Carnival-no thanks

[momofmeg]

A tiny cabin on HAL??? Which ship and which cabin????

 

I think they meant Princess.

[concour]

I think a few ships over the years have gotten a reputation of bring out the party people. It becomes almost self perpetuating. Those who like to part go on them and those who don't stay away and talk down about them. Also ships with shorter length (3-4 nights) are also known for party times. This happens no matter what the cruise line is. The time of the year also means a lot. Even the crew staff starts getting a little antsy around spring break. We were on a cruise a little earlier this year and on the last night the head waiter made a comment on that it was going to be the last good week for awhile and quoted the number of teenagers and college aged cruisers fir the next few weeks.

 

My advise is to choice destinations and what you can afford and sail. Sometimes you might not have the ship exactly like you would want but any cruise is better than sitting behind a desk all day.

[Cruising89143]

You had a tiny cabin on HAL?????? What ship? HAL has some of the biggest staterooms of all the lines. Only Disney give syou comparable staterooms. I think you mean Princess. both Princess and RCI the cabins are not big enough unless you book a minsuite/juniorsuite. Each line has a differant name for it but I am referring to the catagory above a standard balcony.

 

 

Actually on RCI's Voyager, Freedom and Radiance class the cabins match up well with other cruise lines. Only the Sovereign(all three Sovereign class ships will be gone in a few years) and Vision class have what I would classify as smaller cabins. I peaked in a few regular balcony cabins on the Oosterdam a few weeks back and the rooms are about the same size as Carnival. Actually a balcony cabin on HAL's Oosterdam is 249 square feet which is just a little smaller than the same type cabin on Freedom of the Seas.

 

Carnival verses RCI with two of the newest ships in both fleets. The biggest difference is in the interior cabins and RCI has much nicer suites.

 

Outside cabins

 

Carnival Liberty 5A porthole outside stateroom = 185 square feet

Freedom OTS - outside stateroom = 161 square feet.

Carnival Liberty 6A - standard outside stateroom = 185 square feet

Freedom OTS - Large outside stateroom = 200 square feet

Freedom OTS - Family outside staterooom = 290 square feet

 

Balcony cabins

 

Carnival Liberty 8A - Standard balcony stateroom = 220 square feet of which the cabin is 185 square feet and the balcony is 35 square feet.

Freedom OTS - Standard Balcony stateroom = 251 square feet of which the cabin is 177 square feet and the balcony is 74 square feet.

 

Interior Staterooms

 

Carnival Liberty Category 4 = 185 square feet

Freedom Standard Inside = 152 square feet.

 

Suites

 

Carnival Liberty Category 11 = 330 square feet of which the cabin is 245 square feet plus 85 square feet for the balcony.

Freedom OTS Junior Suite = 388 square feet of which cabin is 287 square feet and balcony is 101 square feet.

Carnival Liberty Catergory 12 = 415 square feet of which the cabin is 300 square feet plus 115 square feet.

Freedom of the Seas Grand Suite = 513 square feet of which the cabin is 387 square feet and the balcony is 126 square feet.

[momofmeg]

Actually on RCI's Voyager, Freedom and Radiance class the cabins match up well with other cruise lines. Only the Sovereign(all three Sovereign class ships will be gone in a few years) and Vision class have what I would classify as smaller cabins. I peaked in a few regular balcony cabins on the Oosterdam a few weeks back and the rooms are about the same size as Carnival. Actually a balcony cabin on HAL's Oosterdam is 249 square feet which is just a little smaller than the same type cabin on Freedom of the Seas.

 

Carnival verses RCI with two of the newest ships in both fleets. The biggest difference is in the interior cabins and RCI has much nicer suites.

 

Outside cabins

 

Carnival Liberty 5A porthole outside stateroom = 185 square feet

Freedom OTS - outside stateroom = 161 square feet.

Carnival Liberty 6A - standard outside stateroom = 185 square feet

Freedom OTS - Large outside stateroom = 200 square feet

Freedom OTS - Family outside staterooom = 290 square feet

 

Balcony cabins

 

Carnival Liberty 8A - Standard balcony stateroom = 220 square feet of which the cabin is 185 square feet and the balcony is 35 square feet.

Freedom OTS - Standard Balcony stateroom = 251 square feet of which the cabin is 177 square feet and the balcony is 74 square feet.

