Panama Canal, now or wait for the expansion to be completed.

[startpacking]

Have looked into Panama Canal cruises in the past, but never have had a chance to visit Panama or take a Panama Canal cruise. Thinking of where to travel to later in the year and considering Panama.

 

I know the canal is currently being expanded, but I know very little about how different the canal will be once the work is completed. If you can only visit Panama once, is it best to visit the country now before the canal expansion project is complete, or wait until after the work is completed.

 

Any thoughts on this subject will be appreciated.

 

Thanks.

[Azulann]

i booked a Canal cruise for Dec 2012. It is a 15 day full transit.

The new canal will not be finished until 2014 and they are currently behind schedule. The new canal will be wider to allow the bigger ships through, including the bigger cruise ships which means more people on the cruise and in ports.Panama is the fastest growing country in Central America.They also have lots of national parks and their tourism is growing.

 

I have a bucket list for cruises: South America, Black Sea,

Turkey, Northern Europe, Spain... I am checking them off one at a time.:

 

 

So many places, so little time.

 

Whatever you do , book a cruise for the next year.:D

[AKman2495]

I don't know. I believe in carpe diem. Why wait. First of all, the "new canal" will not be radically different from the old canal. The big difference is the construction of new locks at both ends. These lock are bigger and will permit larger ships to pass through the canal. Other than the locks, the canal will be pretty much the same. Of course, they are working on various parts of the canal all the time, so it is not as it was when it first opened anyway.

 

If you are not planning on passing through the canal when the new locks open-during the big centennial celebration, than I don't think it will make much difference.

 

WHen I was young I visited the Statue of Liberty well before it was renovated. Later, I visited it as the "new" statue. Except of the staircase to the top, which has been modernized, and the changes to the torch, there was not a great deal of difference. Other than being able to say "I went to the top of the old Statue AND the new Statue", there is not much to say.

 

I think it will be the same for the canal.

[BillB48]

AKman summed it up pretty well, other than going through the new locks or the existing locks, the experience will be the same. The new locks will not be that far from the old ones, you just won't really be able to see one very well while you are at the other. The new locks are are no doubt going to be the feature that will have the largest visual impact but the transit across Gatun Lake and through Gaillard Cut will look pretty the same today as it will tomorrow. A great deal of the Canal expansion project aside from the new locks is deepening a widening the main channel...... you can say they have been doing that since 1914;)!

[lafngas]

Trying to figure out if increasing the number of ships will increase competition and possibly lower prices on a PC cruise, or if the hefty costs for ships to transit through the new canal will offset any possible savings on the cruise itself.

Any thoughts?

[CruiserBruce]

The Canal fees for the passage are huge, and limit price competition severely. Think 200K plus per ship, per transit. The new locks cost billions, and have to be paid for. Cruise ships are a very small part of Canal traffic, cargo- new larger ships being able to transit- is far larger. I don't have the exact stats, but would think cargo is over 90% of Canal traffic.

[BillB48]

While there probably be an increase in the number ships (passenger and cargo) to some degree there actually could be a decrease in the number of ships using the Canal due to the fact it will take fewer ships to haul the same amount of cargo. I suspect that there won't be that many more passenger ships using the Canal after the expansion is complete even though there will be more passengers going through the Canal. More than likely it will enable the cruise lines to place one of their post Panamax ships on routes that are being served by the present Panamax ships. They would not send both ships to the same market, probably one, but not the other.

 

The present toll structure for a laden passenger ship is $134/berth. A ship is considered to be laden as long as it is carrying at least one paying passenger. The rate is applied to all berths, whether or not it is occupied. So, on a present Panamax ship 2200x134= 294,800... that's just the base price as there is a healthy list of additional charges such as the fee for a transit reservation slot which gives them a confirmed time and date. For Panamax ships the figure is around $35,000, and when the rest of the additional items are thrown in, you can see we are talking about some serious $$.

 

Passenger traffic through the Canal in terms of ships is a very small percentage. Take for example in the month of May there is only one passenger ship scheduled, pretty small portion of around a 1000 ships in a month.

 

There is one other thing to point out in deciding to do a Canal transit with the present Locks or the brand new and improved locks..... the new locks are not going to be using locomotives (mules) to assist the ships through the locks. This will be accomplished with the use of tugboats. The mules will still be used on the original locks.

