weekend to begin the process. He basically responded that he was "not going to sign anything" and that he would show up at the post office at some point to take care of it when his schedule opens up. So, I'll just wait and see what happens. I'm going to sit tight for a moment and try to let this go until June when I'll be in the six month period before the cruise. I'm feeling a little obsessive about this right now so I need to step back and let things take their course. He may make time in the next few weeks but I think if I continue to badger him about it's only going to make him know how much I want this, thereby causing him to drag his feet even more.

[MelBelle]

You may need to go to the Passport web sight to confirm this, but I believe it says both parents have to be there, at the same time. I don't think he can just show up when it pleases him. You have to be together unless you have the notorized, signed documents. I agree with all the previous posts on this. Get your attorney involved soon. The last I heard the average time to receive a passport was 10 - 12 weeks.

[cruisinMike]

I hear everyone saying get your attorney involved now, but.......

 

If he is a control freak like you say, there is no guarantee that he won't get an attorney also to argue his point. That means not a clear cut, quick answer. It could drag out longer than you want with motions and getting court dates, delays, etc. You know him better than anyone here. There is always more than one way to skin a cat, or should I say rat. But know there is another saying too, live by the sword......

 

So yes you can run to an attorney, but there are no guarantees except that if he drags it out the attorneys will be the only ones laughing all the way to the bank.

[evolutiondob]

MelBelle,

 

Yes, both parents have to be at the post office at the same time with the minor child. That's the issue - he won't give me a date when he's available to go with me.

[SomeBeach]

I think this has been mentioned but I'll mention it again anyway..........

Make copies of all the e's in which he says he'll be there when he feels like it, his schedule opens up, etc. That may make a statement no matter which way you have to proceed with this.

I do wish you luck in dealing with this over the next few weeks. Many of us hope to read in the near future that you have secured this passport.

[gojojo]

I have been lucky my ex allowed me to get the passport, but I did print off a copy of the Parental consent form that he could fill out and get notorized. My ex is not quite a control freak, but let's just say he doesn't mind doing or not doing stuff just to irritate me.

 

Since he doesn't seem to want to do the post office thing, try asking (grit your teeth) nicely, and say there is a form he can fill out, and how about you bring a notary to his house or office and have it done? Would that be ok? You fill out the form, all he has to do is sign his name with the notary.

 

As for the letter of you taking kid out of the country ... I do the same thing. I type up the letter and have him sign it and return it with it notarized. He does so ... but does enjoy making me wait. My kids know they need this from dad, and if he doesn't do it, they know it's him stopping their trip.

 

This year I'm a little lucky as he is finally doing a vacation with the kids out of the country. He has the passports because I got them for my trip. But he will need a letter with my consent .... I will do his just as long as he signs mine at the same time!

[gojojo]

Evolutiondob ... just seeing a few of the other posts and I too feel we have the same ex. He too likes to think he is doing me a favor etc. I think people (not just men!) who do this are doing it because they like to see it get to us. As hard as it is, try not to show how much it bothers you. I have found that the less emotion I show him regarding issues, the better off it is.

 

And definitely keep track of things ... you never know when you may need it for assistance or a c.y.a. Mine is sneaky and will wait for the "right" moment. He "gathers" his pieces prior to making his "attack". I have learned to not let the guard down and to never turn my back on him.

[Iamthesea]

My blood just boiled when I read the latest response from your X. I would not be able to accept his answer and would be getting some legal advice.

 

A suggestion:

Has your DD asked her Daddy to help her out in getting a passport so that she can "go on the very fun cruise ship with mommy?" :cool:

[cruisinMike]

My blood just boiled when I read the latest response from your X. I would not be able to accept his answer and would be getting some legal advice.

 

A suggestion:

Has your DD asked her Daddy to help her out in getting a passport so that she can "go on the very fun cruise ship with mommy?" :cool:

 

 

Ahhh yes, and that is what I was referring to as more than one way to skin a cat, err a rat. The OP knows him best and probably knows his push buttons best. As someone on the other side of the coin, a custodial father (kids are now grown), I had to deal with an ex that liked the games also. I just got to the point where I could play better then her because I knew her push buttons.

