???Piano Bar Question???

[CwuzCwazy]

Never said anything about how hard the entertainers work...I'll give you that....but, the top talent in this country does NOT work on the cruise ships. In fact, this is a starting point for many who MAY ultimately make it in the big world, but they are few in numbers. One very famous performer that I am aware of personally (and John Heald knows him very well) started out on the Carnival Ecstasy and is well known in Las Vegas and other circles these days. Curiously, his Bio mentions NOTHING about his stints on Cruise ships as an entertainer. Wonder why???? Although the entertainment on Cruise ships is very good, they are generally frowned on by others in their own industry. It's not just my opinion, but a universal one. (and by the way, Simon Cowell is usually right...can't argue with his success). So, take offense as you will, but you're not convincing anyone.

[pmang]

CwuzCwazyNever said anything about how hard the entertainers work...I'll give you that....but, the top talent in this country does NOT work on the cruise ships. In fact, this is a starting point for many who MAY ultimately make it in the big world, but they are few in numbers. One very famous performer that I am aware of personally (and John Heald knows him very well) started out on the Carnival Ecstasy and is well known in Las Vegas and other circles these days. Curiously, his Bio mentions NOTHING about his stints on Cruise ships as an entertainer. Wonder why???? Although the entertainment on Cruise ships is very good, they are generally frowned on by others in their own industry. It's not just my opinion, but a universal one. (and by the way, Simon Cowell is usually right...can't argue with his success). So, take offense as you will, but you're not convincing anyone.

 

How did this discussion turn into “Top Talent in this country”? Yes, Billy Joel is not in the piano bar, Charles Mingus doesn’t play in the jazz club, Nathan Lane isn’t performing in the show. How is that relevant? Do you consider only the top of any industry ones who have any measure of success? You didn’t answer my question about the doctor…. Would you put down his/her career path because he/she works on a ship? In my opinion, anyone who can make a solid living in an industry as volatile as the entertainment one is a success.

Funny you mentioned John Heald. I worked with him for 3 years. He’s being considered for a sitcom based on his blog….. He just works on a ship though…. Doesn’t have a REAL job….

BTW, you are right on one thing… Simon is usually right. But, he was against Jennifer Hudson. She won an Oscar…. Oh yeah…. also a production singer on a Disney ship. She’s not coming back because the pay isn’t enough…. That above all else is what’s generally frowned upon in the industry.

[BrittanyLee]

Does anyone know who will be the piano bar entertainer on Jan 3rd 2009??

 

Thanks!

[divetrash]

I was also on the October 11 Glory cruise, so these folks were not seeing things....it was exactly as described by the OP and others on this thread. I doubt he'll show up on this thread again now that he has been "called out". And for all his claims of his Vegas & NY shows etc......Dude! You work on a Cruise Ship!!!! Not exactly the pinnacle of the entertainment industry.

 

Folks need to write to Carnival about this guys lack of class and his annoying solicitaion of tips....get him canned so he can go back to Vegas & NY.....yeah, that's the ticket!

 

Never said anything about how hard the entertainers work...I'll give you that....but, the top talent in this country does NOT work on the cruise ships. In fact, this is a starting point for many who MAY ultimately make it in the big world, but they are few in numbers. One very famous performer that I am aware of personally (and John Heald knows him very well) started out on the Carnival Ecstasy and is well known in Las Vegas and other circles these days. Curiously, his Bio mentions NOTHING about his stints on Cruise ships as an entertainer. Wonder why???? Although the entertainment on Cruise ships is very good, they are generally frowned on by others in their own industry. It's not just my opinion, but a universal one. (and by the way, Simon Cowell is usually right...can't argue with his success). So, take offense as you will, but you're not convincing anyone.

 

Okay, I was going to stay out of this as my views on piano bars and piano entertainers have been posted many times. But these comments strike me as mean and ignorant.

 

There is room for precious few at the "top" of any industry. The entertainment industry in particular is a tough one to make a basic living in whether you are an actor, musician, writer, or even in the technical side of it. The mark of a successful entertainer is one who can actually make a living doing what they love or at least loving it enough to continue doing it until they make their living. These people have my utmost respect and deserve no less from others regardless of what "level" you think they are at. To demean their profession by your rather narrow standards of success is petty and wrong.

