Is HAL moving downscale?

[sail7seas]

Wannaknow,

 

Which HAL ship(s) did you sail?

 

 

 

[iancal]

I have to say that I am somewhat relieved to hear other people say that the lobster on board is nothing worth writing home about. We no longer bother with it. Too often, on HAL and other lines, it has been overcooked, tough, tasteless, or too salty or all three. And quite often the portions could be called meager at best.

 

We have had the real McCoy-fresh out of the water and cooked properly. Absolutely NO comparison I have never been able to understand why people got so exited about having it on formal evenings-or missing it as the case may be.

 

I thought it was just us.

[LindaM]

I have to say that I am somewhat relieved to hear other people say that the lobster on board is nothing worth writing home about. We no longer bother with it. Too often, on HAL and other lines, it has been overcooked, tough, tasteless, or too salty or all three. And quite often the portions could be called meager at best.

 

We have had the real McCoy-fresh out of the water and cooked properly. Absolutely NO comparison I have never been able to understand why people got so exited about having it on formal evenings-or missing it as the case may be.

 

I thought it was just us.

 

Everyone knows the lobster is not the same as in a restaurant. Not even close. It is quite expensive to order in Michigan, so that is something I save for the cruiseship. It has been decent enough more times than not. And, you can always ask for more if it is not cooked to your liking. It's a fun treat for some of us. Rather, it used to be.

[Crazy Gramps]

There was a time, not too long ago, the words "mass market" and "HAL" were not used in the same sentence.

 

As for the Mariner program it's sort of a joke.

 

Las Vegas gives me Free meals and drinks and frre hotel days after one week there.

 

Gramps

[Wannaknow]

Wannaknow,

 

Which HAL ship(s) did you sail?

 

 

 

 

Oosterdam. Lovely ship.

 

Iancal - I do agree with you re the lobster, just not exciting anymore.

[bet410]

Everyone knows the lobster is not the same as in a restaurant. Not even close. It is quite expensive to order in Michigan, so that is something I save for the cruiseship. It has been decent enough more times than not. And, you can always ask for more if it is not cooked to your liking. It's a fun treat for some of us. Rather, it used to be.

 

Totally agree! Being in the Midwest, it's very expensive to get lobster. I always look forward to having it on the ship. It may not be the best lobster in the world, but I still enjoy it.

[Taxguy77]

TeamBozo,

I'm sorry the cruise didn't live up to your hopes! We're on the exact cruise next fall.

 

As stated earlier, sadly there are size constraints to most of the classes and with the # passengers on the Westy not much can be done. Wasn't so much of cost of space. Longer cruises always have classes/events that fill up.

Again Team Bozo, I'm sorry your cruise wasn't all you hoped it would be. You've mentioned what you didn't like, please wax poetic about what you liked about your 35 days.

 

Derek

 

A TA isn't long enough?:confused:

We went to the first trivia on a TA and only one other person showed up! :eek:

We went ahead with it and had to give the girl assigned to give the questions a history lesson about almost every one. She even had problems reading the questions, indicating she had just been called into duty.:o

[Viesczy]

Taxguy77

In the OP it was clearly stated:

 

"We just returned from a 35 day Hawaii/Tahiti cruise on the Westerdam. Although we enjoyed ourselves, there were many troubling signs of cost cutting and crowding that give the impression the HAL is moving downscale in the cruise marketplace... But there seem to be too many passengers competing for space in the activities, theater, etc... Gym classes, computer classes, dance classes and shows in the evening were quite full---often to the point of not being turned away due to lack of space. Our travel documents listed 10 formal nights, but there were only 7 in 5 weeks.

There were many other things I could list where it was apparent that HAL is cutting back."

 

I was replying specifically to those statements based on the 35 day crusie the Westy just completed and where there was a "live from" thread here:

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1484070

 

I'm glad you had plenty of space in your TA; apparently the 35 day cruise had a different outcome, and again it was to that which I was addressing.

