Passenger Fuel Surcharge Announced...

[serendipity1499]

For reminding me of that which I am already aware, that I can cancel my booking if I am unhappy.

 

Not sure I understand your reasoning.

Shorter cruise pax make more $ for the cruiselines so they shld pay extra per day but longer cruise pax don't so they only pay a set amount (14 days worth) & get the rest of the days free?

 

U keep saying u pay more but u have only proved to me that 1 week apart the longer cruise cost more per day than the shorter - this can still be because of the date, not necessarily because it is a longer cruise.

 

Besides, if the shorter cruise pax make the most $ for the cruiselines & I agree with u that cruiselines are not stupid and yes might even be doing this so as not to scare away the longer cruise pax but then why not simply charge them 1/2 the amt that shorter cruise pax pay to make more $.

Or the shorter cruise pax cld pay $3 pppd and the longer $2 pppd.

I am sorry but NO I do not think most people that can afford a 36 day cruise wld care much about another $360 charge.

 

Then there is the question of the 3rd,4th etc. pax in each cabin. Seems they get 'hauled' for free. If it costs more to fuel the ship does it not cost more to haul 3 or more people than 2?

 

I agree that life can be unfair, its why some of us fight to make it more so..Happy cruisin'!

 

CruiseCrazy..Please don't mis=inderstand me when I said that you can cancel if you are unhappy..I wasn't trying to be snarky, but I was trying to point out is that Hal is only assessing those who have not reached final payment yet..

 

Also I stand by my post March 9 & March 16 difference has nothing to do with the dates..I was in the travel business for 30 years & I am well aware of the reasons fares change because of seasons & holidays...Any one in the Travel Business will attest to the fact that the longer trips cost more per day than the 7 day trips..

 

However since you seem not to believe me, here is a comparison of the same dates, which you can check on the HAL WEB site:

 

March 16 -M.S Veendam "E" Cabin for 14 days..Base Fare is 2374.00 (minus discount) Divide that by 14 days & the passenger is paying $169.57 per day..Now add Taxes & Fees 117.89, Fuel Surcharge 70.00..Total Fare $2561.89 divided by 14 days is $182.99 per day..

 

March 16-M.S. Westerdam "E" Cabin for 7 days..Base Fare is 1049.00 (minus discount) Divide that by 7 days & the passenger is paying $149.85 per day..Now add Taxes & Fees $49.72, Fuel Surcharge $35.00..Total Fare $1133.72 divided by 7 days is $161.96 per day...

 

Now the way you are thinking, is that it's fair for those who take the longer trips to pay more than you on longer trips because we can afford them!:(

 

Many of us worked hard & saved our money to put our children through college & now are still saving to take these longer trips..And many of us do watch our finances & do without other things to take the longer trips..In addition many who take the longer trips are still working & save their pennies on a daily basis in order to take the longer trips...So please don't be so quick to judge.. Money is just as important to us as it may be to you, and $360 can make a differnce..

 

As I mentioned before Cruise Lines make most of the $$$ on 7 day trips, because most passengers purchase many more drinks, ship's shore excursions, photo's, Bingo, SPA's, Art work etc..Those on longer trips tend to not take as many of the ship's shore excursions, play Bingo as much, use the Spa as often, purchase photo's or spend as much per day on their cruise..

 

Also agree with JTL the third psgr makes absolutely no differnce in the weight of a ship..

 

JMO..Have a nice day everyone...Betty

[hammybee]

I posted this last week, on one of the other surcharge threads:

Just for fun, I compared the cost of the same cabin cat. on two consecutive Ryndam sails. The first, a 7 day sail, runs about $121 p/p per day. The second, a 30 day sail, runs $167 p/p per day.

 

Both prices are exclusive of port/taxes to compare apples to apples.

 

There is about a 28% premium for the longer sail. No way to tell how much of this is supply/demand versus the longer sail use of more fuel.

 

1FatPER said it best, in post #10, " it's a free economy and companies can charge what they want."

