Letter to Diamond Members (Merged Threads)

[rednancy1]

Now THAT is funny.:D:D:D

 

Okay, OB,

 

DH and I want to sail with you. :)

[rednancy1]

Every night and all ships including the Sovereign Class ships and Vision class ships that don't have a CL. The text of emails from Adam Goldstein addressing both of these issues are contained in the threads on this board and both issues have been discussed in detail.:rolleyes:

 

Bill,

We had to cancel the Jewel TA last Sep due to health reasons. We are sorry we didn't get to meet you.

 

I agree with you about the new lounges. That is really a step in the right direction for RCI. We have 28 nights on the Monarch, 3 nights on the Sovereign and 14 nights on the Vision.....all without a CL. And.....NO Complaint.

 

RCI is a great cruise line.

 

:)

[rednancy1]

Just to set the record straight on a few things:

 

Peggy,

 

Applause for you!! :D:):):):)

[rednancy1]

Why should anyone care, or have an opinion, about anything in life that doesn't have a direct effect on him/her? Honestly, that statement of yours really just makes me shake my head is disbelief.:rolleyes:

 

I agree. Why would anyone stick their noses into anyones business?:confused:

 

That is beyond me. :)

 

The secret to life is to deal with your own happiness.

 

Feel free to be joyous. :

 

Yes, I would like to sail with you.

[Spender Nui]

Continental breakfast, dedicated area to socialize with other Diamonds, a concierge-like staff person manning the breakfast area to help with tickets, etc. Who knows, maybe they'll add soda in their beverages available in this area. They were always available in the CL.

 

Continental breakfast is much cheaper to provide than a full breakfast. That's turning a perk into a $ bottom line plus for RCCL.

[lady of the seas]

...and they'll still be inline with what we pay locally. Went out for dinner with the family on Saturday night. Nice restaurant, but nothing fancy. Martinis were $10, a glass of Ecco Domani Pinot Grigio was $7.50, Jack & Coke was $7.25 and a draught Boddingtons was $6.25. Looking forward to our cruise next week for some reasonabley priced bar drinks.:eek:

 

 

Hold on a second, cruise lines don't pay the tax on liquor, those on land do so it's hardly a good comparison.

[lady of the seas]

agree -- good way to handle by CC folks. I also think a lot of RCI for coming through.

 

(Go Dawgs!!!)

 

 

We just talked to our travel agent who has regular meeting with RCCL. They told us they were furious about the changes (as were other agents) and made their viewpoint know. Obviously it wasn't just the Diamond members outrage that caused RCCL to back of some of the changes.:)

[curley23]

Hold on a second, cruise lines don't pay the tax on liquor, those on land do so it's hardly a good comparison.

 

What do the taxes they pay, or don't pay have to do with. And how do you know whether they pay any or not. Regardless, prices aren't determined by a guessing game. Prices are determined by what a company needs to charge to off set costs, and make a profit. Everyone is different depending on their overhead.

[beachbuddy]

Continental breakfast is much cheaper to provide than a full breakfast. That's turning a perk into a $ bottom line plus for RCCL.

 

What????? I'm not sure I understand your post. Just because it's a continental breakfast doesn't mean you can't go to the dining room or Windjammer and have a full breakfast.

[critterchick]

Hold on a second, cruise lines don't pay the tax on liquor, those on land do so it's hardly a good comparison.

 

What would you compare it to, then - the cost of pouring a glass from a bottle that you bought at a discount liquor store? That's hardly fair, either.

 

We ate out a few times last week with friends who were visiting. Martinis that were half the size of what I get on RCI were $10, a wine that I enoy for $50 on RCI was $75 at one restaurant. So I think their drink prices are fair (except for their lower end wines, although a local restaurant charges $25 for a bottle of La Terrible, so RCI's price is less than that).

 

I was going somewhere with this, but I got lost....:o

[Cancunense]

I think every diamond member should be celebrating right now because the letters we all wrote to headquarters got proper attention and they have leaned our way.

I was really disturbed that we were going to be affect on two 14 day cruises next year because my husbands beer drinking can pay for another family to come with us...and the concierge lounge was letting us take more cruises. He will have to 'suffer' (not) with wine and champagne for 2 cruises before we have the lounge back...

I think diamond members need to applaud a job well done. I really do thing this is a nice compromise. Just to have our place back, acknowledgement of having arrived there by booking many cruises, was the recognition I wanted to continue. I am very very happy with these perks. Which as many of you have noted, are much more than the other cruise lines do...