[AKman2495]

I suspect that there won't be that many more passenger ships using the Canal after the expansion is complete even though there will be more passengers going through the Canal. More than likely it will enable the cruise lines to place one of their post Panamax ships on routes that are being served by the present Panamax ships. They would not send both ships to the same market, probably one, but not the other.

 

I agree with all you said, but I was also thinking the same thing yesterday. Princess has two Panamex ships right now and I was wondering where at least one of them could be going post the new locks era.

[startpacking]

Thanks for all the replies. I will seriously look into a trip to Panama for later this year, finger's crossed it works out this time. I've had a visit to Panama on my bucket list for sometime and just have not had the oppourtunity to visit.

[lcmslady]

I've wrestled with many of the same thoughts as the OP.

 

We decided to do it before the new locks open for the following reasons:

 

definitely wanted to do it in the old locks for the charm

new locks won't use 'mules' - again the charm factor

which lock you go through will be driven by the size of the ship - there is no reason to believe that the cruise lines won't move to larger ships - that being said - doing it before the new locks open means going through the old locks - back to the charm factor.

 

So, we booked for January 2013. Someone else was talking about the fees charged - that alone means you're not likely to find a spectacular deal on the Canal. We didn't - at least by my idea of a deal - but really want to do this particular type of cruise, so out comes the checkbook.

 

Go ahead and book it, don't look back, and have a great time!

[lamchops]

We took a full transit last fall and it was fantastic. We will do another full transit whenever the canal is completed. I enjoyed the crossing and the ports of call. The repositioning cruise offers fantastic value.

[sthelder]

We are also thinking of doing a transcanal cruise in Sep/Oct 2014, would appreciate some input as to whether the new locks will be ready by early 2015, and how it will impact the cruise experience.

 

I noted NCL has a dedicated vessel, Norwegian Star for transcanal cruises in late 2014 to early 2015. Just curious whether it's because the top brass at NCL believes there will be a high demand of transcanal cruises before the new locks are ready for use.

 

Is the early 2015 timetable only for trial passage or it's ready for commercial, including cruise, purposes?

 

My understanding is that the main difference is there will be no "mules" if the ship is using the new locks, and roughly 80% of the view pre and post expansion will remain the same. But would there any difference to the city view if using the new locks?

 

Thanks in advance!

[BillB48]

We are also thinking of doing a transcanal cruise in Sep/Oct 2014, would appreciate some input as to whether the new locks will be ready by early 2015, and how it will impact the cruise experience.

I was just talking to a friend who still works for the Canal and the latest guesstimate for opening is April 2015. He also noted that not every one was in agreement with that date... could be closer to July-August. The new locks will be unique themselves, but the majority of the Canal will be the same as it was... ie. Gaillard Cut and Gatun Lake. The new locks will be a different lane to the main road in a manner of speaking.

I noted NCL has a dedicated vessel, Norwegian Star for transcanal cruises in late 2014 to early 2015. Just curious whether it's because the top brass at NCL believes there will be a high demand of transcanal cruises before the new locks are ready for use. I believe that as the opening date approaches there will be increased interest in the Canal... I guess NCL is just trying to take advantage of it.

Is the early 2015 timetable only for trial passage or it's ready for commercial, including cruise, purposes? I'm sure the new locks will be open in 2015, I don't think the cruise lines will all that anxious to line up and push their post Panamax ships through until the opening has been firmly established. I also think the cruise lines will wait awhile to ensure that the new locks are up and running as well the procedures and techniques are well established before committing to move their post Panamax ships through the Canal. Taking ships through the new locks will be a learn as you go experience for the Canal.

 

My understanding is that the main difference is there will be no "mules" if the ship is using the new locks, and roughly 80% of the view pre and post expansion will remain the same. But would there any difference to the city view if using the new locks? Correct, no mules at the new locks and no change to the city view. The view from the new locks or the present locks will essentially be the same... just at times a slightly different perspective as they are fairly close to one another.

Thanks in advance!

 

My answers in bold.

[sthelder]

Thanks BB, that's a great sypnosis of the sypnosis of the old locks vs. new locks (or rolling gate)!

 

May I ask another question, do cruise passengers get visa waived treatment for these countries (Mexico - 3 ports, Costa Rica, potentially Guatelama, Panama and Colombia)?

 

My family and myself are non-US passport holders but have US B-2 tourist visas with validity over 3 months. Only Colombia is visa-free for me if visit via "conventional" direct flight.

