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It's the latest effort to raise awareness and save the SS United States which continues to languish in rust in south Philadelphia.

 

A fundraiser is planned by the SS United States Conservancy tomorrow night (7/31) at the south Philadelphia Ikea store which has a great view of the docked ship across Columbus Boulevard. As you may know "the Big U" is still owned by NCL but the cruise line has offered the legendary liner for sale. Fans are trying to keep the ship from going to the breakers.

 

In a positive development, Philadelphia area philanthropist H.F. Lenfest has pledged a $300,000 matching grant to help in any non profit purchase. NCL is said to be seeking $20 million for the world's fastest ocean liner.

 

Featured speakers at the event include the granddaughter of the ship's designer, William Francis Gibbs. A buffet dinner will be served. Donation/admission is tax deductible.

 

http://ssunitedstatesconservancy.org...day-july-31st/

Edited by Philly Steve

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If hope alone could restore the SS United States to her operational greatness of 40 years ago, the iconic liner could sail tomorrow.

 

Unfortunately, it will take $20 million up front and another $300 million or so to make it happen.

 

An enthusiastic crowd of about 100 people gathered last night for a fundraiser and awareness event hosted by the SS United States Conservancy. A south Philadelphia Ikea may have seemed like an unusual venue but those who plunked down the fee for a buffet dinner and presentation were thrilled by the stunning view of the liner from the store cafeteria directly across the street from the pier. The store is an open supporter of its nautical neighbor.

 

Susan Gibbs, Conservancy head and grand daughter of the ship's designer said the gathering had "all the enthusiasm of a sail away party." Peering out the large windows, it was easy to look past the rust and decay and imagine the "Big U" cutting through the north Atlantic, setting the trans-Atlantic speed record that still stands. The interior of the ship has long been stripped away but her engines, capable of 40-plus knots, remain intact.

 

There were presentations including a slide show by Conservancy Board member and former ship's photographer Joseph Rota who fascinated the audience with personal stories about celebs he met on board including John Wayne, Kim Novak and Burt Lancaster.

Fans of the ship have been encouraged by word that Philadelphia philanthropist H.F. Lenfest, offered a $300,000 matching grant to help with any non profit purchase of the ship. Unfortunately, Lenfest was unable to attend last night's meeting.

 

Owner Norwegian Cruise Lines is selling the ship after refurbishing plans fell through. The line, which gave extended life to the SS France as the Norway, had hoped to work the same magic. Now, the SS United States seems to await the same fate as the Norway which met an inglorious end on a breakers beach.

 

A violent thunderstorm moved through the Philadelphia region in the hours leading up to the 6pm meeting but mid way through the presentations the clouds parted and a brilliant setting sun illuminated the liner's massive twin funnels and superstructure. Said one presenter, "the ship is happy tonight."

 

 

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Don't you suppose that the reason the turbines are intact is because the ship is so expensive to run that no one wants anything to do with them?

 

I have posted all this before, but here goes again. A good friend of mine is a mechanical engineer who was involved in a survey of the United States a few years ago. The survey found a hull with serious corrosion issues, virtually all the mechanical gear except the turbines and the main shell of the boilers missing, no furnishings and virtually no sign of the interior. The ship is a hulk. I suspect no amount of money can ever repair it enough to even assure that it would stay afloat for a while.

 

This ship was built as an extra fast troop transport. Its operation in civilian commerce was highly subsidized by the U. S. government. It could not make a profit, was never intended to operate without a subsidy, and never did. When the airlift capability of the U. S. armed forces was sufficient, the subsidy for the operation of the ship was withdrawn and very shortly after that, the ship was placed in ordinary. She has been deteriorating ever since.

 

It is a shame, but that is real world, not dreams. Incidentally, a dear departed friend worked at Newport News Shipbuilding during the construction of the United States. He was responsible for doing most of the takeoffs in the machine shop. It is his son who was involved in the survey.

 

Doc

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Don't you suppose that the reason the turbines are intact is because the ship is so expensive to run that no one wants anything to do with them?