[lady of the seas]

WOW...with all these great comments on how wrong Royal Caribbean's new policies are for Diamond members, I hope you will write or email to Mr. Adam Goldstein, the president and CEO of RCC, your feelings! :rolleyes:

 

By posting your comments here shows us Diamond members how strong we are, but I feel it would be more beneficial if we all complained directly to him and his staff telling them how we feel about this issue. Who knows.....they may finally get it that loyalty is worth something! :(

 

Below is the information you can reach Mr. Goldstein at:

 

Adam Goldstein (President & CEO of RCC)

1050 Caribbean Way

Miami, Florida 33132-2096

 

The email I just received yesterday from Mr. Goldstein with his second letter regarding his unfair changes, was sent to me with the following address that you can write to him at: royalcaribbean@explorer.royalcaribbean.com ;)

 

 

 

 

Well it's been several days since Mr. Goldstein's letter was sent and I'm still waiting with baited breath for mine.

 

Incidentally our friends who are only lowly diamond members (just kidding) advised us that they will be investigating other cruise lines until, if and when RCCL comes to their senses and recinds their changes. I doubt they are alone.

[beachbuddy]

What would you compare it to, then - the cost of pouring a glass from a bottle that you bought at a discount liquor store? That's hardly fair, either.

 

We ate out a few times last week with friends who were visiting. Martinis that were half the size of what I get on RCI were $10, a wine that I enoy for $50 on RCI was $75 at one restaurant. So I think their drink prices are fair (except for their lower end wines, although a local restaurant charges $25 for a bottle of La Terrible, so RCI's price is less than that).

 

I was going somewhere with this, but I got lost....:o

 

I really don't think RCCL's drinks (without the souveneer glasses) are overly priced in comparison to regular bars/restaurants but one thing I did notice is that some of their bottled wines are more than twice the normal cost - I think they'd sell a lot more if they lowered their prices. Some of those wines are not worth the price they want for them!! Is it really necessary to charge practically 2 1/2 times the normal cost???

[Merion_Mom]

What would you compare it to, then - the cost of pouring a glass from a bottle that you bought at a discount liquor store? That's hardly fair, either.

 

We ate out a few times last week with friends who were visiting. Martinis that were half the size of what I get on RCI were $10, a wine that I enoy for $50 on RCI was $75 at one restaurant. So I think their drink prices are fair (except for their lower end wines, although a local restaurant charges $25 for a bottle of La Terrible, so RCI's price is less than that).

 

I was going somewhere with this, but I got lost....:o

 

Frighteningly enough, Jean, you make perfect sense.

 

:)

 

See you on Sunday for a LOT of martinis!

[Driftwoodgal]

I think that we both agree in the end. It's mainly about the money.

RCI management made decisions based purely on the bottom line and it backfired. I'm sure they figured in some lost bookings, but judging from these boards, that represent just a small fraction of cruisers, the negative reaction has been overwhelming. RCI's quick retreat backs that up, in my opinion. Their response isn't all that people would wish for, but it is something that appeases many. It also pulls people into bar areas where many will buy drinks that they would otherwise have gotten for free. It could also slow down the cancellations until people get over the change and RCI will then be filling up fewer empty rooms with new cruisers.

My original post was to Driftwoodgal, just to point out that the cost to RCI was much higher than the $2100 that she was quoting. It's a sizeable chunk of change. The overcrowding is a big problem, but IMO, it's about the money.

 

That makes at least three of us that think it is mainly the money and the final bottom line. My post about the cost was to point out that it isn't costing them as much as people might think. If you throw in the loss of people buying drinks on their own then it does add up and really quickly. Restaurants and bars make their money off their drinks wether it be alcoholic or non alcoholic. A glass of tea costs pennies and the charge can be $2.00 or more. The liquor cost of the cruise line allows them to make $7.00 a drink. I haven't cruised in over a year so I am basing the figure on posts on this thread. The cost of losing cruisers well may cost them more than the $2100 I posted. It will be interesting to see how many people abandon their hard liquor and start drinking wine or champagne. I think people that have abused the CL in the past will continue to abuse it. People that have used the CL for a couple of drinks will pay the fees and either grumble and possibly look at other lines, or have their drinks and continue to sail only with RCCL. I have only sailed with RCCL, but with all of the changes I will now price other lines. The funny part is I am just missing the coffee and the tender tickets. I can live without both, but that doesn't make me happy. I posted earlier that it will be interesting to see if any of the Diamond+ cruisers actually leave the CL lounge and sit with their Diamond friends paying for their drinks. Guess I will find out in January 2010.