[nrdsb4]

Well, sent the ex the passport consent form off the Passport Services website and nicely asked him if he would be willing to sign it so that I could take my daughter in this weekend to begin the process. He basically responded that he was "not going to sign anything" and that he would show up at the post office at some point to take care of it when his schedule opens up. So, I'll just wait and see what happens. I'm going to sit tight for a moment and try to let this go until June when I'll be in the six month period before the cruise. I'm feeling a little obsessive about this right now so I need to step back and let things take their course. He may make time in the next few weeks but I think if I continue to badger him about it's only going to make him know how much I want this, thereby causing him to drag his feet even more.

 

Your situation makes me very glad that my husband and I are not divorced. I feel for you.

 

My parents were divorced and put us first always, with no nastiness going on. My Dad now says that they just wanted to make it as easy on us as humanly possible. My husband's Dad never paid his court ordered divorce settlement, paid only one month of child support ever, and his Mom reacted by telling the boys way too much about what was going on. What a mess. :(

 

Good luck, I hope everything works out. Come back and update us when the status changes.

[rsscaptain]

Ahhh yes, and that is what I was referring to as more than one way to skin a cat, err a rat. The OP knows him best and probably knows his push buttons best. As someone on the other side of the coin, a custodial father (kids are now grown), I had to deal with an ex that liked the games also. I just got to the point where I could play better then her because I knew her push buttons.

 

As a word of caution be careful involing children in parental issues. We thought we did a good job with this with our daughter only to learn later how she felt put in the middle when we didn't realize it. Just as they are not bargaining chips, they are not moderators either.

 

FWIW time goes by quickly and before you know it, you won't have to deal with it forever! We have six peaceful years under our belt now. ;)

[cruisinMike]

As a word of caution be careful involing children in parental issues. We thought we did a good job with this with our daughter only to learn later how she felt put in the middle when we didn't realize it. Just as they are not bargaining chips, they are not moderators either.

 

FWIW time goes by quickly and before you know it, you won't have to deal with it forever! We have six peaceful years under our belt now. ;)

 

No, I just said more then one way to skin a....rat. Has nothing to do with the particular example. I have alot of experience as the custodial father with a non-custodial ex wanting to run the show....even as a "deadbeat mom".

 

My word of caution stands, use the court only if you're willing to put up with a battle that you're really willing to pay for...in more ways than one.

[rsscaptain]

No, I just said more then one way to skin a....rat. Has nothing to do with the particular example. I have alot of experience as the custodial father with a non-custodial ex wanting to run the show....even as a "deadbeat mom".

 

My word of caution stands, use the court only if you're willing to put up with a battle that you're really willing to pay for...in more ways than one.

 

Didn't mean to ruffle your feather's. In fact I agree with you. Just throwing out there to watch out for the kids in these situations. I shouldn't have quoted you because it wasn't my intent to dissagree with you but to add a thought. I also have the same experience as you regarding the dead beat MOM and dealing with her.

[arabrab]

Well, sent the ex the passport consent form off the Passport Services website and nicely asked him if he would be willing to sign it so that I could take my daughter in this weekend to begin the process. He basically responded that he was "not going to sign anything" and that he would show up at the post office at some point to take care of it when his schedule opens up. So, I'll just wait and see what happens. I'm going to sit tight for a moment and try to let this go until June when I'll be in the six month period before the cruise. I'm feeling a little obsessive about this right now so I need to step back and let things take their course. He may make time in the next few weeks but I think if I continue to badger him about it's only going to make him know how much I want this, thereby causing him to drag his feet even more.

 

Okay, he sounds like a jerk. But you're playing his game, and allowing him to jerk you around. Even if he signs the paperwork in front of a notary, there's nothing to stop him from filing to prevent you from taking the children out of the country just a few days before you leave. Control freaks do that.

 

Perhaps you can check with your lawyer and get a fixed fee for getting the court order, which shouldn't take even an hour of his or her time? If he's just too expensive, perhaps it is time to get a new attorney that you can afford. Unless you have a judge's order allowing you to get a passport AND take vacations out of the country with both of your children, your ex could step in at the last minute and really ruin all your vacation plans. If the order is written well (remember, your lawyer writes the draft order), you can probably get permission to take the children out of the country for vacations not to exceed X weeks in length for the duration of the order, which preferably would be good until your youngest child turns 18. You might need to offer in the draft order to forego any vacations during holiday periods that your husband has visitation. (If he's got Christmas under the current order, it wouldn't be very fair to try and take the kids for a Christmas cruise unless you gave up some other time that was significant.)