 

Interior Staterooms

 

Carnival Liberty Category 4 = 185 square feet

Freedom Standard Inside = 152 square feet.

 

Suites

 

Carnival Liberty Category 11 = 330 square feet of which the cabin is 245 square feet plus 85 square feet for the balcony.

Freedom OTS Junior Suite = 388 square feet of which cabin is 287 square feet and balcony is 101 square feet.

Carnival Liberty Catergory 12 = 415 square feet of which the cabin is 300 square feet plus 115 square feet.

Freedom of the Seas Grand Suite = 513 square feet of which the cabin is 387 square feet and the balcony is 126 square feet.

 

 

The HAL ship I have been on is the Statendam and our ocean view stateroom was as big as Our Disney veranda. I was very impressed with that. the HAL ship I will be on 2 weeks from now is the Westerdam which is vista class. I do not remember the size of square footage but I can tell you whenI get back.

 

I have already said. I have no interest in booking a carnival cruise on a conquest class ship and I only have interest in booking a radience class ship if I book RCI again. So why do you think I am interested in which room is bigger on the two classes of ships you got statiscs for?

 

I was thinking also, you are forgetting Enchantment of the Seas, Granduer of the Seas, Empress of the Seas, RCI has quite a few older ships that have small rooms.

 

Besides

[momofmeg]

I am just going to add this to crusingator. I can't afford suites-so I could care less which of them is the biggest. I guess if I could I would look for the line with the biggest. tell me the statistics of oceanviews and balconies.

[Cruising89143]

The HAL ship I have been on is the Statendam and our ocean view stateroom was as big as Our Disney veranda. I was very impressed with that. the HAL ship I will be on 2 weeks from now is the Westerdam which is vista class. I do not remember the size of square footage but I can tell you whenI get back.

 

I have already said. I have no interest in booking a carnival cruise on a conquest class ship and I only have interest in booking a radience class ship if I book RCI again. So why do you think I am interested in which room is bigger on the two classes of ships you got statiscs for?

 

I was thinking also, you are forgetting Enchantment of the Seas, Granduer of the Seas, Empress of the Seas, RCI has quite a few older ships that have small rooms.

 

Besides

 

Did not forget as I mentioned in my post that the Vision class along with the Sovereign class had smaller cabins. That covers the Enchantment and Granduer. Empress of the Seas is no longer an RCI ship. I was only making a comment about RCI in general that all of their ships do not have small cabins and match up well with others in the industry. Carnival and the rest no longer have the size advantage. I also gave you sizes of a typical Carnival and RCI ship. The size I quoted on a standard balcony for HAL is also for a Vista class ship which is what HAL is building today. I know how big they are as I saw them myself. Not any larger than the other lines.

[momofmeg]

Did not forget as I mentioned in my post that the Vision class along with the Sovereign class had smaller cabins. That covers the Enchantment and and Granduer. Empress of the Seas is no longer an RCI ship. I was only making a comment about RCI in general that all of their ships do not have small cabins and match up well with others in the industry. Carnival and the rest no longer have the size advantage.

 

I looked it up. Our Statendam oceanview/ picture windowstateroom was 197 square feet and our Disney veranda was 268 square feet plus the veranda.

 

Our westerdam room will be 194 square feet plus veranda.

[NCTribeFan]

I loved our Empress cruise (she's gone now, right?), but, man, was that inside cabin tiny. I mean, miniscule!

 

As I continue to state, I'm not about the ship experience, but it is nice to be able to turn around in your stateroom without hitting something!

 

I know a lot of people feel they HAVE to have a balcony. I loved our extended balcony on Miracle, but, for me, I'll just go with inside cabins and use that price difference on my excursions, on-board expenses, and getting to and from the port.

 

If I were independently wealthy and price was no issue, I probably wouldn't be cruising at all. I'd fly in my private jet to my villa in the South of France where I'd have my private yacht on the Mediterranean! :p

[Sandi149]

I loved our Empress cruise (she's gone now, right?), but, man, was that inside cabin tiny. I mean, miniscule!

 

As I continue to state, I'm not about the ship experience, but it is nice to be able to turn around in your stateroom without hitting something!

 

I know a lot of people feel they HAVE to have a balcony. I loved our extended balcony on Miracle, but, for me, I'll just go with inside cabins and use that price difference on my excursions, on-board expenses, and getting to and from the port.