 

The piano bar world, whether it be on land or sea, is relatively small. Many of these entertainers do have gigs on land and don't just play on ships. Yes some are biding their time while they try and break through onto the music scene with their own stuff. Others play the piano bars because they enjoy it and are talented at it. Either way they are out there taking a chance and doing what they love AND making a living doing it. That deserves applause not derision.

 

Having said that, I've seen Mark play several times here in NYC at Sweet Caroline's which is a dueling piano bar in Times Square and I've had quite a lot of fun. He is very talented, kind of a musical savant in the range of what he plays. From what I gather he conducts his ship show much like he is performing at Sweet Caroline's. And for sure his show is not everyone's cup of tea. But there are many, many who do enjoy it, enough to plan a cruise based on when he will be on ships.

 

To the OP:

 

The piano bars on ships will vary as much as piano bars on land. The styles of the entertainers differ. Some rely more on a performance show, others work to make it an interactive show. Different strokes for different folks. As a frequenter of piano bars on both land and sea I have seen the tipping work from both extremes, from the ones with just a jar on the piano to the ones who pass the hat and make frequent announcements about it. But tipping the piano player is the norm in all, whether you are making a request or just enjoying their efforts.

 

I'm sorry you did not enjoy Mark's performance and found his style distasteful. I hope on future cruises you will give the piano bar another try and perhaps you will find an entertainer more up your alley. We do keep a list of who is where on one of the threads on this site (http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=362780) and you can always ask to find out what their style is like. But I always advise giving it a try first and decide for yourself.

 

 

Happy Cruising,

 

Laura

[momofzeke]

Does anyone know who will be the piano bar entertainer on Jan 3rd 2009??

 

Thanks!

 

On which ship?

[BigSamRocks]

Bravo, DiveTrash! Yes, I found this thread: http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?p=16884009#post16884009

 

You can read all you wanna about the piano bar entertainers, and DiveTrash seems to have a thorough list of which entertainers are on which ships.

 

Let's keep this thread focused on the original question of tipping.

 

And sorry Cruz, the stigma that cruiselines work is for second stringers no longer holds water. The industry is totally different now, and as Dive said, some entertainers choose to work on ships. Hmmm... let's see: work on land and deal with fickle club owners and a city full of competition, OR have a comfy gig on a ship, a guarenteed paycheck and a guarenteed audience, sail to exotic locations on the company's dime, free food and housing, hot women.... Hmmm... Real tough choice here.

 

I mentioned having sailed with Ron Pass, the piano man. After the cruise, I looked up his website (www.ronpass.com) and read his bio. He's a perfect example of someone motivated by his spirit and passion to do what he does. Working as an entertainer is not always about becoming a superstar.

[CwuzCwazy]

But these comments strike me as mean and ignorant.

 

 

Puhleeze! Nothing that you or the other poster wrote makes much sense. The average cruise ship entertainer is not even in the top 75% of their peer group. Get real....exceptions do exist now and then and people are discovered, but watch people's eyes roll (from their own industry) when you tell them you are a cruise ship entertainer. This doesn't mean they are not talented, this is a stereotype that their own industry has formed. This is NOT solely my opinion, but one from their own industry. Now that may be sad, but that's how they are perceived.

 

I witnessed a top comedy talent who has made it, (Bobby Collins), recently on a RCI ship. During his opening comments for his routine he commented, "I don't really do this Cruise Ship Crap anymore". He was perpetuating the stereotype...like it was beneath him. Sooooo., don't blame me, I'm just pointing out what the industry says about it...right or wrong.

 

So get over your indignation and open your narrow mind to reality.

[gibber3]

I guess I look at Mark's performances a little different than most. I am currently on the Glory and heard about how others liked him on this board in our Roll Call. I have been to the Piano Bar two nights so far, and I plan on going back. So far, there has been no shortage of requests with the tips attached, so I haven't seen any begging. We have had folks 'cancel' other requests out with higher tips, but I consider it part of the entertainment, really. I might feel a little different if it were my song getting cancelled, but, I have been entertained without putting any requests in (yet). I did buy Mark a drink the first night I was there (arrggh) and he asked me what song I wanted. I couldn't think I one I specifically wanted, so I gave my request to someone else, and he gladly played it.

 

I have enjoyed his shows and it hasn't bothered me how much otrhers have been throwing his way. I personally think he is a great entertainer.

 

If you don't like his brand of entertainment, I say don't go. Enough people like hime that he is staying quite busy this week.

 

Happy Cruising!

