Alitalia

[Sea Island Lady]

re-cruiserWe booked our flights in August for our Med cruise through Delta- who also is a partner with Alitalia. My daughter and grandson were called the other day and informed their return flight has been cancelled- so now we are waiting to see how they are getting home. My husband and I are returning a day later- and our flight is ok (at this point!)

Fran

 

Fran - When are you flying? Are the cancelled flights with Delta or Alitalia? I had a hard time deciphering your post. ;)

 

We (family of 4) had flights on Alitalia for $467 RT from Newark to Barcelona via Milan in late June.

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We are flying non-stop, hence the higher fare. Interestingly, my flight just went down about $300! :( This surprised me, because the fare has remained constant or higher than what we paid...until now. With the gas crises, I didn't expect it to change. The flight is also being close to being full.

 

I always book directly through the airline, when I see the same fare listed as that of discount sites. In case of a problem, it's just easier to handle things directly with the airline.

[Fran&Tom]

Fran - When are you flying? Are the cancelled flights with Delta or Alitalia? I had a hard time deciphering your post. ;)

 

 

We are on a combination between Delta and Alitalia. We are leaving June 22 & 25 (my husband and I are going a few days before DD and DGS) and return July 13/14. Her flights that were cancelled are a Milan to JFK. Right now they are stuck in Rome. WE booked our flights at 330 days out- the earliest you can book flights. Last week we paid our cruise balance- so now think we are in the losing some $ on the cruise if we have to cancel. Of course now we also have to worry about the flights going over- we are all on Alitalia- I fortunately had a Delta return!

Fran

[Globaliser]

We are flying non-stop, hence the higher fare. Interestingly, my flight just went down about $300! :( This surprised me, because the fare has remained constant or higher than what we paid...until now. With the gas crises, I didn't expect it to change. The flight is also being close to being full.

How do you know that the flight is close to full?

 

One likely reason for the drop in price is the dying swan effect which I mentioned in this post above.

 

Unless your information that the flight is close to full is from a reliable source, I wonder whether we may be seeing the first tangible effects of people no longer booking Alitalia, and maybe cancelling reservations already made. Lower demand for their flights --> lower prices - the first law of economics.

[seapenarth]

I also have Alitalia tickets. They're for May 5, from where we get off the ship in Barcelona to Rome. I've also been keeping an eye on it. There isn't anything I can do about it. Even though I bought them from Alitalia , the tickets are non-refundable, they are also the least expensive so I doubt if another airline will accept them. And I will be on the high seas for two weeks before so I won't really know what's going on.

 

I have only a couple of things to make me feel better. Use it as you wish. First, my DH spoke to a co-worker who travels to Europe all the time and I mean she is on the road more than she is in the office. She said that this is actually common and so far nothing ever happened. And second, they are having an election is a couple of weeks where Barllesconi (sp?) is probably going to win and he is adamant that Alitalia will not be sold so he will probably keep the airline going even if it is losing money. That's what the union is hoping, that's why they're playing hardball. So, since there is not much else I can do, I am keeping a good thought.

 

And if it helps, I tend to have feelings about things (don't laugh, it's happened lots of times before) and I do not get a bad feeling about this. And also my husband tends to be lucky with travel and since he's also going, things should be okay.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Your DH ( whatever that means ) is wrong. EU laws will not let countries bail out airlines. Like most Southern European airlines Spanish, French, and Greece Alitalia are in a financial mess . BA has problems but they are different ones and once on the planes you get proper service.