 

Thanks for your rebuttal post about the revenue that the cruise line is losing.

[Cancunense]

I forwarded Mr Goldsteins letter to my DW. She doesn't read the boards and hasn't been following the situation other that to agree with me that we'd cancel our two Mariner cruises in October and switch to Holland America.

 

She said she was amazed at the double talk in the letter. She was very unimpressed.

 

We were at a friends home over the weekend a group of people were discussing all of the deals to be had at hotels and restaurants. They live in Palm Springs and go out often and always on a coupon. It seems like a bizarre time to lower incentives.

 

When the incentive on our cruises was removed, they no longer were as attractive to us, so we canceled. No whinning and no hard feelings. We list positive and negative features of available cruises and make our decision which to go on.

 

We're booked on the Radiance next year and it has many more postive attributes for us, so we'll be with RCCL in the spring, no matter how this works out.

 

 

.

You guys aren't ready yet for Holland America ! The service is nice but you wont fit in with the 80 + crowd...we were astounded at the atmosphere.

You can't be ready for that yet

[lady of the seas]

Yes. Let's be honest...at heart, we all go on cruises because we like them.

 

That being said, the problem for RCCL is that, over the years (which is what most Diamond and above have noticed), we have seen reductions in the food quality and services (such as access to all seating in the pool area) and a attitude that tries to "sell" you everything.

 

In general, I would say I am willing to pay more to have better services and food. The problem for RCCL is that their food and services are comparable to other cruise lines now (RCCL just has some bigger, flashier ships), but their price/fare is notably higher. As such, I AM paying more (just not getting more) when I cruise RCCL. The C & A perks helped mitigate that, for many.

 

 

So, if we are comparing item by item, RCCL simply costs more. What brought so many people back to repeatedly to RCCL despite the higher pricing was the "carrot" of C & A.

 

True, for the cruiser, the "freebies" are not the make or break it deal (we can all budget dollars for drinks, etc...). But, let's face it, folks. For many of us who had been loyal to royal, we knew down inside that it wasn't always the best "cruise value" out there..certainly not anymore and not since other cruise lines started improving their services and ships. The recent changes in the C & A program simply illuminated the issue and freed many to other options.

 

The light has dawned and many, who were blinded by the light (of that shiny Diamond) can now see;).

 

 

 

You're absolutely right, most of us who have sailed for many years see the changes. All things being equal if you want people to stay loyal, then you have to reward them or they will move on to the the next best thing.

[Kaboochi]

RCCL built the mother of all cruise ships, Oasis, it over-extended their budget so WE are paying - plain and simple:mad:

[lady of the seas]

Actually the BEST way to qualify a loyal passenger should be based on what they've done LATELY! The way to alleviate overcrowding is to create a system that drops people out of the D ranks when they don't cruise enough. I have frequented a casino that does just that... you play enough in a year, you gain a higher level. You don't play enough in a year, you drop back down. Yes, there can be lifetime levels, but they should be MUCH higher than they are now. Now you can make it to Diamond and not cruise for many years, and still be a Diamond? That shouldn't be true unless you've sailed a lot more than 10 cruises.

 

Here is my idea, after a lot of thought, on a better C&A program:

 

Cruise days are used rather than credits. Interior and oceanview window cabins receive 1 credit per day sailed. Balcony passengers receive 1.25 credits per day. JS passengers receive 1.5 credits per day. GS and up receive 2 cruise credits per day.

 

Gold: All that do not qualify for higher levels

Platinum: Past 5 years: 25 credits. Lifetime: 100 credits

Diamond: Past 5 years: 50 credits. Lifetime: 250 credits

 

Translation: to be a Diamond, you'll need to sail over the past 5 years an average of 10 nights a year in an interior, 8 nights a year in a balcony, 7 nights a year in a JS, or 5 nights a year in a larger suite. OR, you need to sail in your lifetime 250 nights in an interior, 200 nights in a balcony, 167 nights in a JS or 125 nights in a larger suite.

 

There would no longer be a need for D+ by doing this.

 

Edited to add: Maybe my levels for 5 years are a little low and will still result in too many Ds? I'm not sure, but the number of credits could always be adjusted. I am just throwing out the idea.