[divetrash]

The average cruise ship entertainer is not even in the top 75% of their peer group.

 

I'm curious where you get your statistics and authority from? And when you talk about the peer group do you mean musicians in general or piano bar entertainers alone? Do you work in the entertainment industry? Do you often talk to entertainers at the highest level of success and get their own personal views? Or are you relying solely on the professed views of comics who think that cruise ship jobs are beneath them (but take them so they can keep on making that living doing what they love) and try to get a laugh from perpetuating a stereotype (that yes, does sadly exist)?

 

All I was saying was that to belittle anyone who is making a living doing what they love just because they do not fit your view of what a success is uncalled for.

[sk8rpatty]

BigSam and Laura, I agree 100%!!

[MszKitty]

I guess I look at Mark's performances a little different than most. I am currently on the Glory and heard about how others liked him on this board in our Roll Call. I have been to the Piano Bar two nights so far, and I plan on going back. So far, there has been no shortage of requests with the tips attached, so I haven't seen any begging. We have had folks 'cancel' other requests out with higher tips, but I consider it part of the entertainment, really. I might feel a little different if it were my song getting cancelled, but, I have been entertained without putting any requests in (yet). I did buy Mark a drink the first night I was there (arrggh) and he asked me what song I wanted. I couldn't think I one I specifically wanted, so I gave my request to someone else, and he gladly played it.

 

I have enjoyed his shows and it hasn't bothered me how much otrhers have been throwing his way. I personally think he is a great entertainer.

 

If you don't like his brand of entertainment, I say don't go. Enough people like hime that he is staying quite busy this week.

 

Happy Cruising!

 

My 2 cents...

 

I don't have an issue with tipping to have my requested song played. But if he accepts someone's higher tip to NOT play my song, then give me back the money I paid to hear it.

[BrittanyLee]

Momofzeke-

 

Sorry, the Glory, I see that Mark is done at the end of this month. I was on the Freedom last Jan. with Ron and loved that Piano bar so much!!!

[ioneblair]

Dear ASONGULOVE, I see that you may indeed be on my sailing at the end of this month (maybe, not sure of your cutoff). I am concerned (but not overly since this will not be a cruise-breaker LOL). I was looking forward to enjoying the piano bar this cruise for some adult time and entertainment. This cruise is a hard-work paid for vacation with family. I spend so much time with kids, grandkids and work. It's far and few in between that I get to enjoy live music (the kind I was looking forward to hearing in the piano bar) with people that appreciate it. I live with youth 22 and under and get to constantly hear music I really try to appreciate and understand and I do some of the time (the other times I live in toleration).

 

The only thing I would like you to address please with a clear and straightforward reply (no need for any type of attitude except genuine-ness because that's all I am bringing to this also) is......

 

Will I be able to enjoy complete songs without tipping solicitations interrupting them?

 

I assure you that tipping has never needed to be pulled from me in any blatant manner. Quite the opposite. I've been educated to tip from quite young and have only grown in it's appreciation as the years passed.

 

I have read this thread almost in it's entirety and feel that you have never quite hit the nail on this. I only ask as I am preparing what activities I would enjoy on the ship. I planned to use the piano bar as a getaway-from-the-kids-and-family treat. However if your performance is truly very frequently interspersed with copious requests for tips, so much so that not many songs are performed all the way through first.......then I will just find another venue to attend. No problem but honestly some dissapointment.

 

I appreciate the input of all that educated me on piano bars. Still I feel in this specific instance posted by the OP, the performances in discussion have not been truly addressed in the face of so many eye witnesses. Too many attitudes, and various side bars have muddied the waters of a clear address to this sailing (in the process I have enjoyed this thread, thanks OP for starting it).

 

So......Will I be able to enjoy the performance of complete songs without tipping solicitations constantly interrupting them (during the time Carnival is paying your base salary)?

No offense intended, just planning my cruise. :) (and because I'm just the type to just want a straight answer)

[Sandgnat]

Okay, I was going to stay out of this as my views on piano bars and piano entertainers have been posted many times. But these comments strike me as mean and ignorant.

 

There is room for precious few at the "top" of any industry. The entertainment industry in particular is a tough one to make a basic living in whether you are an actor, musician, writer, or even in the technical side of it. The mark of a successful entertainer is one who can actually make a living doing what they love or at least loving it enough to continue doing it until they make their living. These people have my utmost respect and deserve no less from others regardless of what "level" you think they are at. To demean their profession by your rather narrow standards of success is petty and wrong.