 

.... The survey found a hull with serious corrosion issues, virtually all the mechanical gear except the turbines and the main shell of the boilers missing, no furnishings and virtually no sign of the interior. The ship is a hulk. I suspect no amount of money can ever repair it enough to even assure that it would stay afloat for a while.

 

Doc

 

 

I would question the comment about the hull because everything I have heard from NCL is that the hull is solid. There are above deck corrosion issues that need to be addressed but the hull is largely as thick as the day it was built. The designer way overspecified the steel intentionally and that meant every after almost 20 years of service the hull was in excellent shape. The NCL survey done a few years ago showed the underway portions to be still in excellent shape I understood.

 

Yes the interior was stripped to the metal with all of the partition walls other than the bulkheads and fire walls removed. That is both a blessing to someone who wants to built it out because there is nothing their way and they larely do not have to deal with ancient plumbing and electric but on the flipside all the people who took of restoration of the interiors are delusional for the same reasons because so much is gone.

 

Further it is my understanding that the engineering spaces while partially intact are all considered to be shot and could never be restarted for operations. Further no insurance company would ever insure the ship if they were to attempt to relight the original boilers after all these years. NCL's plans called for a new diesel power plant.

 

NCL's plans were as much as anything abandoned because the ship did not fit with their concept of 21st century cruising and all their efforts to build modern cruise ships. Not to mention NCL has had its financial problems even before the current economy and would much rather spend its money on the current fleet and the monstrosity they are building in France right now.

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Trusting anything from NCL that has to do with the condition of an old ship is total folly. These are the people who lied for years about the operation and care and condition of the boilers on the Norway. The survey in which my friend was involved was for a potential buyer who declined to buy the hulk.

 

I fear that those of you who want to spend other people's money (you have none of your own or you would have spent it already) are wearing rose colored glasses.

 

As a museum, the ship has no value as there is nothing to look at except to drive up to the dock as say, "Oh look, Martha, there's a pretty ship." There are a large number of you folks who think it can be returned to operation; that is total folly. You remind me of the group that was trying to return rail service to eastern North Carolina about 25 years ago. They said they had cars. They did - two old camp cars that the Aberdeen and Rockfish had abandoned.

 

I have tried to avoid being cruel through several years of threads from proponents of saving the United States. Quite frankly, the effort has resulted in continued pie in the sky dreams and that is all you have or ever will have. The only possible customer for the hulk that exists is the scrappers.

 

Doc

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As a museum, the ship has no value as there is nothing to look at except to drive up to the dock as say, "Oh look, Martha, there's a pretty ship."

I have tried to avoid being cruel through several years of threads from proponents of saving the United States. Quite frankly, the effort has resulted in continued pie in the sky dreams and that is all you have or ever will have. The only possible customer for the hulk that exists is the scrappers.

Doc

 

"It (SS United States) would be a restoration of American pride in something we should be very proud of. It was tear jerking to see it lying up there, and just going to pieces; nobody caring. It showed the

callousness among the American people that it would let such a ship die a miserable death."

 

-Walter Cronkite

"SS United States: Lady in Waiting"

 

 

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The SS United States Conservancy is hosting a FREE screening of the documentary "SS United States: Lady in Waiting" Wednesday, August 26th, 7pm at the Philadelphia Seaport Museum on Philadelphia's waterfront. The session will be followed by a discussion and reception.

 

Also, there is an article in today's Philadelphia Inquirer on efforts to save America's former flagship. Owner Star Cruises is selling the ship.

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The SS United States Conservancy is hosting a FREE screening of the documentary "SS United States: Lady in Waiting" Wednesday, August 26th, 7pm at the Philadelphia Seaport Museum on Philadelphia's waterfront. The session will be followed by a discussion and reception.

 

Also, there is an article in today's Philadelphia Inquirer on efforts to save America's former flagship. Owner Star Cruises is selling the ship.

 

Here's a link to the story PhillySteve mentioned.

 

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/local/20090824_SOS_plan_for_faded_ocean_liner.html

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Last night, the auditorium at the Philadelphia Seaport Museum was filled by fans of the SS United States for the screening of the documentary.

