Getting off Valor early in St Kitts instead of final stop in San Juan

[newzealandpower]

Hi everyone,

I did several searches in the forum before starting a new topic. Most searches regarding 'debarking' or 'leave ship' mainly pertained to when guests are allowed to leave the ship on their last day..

Hopefully this isn't a duplicate post - if it is, I'm sorry.

 

So we are cruising on the Valor on March 30th - our plans for the rest of our holidays have been a bit up in the air until just recently..

Anyway, we decided we wanted to get off the ship in St Kitts and spend two weeks in the country, before flying back to San Juan and making our way to South America.

To be safe we emailed Carnival asking them if there was anything we could do to ensure we would be allowed to get off in St Kitts...and they replied today saying we can't. Apparently they changed their procedures and guests are no longer allowed to leave the ship before the end of the cruise, or to join the cruise after the first day.

 

We recently cruised in Europe with Celebrity and saw several people with their bags all packed, leaving the ship before we arrived at our final destination....

 

Question is, can they actually MAKE US stay? I mean, if we settle our on board account and leave on time, what difference does it make to them?

 

I wish we had emailed them before we booked our accommodation and flights in St Kitts as now we're caught in a pickle.

 

Any help with this would be highly appreciated

[Shmoo here]

Hi everyone,

I did several searches in the forum before starting a new topic. Most searches regarding 'debarking' or 'leave ship' mainly pertained to when guests are allowed to leave the ship on their last day..

Hopefully this isn't a duplicate post - if it is, I'm sorry.

 

So we are cruising on the Valor on March 30th - our plans for the rest of our holidays have been a bit up in the air until just recently..

Anyway, we decided we wanted to get off the ship in St Kitts and spend two weeks in the country, before flying back to San Juan and making our way to South America.

To be safe we emailed Carnival asking them if there was anything we could do to ensure we would be allowed to get off in St Kitts...and they replied today saying we can't. Apparently they changed their procedures and guests are no longer allowed to leave the ship before the end of the cruise, or to join the cruise after the first day.

 

We recently cruised in Europe with Celebrity and saw several people with their bags all packed, leaving the ship before we arrived at our final destination....

 

Question is, can they actually MAKE US stay? I mean, if we settle our on board account and leave on time, what difference does it make to them?

 

I wish we had emailed them before we booked our accommodation and flights in St Kitts as now we're caught in a pickle.

 

Any help with this would be highly appreciated

 

It has to do with you getting off the ship earlier than the cruise is scheduled to end changes the type of cruise it is (no longer a "closed-loop" cruise, it's now a "Foreign Itinerary" cruise). The Customs and immigration procedures are different for a cruise that isn't a closed loop cruise (more involved and longer), and Carnival doesn't want to be involved in that.

 

In Europe, it's different. They are not governed by things like the Passenger Vessel Services Act (having to do with where cruise ships can and cannot embark/disembark passengers and itinerary requirements for those cruises).

 

It could be possible, IF you are able to get your account settled and your luggage off the ship early (could be a problem), that there would be fines involved that would be passed on to you.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Shmoo here

[1kaper]

I'm interested in the replies.

My guess is that it is more immigration officals you need to worry about than Carnival itself. I know Carnival has to notify authorities of anyone who does not make the ship.

 

Also it may not be an issue in Europe because they often make several stops in the same country. It may be different getting off in a different stop in the same country as opposed to getting of in a different one.

[SeaScout]

Interesting question. I can't imagine that they could force you to stay on the ship.

 

What could they possibly say if you presented yourself at guest services and said you just found out there was a family emergency and you need to debark to make your way home ASAP?

[Shmoo here]

Interesting question. I can't imagine that they could force you to stay on the ship.

 

What could they possibly say if you presented yourself at guest services and said you just found out there was a family emergency and you need to debark to make your way home ASAP?

 

Certainly nothing would stop them from letting someone off the ship given these circumstances, however, due to the "emergency" nature of this sort of situation they couldn't make plans (confirm with the cruiseline before the cruise) that they would be allowed off.

[KPfromCT]

Or, pack VERY lightly (backpack) and just get off, and don't get back on:rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

They'll be paging you, but they won't wait for you:D:D

 

Odd, I am curious what the big deal is.

Keep us posted.

[StaceySteveDMB]

You could ship most of your stuff from SanJuan to St Kitts and pack lite for the cruise. Alert the hotel and have your belongings delivered there. Don't show back up.

 

 

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[irishnyc]

Flights from San Juan to St. Kitts are relatively cheap. Probably less than the fine you'd end up paying for leaving the ship in St. Kitts.

 

Aside from it changing the type of cruise you're on, St. Kitts needs to be able to process your immigration and customs differently than if you were just getting off the ship for the day like the rest of the passengers. There are different procedures.