[dutchclogs]

Hi, I am following this thread with interest. We (family of four) also have a booking to fly with Alitalia, in our case London Heathrow--Rome return 27 July-3 August. This being our first ever cruise, we followed our TA advice that for a Rome embarkation we should take the RCI air package even though this was more expensive than if we had booked independently, as it afforded more security than using a budget airline(!) My instinct is that Alitalia will continue to operate in some form or another, but I am curious how RCI would handle any disruption

[Sea Island Lady]

Hi, I am following this thread with interest. We (family of four) also have a booking to fly with Alitalia, in our case London Heathrow--Rome return 27 July-3 August. This being our first ever cruise, we followed our TA advice that for a Rome embarkation we should take the RCI air package even though this was more expensive than if we had booked independently, as it afforded more security than using a budget airline(!) My instinct is that Alitalia will continue to operate in some form or another, but I am curious how RCI would handle any disruption

There is a poster on this board that says you should never book air through the cruiseline. Perhaps he will pop in a answer your questions. You may be able to cancel your package with RCCL and still book flights on-your-own, but I would stick to a more reputable airline (if there is such a thing) and try to keep to connections down to 1.

 

We are on a combination between Delta and Alitalia. We are leaving June 22 & 25 (my husband and I are going a few days before DD and DGS) and return July 13/14. Her flights that were cancelled are a Milan to JFK. Right now they are stuck in Rome. WE booked our flights at 330 days out- the earliest you can book flights. Last week we paid our cruise balance- so now think we are in the losing some $ on the cruise if we have to cancel. Of course now we also have to worry about the flights going over- we are all on Alitalia- I fortunately had a Delta return!

Fran

Thank you Fran. I understand now. ;) Our flights are in early June. Both segments are on Delta.

 

I hope something can be worked out for your family. Did you buy travel insurance? We bought independent insurance for cruise and flight.

 

How do you know that the flight is close to full?

 

Globaliser, although not a reliable source, I check the seating charts ever few days and the availability is slowly dwindling. It remained steady for awhile, and then the price started moving down, so more seats were taken.

[Globaliser]

... although not a reliable source, I check the seating charts ever few days and the availability is slowly dwindling.

OK - while that might show that a few more seats are being sold, it won't be a good basis for concluding that the flight is anything like close to full. You need to know a lot more about Alitalia's pre-allocation practices to reach such a conclusion. One airline I regularly use has a pre-allocation policy of 35% of the economy cabin. So when the seat map looks like it's full, that means that only 35% of the seats have been allocated. And theoretically, that means that only 35% of the seats have been sold. Quite a big difference from "full".

 

There is, of course, an entirely separate question of what is meant by "full". It could mean that the airline has taken as many reservations as it is prepared to take for that flight at that time. Or it could mean that the airline has taken as many reservations for the flight as there are seats on the aircraft - often a much smaller number.

[49er]

Not flying Alitalia but for those that are (or hope to).......

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080406/bs_nm/alitalia_dc_1

 

49er

[Globaliser]

Is there an Italian word for "arrogance"? :rolleyes:

[Sea Island Lady]

You need to know a lot more about Alitalia's pre-allocation practices to reach such a conclusion.

 

I'm not flying Alitalia's, but thanks for the information. :rolleyes:

[slomotion]

Is there an Italian word for "arrogance"? :rolleyes:

 

Yes, it is Silvio Berlusconi,

 

One of many articles on him and his "plan"

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB120639473091460651.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

[Globaliser]

I'm not flying Alitalia's

Sorry, I misunderstood your posting.

 

The advice is still the same, though, as all airlines work like this to some extent. But at least you're not sitting there wondering whether you're looking at signs of the airline's imminent demise, which must be a consolation!

[Globaliser]

One of many articles on him and his "plan"

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB120639473091460651.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

I liked this paragraph:-

Trade-union leaders also are threatening to scuttle the Alitalia deal unless Air France-KLM essentially gives up its right to restructure the airline back to health. These same unions helped to create Alitalia's misfortunes with their numerous strikes and repeated rejection of corporate restructuring. They'd do well to recall the fate of former Belgian flag carrier Sabena, whose workers refused concession after concession -- until the company finally went out of business. The Italian unions would have a much more difficult time taking a hard line if they weren't getting political cover from Mr. Berlusconi.

Two weeks on from that article, and after AF-KL has withdrawn from the negotiations because of the intransigence of the unions, the very same unions continue to say "please come back to the negotiating table, where we will again tell you that we want you to buy the company so long as you give up your right to restructure the company back to health".