 

I do hope that TeamBozo does comment on what they liked on the cruise, it would be sad that rather then remember their 35 day trip to Pacific Paradise, they remember that they only had 7 formal nights and that classes were full.

 

Derek

[AirGorilla]

Indeed - Oceania, Cunard (Grill Class) and Crystal have proven that there remains a market for a true premium product...

...which is what the HAL brand was intended to be when Carnival Corporation made it's purchase.

However, you can't be a premium product when it's priced like mainstream brands and when you have too much capacity.

 

I saw an ad for HAL this morning on Cruise Critic offering a seven night Caribbean cruise for $449!! Talk about lower mass market standards!

 

AG

[sail7seas]

I saw an ad for HAL this morning on Cruise Critic offering a seven night Caribbean cruise for $449!! Talk about lower mass market standards!

 

AG

 

 

And we wonder why people are complaining about the prime rib they were served in the dining room? :eek: :rolleyes:

 

What can we expect to be served at those prices?

 

Of course, there are those who are paying a great deal more and are expecting more. :rolleyes:

[Hlitner]

Taxguy77

In the OP it was clearly stated:

 

"We just returned from a 35 day Hawaii/Tahiti cruise on the Westerdam. Although we enjoyed ourselves, there were many troubling signs of cost cutting and crowding that give the impression the HAL is moving downscale in the cruise marketplace... But there seem to be too many passengers competing for space in the activities, theater, etc... Gym classes, computer classes, dance classes and shows in the evening were quite full---often to the point of not being turned away due to lack of space. Our travel documents listed 10 formal nights, but there were only 7 in 5 weeks.

There were many other things I could list where it was apparent that HAL is cutting back."

 

I was replying specifically to those statements based on the 35 day crusie the Westy just completed and where there was a "live from" thread here:

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1484070

 

I'm glad you had plenty of space in your TA; apparently the 35 day cruise had a different outcome, and again it was to that which I was addressing.

 

I do hope that TeamBozo does comment on what they liked on the cruise, it would be sad that rather then remember their 35 day trip to Pacific Paradise, they remember that they only had 7 formal nights and that classes were full.

 

Derek

 

We are puzzled by your post. The Westerdam is about 8 years old and carries the same number of passengers now as when she was launched. Her space ratio is over 45 tons per passenger which is among the highest in the business (for mass market ships). We do agree that there seems to be more crowding these days then years ago...but its not because of the size of the ship. Many more HA passengers seem to want to do everything early....early dinner, early shows, etc. When we cruise on HA (or other ships) we normally dine around 8 and go to the late shows (which are now sometimes before dinner) which are never crowded. It is a similar problem at the lido buffets. If lunch opens at 11:30 it seems like the entire ship wants to eat before noon. If you simply go to lunch around 1 there are no lines. One way to avoid this change in passenger habits is to simply book one of the ultra-luxury lines (such as Regent, Seabourn, etc) where you get an even better space ratio and they can handle all the passengers at a single seating, show, etc.

 

Hank

[bepsf]

We are puzzled by your post. The Westerdam is about 8 years old and carries the same number of passengers now as when she was launched.

 

Not quite.

HAL added roughly 35 cabins to the sterns of Westerdam, Oosterdam and Zuiderdam about 3-4 years ago.

[sail7seas]

Compare the view of Westerdam's stern before the added cabins and after. It's evident there's been a change.

[bepsf]

Of course, there are those who are paying a great deal more and are expecting more. :rolleyes:

 

Yes - folks paying full fare are expecting more, as they should.

 

But when a good portion of the passengers of a given sailing are paying Sub-Economy rates, I doubt any line could maintain Premium standards for very long and remain profitable.

[terrydtx]

:

Yes - folks paying full fare are expecting more, as they should.

 

But when a good portion of the passengers of a given sailing are paying Sub-Economy rates, I doubt any line could maintain Premium standards for very long and remain profitable.