 

The SS United States Conservancy is mounting a campaign to involve schools, museums and others in a last ditch effort to save the ship and promote awareness.

 

Sadly, it looks like the beginning of the end. A Conservancy officer told the gathering that scrappers have asked about the possibility of protests, should the ship be towed from its pier in south Philadelphia. :(

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SS_United_States_cutaway.jpg

 

Ship+Photo+UNITED+STATES.jpg

 

ss United States (1952-present) Built in 1952 by Newport News Shipbuilding & Drydock Company, Newport News, Va for United States Lines. Inspired by the exemplary service of the British liners RMS Queen Mary and RMS Queen Elizabeth which transported hundreds of thousands of U.S. troops to Europe during World War II, the United States government decided to sponsor construction of a large and very fast merchant vessel capable of transporting large numbers of soldiers. Designed by renowned American naval architect and marine engineer William Francis Gibbs, the liner's construction was a joint effort between the United States Navy and United States Lines. The U.S. government underwrote $50 million of the $78 million construction cost, with the ship's operators, United States Lines, contributing the remaining $28 million. In exchange, she was designed to be easily converted into a troopship with a capacity of 15,000 troops, or a hospital ship in the case of war.

 

Her keel was laid and her hull was constructed in a graving dock. The United States was built to exacting Navy specifications, which required that she be heavily compartmentalized and have separate engine rooms to enable her to survive should she be damaged in war.

 

To minimize the risk of fire, the designers of the United States did not use a single piece of wood in her framing, accessories or decorations. There were no wood interior surfaces. Fittings, including all furniture and fabrics, were custom made in glass, metal and spun glass fiber to ensure they were in full compliance with strict fireproof guidelines set by the U.S. Navy. Even the clothes hangers in the luxury cabins were made of aluminum. The only wooden equipment used in the construction of the vessel was in the bilge keels and butcher blocks in the galleys. The grand piano in the ballroom was even made of a rare, fire-resistant species of wood, and was originally specified to be made of aluminum. The grand piano was accepted after a demonstration in which gasoline was poured upon the wood and lit without causing the wood itself to catch fire.

 

The construction of the ship's superstructure involved the largest use of aluminum in any construction project to that time, and presented a special challenge to the builders in joining the aluminum structure to the steel decks below. The significant use of aluminum provided extreme weight savings. At 105 feet beam, the United States was built to Panamax capacity, ensuring that she could clear the Panama Canal locks with just 2 feet to spare on either side.

 

The United States had the most powerful engine installation in a merchant marine vessel. She was capable of steaming astern at over 20 knots, and could carry enough fuel and stores to steam non-stop for over 10,000 nautical miles.

 

united_states_1952_1.jpg

 

 

Also known as "the Big U", she was used on the New York City to Northern Europe service. At 53,329 gross tons, she still is the largest ocean liner to date built entirely in the United States. Embarking on her maiden voyage on July 4, 1952, she smashed the transatlantic speed record held by the Queen Mary for the previous 14 years by over 10 hours, making her maiden crossing from the Ambrose Lightship at New York harbor to Bishop Rock off Cornwall, UK in 3 days, 10 hours, 40 minutes at an average speed of 35.59 knots (40.96 mph). The liner also broke the westbound crossing record by returning to America in 3 days 12 hours and 12 minutes at an average speed of 34.51 knots (39.71 mph), thereby capturing both the eastbound and westbound prestigious Blue Ribands. This marked the first time a U.S.-flagged ship held the Blue Riband, surpassing European speed records which had stood for decades. The United States lost the eastbound record in 1990 to HSC Hoverspeed Great Britain, an ocean-going catamaran, who made the run in 3 days 7 hours 54 minutes, travelling at an average speed of 36.6 knots (67.8 km/h). United States still holds the westbound record, and remains the fastest ocean liner to cross in either direction. She would maintain a 30-knot (35 mph) crossing speed on the North Atlantic in a service career that lasted 17 years.