[Clairescurtains]

We booked Alitalia for Sept 6 to Rome returning 9/21 partnered with Delta. We do have trip insurance so feel pretty sure we will be OK but it seems to me that since the reservations were made through Delta that they should get us there somehow. Am I being too nieve?

Sheila, are you sailing on the CCL Freedom 9/7?

[Globaliser]

... but it seems to me that since the reservations were made through Delta that they should get us there somehow.

One thing to do is to see whether you have e-ticket numbers. You're looking for a 13-digit all-numeric number, starting with either 055 or 006. There should be one number for each passenger. This is not the same as the five or six character booking reference that you use to retrieve your booking from websites.

 

If your ticket number starts 006, then you should probably be fine as your ticket was issued by (or on behalf of) Delta and your contract is with Delta. So if Alitalia ceases to operate, then Delta ought to be obliged to get you to your destination somehow, if that's what you wish to do. But that doesn't remove the possibility that if Alitalia stops operating just before your trip, it may simply not be possible for Delta to get you space on the day(s) that you originally wanted to fly, so there is some residual risk.

 

But if your ticket number starts 055, it was issued by (or on behalf of) Alitalia, and your contract is with Alitalia. If so, then I think that legally you're fundamentally in much the same position as if you'd bought the ticket directly from Alitalia. That would make it more difficult if Alitalia went under; you might only be entitled to a refund.

 

However, the first thing at least is to look, so that you know where you stand on that.

[Globaliser]

There's a very funny article in The Independent today.

 

Funny, that is, if you're tickled by things that would in normal circumstances make you bury your face in your hands and weep.

[marci22]

I liked the 'exorcist' comment.

[ennjay]

I booked short-haul inter-Europe tickets (Paris-Venice, Rome-Paris) for this summer on Alitalia, but both flights are operated by Air France. If Alitalia goes under, am I completely screwed? My flights, theoretically, would still be flying since they're on Air France planes/crew (I think!)... is it likely I could convince Air France to honor the reservation??

[shop516]

I hope this helps, But i just heard that air france was going to take over ALITALIA. SO you guys would probably be OK. I would try to google it and find out whats going on.

GOOD LUCK!;)

[Globaliser]

But i just heard that air france was going to take over ALITALIA.

You might want to read this thread for the current position. We'll have to see whether Air France might be prepared to come back to the negotiating table at all, or if it has walked away permanently.

[Clairescurtains]

It looks like we have the 055 ones so we will just have to watch this unfold.:(

It is a blessing to me that we have some time and travel insurance. I feel really sorry for those that are flying [hopefully] soon because of the indecision.

Again hopefully, something will actually happen and resolve this problem.

[Fran&Tom]

If your ticket number starts 006, then you should probably be fine as your ticket was issued by (or on behalf of) Delta and your contract is with Delta.

 

Thanks for that info- my ticket does begin with 006. Mt return flights are on Delta- but would rather be going over on Delta and making sure we make the cruise.

Fran

[nomoredyess]

From Toronto to Rome and on the way back from Venice to Toronto. That's what got me, the price...but i guess nothing is free in life!

 

Yeah, my wife and I got round trip from JFK to FCO for $1,900 for the 2 of us. I knew it was too good to be true!! I fly in June, so please let me know once you get back from your trips!!

[nomoredyess]

That too bad. I love that airline. Even on short flights of less than 1 hour, they will serve you a glass of wine. They also distributed ice cream drumsticks and/ or biscotti with the wine and that was at 8 am!!!

 

This is one of the 1st posts I have read like this!!! Did you fly economy??

[shabal57]

I too have a flight on Alitalia at the end of May. It's the second leg of our journey, from Amsterdam to Rome. It was booked through KLM. From what I understand and everything I have read, Alitalia has had problems for years and years. Honestly, if I stress too much about this I won't be able to sleep for the next 6 weeks. Look at what's happening with good old American Airlines. Thousands of flights have been cancelled and left people to fend for themselves. I'm just going to keep my fingers crossed and hope there won't be a problem. I also think because the flight was booked through another airline, if something happens, they must get you on another flight.