 

Looked at this way, you're spending one lawyer's fee to obtain a release from these kinds of problems for the full remaining time your children are minors, which may be the best early Christmas present you've ever bought yourself.

 

Yes, it is aggravating that he's so unreasonable, but the reality is that you can't change him. Change what you can change -- the court order -- and move on with your life. I'd also second the previous recommendation that you keep your kids out of it. It isn't healthy for them or for you.

 

Best of luck, and congratulations on getting that college diploma.

[Lisichka]

I have been giving this some more thought, hoping to maybe give you some advice. When I look back on my relationship with my ex, one thing has never changed: his need to control everything and everyone around him. When I first married him he had me refold all the towels in the house because I had folded them lengthwise first, and he wanted them folded the other way. Unfortunately, this was only the tip of the iceberg. I have since learned that his need to control stems from his need to feel secure and lessen his own anxiety/insecurities. I also know now that when he felt he lost 'control' over me (for whatever reason, usually it was because I stood my ground and refused to give in on matters that were important to me), he became angry and sometimes violent. After years of living with him, and after years and years in court fighting over various issues, I have found only one thing works with controlling (wo)men: give them the control they need in a way that is acceptable to you. Fighting back does not help. The minute you fight back they feel out of control, and they will feel the need to regain control thereby making the situation worse, etc etc. I am not sure what your situation is, but my ex can outspend and outlast me in court any day of the week. As such, I have chosen to no longer fight. Right now I have 4 cruises booked for summer '08 because my ex will not tell me when he will have the children and when I can go. Obviously I will only go on one, but rather than fight the issue, I just forked out the money and let him set the course of when this gets decided. I asked him once, and after that I let it go. I will deal with it when the time comes and until then I refuse to let my ex control me by freaking me out with all the "what if's".

 

One way to maybe give your ex the control he craves, is to ask him for advice on how to go about getting a passport, or to give him several options that you feign confusion about ("can you help me with getting a passport? I feel you are much better at doing this than I am, and was hoping you could give me some direction. Do you think we should go to a post office or to a government agency? What is the latest we could do this and still be ok timewise?"). When he can control some aspect of the passport-getting, it may satisfy this hunger he feels inside of him to control.

 

I know there is no easy way to deal with someone who has this need to control. However, giving them the illusion of control (or if they think you look up to them) may often get you the result you want.

 

Good luck.

 

A disclaimer: while my ex continues to be controlling, he has in many ways become a 'better' man. I am hopeful this is a trend that will continue.

[scissorgui]

One thing I would like to add. Please understand I am sympathetic to the plight of mothers in this situation, BUT, please remember that there are dads out there who are dealing with mothers who are over the top crazy and controlling too.

 

My S/O of 4 years tries hard to be a good dad...ALWAYS pays child support on time...sees the child all the time...never misses a custody weekend (even if I offer to pay his way on a cruise! :p )...never misses a ballgame or a teacher's conference...they have joint custody, but she has primary physical custody. He got to spend another $1000 on lawyer fees a few weeks ago when the mother took him back to court for getting the 9 year old boy a haircut.

 

And before anyone starts on it being his fault they divorced, they did so because the ex-wife, who thinks she's very beautiful with her huge fake boobs, etc., (yes I get sick of hearing about this.. :D ), had too many "extracurricular" activities on the side, among other things. He was her 4th marriage, and she has a total of 3 children, each by a different dad.

 

At first, she took him to court every few months over anything she could come up with. Now that she has finally remarried (yes, it's the 5th marriage), it's decreased somewhat and has only been twice in one year! :rolleyes:

 

So, it needs to be said that not all divorced dads are bad. Some really do try, and the mother tries to block them from being a good dad at every opportunity.

I know this is off topic, but if his ex got remarried, he shouldn't have to pay a dollar in child support..that is up to the new hubby...at least that is how it is my state.

[bankonus]

I know this is off topic, but if his ex got remarried, he shouldn't have to pay a dollar in child support..that is up to the new hubby...at least that is how it is my state.

 

 

Oh I'm sure there are alot of dads who wish that was the situation. That usually only applies when spousal support is involved, and even now they are still making ex's pay that when remarried. I feel it's not my new husbands job to pay for raising them on his own (which he does whole heartedly) and not even get them to take his last name. In same perspective I wouldn't stop paying his ex either should she ever remarry (which we pray for everyday):D

 

scissorgui - You are gonna get bombarded with dad's who want to know where you live!!:D :D