 

 

Wow, interesting post, perhaps RCCL will put you on it's board or maybe give you extra credits or free cruises for all your suggestions.:rolleyes:

[Maraprince]

You're absolutely right, most of us who have sailed for many years see the changes. All things being equal if you want people to stay loyal, then you have to reward them or they will move on to the the next best thing.

 

 

 

One of the biggest problems with the RCL experience is that the changes have occurred very rapidly over a very short period of time. In just over 4 months between 2 sailings on the EOS in 2008 the difference was glaringly obvious. Corners were cut everywhere. With almost 6 sea days on a 12-night sailing, on-board activities were the same as you would find on a 9-night sailing with only 2 sea days. Does it really cost that much to offer more activities when there are more sea days? RCL sails to less ports in either the same amount of days or more days than the other lines. Also, they are probably the only cruise line NOT going to Tortola with the EOS. Depending on the time of day (I am not kidding) you will get a different answer as to why the EOS does not go to Tortola! At least agree one just one reason why not! That way it doesn't seem so obvious that one or more of the stories is a complete lie.

 

I don't mind paying more if I am getting more. But RCL isn't delivering in comparison to other lines. After my second sailing in 2008 on the EOS I was so disappointed that it will be a long time before RCL sees me again. This was before the ceiling fell in and all the other changes(reductions) were made!

 

 

:(

MARAPRINCE

[beachbuddy]

Wow, interesting post, perhaps RCCL will put you on it's board or maybe give you extra credits or free cruises for all your suggestions.:rolleyes:

 

LOL..........Alex did make a lot of suggestions but I don't think they'd be able to handle something like that. They have enough problems just keeping peoples cruises straight......LOL I really think they need to take a look at the people they gave different statuses to just because they were in the same household. When you think of it, a newborn could be a Diamond Member..........LOL That has to account for a lot of members that shouldn't be. I also think that maybe they should change the way they give cruise credits........maybe 1/2 credit for 2 to 4 night cruises, 1 credit for 5 to 11 and 2 credits for 12 and up.

 

I really don't know what they can do, but I do know they have to stop giving people a status that only cruised a few times.

[Driftwoodgal]

What do the taxes they pay, or don't pay have to do with. And how do you know whether they pay any or not. Regardless, prices aren't determined by a guessing game. Prices are determined by what a company needs to charge to off set costs, and make a profit. Everyone is different depending on their overhead.

 

Cruise lines don't pay tax on their liquor. My brother owns and operators several restaurants in Florida. http://pincherscrabshack.com I called him about what a drink would cost the cruise line. Also talked to my nephew, who was in managment for a liquor distributor in the Southeast, about the cost of a bottle.He told me that they pay less than someone here in the states as it is duty free. Both came up with a cost basis of $.50 or less for a mixed drink. Sometimes prices are set by supply and demand rather than cost and profit. Cruiselines can set the price to what the market, cruiser, will tolerate. It isn't like you can change bars if you don't like the price. The cost of a drink for a Diamond cruiser is $0 until September 1st. After that date it will cost them approximately $5.83 for a mixed drink. Pretty stiff increase IMHO.

[texlatin1]

Cruise lines don't pay tax on their liquor. My brother owns and operators several restaurants in Florida. http://pincherscrabshack.com I called him about what a drink would cost the cruise line. Also talked to my nephew, who was in managment for a liquor distributor in the Southeast, about the cost of a bottle.He told me that they pay less than someone here in the states as it is duty free. Both came up with a cost basis of $.50 or less for a mixed drink. Sometimes prices are set by supply and demand rather than cost and profit. Cruiselines can set the price to what the market, cruiser, will tolerate. It isn't like you can change bars if you don't like the price. The cost of a drink for a Diamond cruiser is $0 until September 1st. After that date it will cost them approximately $5.83 for a mixed drink. Pretty stiff increase IMHO.

 

(off topic)

Hey Driftwoodgal,

I just replied to your post in my Alaska thread! Thanks for the info, wishing you a great cruise as well!:)

 

(we now return to our regularly scheduled program)

[magicaliam]

This may appear dumb/stupid to many - it wouldn't be the 1st time...I laugh at some of my thoughts quite often. I'm been reading all the various opinions we posters have on RCL's decision to present the case for changes to Loyalty program. I was still getting over the combination of benefits/discount coupons/future booking credits and any etc. I left out. I was trying to re-adjust, hopeful that I would read of news that it was restructured in a way that wasn't so drastic...while keeping up on this site ( I never got notice of this in any email) I read about the focus group. That really put some questions in my mind because I have been part of other focus groups - and they have been run totally different...but - I think it placed doubts- regardless of whether it was or was not biased. I was mulling over these things but nothing as major as what came next - and so quickly pow, pow, pow! It was the rapid succession of "issues" clouding RCC.