 

The piano bar world, whether it be on land or sea, is relatively small. Many of these entertainers do have gigs on land and don't just play on ships. Yes some are biding their time while they try and break through onto the music scene with their own stuff. Others play the piano bars because they enjoy it and are talented at it. Either way they are out there taking a chance and doing what they love AND making a living doing it. That deserves applause not derision.

 

Having said that, I've seen Mark play several times here in NYC at Sweet Caroline's which is a dueling piano bar in Times Square and I've had quite a lot of fun. He is very talented, kind of a musical savant in the range of what he plays. From what I gather he conducts his ship show much like he is performing at Sweet Caroline's. And for sure his show is not everyone's cup of tea. But there are many, many who do enjoy it, enough to plan a cruise based on when he will be on ships.

 

To the OP:

 

The piano bars on ships will vary as much as piano bars on land. The styles of the entertainers differ. Some rely more on a performance show, others work to make it an interactive show. Different strokes for different folks. As a frequenter of piano bars on both land and sea I have seen the tipping work from both extremes, from the ones with just a jar on the piano to the ones who pass the hat and make frequent announcements about it. But tipping the piano player is the norm in all, whether you are making a request or just enjoying their efforts.

 

I'm sorry you did not enjoy Mark's performance and found his style distasteful. I hope on future cruises you will give the piano bar another try and perhaps you will find an entertainer more up your alley. We do keep a list of who is where on one of the threads on this site (http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=362780) and you can always ask to find out what their style is like. But I always advise giving it a try first and decide for yourself.

 

 

Happy Cruising,

 

Laura

I have been to many piano bars on land, and have tried them all on the 18 Carnival cruises I have taken. I love them. Some are so smoky I can't handle it. Some don't have a performer or audience that makes it special. What we saw on the Glory was out of line with the constant "demand" for a tip. He talked about it between almost every song and a few times in the middle of songs. The whole thing became offensive. I just returned from the Destiny and never once did Damian speak of tips. I would bet he made a lot more on the 4 day cruise than Mark did on the 7 day cruise I was on. It was not that the performace was distasteful but the constant demand for tips. I hope he really thinks about this and maybe try a few cruises without "demanding" tips and see what happens. What we heard was good but the constant stopping and talking about tips is what we remember the most.

[Sandgnat]

My 2 cents...

 

I don't have an issue with tipping to have my requested song played. But if he accepts someone's higher tip to NOT play my song, then give me back the money I paid to hear it.

He is very blatant about this and you will not hear it if some one wants to "pay" him not to. I would never pay to not have your song played even if it was one I don't like. Why? Because you asked for it and I can stand to listen to any song, once and you should enjoy your cruise too. I will admit I don't normally "tip" the piano player the first night because I normally don't carry cash with me on a cruise. If I have frequented the piano bar I will bring a decent tip near the end of the cruise to tip them for my enjoyment. I do order drinks for them though earlier in the cruise.

[ASONGULOVE]

here it is, from the horses mouth -

 

despite the posts below, songs are played ALL THE WAY THROUGH by me unless another audience member stops them, just like at any rock n roll piano bar.

On average, this happens 1-3 times in a 4 hour show.

 

all requests get played, even if i have to stay til 3am to play them all.

[Wennfred]

 

I witnessed a top comedy talent who has made it, (Bobby Collins), recently on a RCI ship. During his opening comments for his routine he commented, "I don't really do this Cruise Ship Crap anymore". He was perpetuating the stereotype...like it was beneath him. Sooooo., don't blame me, I'm just pointing out what the industry says about it...right or wrong.

 

Great Post CwuzCwazy,

 

I too saw a great comedian onboard a Carnival Fun Ship way back before he was ever known. His name is George Lopez... I remember him very well because of a stupid tasteless joke he said on that ship.

 

As far as tipping at the Piano Bar, I have seen the Tipping Jar but I could never stay there long enough to enjoy my time there due to the smoke. Hopefully I will be able to enjoy a smoke free piano bar environment onboard Splendor in April. Will I tip? if that piano man is good then yes.

 

 

Fred

[MszKitty]

here it is, from the horses mouth -

 

despite the posts below, songs are played ALL THE WAY THROUGH by me unless another audience member stops them, just like at any rock n roll piano bar.

On average, this happens 1-3 times in a 4 hour show.