[BillB48]

I'm afraid those questions are a little outside my pay grade:o. The only light I can shed is when visiting those countries via a cruise ship, you don't formally enter the country going through immigration procedures etc. You are "in transit" much like a stopover at an airport on a international flight.

[sthelder]

Thanks for the input, it's very reassuring.

 

I have indeed trying to look up the respective countries' official visa requirement websites (only Guatelama still unclear), and currently, it does appear that no seperate visa would be required.

 

I will have to set up a note-to-self to confirm on the most up-to-date requirement closer to the sail date :cool:

[Ashryn]

We have chosen to go through the canal this year because we wanted to be on a big ship and 'squeeze' through the old locks. It amazes us how they get those big ships through! If I were you I would do it now, you never know what will happen in the future, you may also get to do the new locks as well in a few years.

[swedish weave]

Something I haven't seen mentioned is that the new locks will by-pass Miraflores lake.

 

The present channel is via Miraflores locks and lake and Pedro Miguel locks. The new channel goes alongside the present locks and lake and has all three locks in one area.

[BillB48]

Here is a rendering of what the new channel will look like, I posted this awhile back and for the life of me I could not remember what I called the thread... took some time for the coffee to kick in and find the thread:D! This new channel which will connect the new Pacific Locks (by-passing Miraflores Lake as you noted) with Gaillard Cut is presently called the Pacific Access Channel.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1413601&highlight=new+locks

 

Below is picture I captured from one of the expansion cams and put identified some of the key features.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=33824891&postcount=7

[tobyandbuddy2012]

Hello, The Panama Canal is on our bucket list. When is the best time to schedule the cruise - I see sailings in Oct, Nov, Dec, Jan, and Feb? Any recommendations? Would like to have a balcony for this also, any recommendation for what side of the ship to reserve your cabin on? Any favorite ports on the cruise?:)

 

thanks,

Toby & Buddy

[BillB48]

Hello, The Panama Canal is on our bucket list. When is the best time to schedule the cruise - I see sailings in Oct, Nov, Dec, Jan, and Feb? Any recommendations? Would like to have a balcony for this also, any recommendation for what side of the ship to reserve your cabin on? Any favorite ports on the cruise?:)

 

thanks,

Toby & Buddy

 

January and February are probably the "best" months when it comes to the weather.... the least chance of rain, the heat and humidity are going to be as good as it gets. October and into November you are going to have a higher chance for rain, it trends drier as you move towards December. The differences are not always huge and if you pick a date in the wetter months, you may get some rain..... but not usually an all day washout. I would use the dates just as a tie breaker if most other things are equal.

 

As far as side of the ship... pick your cabin based on how you like to use it during the remainder of the cruise. The best side is topside, that being in the public areas where you can move to a particular side of the ship to see what is of interest. Don't limit yourself in seeing only half of the Canal from your balcony.... this is one time where there are two sides to the story;)!

 

Favorite ports.... the only thing I would look for on your Canal cruise is an itinerary that includes a full day stop in Panama in addition to your transit day.

 

Enjoy!

[kuldalai]

What wonderful foresight the original Engineers had . over a hundred years ago they foresaw the need for future additiona/larger locks and a large part of the approach waterways were partially constructed . Those works are being used today to create the final deepened and widened approaches to the new larger locks.

 

Imagine such foresight today, the "bean counters" would put a stop to that, we are not going to build something well sort of even if it is not required immediately .

[tobyandbuddy2012]

Hi BB,

 

Thank you for your suggestions. We are looking for a cruise to book in Jan or Feb 2014. Anything else you would recommend - what cruise line or ship did you sail on for the canal cruise? What were your thoughts? Thanks again.

 

Have a great weekend,

Sonya

[BillB48]

T&B,

 

My last trip through the Canal was with RCI on the Vision of the Seas and it was great. However to be honest if you wish to make the trip in the Jan/Feb time frame, the cruise lines that have trips available at that time are Princess, HAL and Celebrity. There could be others lines lurking around, but those are the ones off the top of my head. Those three offer a selection of of FL-CA and back during the winter months. I believe any of them would do a good job, if you have favorite among them then go with them. As I mentioned earlier if you can find one with the full day stop in Panama in addition to your transit, that is the one I would be inclined to pick.

[tobyandbuddy2012]

Thanks BB for your suggestions. We are making our decision this weekend. Have been saving for this vacation for awhile and want to make the best of it! Appreciate your time & experience.

 

have a wonderful day,

T & B