 

If I were independently wealthy and price was no issue, I probably wouldn't be cruising at all. I'd fly in my private jet to my villa in the South of France where I'd have my private yacht on the Mediterranean! :p

 

I think we all would do that. :D:D

[cruisemamma99]

I believe Carnival is trying to get away from their party ship image. We've only done another line (RC) and liked the Carnival a little bit better though they're pretty much in the same category. Carnival at least has or is getting rid of their topless decks which imo was a wise decision, since that kinda gives the impression of low rent. As I've said before you can go on most lines and have a great cruise, but it always pays to do the research first.

[cathyz]

I believe Carnival is trying to get away from their party ship image. We've only done another line (RC) and liked the Carnival a little bit better though they're pretty much in the same category. Carnival at least has or is getting rid of their topless decks which imo was a wise decision, since that kinda gives the impression of low rent. As I've said before you can go on most lines and have a great cruise, but it always pays to do the research first.

I'm not sure topless is low-rent, since that is the mode in all the very high-end resorts in Europe.

 

And to the OP, I sure don't mind the Carnival haters since it leaves much more opportunity for us Carnival lovers and also keeps the grouchy people off the fun ships! I don't have much non-Carnival experience, but many friends who have been on other lines also usually like Carnival better, there's something alway going on and the atmosphere is much more energetic and lively and there's something to do after 10:00 p.m.!

 

We also had a conversation with a crew member from Canada who had been on several Carnival ships and said the port made a huge difference. He is on the Elation now from San Diego and said it was like a completely different cruise line than the previous east coast and Florida ships he had been on and was going to try to stay on west coast ships because the people were so much nicer and more laid back and looked like they wanted to have more fun! I thought it was an interesting conversation.

[firefly333]

Why can we not get any ships on a full time basis except Carnival, from Galveston?

 

So... Im sure you have tried Conquest? I see so many turning it down who never been on it, just think its a party ship.

 

I was on Voyager last week and one gal said she is going back to Carnival lol, she thought it was RCL's or Voyager's fault she got seasick. She also said Carnival has a lot more activities, she was bored on Voyager many times.

 

Each to his own. Im glad Carnival is still there. Im still hoping Princess comes to Houston now that that port is almost finished.

[firefly333]

 

Outside cabins

 

Carnival Liberty 5A porthole outside stateroom = 185 square feet (incorrect)

Freedom OTS - outside stateroom = 161 square feet.

Carnival Liberty 6A - standard outside stateroom = 185 square feet (incorrect)

Freedom OTS - Large outside stateroom = 200 square feet

Freedom OTS - Family outside staterooom = 290 square feet.

 

This is very slanted if folks dont know their ships, they might be fooled.

 

Conquest class ships the OVs are 220 s.f. and a few are bigger like the 6Bs in the aft and 6Es.

 

I was just on the Voyager and the OV was 180 s.f.

 

You give some superior OV on RCL line newest ships to compare to incorrect size on Liberty....biased or just a mistake??

 

Ocean view Stateroom

Twin beds that convert to a king, TV.

(All cabins Cat. 6B facing forward have partially obstructed view) Ample drawer and closet space, private facilities (shower, basin and toilet), telephone, color TV, and sitting area with sofa.

Average size: 220 square feet

On Decks: Empress, Riviera, Upper, Spa, Main, Panorama.

 

PS why are you mentioning only 5A cabins as OVs when the standard OV on Carnival is a 6A, not a 5a.

 

I was on Voyager last week and my OV was 180 s.f...much smaller than on Conquest where it is 220 s.f.

I was on the SOV and the inside cabins are 119 s.f. and the outside are 121 s.f.

Yes sure if you pay to upgrade to a deluxe OV its larger, but comparing a deluxe size to a regular OV and then claiming it is 185 when in fact its 220 s.f. seems like folks here are really squirming to prove RCL doesnt have a lot of very small cabins on some ships.

[momofmeg]

So... Im sure you have tried Conquest? I see so many turning it down who never been on it, just think its a party ship.

 

I was on Voyager last week and one gal said she is going back to Carnival lol, she thought it was RCL's or Voyager's fault she got seasick. She also said Carnival has a lot more activities, she was bored on Voyager many times.