 

If the strategy is for shorter cruises to subsidize the cost of fuel on longer cruises, that's the company's perogative to do so. As consumers, we are never going to know.

 

Only you can decide if it's acceptable to you.

 

Also, here is a copy of what is showing on HAL's web site:

 

New Fuel Supplement

 

 

Because of the continuing rapid escalation of fuel prices, the North American brands of Carnival Corporation, including Holland America Line, have announced a fuel supplement of $5.00USD per passenger, per day, for all voyages departing on or after February 1, 2008.

 

The supplement applies to the first and second passengers in a stateroom up to a maximum of $70.00USD per person per voyage, for both new bookings and those that are currently under deposit or fully paid.

 

We are in the process of contacting all existing bookings, most of which are outside of the cancellation period. Those within the cancellation fee period will be given five days to cancel without charge, after receipt of notification.

 

The fuel supplement is necessitated by significant rises in fuel prices which have dramatically increased Carnival Corporation's operating costs.

 

Until now, the company has absorbed the increase in fuel costs but, unfortunately, it is not possible to continue covering these substantial expenses.

 

Implementing this fuel supplement was a difficult decision, and we hope that our guests will understand that this is a necessary step in today's economic environment.

 

No one is being forced to cruise if they do not want to pay the fuel surcharge.

[serendipity1499]

Agree Hammy..It is a free economy & they can charge what they want..At least they are giving them the option to cancel without penalty..

Our Hot water tank was installed Sept 19, 2005, & started leaking today..Called our plumber & was advised the tank had a 6 year warranty, but the installation only a two year warranty..Now we have no choice but to pay for the new tanks installation & our new tank will only be warranted for the balance of the 6 years..(3 years & 10 months) ..Is this fair? ..I'm hopping mad, :( but have no choice in the matter! Thank goodness it did not happen while we were on our cruise!:eek:

Airlines have been selling seats at discounts for years..Most Business people pay much more for their Airline seat than those who are on Vacation sitting next to them...Why is that acceptable or fair?

Several years ago, we were booked in April on a Trans-Atlantic from MIA to BCN with another couple...I booked our Friends Flights on LH in July (the year before) ..DH & I were going to have passes.. It was not to be! Three Months later our Company ceased operation from New York & was only operating charters in Europe...So the following Nov. I booked our flights on LH & DH & I each paid $100.00 more than our friends did on the same flight for the same type of ticket.. Was that fair?..Perhaps not but we had the option of taking it or not..

Happy Cruising everyone..:) Betty

[cruisecrasy]

CruiseCrazy..Please don't mis=inderstand me when I said that you can cancel if you are unhappy..I wasn't trying to be snarky, but I was trying to point out is that Hal is only assessing those who have not reached final payment yet..

 

Also I stand by my post March 9 & March 16 difference has nothing to do with the dates..I was in the travel business for 30 years & I am well aware of the reasons fares change because of seasons & holidays...Any one in the Travel Business will attest to the fact that the longer trips cost more per day than the 7 day trips..

 

However since you seem not to believe me, here is a comparison of the same dates, which you can check on the HAL WEB site:

 

March 16 -M.S Veendam "E" Cabin for 14 days..Base Fare is 2374.00 (minus discount) Divide that by 14 days & the passenger is paying $169.57 per day..Now add Taxes & Fees 117.89, Fuel Surcharge 70.00..Total Fare $2561.89 divided by 14 days is $182.99 per day..

 

March 16-M.S. Westerdam "E" Cabin for 7 days..Base Fare is 1049.00 (minus discount) Divide that by 7 days & the passenger is paying $149.85 per day..Now add Taxes & Fees $49.72, Fuel Surcharge $35.00..Total Fare $1133.72 divided by 7 days is $161.96 per day...