[christyran1228]

I don't know entirely what the repercussions might be, but I hear if you go base jumping off the Lido deck they will happily escort you and your belongings off the boat. ;) lol

 

 

 

 

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[irishnyc]

And no, the ship won't wait for you if you just don't get back on, but someone that legitimately missed the ship would need to call Carnival and make an effort to catch back up to the ship, and get their belongings back. Once they look for you and check your room for your belongings and see that it's empty, they'll know you pulled a fast one on them.

[1kaper]

Or, pack VERY lightly (backpack) and just get off, and don't get back on:rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

They'll be paging you, but they won't wait for you:D:D

 

Odd, I am curious what the big deal is.

Keep us posted.

 

I suspect part of it is entering a country without properly going through customs. When you enter as a ship's passenger, you are expected to stay for the day.

I know entering the US, I must tell them how long I'll be there and be prepared to provide and address, show proof of where I am staying and proof of a return ticket.

Like I said earlier, Carnival wouldn't be my primary concern, immigration/customs, who will be notified of your failure to return to the ship, would be.

[Isa65]

We have sailed on the Freedom and debarked in Curacao. BUT, that was because we are residents and we requested this prior to the sailing.

 

On the day that we arrived in Curacao, we had to hand in our passports so the local authorities could verify some things. And even as we walked off and the Carnival employees saw us with our luggage we could not get off the ship.

We had to wait until someone from Guest Services escorted us off the ship.

 

I think you best bet is to follow the advice of the previous poster - pack lightly, pay all of your bill and walk off when you reach St. Kitts. They'll think you're a pier runner and haven't made it back.

Also, as a courtesy - call the local Carnival agent the day after (number is located in your daily Fun Times) and tell them that you stayed behind and will take care of your transportation back to the US. Good luck!

[1kaper]

I don't know entirely what the repercussions might be, but I hear if you go base jumping off the Lido deck they will happily escort you and your belongings off the boat. ;) lol

 

 

 

 

Sent from my Commadore 64 using the Cruise Critic forum app

 

They also paid for his flight out of the country the following day (from what I gathered). I also expect he will recieve a bill from them for that. On that thread people were wondering why Carnival would pay for him to leave, someone said that they are responsible to make sure they leave the country asap which makes sense to me.

[LostPuppy]

Or, pack VERY lightly (backpack) and just get off, and don't get back on:rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

They'll be paging you, but they won't wait for you:D:D

 

Odd, I am curious what the big deal is.

Keep us posted.

 

I think the "Big Deal" wouldn't be known until one arrives back on US soil.

 

Carnival would report your non-return to customs and your name would be flagged for questioning upon return to the U.S. AFA what happens next? it could be jail time (I doubt it), a fine, or just a nasty lecture.

 

Just like everyone else here, it's a guess. Tell you what, try this and then report back to us!

[klfrodo]

1. You'll be on whats called here in the US, a "Closed Loop" cruise. A cruise that departs a US port and returns to the exact same port.

2. By getting off the ship early, you'll be in violation of the Passenger Vessels Services Act. The ship will be fined. That fine will be passed on to you.

3. You'll be entering St. Kitts illegally. You'll have no entry visa stamp in your passport, how are you going to leave?

 

In Europe, most of the cruises visit ports within the EU. No passports or visas required when traveling from one country to another within the EU.

[qshari]

I just sailed Valor a couple of weeks ago and a family we met through here prior to the cruise debarked in St.Maarten. From what I recall they asked prior to boarding and were told the couldn't get off early but once on the ship they asked again and were told it was no problem. They had booked airfare from Puerto Rico to St. Maarten for after the cruise but decided to get off the ship and lose out on the airfare. Not sure if it made any difference but they were from Canada. We are still in touch so I will see if they will come over and fill in details I am not aware of.

[megmno]

For what it's worth, the OP appears to be a New Zealander, not an American. Does the Passenger Services Act apply to them too?

[Shmoo here]

For what it's worth, the OP appears to be a New Zealander, not an American. Does the Passenger Services Act apply to them too?

 

The PVSA only applies to the cruise ship - where it goes and who can be transported/embarked/disembarked where, regardless of where the passenger is actually from.

[hftmrock]

1. You'll be on whats called here in the US, a "Closed Loop" cruise. A cruise that departs a US port and returns to the exact same port.

2. By getting off the ship early, you'll be in violation of the Passenger Vessels Services Act. The ship will be fined. That fine will be passed on to you.

3. You'll be entering St. Kitts illegally. You'll have no entry visa stamp in your passport, how are you going to leave?

 

In Europe, most of the cruises visit ports within the EU. No passports or visas required when traveling from one country to another within the EU.

 

this

[newzealandpower]

Thanks for all the replies folks..

Ok, so first off, I wouldn't want to break any laws. I wasn't aware that when you are cruising you don't go through immigration. I just figured we could disembark, have our passport stamped, and go on ourmerry way to Nevis island. My wife and I are on a Round the World tour and 7 months into it there haven't been any problems so I wouldn't want to start now..