 

The United States plied the transatlantic with passenger service until 1969, and she outlasted the demise of her original owners. While at Newport News for her annual overhaul in 1969, her owners decided to take her out of service and she was laid up at Newport News. A few years later, she was moved to Norfolk, Va. Since then, ownership has been passed between several companies.

 

In 1978 she was sold to private interests who hoped to revitalize the liner in a time-share cruise ship format. Financing fell through and the ship was placed up for auction by MARAD (the United States Marine Administration). During the 1980s she was considered by the United States Navy as a troop ship or a hospital ship to be called the USS United States, but this plan never materialized. In 1984, the ship's remaining fittings and furniture were sold at auction in Norfolk.

 

united_states_1952_2.jpg

 

In 1992, a new consortium of owners bought the vessel and had her towed to Turkey and then Ukraine, where she underwent asbestos removal. No viable agreements were reached in the U.S. for a reworking of the vessel and eventually she was towed to her current dock in South Philadelphia, where she has been moored since 1996.

 

In 2003, Norwegian Cruise Line (NCL) purchased the ship from the estate of Edward Cantor when she was put up for auction after his death with the stated intent of fully restoring her to a service role in their newly-announced American-flagged Hawaiian passenger service called NCL America. However, she is currently still berthed in Philadelphia, PA until a decision is made about her fate.

 

Ship+Photo+SS+United+States.jpg

 

Ship+Photo+United+States.jpg

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Trusting anything from NCL that has to do with the condition of an old ship is total folly. These are the people who lied for years about the operation and care and condition of the boilers on the Norway. The survey in which my friend was involved was for a potential buyer who declined to buy the hulk.

 

I fear that those of you who want to spend other people's money (you have none of your own or you would have spent it already) are wearing rose colored glasses.

 

As a museum, the ship has no value as there is nothing to look at except to drive up to the dock as say, "Oh look, Martha, there's a pretty ship." There are a large number of you folks who think it can be returned to operation; that is total folly. You remind me of the group that was trying to return rail service to eastern North Carolina about 25 years ago. They said they had cars. They did - two old camp cars that the Aberdeen and Rockfish had abandoned.

 

I have tried to avoid being cruel through several years of threads from proponents of saving the United States. Quite frankly, the effort has resulted in continued pie in the sky dreams and that is all you have or ever will have. The only possible customer for the hulk that exists is the scrappers.

 

Doc

Very well said. Another thing to consider is that even if it was financially feasible and mechanically possible to restore this ship, it would have none of the amentities required by modern cruise passengers. How are you going to add balcony cabins, multi-story atriums, swimming pools, rock climbing walls, ice skating, and all the other crap that people seem to want without radically altering the profile and character of this ship? I seriously doubt there are enough liner fans out there to keep the ship filled to capacity week after week.

 

And forget about United States in a static role - the track record of these type of projects is a disaster. It was a great accomplishment for the time, but that time has passed. Better to open a nice museum or something than mess around with a rotting gross hulk, especially in these economic times. Most intelligent folks realize that NCL only purchased United States in order to obtain their Hawaii route and never had the faintest intent of actually restoring her. Anyone who says otherwise is a liar, including Colin Vitch. Let NCL sell her for scrap on the condition that they donate funds for a SSUS museum or other attraction and everybody will be unburdened.

 

SS Norway needed, comparitively, very minimal repairs to bring it back to service but it was not done because the ship was outdated and uncompetitive.

Edited by cable

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John, thank you for posting the dazzling pics and information on the Big U. It saddens me that so many people have turned their back to this great lady. :(

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Heartbreaking

abc_uss_us1_080501_ssh.jpg

I wish they could use some of the economic stimulus money to save her, she is such a symbol of our country.

 

picture.aspx?date=20070628&catalog=119648&gallery=110889&lot=00146&filetype=2

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Heartbreaking

abc_uss_us1_080501_ssh.jpg

I wish they could use some of the economic stimulus money to save her, she is such a symbol of our country.

 

 

 

A great symbol. Rusting, abandoned, out of date, falling apart, lacking sufficient support from her people, and about to be scrapped.