 

Now the way you are thinking, is that it's fair for those who take the longer trips to pay more than you on longer trips because we can afford them!:(

 

Many of us worked hard & saved our money to put our children through college & now are still saving to take these longer trips..And many of us do watch our finances & do without other things to take the longer trips..In addition many who take the longer trips are still working & save their pennies on a daily basis in order to take the longer trips...So please don't be so quick to judge.. Money is just as important to us as it may be to you, and $360 can make a differnce..

 

As I mentioned before Cruise Lines make most of the $$$ on 7 day trips, because most passengers purchase many more drinks, ship's shore excursions, photo's, Bingo, SPA's, Art work etc..Those on longer trips tend to not take as many of the ship's shore excursions, play Bingo as much, use the Spa as often, purchase photo's or spend as much per day on their cruise..

 

Also agree with JTL the third psgr makes absolutely no differnce in the weight of a ship..

 

JMO..Have a nice day everyone...Betty

 

I hope I do not rush to judge...I apologize if it offended anyone.. It was not my intent to suggest longer cruise pax can afford the extra charges simply that in the total amount paid $360 wld be miniscule and not a worry for most...I mean, I have heard of some $2000 or more bar bills alone - $500 is nothing today.. So, perhaps those pax wld then simply drink a bit less to make up that charge..

 

I totally agree with u that it takes lots of saving (been there and still doing that myself) to take these longer cruises - or any cruise for that matter but many will not consider $360 much when the cruise itself costs say $10000 or more.

I mean, if they increased the fares rather than levy a fuel surcharge do u think most cruisers wld cancel - I don't believe so.. Not unless the economy gets really bad & cruisers start losing their jobs.

That said, adding a fuel surcharge is something everyone is aware of and can understand - simply raising fares is more difficult 'cause cruisers for the most part can't/won't relate to it..

 

U might have made my point for me when u said the cruiselines charge more per day on longer trips to make up for the lost revenue realized on the shorter cruises and so it is perhaps NOT to cover extra fuel costs.

I still say the shorter cruise pax are subsidizing the longer cruise pax..

 

Curious also another statement - if the 3rd+ pax makes no difference in the weight of a ship - then why do the #1 & #2 paxs unless as another poster with a marvelous sense of humor stated -they are filled with 'helium' :0).

 

I have a question for anyone who cares to answer this - if the paxs make very little to no difference in the weight factor why do they charge per pax per day up to 2 in a cabin then -why not simply levy say $2 per cabin per trip??

I suggest it does make a difference in the weight factor. Perhaps not a lot but some. I'm sorry but 2200 pax with at least 1/3 (on my last cruise in October) averaging approx 300 lbs - 'not kidding' - must have some effect. Will get worse also as obesity is increasing not to mention extra food to feed them, larger, heavier suitcases (larger size clothing + medicines) wheelchairs & walkers & so will the fuel costs to haul them around..It is not like an empty ship weight wise..

 

As u & others have posted - we can opt out or 'pay up & shut up' which is exactly what the cruiselines want us to do..!!

I choose to complain on a forum where I know it is being monitored by the cruiselines. Squeaky wheels get greased - silent ones take the load...!!

 

Have happy cruisin'!

[cruisecrasy]

Not really. The weight of a person is so minuscule compared to the weight of the ship that the fuel used would not be much different if the ship were cruising around entirely empty of passengers. The entire passenger weight on a Vista ship might be, say, 175 pounds times 1900 people, or 166 tons. That is perhaps 0.2% of the ship's empty weight.

 

U have neglected to add in the food/drinks to feed all those people plus the staff to serve them, weight of suitcases, wheelchairs, beds, chairs, lamps, sofas, pictures, linens, china, cutlery etc. - all of which are part of the cruising experience.. Seems to me that does add considerably more weight and it wld be a factor in the fuel consumed..

 

Happy cruisin'!

[DOC & BABE]

how do posters have time for this silly post, whoever said any company has to be fair or democratic. when i fill up my car i am not angry with the gas station over the price increase they are passing on to the consumer. i just hope world finds alternative fuel source. how would you feel if they announced no more cruises due to waste of energy usage, after all, who needs to have a fun vacation, so no more vacation travel whether land, air, or sea!