 

Each to his own. Im glad Carnival is still there. Im still hoping Princess comes to Houston now that that port is almost finished.

 

Her only Carnival crusie was on the conquest. She never said what she disliked about it-although I asked and so did others.

 

I would not cruise a conquest class because it holds a third more PAX then the spirit class-yet the same amount of pools and lounges. It has to be very congested.

 

My dislike was the voyager class was that very reason, the pool area was not big enough and that Royal Promanade was WAY too congested in the evening.

 

There seeme t o be plenty going on on my crusie though-so that was not a problem. As far as seasickness, I only have sea sickness problems on the small older ships or when I am in the middle of the Atlantic with 30 foot waves. A voyager class ship is so huge, there should be less sea sickness problems. I wonder if the gal had a bug, especially if she does not get sea sick on a Carnival ship.

[Cruising89143]

This is very slanted if folks dont know their ships, they might be fooled.

 

Conquest class ships the OVs are 220 s.f. and a few are bigger like the 6Bs in the aft and 6Es.

 

I was just on the Voyager and the OV was 180 s.f.

 

You give some superior OV on RCL line newest ships to compare to incorrect size on Liberty....biased or just a mistake??

 

Yes sure if you pay to upgrade to a deluxe OV its larger, but comparing a deluxe size to a regular OV and then claiming it is 185 when in fact its 220 s.f. seems like folks here are really squirming to prove RCL doesnt have a lot of very small cabins on some ships.

I was on the SOV and the inside cabins are 119 s.f. and the outside are 121 s.f.

 

PS why are you mentioning only 5A cabins as OVs when the standard OV on Carnival is a 6A, not a 5a.

 

I was on Voyager last week and my OV was 180 s.f...much smaller than on Conquest where it is 220 s.f.

 

I'm giving the different sizes and the sizes came from the cruise line websites. If they are wrong here then they are wrong on the cruise line websites. Nothing slanted about it. Do your homework if you don't know a ship. Very simple idea isn't it. Also I mentioned a 5A as IT IS an ocean view cabin. I gave the cabin sizes by name. RCI offers more cabin choices than that of Carnival. Anyway that you put it, Carnival no longer has the advantage that they once had with cabin sizes with the exception of interior cabins. I clearly pointed out that the Sovereign and Vision class had smaller cabins. I used a new ship from RCI and also a new ship from Carnival as the example. When you add up the Radiance, Voyager and Freedom class, you have about 60% of the berths available right now that match up with the competition.

[NCTribeFan]

Conquest class space ratio is 37:1

Spirit class space ratio is 41:1

 

Of course, it depends on how many people are actually booked into the cabins that hold more then 2.

 

I just hope I won't hate Glory because of the size and the number of passengers. I'm claustrophobic - not in my inside cabin (where I can exit it whenever I want) but I have had panic attacks when stuck in the middle of a non-moving crowd of people!

[firefly333]

I'm giving the different sizes and the sizes came from the cruise line websites. If they are wrong here then they are wrong on the cruise line websites. Nothing slanted about it. Do your homework if you don't know a ship. Very simple idea isn't it. Also I mentioned a 5A as IT IS an ocean view cabin. I gave the cabin sizes by name. RCI offers more cabin choices than that of Carnival. Anyway that you put it, Carnival no longer has the advantage that they once had with cabin sizes with the exception of interior cabins. I clearly pointed out that the Sovereign and Vision class had smaller cabins. I used a new ship from RCI and also a new ship from Carnival as the example. When you add up the Radiance, Voyager and Freedom class, you have about 60% of the berths available right now that match up with the competition.

 

Ahh, that WAS a copy and paste to prove to you the sizes you posted for that size for OV were wrong. sorry, if you cant admit to being wrong.

 

Here is a link to the copy and paste...one of many I could provide.

 

http://www.cruisedeckplans.com/DP/Carnival/Liberty.php

 

Before you tell me to do my homework, you might have been smarter to check your own figures, maybe you made a typo and meant another ship?

 

I would not have posted that you were incorrect about the OV size on Liberty if I was not sure of my facts. Just to prove to you I was correct however, I had posted a copy and paste to show the size was 220 s.f.

 

btw, just for your information ALL THE OV'S ON CONQUEST CLASS ARE 220 S.F. OR LARGER. I have one booked is why I knew the OV s.f. you posted was incorrect.