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We need a Bill Gates or a James Cameron to step in and save her! A historic minded restoration of the S.S. United States might not be as trendy as the blue folks on Pandora, but it would do a lot of good in this country

 

the-big-u.jpg

Lets get a few hundred (or thousand) Americans working on her again.

 

The Brooklyn Navy Yard has a huge empty drydock, and needs a high profile attraction. The S.S. United States has fame, but needs a safe haven.

Brooklyn construction workers will get jobs now, and down the line there will be ticket takers and tour guides needed. What situation could be better?

0409drydock1.jpgss_united_states_1956.jpg

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We need a Bill Gates or a James Cameron to step in and save her! A historic minded restoration of the S.S. United States might not be as trendy as the blue folks on Pandora, but it would do a lot of good in this country

 

the-big-u.jpg

Lets get a few hundred (or thousand) Americans working on her again.

 

The Brooklyn Navy Yard has a huge empty drydock, and needs a high profile attraction. The S.S. United States has fame, but needs a safe haven.

Brooklyn construction workers will get jobs now, and down the line there will be ticket takers and tour guides needed. What situation could be better?

0409drydock1.jpgss_united_states_1956.jpg

 

 

Currently the smallest international mass market cruise ship that can turn a profit carries around 2,200 passengers. An American flag vessel has much higher costs than an international flag ship. Labor costs alone on an American ship are 500% higher than on a foreign flag ship.This ship would need to carry 3,000 or 4,000 passengers in any hope to break even on operating costs. The SS United States would require some very severe rebuilding in order to carry that many pax. The resulting design would probably resemble your local shopping mall. Are you ready for that?

 

When NCL was trying to get their Pride of America ship finished, they were required to have the work done in a US Yard. They put the job up for bid. Despite the fact that many US Yards are sitting empty, not one would even consider bidding on the job. There is far more money to be made with cost over-runs building military ships. They were willing to wait for the bigger payoffs.

Congress had to change the law to allow the American ship to be completed in Germany.

 

When NCL was ready to have their second American Flag ship completed, the same thing happened again. The second ship was built in Germany.

 

What makes you think that this wouldn't happen again with the SS United States?

Edited by BruceMuzz

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BruceMuzz-

 

I think that you misunderstood my post. I know that she can never sail again commercially.

I was suggesting that the United States be restored as a static attraction at the Brooklyn Navy Yard (which is now closed).

 

By the way, this statement of yours:

Currently the smallest international mass market cruise ship that can turn a profit carries around 2,200 passengers.

is patently false. Oceania cruise line is currently operating three 600 passenger ships, which are making enough of a profit to justify the building of two further 1250 passenger ships.

Marina.png

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BruceMuzz-

 

I think that you misunderstood my post. I know that she can never sail again commercially.

I was suggesting that the United States be restored as a static attraction at the Brooklyn Navy Yard (which is now closed).

 

By the way, this statement of yours:

 

is patently false. Oceania cruise line is currently operating three 600 passenger ships, which are making enough of a profit to justify the building of two further 1250 passenger ships.

Marina.png

 

Gents,

 

You need to read the posts a bit more thoroughly. I'm talking about MASS MARKET cruise vessels. You are talking about LUXURY vessels. These are completely different animals. There are many SMALL LUXURY vessels sailing today - and making a profit. They are charging from $600 - $1200 per person, per day. They are only able to make a profit at those rates because they are not US Flagged, and not subject to US Taxes, US Wages, US Laws, and US Regulations - and they don't have to operate very expensive steam engines.

 

If they had US Flags and Crews, they would need to double their already sky-high fares to turn a profit.

Do you think anybody would pay $1200 - $2400 per person, per day to sail on the renovated SS United States Not very likely.

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Gents,

 

You need to read the posts a bit more thoroughly. I'm talking about MASS MARKET cruise vessels. You are talking about LUXURY vessels. These are completely different animals. There are many SMALL LUXURY vessels sailing today - and making a profit. They are charging from $600 - $1200 per person, per day. They are only able to make a profit at those rates because they are not US Flagged, and not subject to US Taxes, US Wages, US Laws, and US Regulations - and they don't have to operate very expensive steam engines.