[maxout]

[Opinions]

If you are so unhappy with the way the fuel surcharge is being handled, then you have a choice of either accepting it or not...You are entitled to a full refund of your deposit..

 

 

True...But what if you have HAL insurance...HAL Insurance can be quite costly and they require that it be bought at time of deposit and it is not refundable.

[hammybee]

I caught a glimpse today of a thread elsewhere, called "Maxout". So here I was thinking, hey someone took the opportunity to acknowledge you for your patient technology help and crazy sense of humor.

 

Alas, it was a lengthly discussion of what happens when one maxes out their credit card and can't pay for their onboard expenses, or something along those lines.

 

So here's to you, for all you do. Thanks.

[cruisecrasy]

Sorry double post!!

[cruisecrasy]

how do posters have time for this silly post, whoever said any company has to be fair or democratic. when i fill up my car i am not angry with the gas station over the price increase they are passing on to the consumer. i just hope world finds alternative fuel source. how would you feel if they announced no more cruises due to waste of energy usage, after all, who needs to have a fun vacation, so no more vacation travel whether land, air, or sea!

 

Might I suggest u simply not read it or respond if u find it 'silly' and not be so offensive to other folks who do not think so because calling the post 'silly' implies those who do choose to spend their time here - are also..

 

My personal objection is NOT the fuel surcharge, simply that I feel it is being unfairly set and subsidizing...

 

 

Happy cruisin'!

[cruisecrasy]

I caught a glimpse today of a thread elsewhere, called "Maxout". So here I was thinking, hey someone took the opportunity to acknowledge you for your patient technology help and crazy sense of humor.

 

Alas, it was a lengthly discussion of what happens when one maxes out their credit card and can't pay for their onboard expenses, or something along those lines.

 

So here's to you, for all you do. Thanks.

 

Interesting...

[maxout]

Thanks hammy.

[cruisecrasy]

True...But what if you have HAL insurance...HAL Insurance can be quite costly and they require that it be bought at time of deposit and it is not refundable.

 

I agree - what about refunding the insurance then...???

[maxout]

Is there an echo in here?? Hello!!! it's in the contract, read it before you purchase.

 

As we say to the inmates - "Don't like the hotel?, then don't make the reservation"

[iamirish]

Are you suggesting that people take personal responsibility for their actions??

[serendipity1499]

Cruisecrazy I understand what you are saying...But the increase in fuel prices has nothing to do with the Cruise Lines..They are paying more for their fuel just as much as we the consumer's, are paying more...So instead of increasing the fares they tack on a fuel surcharge which will affect more of their passengers..If fuel prices come down, which probably will not happen any time soon, then they can rescind the fuel surcharge..

 

You still believe that 7 day cruisers subsidize the long hauls...But let's not forget that to make up for the on board spending from the long-haul passengers, they are charging us more per day for the same cruise.. Each passenger on the long-hauls including the third are paying at least $21.03 more per day for an "E" Cabin than the 7 day cruisers are paying...(see my example)...Hammy found a difference of $46.00 per day on a 30 day cruise, on the Ryndam, but don't know what class that was..

 

The fuel cost to haul around extra passengers including wheelchairs, suitcases, medicines etc..will increase but it's still LESS THAN TWO PERCENT of the Ships weight when empty...And how many cabins do you really believe have a third psgr. in them? The majority of cabins have only two in each cabin on normal 7 day cruises..When school is out then there may be 150-200 extra children on board which is still only ten percent of the ship's capacity..And many families book separate cabins for their children...

 

Yes, I've heard some will spend $1,000-$2,000 per week on a bar bill, but don't believe that's the norm..I know on our last 25 day "Prinsendam" Cruise we spent less than $1500 in on-board expenses for the entire cruise, which included gratuities as well as extra tips for our wonderful Stewards..