 

all requests get played, even if i have to stay til 3am to play them all.

 

...."songs are played ALL THE WAY THROUGH by me unless another audience member stops them"

 

Isn't that contradictive?

 

In other words, when an audience member pays to stop a song, then its NOT played all the way through. That's exactly what I find unfair. As a matter of fact, in July '06, on the Pride that happened several times on the first night (not just to me, but to other audience members). Never went back into the piano bar the rest of the week. (I have no idea who the piano player was...but he was very full of himself.)

[ioneblair]

Thank you ASONGULOVE for responding to my question. I think I will venture into the piano bar on my cruise and I am looking forward to enjoying the entertainment.....hoping it will be my cup of tea and of course I will show my appreciation.

 

Happy Crusing all :)

[LHP]

We saw Jeff Dunham on a Carnival cruise (stand up comedian) and he was a hoot. Loved him. Now we watch his Comedy Central shows every time they come on.

[Sandgnat]

here it is, from the horses mouth -

 

despite the posts below, songs are played ALL THE WAY THROUGH by me unless another audience member stops them, just like at any rock n roll piano bar.

On average, this happens 1-3 times in a 4 hour show.

 

all requests get played, even if i have to stay til 3am to play them all.

Mark you are speaking out both sides of your mouth on this thread. You stopped several times in the middle of songs to make your pitch. You DID make sure to tell us it had to be $5.00. You did crumple up a "suggestion" and never looked at what it said while you threw it on the floor. You said "suggestions" were written on the slips of paper that did not have the "mandatory" $5.00 wrapped around it. I hope you take this criticism and try not talking about tipping over and over and see what happens. It truely is a turn off and so unbecoming. I do think you have talent but I don't care to come to your piano bar again if you continue to "demand" tips.

[Socref124]

 

 

My SIL is a SGT in the USMC. The picture in my signature is of my granddaughter Rylynn. She is a treasure! :o)

 

Semper Fi!

 

Sweet. I was a Sgt in the Corps back in the day...LOL

[pe4all]

We have been fortunate to visit piano bars in many places, and also on Disney and Carnival ships. (we have also been to Sweet Caroline's in NYC a few times) I must say - I have found all the entertainers in the bars pretty much do the same thing -- your song can be "outbid" and stopped by some green wrapped around another song slip. Truthfully, I think it is part of the "show", and we always get a laugh when a song is outbid. There are plenty of other entertainment venues on the cruise ships. If something annoys me, I will remove myself from that situation - not sit and suffer thru it. We have never heard a piano bar person "demand" a tip - but we do tip for good service/entertainment wherever we go. We will continue to frequent the piano bars on board - as long as they are not too smoky, like the Freedom was in April. (but that is for another thread!!) If you cruise again, try again. Hopefully your next experience will be better for you. Or maybe piano bars just aren't up your alley!

[Sandgnat]

There are plenty of other entertainment venues on the cruise ships. If something annoys me, I will remove myself from that situation - not sit and suffer thru it. We have never heard a piano bar person "demand" a tip - but we do tip for good service/entertainment wherever we go. If you cruise again, try again. Hopefully your next experience will be better for you. Or maybe piano bars just aren't up your alley!

We went to other venues because the piano bar was not entertaining due to his constant "Demand" for tips. I am glad you have never encountered this, I had never either until we saw Mark. I have cruised again since my Oct. 11th cruise on the Glory. I just returned from the Destiny where we spent every night (except the night we were in Cozumel:o). Many of the group I was with did enjoy him every night and are enjoying Damian tonight because they did a B2B. Piano bars are up my alley. I have enjoyed many on the 18 cruise I have done with Carnival. I will enjoy many more and hope that if Mark is ever on one of my cruises he has stopped this very annoying, obtusive behavior. It should be addressed by Carnival as I don't believe it stands up to their standard of operation.

[pe4all]

I am sorry - I didn't notice all the other cruises you were on. Yes, you are experienced with piano bars. It is unfortunate you had a bad time with Mark. We enjoyed him at Sweet Caroline's the 2 times we saw him. We also had one bad experience (Destiny) at a CCL piano bar - the performer (no names to protect the guilty) just plain stank. the PB was empty each nite. We have been lucky enough to have Ron Pass 2x on Freedom- he was fantastic- just a great performer and person. I can see how soliciting tips can be annoying. Hoping your next cruises are better in the pb dept.