 

If they had US Flags and Crews, they would need to double their already sky-high fares to turn a profit.

Do you think anybody would pay $1200 - $2400 per person, per day to sail on the renovated SS United States Not very likely.

 

Actually, it is you who will need to read things more closely, so that you may check your facts.

They are charging from $600 - $1200 per person, per day.

The per diems on those "luxury" Oceania ships start at around $240, and even the top suits just barely hit $600, so your estimates are way off.

You are talking about LUXURY vessels. These are completely different animals. There are many SMALL LUXURY vessels sailing today - and making a profit.

It may interest you to consider that the new Oceania Ship (the Marina, pictured above), is priced identically to the rest of their fleet, and clocks in at 65000 tons which makes her 12% BIGGER than the big U. I don't think that fits anyones definition of small.

 

That being said, and this is the third time that I have written this, I agree with you, sadly, the United States will never be able to sail commercially again.

abc_uss_us3_080501_ssh.jpg

Her interior partitions and all decorations were almost entirely removed during asbestos abatement, and an engine room staff who could safely run a high power turbine installation, such as hers, simply does not exist any longer.

 

I was suggesting that she might be RESTORED for use as a STATIONARY tourist attraction in Brooklyn.

 

New York WAS her home port, after all, and by some definitions, she is still technically the fastest Ocean Liner in the world.

 

The folks in Brooklyn need jobs, the Navy Yard needs a Tourist Attraction, and the Big U needs a berth.

BigU_01.jpg

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Actually, it is you who will need to read things more closely, so that you may check your facts.

 

The per diems on those "luxury" Oceania ships start at around $240, and even the top suits just barely hit $600, so your estimates are way off.

 

It may interest you to consider that the new Oceania Ship (the Marina, pictured above), is priced identically to the rest of their fleet, and clocks in at 65000 tons which makes her 12% BIGGER than the big U. I don't think that fits anyones definition of small.

 

That being said, and this is the third time that I have written this, I agree with you, sadly, the United States will never be able to sail commercially again.

abc_uss_us3_080501_ssh.jpg

Her interior partitions and all decorations were almost entirely removed during asbestos abatement, and an engine room staff who could safely run a high power turbine installation, such as hers, simply does not exist any longer.

 

I was suggesting that she might be RESTORED for use as a STATIONARY tourist attraction in Brooklyn.

 

New York WAS her home port, after all, and by some definitions, she is still technically the fastest Ocean Liner in the world.

 

The folks in Brooklyn need jobs, the Navy Yard needs a Tourist Attraction, and the Big U needs a berth.

BigU_01.jpg

 

As soon as you get your US$300 million together, shoot me an email and I will explain in excrutiating detail why a US Shipyard will never touch this job.

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As soon as you get your US$300 million together, shoot me an email and I will explain in excrutiating detail why a US Shipyard will never touch this job

 

Under what possible definition could you consider the defunct Brooklyn Navy Yard as a US shipyard?

This is no longer an industrial issue. Your discussion is a throwback to the 1970's.

Either they restore the ship as a work of preservation, or she will sink or be scrapped.

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Owner Norwegian Cruise Lines has reportedly announced it is accepting bids from scrappers for the decaying SS United States which remains tied up at South Philadelphia. The company has failed to find a buyer willing to keep the ship intact.

 

 

Now, there is a last ditch campaign to save the ship from being torn apart.

It's called "SOS."

 

 

 

http://www.kyw1060.com/Salvation-Sought-for-Floating-South-Phila--Landmar/6488948

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This week, the Philadelphia Inquirer reported owner NCL is actively shopping the SS United States to scrap companies, reducing the price from $20 million last year to 1.5 million. The report says a deal could be finalized by the end of the month.

 

The paper reports the SS United States Conservancy is exploring possible legal options to block the sale to any company for scrapping purposes, citing the ship's historic designation.

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