[cruiselover57]

Hello fellow cruisers,

 

I'm coming up on cruise #69 this summer on yep, you guessed it - a Carnival cruise and on the Freedom! It got excellent reviews; plus, I talked to a restaurant critic on my last cruise which was on Celebrity last December and he said the food/service/entertainment were fantastic! As someone else mentioned, a cruise is what YOU make of it! I've seen the drunks/rude people on other cruise lines as well so it's not just Carnival that has that type of reputation. In fact, they're the largest cruise line in the world - they must be doing something right. Try out other lines and compare. My mom swore off Princess years ago because of a dining reservation they messed up with 24 of our family members but eventually we talked her into Princess once again and everything was fine. If you have a legitimate complaint WHILE you're on the ship, make yourself heard - they will listen and do the best they can do resolve the issue.

 

Just enjoy and have a great time!

 

Laurie

[Cruising89143]

Ahh, that WAS a copy and paste to prove to you the sizes you posted for that size for OV were wrong. sorry, if you cant admit to being wrong.

 

Here is a link to the copy and paste...one of many I could provide.

 

http://www.cruisedeckplans.com/DP/Carnival/Liberty.php

 

Before you tell me to do my homework, you might have been smarter to check your own figures, maybe you made a typo and meant another ship?

 

I would not have posted that you were incorrect about the OV size on Liberty if I was not sure of my facts. Just to prove to you I was correct however, I had posted a copy and paste to show the size was 220 s.f.

 

btw, just for your information ALL THE OV'S ON CONQUEST CLASS ARE 220 S.F. OR LARGER. I have one booked is why I knew the OV s.f. you posted was incorrect.

 

I guess we all make mistakes. I told you that those were a copy and paste from the cruise lines and if they were wrong then the websites were incorrect. I seem to remember your mistakes or more like gossip on the Carnival board more times that I can count. Like RCI removed lobster from the menu which wasn't true. That they removed live entertainment from the lounges which wasn't true since they replaced the dueling pianos in the Latin bar Boleros with a Latin band. See I guess there are several of us that can't get our facts straight.:rolleyes:

[Cruising89143]

Conquest class space ratio is 37:1

Spirit class space ratio is 41:1

 

Of course, it depends on how many people are actually booked into the cabins that hold more then 2.

 

I just hope I won't hate Glory because of the size and the number of passengers. I'm claustrophobic - not in my inside cabin (where I can exit it whenever I want) but I have had panic attacks when stuck in the middle of a non-moving crowd of people!

 

The Conquest class ships are nothing like the Spirit class in design which IMHO is not a good thing. I call them cattle boats as that is exactly what they are. They are the most cramped ships that I have ever cruised. The promenade and pool area was horrible. On formal night on the Glory when they had all of those photo stations set up, you could not move and to top it off the smoke was so thick you could not cut it with a knife. I have cruised a lot of ships and you will see more complaints about this class ship than any other due to the chopped up design of not being able to get from front to back without going up and down several decks. You may like it but those ships are not for me. They are huge money makers for Carnival and that's why they continue to build them.

[caviargal]

I don't agree that a cruise is what you make it. The basic components have to be there and those are different for all of us.

 

I don't like Carnival, though not because it is a party ship. I have found RCI to be just as active on some sailings in terms of nightlife, pool site and activities.

 

I like my ships elegant, smaller, traditional and formal and Carnival is none of those things. In three sailings with them (1990, 1996, 2005) I have always felt like a fish out of water. I have zero interest in ever getting on one of those ships again.

[Cruising89143]

I don't agree that a cruise is what you make it. The basic components have to be there and those are different for all of us.

 

 

I agree. I laugh at those comments that it's "our" job to make a cruise great. Like the cruise line has no responsibility for giving me as a paying guest what we deserve.

[firefly333]

I guess we all make mistakes. I told you that those were a copy and paste from the cruise lines and if they were wrong then the websites were incorrect. I seem to remember your mistakes or more like gossip on the Carnival board more times that I can count. Like RCI removed lobster from the menu which wasn't true. That they removed live entertainment from the lounges which wasn't true since they replaced the dueling pianos in the Latin bar Boleros with a Latin band. See I guess there are several of us that can't get our facts straight.:rolleyes:

 

Iv been on more RCL cruises than Carnival cruises...and imo they removed SOME live music. I never said ALL live music. SOME has been removed. You want to mince words and correct me...then read what I said...which was true.