 

Our Government has been dragging their feet for years instead of trying to increase our domestic fuel production..If we had increased production years ago then we would not have to be so Dependant on foreign oil...Our state (Florida), stopped oil exploration off our coast & is just now agreeing & understanding the need to have it..

 

There is enough fuel stockpiled, however the Foreign Oil Producing Countries are holding back in order to drive up fuel prices.. So if we want to drive down these prices, we have to start cutting our own fuel consumption & lobby our Government...We probably should walk instead of driving everywhere & turn down our Heat & Raise the Temp of Air Cond. & start using solar for our homes..In addition, we should all get rid of the gas guzzlers..In most other countries they drive smaller cars &/or use Bicycles, scooters & Public transportation! Why can't we do that? I know I'll be flamed for this, but something has to give..

 

We were talking with our Friends, today & everyone agrees, if both Cruise Fares increase & fuel prices increase, we will not be able to afford our long-hauls any more..

 

OK, I'm off my soap-box..JMO...Happy cruising while it lasts everyone!:) Betty

 

P.S. I believe all of you should fight to get your insurance back! Also understand that HAL will let you apply your insurance to another cruise, but I'm not certain of this..We never buy HAL insurance..We use Insuremytrip.com..

[prescottbob]

Ahoy!

 

I'm reminded of a phrase by President Reagen (given during his first

inaugral address a couple decades ago) as it might be relate to 'our' current energy concerns:

 

"...government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem."

 

Now back to cyber-chatting on the CC board.

 

Bon Voyage and Continued Good Health!

Bob:)

[cruisecrasy]

Cruisecrazy I understand what you are saying...But the increase in fuel prices has nothing to do with the Cruise Lines..They are paying more for their fuel just as much as we the consumer's, are paying more...So instead of increasing the fares they tack on a fuel surcharge which will affect more of their passengers..If fuel prices come down, which probably will not happen any time soon, then they can rescind the fuel surcharge..

 

You still believe that 7 day cruisers subsidize the long hauls...But let's not forget that to make up for the on board spending from the long-haul passengers, they are charging us more per day for the same cruise.. Each passenger on the long-hauls including the third are paying at least $21.03 more per day for an "E" Cabin than the 7 day cruisers are paying...(see my example)...Hammy found a difference of $46.00 per day on a 30 day cruise, on the Ryndam, but don't know what class that was..

 

The fuel cost to haul around extra passengers including wheelchairs, suitcases, medicines etc..will increase but it's still LESS THAN TWO PERCENT of the Ships weight when empty...And how many cabins do you really believe have a third psgr. in them? The majority of cabins have only two in each cabin on normal 7 day cruises..When school is out then there may be 150-200 extra children on board which is still only ten percent of the ship's capacity..And many families book separate cabins for their children...

 

Yes, I've heard some will spend $1,000-$2,000 per week on a bar bill, but don't believe that's the norm..I know on our last 25 day "Prinsendam" Cruise we spent less than $1500 in on-board expenses for the entire cruise, which included gratuities as well as extra tips for our wonderful Stewards..

 

Our Government has been dragging their feet for years instead of trying to increase our domestic fuel production..If we had increased production years ago then we would not have to be so Dependant on foreign oil...Our state (Florida), stopped oil exploration off our coast & is just now agreeing & understanding the need to have it..

 

There is enough fuel stockpiled, however the Foreign Oil Producing Countries are holding back in order to drive up fuel prices.. So if we want to drive down these prices, we have to start cutting our own fuel consumption & lobby our Government...We probably should walk instead of driving everywhere & turn down our Heat & Raise the Temp of Air Cond. & start using solar for our homes..In addition, we should all get rid of the gas guzzlers..In most other countries they drive smaller cars &/or use Bicycles, scooters & Public transportation! Why can't we do that? I know I'll be flamed for this, but something has to give..

 

We were talking with our Friends, today & everyone agrees, if both Cruise Fares increase & fuel prices increase, we will not be able to afford our long-hauls any more..