I really think I would have felt better if the changes had come all at once - I wouldn't have been happy - but if it had been explained that economy being what it is - changes have to be made and suggesting that company was going to do it's best to put together a new program that they hoped would please their loyal passengers and APOLOGIZING for the necessary changes...... Then I would have felt entirely different - I would have understood. It would have sounded honest ....

OK - Shoot me if you must....Maybe it only would have helped me and made everyone else ( and 'the market') think less of the company? I have kept up enough to know revenue was declining, pod problems are not solved ( my canceled cruise in March), all cruise lines are suffering as consumers try to keep heads above water, debt issues, ratings, RCL stock prices, financing for mega ships ...all are legitimate issues. I don't think I would have felt the anger I felt with that type of announcement - OH - and I still haven't gotten notice - just found out on this site. (I did receive letter - form- though I asked to be called about the cancellation of my cruise...but I can call later- just showed letters were not read)....I should add to the list they need new and better communication software and upgrades..and that also is costly.

All this leads me to think the executive staff has been wrongly focused for a while - maybe putting out too many fires constantly? - rather than proactively paying attention? These are my thoughts - I have been one of those cheerleaders for RCC ( X included) and they didn't necessarily justify all my cheers - but I was loyal and I have never had a bad time on their vessels. (Never on any of the few others either-how can any cruise be bad?) I checked prices - but between RCC and X ships - and then itinerary.. and my intention was to become diamond plus like "winning a award " ...I was SOLD on doing all my future Cruises with this company. (FYI: Princess yearly cruise is handled by a loyal Princess cruiser and I just go along - but was working on switching this group...Carnival are just short fun at the $299 for a weekend type... Norwegian we went on long ago and it was great - We just decided to work on making Diamond with RCC) I'll steel myself and wait for your comments.....

 

read that title as shot at - burned - flamed...( wouldn't let me correct- LOL)

 

- Gee - no response? Am I ostrasized ? OR - Left to "not worthy of comment"? Oh well - Guess my only ending line is -

hoping to be on cruise boards with you in the future - Suzy

[beachbuddy]

read that title as shot at - burned - flamed...( wouldn't let me correct- LOL)

 

- Gee - no response? Am I ostrasized ? OR - Left to "not worthy of comment"? Oh well - Guess my only ending line is -

hoping to be on cruise boards with you in the future - Suzy

 

Suzy,

 

I don't think i would have felt better if the changes came all at once. I still don't agree with all the previous changes that they made. I still believe that we should be able to use our balcony discount with either a NC OBC or a shareholder OBC. The balcony discount is what we worked toward but now they took away our OBC so we didn't really gain much there. That change alone of not combining coupons, discounts, OBC's has to be saving them millions of dollars which is good for them and I'm not so much against most of those changes except the fact that they are not treating the balcony discount as a perk any longer. It should be in addition to one other thing.

 

I think they've made to many changes to fast!!! People are still angry over the January 09 changes and this last change has just added salt to the wound.

 

I still haven't received any letters at all from RCCL about the changes so the only way I know about them is from reading Cruise Critic. I'm sure there are thousands out there who like me didn't receive any letters and will have a surprise when they sail in September.

 

From what I understand now they are providing this Diamond Happy Hour on all their ships........even the ships that don't have a CL. I think that's going to cost them some money to do that so I don't understand what they accomplished by cutting the overflow lounge out on the ships that do have a CL and only offering wine and champagne at the Happy Hour. Now they have to have Happy Hours on all the ships which means giving away more wine and champagne not to mention using staff to run these Happy Hours. I just don't get it. They made a bunch of people who were use to this perk very unhappy. I know it wasn't because of overcrowding - it was definitly a dollar decision but now they are spending more putting it on all ships which is actually a great deal for those that sail the smaller ships since they never had anything. I'm happy for those people but it was well known that those ships had no CL so I don't know what the heck RCCL is doing. There were no complaints from people that sailed on those ships because we all didn't expect anything on those ships.

 

Well, I gotta run.......