 

I think this is called the "Carnival Effect":eek:

[sail7seas]

:

 

I think this is called the "Carnival Effect":eek:

 

 

You do know that Carnival Corporation has owned HAL for more than 20 years, right? :confused:

 

They also own Princess, Costa, Cunard, Seabourn, and Carnival in addition to HAL.

[iancal]

Yes, and it is my understanding that Carnival Corp. essentially saved the HAL brand.

 

At the time of the acquisition Holland America was essentially an insolvent company with a fleet of tired, outdated ships.

[sail7seas]

Yes, and it is my understanding that Carnival Corp. essentially saved the HAL brand.

 

At the time of the acquisition Holland America was essentially an insolvent company with a fleet of tired, outdated ships.

 

 

That sounds about what I recall to be the case.

[hypercafe]

I don't know why people on this board seem to put Carnival down. They give a very nice cruise experence on ships that in some cases are sisters to HAL ships. The food is about the same and the shows are better. The difference is the pax are a very mixed crowd of all ages and the hull is white. The days of thinking that HAL is somehow a step above are over.

[sail7seas]

I don't know why people on this board seem to put Carnival down. They give a very nice cruise experence on ships that in some cases are sisters to HAL ships. The food is about the same and the shows are better. The difference is the pax are a very mixed crowd of all ages and the hull is white. The days of thinking that HAL is somehow a step above are over.

 

 

Well, THAT's was does it for me........

 

the hulls are white.

 

I truly love those beautiful blue HAL hulls. :)

 

White hulls just don't do it for me in the same way. :D

[terrydtx]

I don't know why people on this board seem to put Carnival down. They give a very nice cruise experence on ships that in some cases are sisters to HAL ships. The food is about the same and the shows are better. The difference is the pax are a very mixed crowd of all ages and the hull is white. The days of thinking that HAL is somehow a step above are over.

 

I guess the sister ships must be big,:eek: really big sisters, being on a ship with 1800-2000 passengers VS 3800-4500 does it for me:D I love the dark hulls too and way less kids and 20 somethings partying all night.

[iancal]

We were on the Carnival Spirit once and had a wonderful cruise. The ship was the same size, actually same hull, as some of the newer HAL ships. Carnival Corp uses cookie cutter design for most of their subs-including HAL. when it comes to certain classes of ships.

 

We did not experience screaming kids or drunken adults. What we experienced was a great cruise, same beds as HAL, much better entertainment, same great service, equal food in the MDR. The buffet was not as good though. I sometimes wonder if some of the HAL posters who like to knock Carnival and Carnival patrons have ever really had a cruise on Carnival recently, and if so did they do some research to select the right Carnival ship for their tastes instead of painting every ship in their fleet with the same broad brush.

[sail7seas]

We were on the Carnival Spirit once and had a wonderful cruise. The ship was the same size, actually same hull, as some of the newer HAL ships. Carnival Corp uses cookie cutter design for most of their subs-including HAL. when it comes to certain classes of ships.

 

We did not experience screaming kids or drunken adults. What we experienced was a great cruise, same beds as HAL, much better entertainment, same great service, equal food in the MDR. The buffet was not as good though. I sometimes wonder if some of the HAL posters who like to knock Carnival and Carnival patrons have ever really had a cruise on Carnival recently, and if so did they do some research to select the right Carnival ship for their tastes instead of painting every ship in their fleet with the same broad brush.

 

 

 

Carnival must be doing a lot of things very right. They are hugely successful and have millions of people who have sailed their ships and had great cruises.

[LindaM]

Well, THAT's was does it for me........

 

the hulls are white.

 

I truly love those beautiful blue HAL hulls. :)

 

White hulls just don't do it for me in the same way. :D

 

When we were choosing the line for our first cruise, about 35 years ago, we chose Carnival because the ship had a white hull. Our other choice, HAL, had blue. We were young----what did we know??? We knew so little, that is how we made our choice.

[hypercafe]

Dear terriers, many of the Carnival ships are the same size of the larger HAL ships 1800 to 2200 pax and they are not adding more rooms as HAL is doing so don't sell them short, try something different and take a trip on them.