 

I hear it is also true that lobster was removed from cruises on RCL less than 7 days, so it has been removed from some cruises...

 

Get your facts right....what I said is true.

 

I was on RCL Voyager last week and the lobster was all time tiny and they served it with the smallest shimp ever. Last year they gave us 4 large shrimp with garlic and spices...that was cut down last week.

 

I loved Voyager and love cruising...but you can call it gossip if you want that I repeated a poster's comments from the RCL threads... you dont seem to want to deal with facts.

 

My OV on Voyager was 180 s.f. and Conquest will be 220 s.f. RCL does have smaller cabins on average, this is a fact. On the other hand what Iv found is RCL makes much better use of the space and puts in a lot of nice little storage in nooks and crannies so there is plenty of space. But the cabin is 40 s.f. smaller than a smilalar cabin on Carnival built the same year.

 

I am not saying RCL newer cabins are not just as nicer or nicer than Carnival's....why are you so defensive about stuff??? You seem to have it out for me in particular...I guess you cant stand being wrong about stuff.

 

I submitted my photos last night to that site deckplans and had them accepted for my cabin on voyager, all 3 photos, the site paid me on paypal within an hour.

 

Im not saying Im never wrong, but what I said is true, and I used the word SOME...never said ALL, please dont twist what I said. Dueling pianos is gone. some music is gone. I could care less if some band is now there.

[Cruising89143]

Iv been on more RCL cruises than Carnival cruises...and imo they removed SOME live music. I never said ALL live music. SOME has been removed. You want to mince words and correct me...then read what I said...which was true.

 

I hear it is also true that lobster was removed from cruises on RCL less than 7 days, so it has been removed from some cruises...

 

Get your facts right....what I said is true.

 

I was on RCL Voyager last week and the lobster was all time tiny and they served it with the smallest shimp ever. Last year they gave us 4 large shrimp with garlic and spices...that was cut down last week.

 

I loved Voyager and love cruising...but you can call it gossip if you want that I repeated a poster's comments from the RCL threads... you dont seem to want to deal with facts.

 

My OV on Voyager was 180 s.f. and Conquest will be 220 s.f. RCL does have smaller cabins on average, this is a fact. On the other hand what Iv found is RCL makes much better use of the space and puts in a lot of nice little storage in nooks and crannies so there is plenty of space. But the cabin is 40 s.f. smaller than a smilalar cabin on Carnival built the same year.

 

I am not saying RCL newer cabins are not just as nicer or nicer than Carnival's....why are you so defensive about stuff??? You seem to have it out for me in particular...I guess you cant stand being wrong about stuff.

 

I submitted my photos last night to that site deckplans and had them accepted for my cabin on voyager, all 3 photos, the site paid me on paypal within an hour.

 

Im not saying Im never wrong, but what I said is true, and I used the word SOME...never said ALL, please dont twist what I said. Dueling pianos is gone. some music is gone. I could care less if some band is now there.

 

RCI has not served lobster on the short cruises in years. I told you that before and yet you kept reporting different. I know what you have posted. And yes dueling pianos is gone but they also replaced music in the same lounge with a live band. Now who would have thought that a lounge named Boleros would have a Latin band. Makes sense doesn't it? So in the end they did not lose anything did they? Adios, I have played with you long enough. :rolleyes:

[firefly333]

RCI has not served lobster on the short cruises in years. I told you that before and yet you kept reporting different. I know what you have posted. And yes dueling pianos is gone but they also replaced music in the same lounge with a live band. Now who would have thought that a lounge named Boleros would have a Latin band. Makes sense doesn't it? So in the end they did not lose anything did they? Adios, I have played with you long enough. :rolleyes:

 

Some of us liked dueling pianos..."some" music is gone. Why are you so defensive. My last 4 cruises, all within the last 12 months have all been on RCL. Im not a Carnival lover as some are. I like any cruise.

 

The only reason Im booking Carnival now to be honest is because RCL doesnt have a year round ship out of Galveston and Voyager isnt going out of Texas as long as I want to cruise.

 

The OP asked about Galveston and you are pulling RCL ships out of some other port to compare to try and show RCL ships do have some cabins almost as big as Carnival's. Who cares, RCL uses the space wonderfully.