 

I think our best bet would be to try and cancel the two extra nights accommodation we have already booked in Nevis and buy a cheap plane ticket from SJU to St Kitts.

 

I guess by staying on the ship we will get our money's worth as we will be staying there those two nights..

 

It's just a shame because I hate flying, and that's one of the reasons we were wanting to get off in St Kitts - but also this way we lose two days to spend there...but I think there isn't any other way.

 

Now the big question is, do I book the ticket to St Kitts now or do I wait until we board the cruise and ask Guest Services?? I.e. I would be pretty upset if we did all this and then, like others mentioned, we were able to organize the early debarkation!!

 

Anyway, flying to Puerto Rico tomorrow..well actually in a few hours since we have to be at the airport at 4.30am!! Not looking forward to the two flights to SJU and especially to flying the little plane from there to Vieques Island, where we'll spend a week before getting back to SJU ready to go on our cruise!!

[vjmatty]

1. You'll be on whats called here in the US, a "Closed Loop" cruise. A cruise that departs a US port and returns to the exact same port.

2. By getting off the ship early, you'll be in violation of the Passenger Vessels Services Act. The ship will be fined. That fine will be passed on to you.

3. You'll be entering St. Kitts illegally. You'll have no entry visa stamp in your passport, how are you going to leave?

 

In Europe, most of the cruises visit ports within the EU. No passports or visas required when traveling from one country to another within the EU.

 

The PVSA only applies to starting and ending in a US port. If the passenger is not traveling between US ports as starting and ending points, there is no PVSA violation, in fact it is kind of the opposite. By getting off in St. Kitts, the PVSA is rendered moot for that passenger.

 

If the converse were true, and the passenger disembarked in a different US port that the embarking port without visiting a distant foreign port, the ship would be in violation of the PVSA.

[Shmoo here]

The PVSA only applies to starting and ending in a US port. If the passenger is not traveling between US ports as starting and ending points, there is no PVSA violation, in fact it is kind of the opposite. By getting off in St. Kitts, the PVSA is rendered moot for that passenger.

 

If the converse were true, and the passenger disembarked in a different US port that the embarking port without visiting a distant foreign port, the ship would be in violation of the PVSA.

 

But the OP is on a closed loop cruise that starts/ends in a US port.

 

Recently, cruiselines (particularly Carnival) have not been allowing passengers to embark/disembark early on closed loop cruises out of a US port due to the change of cruise type (closed loop to foreign itinerary). There are different immigration/customs procedures for each of these types of cruises. The foreign itinerary one (from what I've read) is more involved and lengthier. So Carnival opts not to allow such early embarkation/disembarkation.

[hftmrock]

The PVSA only applies to starting and ending in a US port. If the passenger is not traveling between US ports as starting and ending points, there is no PVSA violation, in fact it is kind of the opposite. By getting off in St. Kitts, the PVSA is rendered moot for that passenger.

 

If the converse were true, and the passenger disembarked in a different US port that the embarking port without visiting a distant foreign port, the ship would be in violation of the PVSA.

 

 

the cruise IS starting and ending in a US port. the OP wants to break that and thats why its not allowed. the OP is trying to take a closed loop cruise and make is an open. that is not allowed and subject to fines

[vjmatty]

But the OP is on a closed loop cruise that starts/ends in a US port.

 

Recently, cruiselines (particularly Carnival) have not been allowing passengers to embark/disembark early on closed loop cruises out of a US port due to the change of cruise type (closed loop to foreign itinerary). There are different immigration/customs procedures for each of these types of cruises. The foreign itinerary one (from what I've read) is more involved and lengthier. So Carnival opts not to allow such early embarkation/disembarkation.

 

That may be so, but it isn't a PVSA violation. Open loop cruises by definition aren't subject to the PVSA. The OP would as you say be creating an open loop cruise.

 

I've actually gotten permission in the past to disembark early but not from Carnival.... it was a Cunard ship, which is interesting because they are owned by Carnival.

[vjmatty]

the cruise IS starting and ending in a US port. the OP wants to break that and thats why its not allowed. the OP is trying to take a closed loop cruise and make is an open. that is not allowed and subject to fines

 

Right, but the passenger would not be therefore it isn't a PVSA violation. There may be other problems such as with Carnival policy and local immigration in St. Kitts but isn't about the PVSA.

 

Let's say for the sake of argument that the ship embarked from Miami for a closed loop cruise. If the passenger got off in Key West, that would be a PVSA violation because he is going from one US port to a different US port without visiting a distant foreign port. In the OP's example the change is not a violation because he is ending in a foreign port where the PVSA does not apply. For the passenger to be violating the PVSA it doesn't matter what the ship is doing, it matters what the passenger is doing.