 

OK, I'm off my soap-box..JMO...Happy cruising while it lasts everyone!:) Betty

 

P.S. I believe all of you should fight to get your insurance back! Also understand that HAL will let you apply your insurance to another cruise, but I'm not certain of this..We never buy HAL insurance..We use Insuremytrip.com..

 

I for one wldn't dream of flaming u - it is a valid and articulate posting..

 

Ever wondered WHY the Govt has been dragging their feet for yrs? Perhaps we shld consider that the US oil companies have been making too much $ also to care about increasing production which tends to lower prices!! It isn't just foreigners keeping prices up..Besides when u have the 'ear' of the Govt it also helps..

 

Excellent posting on what ails us and shall continue to in the future & possible solutions.

 

The glory days of cheap anything even food are over, disappointing as it may be. The future will be much more expensive and we may all have to do with a lot less.

 

China is becoming an 800 lb gorilla and we all know the joke about that so I do not believe oil prices will fall but if they do it won't be back to the prices we were used to..And likely no company, once having an extra charge in place & raking in cash, will rebate if they don't have to especially since most folks won't complain if they don't..

Seems we may be reverting back to when only a select few cld enjoy the finer things in life & travel - life comes full circle..!

 

In the meantime plse enjoy your cruisin', I sure intend to!!

[jhannah]

Betty, your post is right on the mark. As Pogo said years ago, "We have met the enemy, and he is us." Sadly, not enough of us are willing to make any sacrifice in our convenience or comfort to make any difference in our fossil fuel consumption.

[3 Fan]

We received an e-mail from our TA. Final payment is due on 11-13 for our back to back cruises on the Westerdam. It is a notice that the final payment will be increased by $140 for the fuel charge. I guess we won't have to worry about it being added to the final bill on board. If the price drops I wonder if we'll see a SBC?

[Pete Jackson]

According to the newswire, Holland-America cruise line has found a new source of energy that will enable it to save enough fuel oil to rescind the recently imposed fuel surcharge! It has found out how to direct the flames from the cruise-critic boards directly to the ships' boilers! While the exact method developed is a closely guarded corporate secret, port spies have noted unusual numbers of laser printers being loaded on board HAL ships.

 

When the flames from the fuel surcharge have died out, HAL plans to make changes to the dress codes, and to use more public space for art auctions in order to keep the flames coming...

[hammybee]

According to the newswire, Holland-America cruise line has found a new source of energy that will enable it to save enough fuel oil to rescind the recently imposed fuel surcharge! ........

 

Thank you Pete, for the absolute best laugh of the day. :D

[wizard-of-roz]

Maxout & Pete: You are two writers on-strike.....correct? If not, you guys are in the wrong business......

You've got me spitting coffee and peeing at my desk...........:D

Thanks for lightening this post up......we needed it!!!!!!!!!!:rolleyes:

[Stakeout]

I still don't think it is right to impose new charges AFTER a booking has been made at a certain price. They should change their prices for future bookings only -- and if necessary, they should hedge immediately as bookings come in, so they don't have to get people upset with changes.

and that's my gripe..I agree with you 1000%... they should have at least 'grandfathered in' all those who already booked cruises ..

 

I just called HAL after reading about it... we're booked for the Maasdam's 1/25 and 2/9 cruises thru the Canal and back...would have gotten us to over 300 days with HAL...they had no idea what to do or what was going on.. looks like we're gonna cancel both trips... the HAL rep.. after a number of 'put me on holds' said we could cancel both ..no penalty as the news release states.. however since we booked thru a travel agent have to go that route .. no one knows what's up in Seattle.. I hate dealing with them over the years.. and it still continues..

 

nothing was mentioned on our last cruise this past week on the Maasdam.. got off the ship this past Friday 11/9... sneaky

 

yet more garbage from Carnival... they can ruin anything.. and do

 

as for the 'As You Wish' dining... that's another story... arrrrrgghhh:mad: